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ExpandMyMind

Trump - Putin Press Conference

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Tatetopa
On 7/20/2018 at 11:05 AM, and then said:

Obama was so slick he oozed.

He definitely had some faults.  On the positive side, he appeared to truly love his wife and children.  His interaction with other young people seemed positive. As a private individual, he had some good qualities.

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Tatetopa
3 minutes ago, RavenHawk said:

Conservatives never want to live under a socialist totalitarian Russian state and neither do they want to live under an American Progressive Socialist state either.  So hope for what? 

Hope that we avoid both those things.  I don't know what progressives want any more than I know what conservatives want.  I don't want to read anybodies mind or put words in their mouth.  Say what you think not what you believe other people have in the dark recesses of their mind.  Do you speak for progressives, do you want to throw out the Constitution?  If you want to defend the Constitution say that.   Don't try to tell me what evil lurks in somebody else' mind.  Let me decide by their actions what they want and believe.

Right now neither you nor your progressive bogeymen have a positive plan to make America strong, and free with equality and justice for all.  Both sides are full of self interest and contention.  I can't see that either one of you wants America to be any more than a     has -been in the future. We could be a lot better than either of your small visions of nanny state or fading third world country.

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RavenHawk
43 minutes ago, Kittens Are Jerks said:

You just pulled a Trump-style reversal.

You said something, walked it back, then said it again.

Well done.

No, I didn’t.  You are just hearing what you want.  You don’t realize that one can be sarcastic and serious at the same time.  Ultimately it is still sarcasm.

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RavenHawk
7 minutes ago, Tatetopa said:

Hope that we avoid both those things.  I don't know what progressives want any more than I know what conservatives want.

Then you haven’t been paying attention because it is very clear.  It is the difference between night and day.

 

I don't want to read anybodies mind or put words in their mouth. 

At such a top level, you don’t have too.

 

Say what you think not what you believe other people have in the dark recesses of their mind. 

I do both, but with the later, I don’t have to guess.  I have their own words and actions to go off of.  Many on this forum have been very clear.

 

Do you speak for progressives,

I don’t have too.  They speak clearly for themselves.

 

do you want to throw out the Constitution? 

That’s absurd.  You act like things have not been decided yet??

 

If you want to defend the Constitution say that.   

I do all the time.  If you look through my body of work, that would be clear.

 

Don't try to tell me what evil lurks in somebody else' mind.  Let me decide by their actions what they want and believe.

Then you need to hurry up and decide because most people have already.  This is not something where the jury is still out.  The sides have already been drawn.  What is it that you believe?

 

Right now neither you nor your progressive bogeymen have a positive plan to make America strong, and free with equality and justice for all. 

I beg your pardon?  It is as clear as night and day.  There is nothing positive put forward by the Progressives.

 

Both sides are full of self interest and contention. 

Absolutely!  If Conservatives were not, then we’d be rolled over by the Progressives.  Self-interest has been the whole point.  Keeping the Constitution as intended is very much a self-interest of Conservatives.  The Constitution is not about changing times.  It is about human nature.  Times change, human nature does not.  Progressives do not understand this.

 

I can't see that either one of you wants America to be any more than a     has -been in the future.

What do you think either want?

 

We could be a lot better than either of your small visions of nanny state or fading third world country.

Those are Progressive values.  Of course we can do better.  The Conservative view is that our best days are still ahead of us.  The Progressive believes that we are not special and will never be great again (if at all) and that we should just fall in line with the rest of the planet.

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Kittens Are Jerks

Trump complained reporter's question at summit was too hard
President Trump reportedly complained that a reporter’s question about Russian interference in the 2016 election during a press conference with Russian President Vladimir Putin was too difficult. The Washington Post reported Saturday that Trump wondered why Associated Press reporter Jonathan Lemire had been selected to ask the president a question, rather than someone who would have presented him with an easier query.

http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/398192-trump-complained-reporters-question-at-summit-was-too-hard

:lol:

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Paranormal Panther
3 hours ago, Tatetopa said:

Not trying to be stupid here, but which indicators over what time frame?  

