Florida's Stand your ground to be tested

[lost_shaman]

The Sheriff and law enforcement in general have not raised any objection to how Drejka parked nor did they issue any type of citation to him. You are just nit-picking as 'and then' stated. It's a non-issue. 

[Farmer77]

5 minutes ago, lost_shaman said:

The Sheriff and law enforcement in general have not raised any objection to how Drejka parked nor did they issue any type of citation to him. You are just nit-picking as 'and then' stated. It's a non-issue. 

It is nit picking. Dear god a man died, if there ever were a time to nitpick, it is after someone is killed. 

This particular nit points out that Drejka was focused on causing problems over a particular parking spot, not necessarily the law. 

[lost_shaman]

Farmer, not just any parking spot, a handicapped parking spot. Considering Drejka's Mother is handicapped then it's not hard to understand he would be upset to see perfectly able bodied 20 somethings parking there. At any rate is was McGlockton's felonious assault that resulted in the events that transpired and that is the bottom line. 

[Golden Duck]

10 minutes ago, lost_shaman said:

The Sheriff and law enforcement in general have not raised any objection to how Drejka parked nor did they issue any type of citation to him. You are just nit-picking as 'and then' stated. It's a non-issue. 

Not picking is not the same as asserting hallucinations as fact.

[Setton]

9 hours ago, Paranormal Panther said:

I'm addressing your false portrayals of the USA. Violent crime is relegated to certain places, so our countries have that in common.

What false portrayals? 

Quote please, not inaccurate paraphrasing. 

[Kismit]

2 minutes ago, lost_shaman said:

Farmer, not just any parking spot, a handicapped parking spot. Considering Drejka's Mother is handicapped then it's not hard to understand he would be upset to see perfectly able bodied 20 somethings parking there. At any rate is was McGlockton's felonious assault that resulted in the events that transpired and that is the bottom line. 

I'm still not sure what the definition for felony assault is. Or if that is what it was. It looks like a hard shove. Is that a felony offense?

[Farmer77]

2 minutes ago, Kismit said:

I'm still not sure what the definition for felony assault is. Or if that is what it was. It looks like a hard shove. Is that a felony offense?

The brutal reality is in America it most likely depends on who did the shoving. 

Socio economic status can have as much to do with the outcome as any laws actually on the books. 

[lost_shaman]

6 minutes ago, Kismit said:

I'm still not sure what the definition for felony assault is. Or if that is what it was. It looks like a hard shove. Is that a felony offense?

It depends on how a Prosecutor decides to charge a person, for example here Drejka was violently slammed to the ground and that makes it more damning then had McGlockton just shoved him back a step or two. Also, since McGlockton was a violent Felon that also would enhance the charges against him. The Prosecutor may even consider the pavement a deadly weapon in a case like this. So it's not cut and dry by any means, a Prosecutor has lots of discretion here in a case like this. For example if this was a persons first offense it may be prosecuted as Simple Assault which is a Second degree Misdemeanor, where as Aggravated Assault is a Third degree Felony, the latter is most likely what McGlockton would have been charged with considering his violent past convictions.

[Kismit]

18 minutes ago, lost_shaman said:

Farmer, not just any parking spot, a handicapped parking spot. Considering Drejka's Mother is handicapped then it's not hard to understand he would be upset to see perfectly able bodied 20 somethings parking there. At any rate is was McGlockton's felonious assault that resulted in the events that transpired and that is the bottom line. 

As I stated earlier.  I  spent 6 months nursing my husband in a wheelchair 24 hours a day. I have an intimate experience of the need for disabled parking.

In my current job it is sometimes my responsibility to ask people to move thier cars. I have no problem doing this in a polite manner.  

I have never, gone out of my way to abuse a person for parking in a disabled spot. 

I have never had a verbal go at a person sitting in thier car with thier 4 month old and 3 year old.

Do you have any idea what is involved in getting all of those kids in and out of the car? This was very likely meant to be a quick stop, the driver could have shifted if the spot was needed.

[lost_shaman]

24 minutes ago, Golden Duck said:

Not picking is not the same as asserting hallucinations as fact.

You can see the parking lines in the photo I posted, in the areal photo you posted you can't really see any of the painted parking lines. 