That's a fair question, and there's nothing stupid about it. Black employment and Latino employment are at their peaks thus far. Trump's growth rate puts Obama's abysmal performance to shame. More companies are hiring than they did in the past two administrations.

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Tatetopa
4 hours ago, Paranormal Panther said:

That's a fair question, and there's nothing stupid about it. Black employment and Latino employment are at their peaks thus far. Trump's growth rate puts Obama's abysmal performance to shame. More companies are hiring than they did in the past two administrations.

Cool.  Good start.  I guess I need to get up off my duff and stop being lazy.

I would like to know more about the American economy and the trends affecting the middle class.

Are those Blacks and Latinos  and Whites working part time, full time, gig economy, ,or two jobs?  Can a man provide for a modest family?  Can a husband and wife support two children without public assistance?  Is that a growing or shrinking population?  Is child care available if both partners work?  Can these people move forward, do they have the skill and training to advance?  Can they help their children be better than they are?   Are public schools serving them adequately?  Is infrastructure being replaced and modernized around them?  Maybe the American dream has been reduced, not to owning a home but to providing for your family without public assistance for rent or food and helping your children start from a higher place?   Can they achieve that?

Job numbers are a start, but I get the sense that we are not doing so well in the fields of wage growth, infrastructure, preparing for future employment needs, educating our children to compete in the world.

Paranormal, it is not your job to school me, I don't expect it, I need to take the initiative.  Thanks..

 

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AnchorSteam
18 minutes ago, Tatetopa said:

Cool.  Good start.  I guess I need to get up off my duff and stop being lazy.

 

Yeah, I said that too, and so I'm going to the Gym for the first time in a couple of decades.

And to think, it was the work that I was dreading.... but the pain involved in getting unused muscles to work again is making the work itself seem pleasant by comparison. 

18 minutes ago, Tatetopa said:

 

Job numbers are a start, ...

Numbers are also numbers, hard data showing a definite trend, so why try to obfuscate them with conjecture? 

When did politics cease top have anything to do with reality, and instead become an expression of personal dislike for "the other guys" regarding every facet of every possible situation? 

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Tatetopa
2 hours ago, AnchorSteam said:

When did politics cease top have anything to do with reality, and instead become an expression of personal dislike for "the other guys" regarding every facet of every possible situation? 

To that I don't know the answe, but I kinda like reality, good or bad.

As a long time engineer, I always want to know what value goes down when another value goes up.  What is related, what is coming down the road?   Its not new, but job numbers are played up when good and dismissed when bad and frequently monkeyed with.  Maybe I am too suspicious because I have worked for big corp[orations a long time.  The shareholders seldom get the whole straight story.   

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toast
8 hours ago, Paranormal Panther said:

That's a fair question, and there's nothing stupid about it. Black employment and Latino employment are at their peaks thus far. Trump's growth rate puts Obama's abysmal performance to shame. More companies are hiring than they did in the past two administrations.

 

Quote

Jobs and Unemployment

Since Trump took office, job growth has slowed. Job-seekers became more scarce, and employers struggled to find workers.

Employment — Total nonfarm employment grew by 1.84 million during the president’s first 11 months in office, according to the most recent figures available from the Bureau of Labor Statistics.

It’s a respectable gain, to be sure. But it’s 12 percent lower than the 2.01 million jobs that were created in the 11 months before he entered office.

The average monthly job gain under Trump is now 167,182, well behind the average monthly gain of 216,958 jobs during Obama’s entire second term. It’s also well shy of the pace required to meet his goal of 25 million new jobs over 10 years.

Trump will have to pick up the pace if he is to fulfill his campaign boast that he will be “the greatest jobs creation president that God ever created.”

factcheck.org

 

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ExpandMyMind
14 hours ago, Paranormal Panther said:

That's a fair question, and there's nothing stupid about it. Black employment and Latino employment are at their peaks thus far. Trump's growth rate puts Obama's abysmal performance to shame. More companies are hiring than they did in the past two administrations.

See, this is one of those issues that new administrations try to take credit for, when it's run-off from the previous one.

image.thumb.jpg.91e525ca6f9212e78e3cc770d09d72cc.jpg

The unemployment rate for minorities has been on a downward trend for almost 10 years. You can't just inherit something that has been the result of Obama's policy and take credit for it.

The best that can be said is that Trump hasn't done anything to alter the downward trend of unemployment. To claim credit for it is grossly dishonest.

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Paranormal Panther
18 hours ago, Tatetopa said:

Cool.  Good start.  I guess I need to get up off my duff and stop being lazy.

I would like to know more about the American economy and the trends affecting the middle class.

Are those Blacks and Latinos  and Whites working part time, full time, gig economy, ,or two jobs?  Can a man provide for a modest family?  Can a husband and wife support two children without public assistance?  Is that a growing or shrinking population?  Is child care available if both partners work?  Can these people move forward, do they have the skill and training to advance?  Can they help their children be better than they are?   Are public schools serving them adequately?  Is infrastructure being replaced and modernized around them?  Maybe the American dream has been reduced, not to owning a home but to providing for your family without public assistance for rent or food and helping your children start from a higher place?   Can they achieve that?

Job numbers are a start, but I get the sense that we are not doing so well in the fields of wage growth, infrastructure, preparing for future employment needs, educating our children to compete in the world.

Paranormal, it is not your job to school me, I don't expect it, I need to take the initiative.  Thanks..

 

It depends on the person and the situation. As you know, you can have great times when times are terrible, and you can have terrible times when times are great. Your post describes reality for many people across the country, and the same holds true for Americans in the past. The economy has greatly improved under Trump. Still, there are some problems that need to be solved. I think the main one is that prices are rising faster than wages. We encounter that fact of life each time we buy gas and groceries. Real income has remained stagnant for years. 

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Paranormal Panther
9 hours ago, ExpandMyMind said:

See, this is one of those issues that new administrations try to take credit for, when it's run-off from the previous one.

image.thumb.jpg.91e525ca6f9212e78e3cc770d09d72cc.jpg

The unemployment rate for minorities has been on a downward trend for almost 10 years. You can't just inherit something that has been the result of Obama's policy and take credit for it.

The best that can be said is that Trump hasn't done anything to alter the downward trend of unemployment. To claim credit for it is grossly dishonest.

Obama had just eight years to make such improvements. You'll likely blame Bush for his failure to do so. You guys can't or won't blame Obama for anything. Surprise me.

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Tatetopa
6 hours ago, Paranormal Panther said:

Obama had just eight years to make such improvements. You'll likely blame Bush for his failure to do so. You guys can't or won't blame Obama for anything. Surprise me.

Obama did a lot of foolish and stupid things,  TPP springs to mind among other things, Syria, Russian interference handling so forth..

But here is a point to consider.  After an election, there may be an immediate stock market bump or decline base on attitude.

Next, lets say a President signs some orders to remove regulations on his first day in office, or benefit some industry.  It takes a few months to get an industry rolling.  If it is manufacturing or mining, initial investments must be made.  Construction jobs start it off, then plant employees,  It may take a couple of years for a new plant or mine to come online. And a full plant employment be in place.

Tax cuts, some right away: stock buybacks and dividends right out of the box.  Investment in new facilities resulting in actual jobs, a year or two out, see above.

Tariffs  and their impact on trade and jobs doesn't take full effect right away either.  Increased  cost of domestic and imported goods hitting citizens with low unemployment and flat wages, also a year or two out.

So, I would say the first two years of a president's term are largely influenced by the legacy of his predecessor.  That doesn't mean 4 years or 8 years Paranormal.  Obama gets credit and blame for his last 6 years.  President Trump's legacy is just now beginning.  We will know a lot more in another couple of years.  That is why I am neither cheering or condemning his performance yet.  I may think he is an arrogant jerk, but he might have some good ideas.

 

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President-Elect Acidhead
44 minutes ago, Tatetopa said:

Obama did a lot of foolish and stupid things,  TPP springs to mind among other things, Syria, Russian interference handling so forth..