[Kismit]

4 minutes ago, lost_shaman said:

It depends on how a Prosecutor decides to charge a person, for example here Drejka was violently slammed to the ground and that makes it more damning then had McGlockton just shoved him back a step or two. Also, since McGlockton was a violent Felon that also would enhance the charges against him. The Prosecutor may even consider the pavement a deadly weapon in a case like this. So it's not cut and dry by any means, a Prosecutor has lots of discretion here in a case like this. For example if this was a persons first offense it may be prosecuted as Simple Assault which is a Second degree Misdemeanor, where as Aggravated Assault is a Third degree Felony, the latter is most likely what McGlockton would have been charged with considering his violent past convictions.

So it is not actually felony assault at this stage? Or has that decision been made by a prosecutor? It is not really fair to keep referring to it as felony assault unless that decision is made by the proper due process.

 

[lost_shaman]

1 minute ago, Kismit said:

As I stated earlier.  I  spent 6 months nursing my husband in a wheelchair 24 hours a day. I have an intimate experience of the need for disabled parking.

In my current job it is sometimes my responsibility to ask people to move thier cars. I have no problem doing this in a polite manner.  

I have never, gone out of my way to abuse a person for parking in a disabled spot. 

I have never had a verbal go at a person sitting in thier car with thier 4 month old and 3 year old.

Do you have any idea what is involved in getting all of those kids in and out of the car? This was very likely meant to be a quick stop, the driver could have shifted if the spot was needed.

These are your opinions. And you are entiteled to them, just as I am entitled to mine. That said, what about handicapped people that might want to stop and the Store and decide not to because they see the handicapped space already taken? Do you really believe most handicapped people would know it's just a 20 something year old and pull up and roll down their window and ask them to move? That really stretches the imagination if you ask me!

[lost_shaman]

1 minute ago, Kismit said:

Or has that decision been made by a prosecutor?

There is no crime to prosecute now that the defendant is deceased. So we will never know how a Prosecutor would handle this specific case. But yes, in my opinion it was a felony Assault.

Edited August 1, 2018 by lost_shaman

[Kismit]

16 minutes ago, lost_shaman said:

These are your opinions. And you are entiteled to them, just as I am entitled to mine. That said, what about handicapped people that might want to stop and the Store and decide not to because they see the handicapped space already taken? Do you really believe most handicapped people would know it's just a 20 something year old and pull up and roll down their window and ask them to move? That really stretches the imagination if you ask me!

No. I know most handicapped people would park elsewhere, like the park by the door with the ramp and either complain to the shop assistant or actively shame the poor parking. 

I have no idea what thier age has to do with it.

Drejka was looking for a fight. Heven drove up to the vehicle, with the intent of policing that park (which is not his job). He walked around the vehicle, which gave him enough time to see there was no permit for the park, and also that it was a young woman alone with two small children in the vehicle. He may have said,"did you realise this is a disabled carpark? There are other car parks over yonder you could use". She may have responded my partner will be out in a secondition and we will be gone."  That's is all any of us actually has a right to do unless we are licensed to police those parks. 

However Drejka spends a lot more time than that saying whatever he says. I don't know what he says but I don't think he is passing the time of day.  And let us go back and remember Drejka is a 47 year old, able bodied man who has a loaded weapon, standing outside of a vehicle with a young woman alone, with her two small children. 

That's intimidation. Why should anyone allow another human being to intimidate thier wife and 4month old and 3 year old?

[Kismit]

14 minutes ago, lost_shaman said:

There is no crime to prosecute now that the defendant is deceased. So we will never know how a Prosecutor would handle this specific case. But yes, in my opinion it was a felony Assault.

So it is not actually felony assault then?

[lost_shaman]

2 minutes ago, Kismit said:

So it is not actually felony assault then?

I answered your question. In my opinion yes it was. 

[Kismit]

1 minute ago, lost_shaman said:

I answered your question. In my opinion yes it was. 

And in my opinion this was murder. So I  guess we are even in our assumptions.

[lost_shaman]

3 minutes ago, Kismit said:

No. I know most handicapped people would park elsewhere, like the park by the door with the ramp and either complain to the shop assistant or actively shame the poor parking. 

I have no idea what thier agenda has to do with it.