But here is a point to consider.  After an election, there may be an immediate stock market bump or decline base on attitude.

Next, lets say a President signs some orders to remove regulations on his first day in office, or benefit some industry.  It takes a few months to get an industry rolling.  If it is manufacturing or mining, initial investments must be made.  Construction jobs start it off, then plant employees,  It may take a couple of years for a new plant or mine to come online. And a full plant employment be in place.

Tax cuts, some right away: stock buybacks and dividends right out of the box.  Investment in new facilities resulting in actual jobs, a year or two out, see above.

Tariffs  and their impact on trade and jobs doesn't take full effect right away either.  Increased  cost of domestic and imported goods hitting citizens with low unemployment and flat wages, also a year or two out.

So, I would say the first two years of a president's term are largely influenced by the legacy of his predecessor.  That doesn't mean 4 years or 8 years Paranormal.  Obama gets credit and blame for his last 6 years.  President Trump's legacy is just now beginning.  We will know a lot more in another couple of years.  That is why I am neither cheering or condemning his performance yet.  I may think he is an arrogant jerk, but he might have some good ideas.

 

No.

It all comes down to confidence in the market to which way it'll go.

The Fed bases their percentage in consumer confidence.

The very second Trump won consumer confidence went through the roof.

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Paranormal Panther
17 hours ago, Tatetopa said:

Obama did a lot of foolish and stupid things,  TPP springs to mind among other things, Syria, Russian interference handling so forth..

But here is a point to consider.  After an election, there may be an immediate stock market bump or decline base on attitude.

Next, lets say a President signs some orders to remove regulations on his first day in office, or benefit some industry.  It takes a few months to get an industry rolling.  If it is manufacturing or mining, initial investments must be made.  Construction jobs start it off, then plant employees,  It may take a couple of years for a new plant or mine to come online. And a full plant employment be in place.

Tax cuts, some right away: stock buybacks and dividends right out of the box.  Investment in new facilities resulting in actual jobs, a year or two out, see above.

Tariffs  and their impact on trade and jobs doesn't take full effect right away either.  Increased  cost of domestic and imported goods hitting citizens with low unemployment and flat wages, also a year or two out.

So, I would say the first two years of a president's term are largely influenced by the legacy of his predecessor.  That doesn't mean 4 years or 8 years Paranormal.  Obama gets credit and blame for his last 6 years.  President Trump's legacy is just now beginning.  We will know a lot more in another couple of years.  That is why I am neither cheering or condemning his performance yet.  I may think he is an arrogant jerk, but he might have some good ideas.

 

You raise good points. The economy was stagnant during his term, though. Look at his abysmal growth rate for the whole eight years. Obama was a singular and unmitigated disaster. For the sake of bipartisanship, Bush was disastrous too. We had sixteen years of them! I really and truly thought that this double whammy of endless war and social strife would turn us into a Third World country. I felt a sense of optimism at the start of both presidencies, but my hopes were dashed both times. It's as if both are members of the Establishment Party, one dedicated to globalism at the expense of sovereignty. The EP then had the chutzpah and temerity to run Clinton, cheating Sanders and his fans in the process. *She* is the main reason why Trump is in the White House now. The Democrats' slam dunk was blocked.  

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Paranormal Panther
On 7/22/2018 at 3:18 AM, toast said:

 

 

7 Facts That Show Obama's Economic Recovery Has Been Awful:

http://www.dailywire.com/news/7970/7-facts-show-obamas-economic-recovery-has-been-aaron-bundler

ETA: Just google the phrase to find the story. I don't know how or why the link SNAFU'ed.

Edited by Paranormal Panther

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Tatetopa
4 hours ago, Paranormal Panther said:

ou raise good points. The economy was stagnant during his term, though. Look at his abysmal growth rate for the whole eight years. Obama was a singular and unmitigated disaster. For the sake of bipartisanship, Bush was disastrous too. We had sixteen years of them! I really and truly thought that this double whammy of endless war and social strife would turn us into a Third World country. I felt a sense of optimism at the start of both presidencies, but my hopes were dashed both times. It's as if both are members of the Establishment Party, one dedicated to globalism at the expense of sovereignty. The EP then had the chutzpah and temerity to run Clinton, cheating Sanders and his fans in the process. *She* is the main reason why Trump is in the White House now. The Democrats' slam dunk was blocked.  

As do you.  How much is our leadership and how much the times and the evolving world situation?  Robert E  Lee was by all accounts a great general as was also said of Red Cloud and Sitting Bull.  They all lost, not because they were not great or heroic men.    What will the times do to us.  Sometimes I am afraid our own hubris and disinterest with the rest of the world as lesser beings will one day find them ahead of us in technology and influence.

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President-Elect Acidhead
6 hours ago, Paranormal Panther said:

7 Facts That Show Obama's Economic Recovery Has Been Awful:

http://www.dailywire.com/news/7970/7-facts-show-obamas-economic-recovery-has-been-aaron-bundler

ETA: Just google the phrase to find the story. I don't know how or why the link SNAFU'ed.

"s" after http is my guess but what do I know?

 

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toast
6 hours ago, Paranormal Panther said:

7 Facts That Show Obama's Economic Recovery Has Been Awful:

http://www.dailywire.com/news/7970/7-facts-show-obamas-economic-recovery-has-been-aaron-bundler

ETA: Just google the phrase to find the story. I don't know how or why the link SNAFU'ed.

The Daily Wire:

Quote

False stories

According to Snopes, "DailyWire.com has a tendency to share stories that are taken out of context or not verified."[11] Among the falsehoods published on The Daily Wire include protesters digging up Confederate graves, Democratic congresspeople refusing to stand for a fallen Navy SEAL's widow, and Harvard University holding segregated commencement ceremonies.[11]

FactCheck.Org found that The Daily Wire was the source of a false story which credited Housing and Urban Development Secretary Ben Carson with finding over $500 billion in accounting errors made by the Obama administration. FactCheck.org found that the errors were discovered and published by HUD's independent inspector general before Carson became secretary.[12]

The Daily Wire has published a number of articles which cast doubt that climate change is occurring and that humans contribute to climate change. Experts have described the articles as inaccurate and misleading

wiki

 

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aztek

 

 

Edited by aztek

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Paranormal Panther
19 hours ago, Tatetopa said:

As do you.  How much is our leadership and how much the times and the evolving world situation?  Robert E  Lee was by all accounts a great general as was also said of Red Cloud and Sitting Bull.  They all lost, not because they were not great or heroic men.    What will the times do to us.  Sometimes I am afraid our own hubris and disinterest with the rest of the world as lesser beings will one day find them ahead of us in technology and influence.

I couldn't agree more with your point about "lesser beings". Although I'm an American nationalist (not a Black nationalist or a White nationalist), my overarching belief is that we're all brothers and sisters in the Eyes of God. I don't think that American children have more worth than foreign children. Thousands of children have died since the time of the first Iraq War. This should pierce our hearts and souls, but it's excused as "collateral damage". Albright said that thousands of starved kids was an acceptable price to pay when we placed very strict economic sanctions on Iraq. We rightly recoil in horror when we witness news stories about starved American children. We don't dismiss them as "lesser beings".

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Paranormal Panther
17 hours ago, acidhead said:

"s" after http is my guess but what do I know?

 

That sounds about right, but I don't know what you know. Do you know what you know?

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Paranormal Panther
16 hours ago, toast said:

The Daily Wire:

 

You can't dispute the facts, so you dispute the source. I found questions about some of your "sides'" sources too. We can go back and forth with stats that we cut and pasted from varied stories. A chimpanzee can do that, and it would accomplish as much.

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Michelle
11 minutes ago, Paranormal Panther said:

You can't dispute the facts, so you dispute the source. I found questions about some of your "sides'" sources too. We can go back and forth with stats that we cut and pasted from varied stories. A chimpanzee can do that, and it would accomplish as much.

To be fair, I triple check the Washington Post and the Huffington Post. I wouldn't trust their sources if they came notarized. :lol:

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