Drejka was looking for a fight. Heven drove up to the vehicle, with the intent of policing that park (which is not his job). He walked around the vehicle, which gave him enough time to see there was no permit for the park, and also that it was a young woman alone with two small children in the vehicle. He may have said,"did you realise this is a disabled carpark? There are other car parks over yonder you could use". She may have responded my partner will be out in a secondition and we will be gone."  That's is all any of us actually has a right to do unless we are licensed to police those parks. 

However Drejka spends a lot more time than that saying whatever he says. I don't know what he says but I don't think he is passing the time of day.  And let us go back and remember Drejka is a 47 year old, able bodied man who has a loaded weapon, standing outside of a vehicle with a young woman alone, with her two small children. 

That's intimidation. Why should anyone allow another human being to intimidate thier wife and 4month old and 3 year old?

We don't have all the evidence. The Sheriff does. He spoke out today and said we don't have all the evidence and Witness testimony that he has, and he said he made the correct decission not to charge Drejka based on the evidence he has that we haven't seen. 

[lost_shaman]

Just now, Kismit said:

And in my opinion this was murder. So I  guess we are even in our assumptions.

In this Country it is not MURDER if you are not charged with MURDER and NOT convicted by a jury of MURDER. Period.

[Farmer77]

1 minute ago, lost_shaman said:

We don't have all the evidence. The Sheriff does. He spoke out today and said we don't have all the evidence and Witness testimony that he has, and he said he made the correct decission not to charge Drejka based on the evidence he has that we haven't seen. 

He also said his decision is not final and there are a couple of other layers of oversight to confirm whether his decision was correct or not. The case still hasn't been officially forwarded to the state attorney. 

[Farmer77]

1 minute ago, lost_shaman said:

In this Country it is not MURDER if you are not charged with MURDER and NOT convicted by a jury of MURDER. Period.

Legally, but not necessarily morally. I mean im sure you have no problem calling this guy a murderer right?

 

[lost_shaman]

2 minutes ago, Farmer77 said:

He also said his decision is not final and there are a couple of other layers of oversight to confirm whether his decision was correct or not. The case still hasn't been officially forwarded to the state attorney. 

That's true. It may take several weeks or even month's before the State Attorney makes the final call. 

[Golden Duck]

22 minutes ago, lost_shaman said:

You can see the parking lines in the photo I posted, in the areal photo you posted you can't really see any of the painted parking lines. 

Well... I simply don't agree.

I was confident I could see all designated car spaces - wheel stops and corresponding lines - on the CCTV.

You disagreed.

I confirmed my confidence with an even clearer picture. I did reduce the size to pay it directly here; but, you can have a look at ABC coverage in high-res.

The bottom line is it treatises a apprehension her was seeking conflict. 

I don't have confidence it will have a bearing on legal proceedings. The way the sherriff described "Stand Your Ground" it sounds synomous with "Look Out It's Coming Right At Us".

[lost_shaman]

5 minutes ago, Golden Duck said:

Well... I simply don't agree.

I was confident I could see all designated car spaces - wheel stops and corresponding lines - on the CCTV.

You disagreed.

I confirmed my confidence with an even clearer picture. I did reduce the size to pay it directly here; but, you can have a look at ABC coverage in high-res.

The bottom line is it treatises a apprehension her was seeking conflict. 

I don't have confidence it will have a bearing on legal proceedings. The way the sherriff described "Stand Your Ground" it sounds synomous with "Look Out It's Coming Right At Us".

Not sure what you're going on about re: in Bold, however the only real facts that matter here are McGlockton's and Drejka's actions at the time Mcglockton exited the store and until Drejka fired the single shot. Everything else is immaterial here. 

[Golden Duck]

38 minutes ago, lost_shaman said:

These are your opinions. And you are entiteled to them, just as I am entitled to mine. That said, what about handicapped people that might want to stop and the Store and decide not to because they see the handicapped space already taken? Do you really believe most handicapped people would know it's just a 20 something year old and pull up and roll down their window and ask them to move? That really stretches the imagination if you ask me!

Why not? A similar thing happened to me with pram parking. I was at my car strike a young make was trying park next to me. I was just watching to make sure I was clear. He must've taken as a look of disdain, felt guilty, and looked for another space.

You get more flies with honey than vinegar.