Setton Posted October 14, 2018 #201 Share Posted October 14, 2018 (edited) 30 minutes ago, bee said: They were / are MARKETED as a public platform ---- a "platform for all ideas"---- Mark Zuckerberg Struggles To Answer If Facebook Is A ‘Neutral Public Forum’ but it turns out people were lured into it under false pretenses.... If it was marketed as a CIA backed, Data collection, spying and social engineering platform it wouldn't be where it is now... that would hardly be an attractive marketing strategy.. You are supporting widespread internet political censorship under the flimsy excuse of 'free market' when the situation is more complex than that.... and more harmful.... Don't break the terms if use then. If you signed up without reading them, that's your fault. Oh, and none of you have provided any evidence that it was 'CIA backed' so suggest you either drop that lie or put up the evidence. Edited October 14, 2018 by Setton 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmer77 Posted October 14, 2018 #202 Share Posted October 14, 2018 51 minutes ago, bee said: You are supporting widespread internet political censorship under the flimsy excuse of 'free market' when the situation is more complex than that.... and more harmful.... The alternative being that you are supporting communist style government intervention into the free market because your ideas are losers in the marketplace. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bee Posted October 14, 2018 #203 Share Posted October 14, 2018 5 hours ago, Setton said: Oh, and none of you have provided any evidence that it was 'CIA backed' so suggest you either drop that lie or put up the evidence. I thought it was more or less common knowledge that the CIA uses Facebook in various ways and so would therefore back it in various ways... to keep control of the goldmine that Facebook is for them... in terms of data collection, social and psychological manipulation... and I think now that they use it to help 'teach' and program Artificial Intelligence in some way... Are you seriously trying to claim or pretend that the CIA wouldn't have a vested interest in Facebook..? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Setton Posted October 14, 2018 #204 Share Posted October 14, 2018 6 minutes ago, bee said: thought it was more or less common knowledge that the CIA uses Facebook in various ways You said it was CIA 'backed', implying they provide material support to Facebook. This is a claim that has already been made on this thread and the poster disappeared when challenged. Now, do you want to provide evidence of your claim or are you content to walk it back to 'the CIA uses Facebook to gather information'. Which we all can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bee Posted October 14, 2018 #205 Share Posted October 14, 2018 5 hours ago, Farmer77 said: The alternative being that you are supporting communist style government intervention into the free market because your ideas are losers in the marketplace. The free market isn't free from regulation - for example... United States antitrust law "United States Antitrust law is a collection of federal and state government laws that regulates the conduct and organization of business corporations, generally to promote fair competition for the benefit of consumers. (The concept is called competition law in other English-speaking countries.) The main statutes are the Sherman Act of 1890, the Clayton Act of 1914 and the Federal Trade Commission Act of 1914. These Acts, first, restrict the formation of cartels and prohibit other collusive practices regarded as being in restraint of trade. Second, they restrict the mergers and acquisitions of organizations that could substantially lessen competition. Third, they prohibit the creation of a monopoly and the abuse of monopoly power." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bee Posted October 14, 2018 #206 Share Posted October 14, 2018 10 minutes ago, Setton said: You said it was CIA 'backed', implying they provide material support to Facebook. they're hardly going to admit it are they.... just like they are hardly going to let the Facebook Goose that lays them all their Golden Eggs slip away into 'other hands' .... that might try and reign them in and curb their involvement... It's just an exercise in logic... Timeline - where Facebook got it's funding you won't find CIA listed there but you can see how valuable it is... even though no one pays to be on it... it's the Users themselves that are the products that are bought and sold.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Setton Posted October 14, 2018 #207 Share Posted October 14, 2018 Just now, bee said: they're hardly going to admit it are they.... just like they are hardly going to let the Facebook Goose that lays them all their Golden Eggs slip away into 'other hands' .... that might try and reign them in and curb their involvement... It's just an exercise in logic... Timeline - where Facebook got it's funding you won't find CIA listed there but you can see how valuable it is... even though no one pays to be on it... it's the Users themselves that are the products that are bought and sold.. So absolutely no evidence to support your claim. Just supposition, guesswork and 'might haves'. Donald would be proud. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Setton Posted October 14, 2018 #208 Share Posted October 14, 2018 13 minutes ago, bee said: . These Acts, first, restrict the formation of cartels and prohibit other collusive practices regarded as being in restraint of trade. Second, they restrict the mergers and acquisitions of organizations that could substantially lessen competition. Third, they prohibit the creation of a monopoly and the abuse of monopoly power." None of which apply in this situation. But there are always people, like Jones, who think they are too special for the rules to apply to them. 1. Facebook is not part of a cartel. It actively competes with other companies, not collides with them. 2. This should stop your fear that alternative platforms would be bought out. Go and start your own and stop complaining about the rules. 3. Same as 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bee Posted October 14, 2018 #209 Share Posted October 14, 2018 2 minutes ago, Setton said: So absolutely no evidence to support your claim. Just supposition, guesswork and 'might haves'. Donald would be proud. you want me to find the documentation and receipts and copy / paste them on this thread... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Setton Posted October 14, 2018 #210 Share Posted October 14, 2018 Conservatives: It doesn't matter that Hillary won the popular vote. That's not the game. You can't complain when you lose a game because you don't like the rules. Also Conservatives: My favourite pundit was kicked off a free platform because he broke the rules. I don't like that result so they should change the rules. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Setton Posted October 14, 2018 #211 Share Posted October 14, 2018 Just now, bee said: you want me to find the documentation and receipts and copy / paste them on this thread... Just something beyond guesswork. Literally anything. Unless you're just admitting there is no evidence to support your claim? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bee Posted October 14, 2018 #212 Share Posted October 14, 2018 1 minute ago, Setton said: Just something beyond guesswork. Literally anything. Unless you're just admitting there is no evidence to support your claim? elementary basic logic.. again... you think that any evidence wouldn't be removed from the internet...? even if a miracle happened and I found some... and gave it to you it would probably be gone within hours... so you know you are safe to demand it and then go.... 'oh where's the evidence - it can't be true without the evidence' 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmer77 Posted October 14, 2018 #213 Share Posted October 14, 2018 4 minutes ago, bee said: elementary basic logic.. again... you think that any evidence wouldn't be removed from the internet...? even if a miracle happened and I found some... and gave it to you it would probably be gone within hours... so you know you are safe to demand it and then go.... 'oh where's the evidence - it can't be true without the evidence' Damn did you copy and paste that from the Flat Earth Society's website? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Setton Posted October 14, 2018 #214 Share Posted October 14, 2018 2 hours ago, bee said: elementary basic logic.. Basic logic can tell you something is possible. It doesn't mean it's happened. Quote again... you think that any evidence wouldn't be removed from the internet...? even if a miracle happened and I found some... and gave it to you it would probably be gone within hours... Convenient. If it helps, if you can really provide proof, I'd be happy to provide a postal address Quote so you know you are safe to demand it and then go.... 'oh where's the evidence - it can't be true without the evidence' Not can't be true. Just there's absolutely no reason to think it is. Very, very glad you're not a lawyer, police officer or doctor. Evidence is everything. God help the victim and defendant if you're ever called for jury service. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bee Posted October 15, 2018 #215 Share Posted October 15, 2018 (edited) 10 hours ago, Setton said: Very, very glad you're not a lawyer, police officer or doctor. Evidence is everything. God help the victim and defendant if you're ever called for jury service. funnily enough... I feel the same about you ... the way you are so easily fobbed off and quick to promote the more comfortable view that all this censorship is simply down to Free Market forces - But anyway.... I have devoted a few minutes to furthering my hypothesis.... and the obvious place to start is ............ at the beginning......... when Facebook began and who was involved .......... So back to the Timeline:where Facebook got it's funding quote.. February 2004 Mark Zuckerberg, Dustin Moskovitz, Chris Hughes and Eduardo Saverin launch The Facebook from their Harvard dorm room. June-July 2004 The fledgling social network receives $500,000 from Peter Thiel, president of Clarium Capital. end quote... ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ A quick look into Peter Thiel and if he has connections with the CIA reveals that Yes he has... https://www.forbes.com/profile/peter-thiel/#3b176b6533a3 "PayPal cofounder Peter Thiel became a venture capitalist and early investor in Facebook. He also cofounded CIA-backed big data startup Palantir, recently valued at $20 billion; his estimated 10% stake makes up two-thirds of his wealth." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ more about Palantir... https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4250750/Peter-Thiel-s-company-Palantir-built-CIA-funding.html "Palantir's role in helping the National Security Agency's domestic surveillance program was revealed in documents leaked by Edward Snowden. Palantir's initial funding came from Thiel, who is a chairman in the company and who invested $30 million after Palantir was founded in 2004. Another $2million came in 2005 from CIA's venture arm In-Q-Tel, which uses Palantir's products to help the intelligence agency break down large amounts of data. A private 2013 document which was leaked on Monday by TechCrunch shows that Palantir's other clients include the FBI, NSA, DHS and at least nine other US government groups." And information about the Investment Capital arm of the CIA ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ aaaaanyway - that's all for now - but a cursory look taking just a few minutes has revealed a connection between the person who first financed and elevated Facebook... and the CIA... not the kind of hard evidence you are demanding... but a positive move towards circumstantial evidence... (one is extremely unlikely to be able to provide hard evidence for something like that on the internet..... wouldn't you agree? ) Edited October 15, 2018 by bee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obviousman Posted October 15, 2018 #216 Share Posted October 15, 2018 Okay, so by Bee's logic: Person A donates $20,000 to the American Communist Party. Person A donates $10,000 to the Salvation Army. Therefore the Salvation Army is a communist-backed organisation. Yeah, right...... 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Setton Posted October 15, 2018 #217 Share Posted October 15, 2018 14 hours ago, bee said: funnily enough... I feel the same about you ... the way you are so easily fobbed off and quick to promote the more comfortable view that all this censorship is simply down to Free Market forces - But anyway.... I have devoted a few minutes to furthering my hypothesis.... and the obvious place to start is ............ at the beginning......... when Facebook began and who was involved .......... So back to the Timeline:where Facebook got it's funding quote.. February 2004 Mark Zuckerberg, Dustin Moskovitz, Chris Hughes and Eduardo Saverin launch The Facebook from their Harvard dorm room. June-July 2004 The fledgling social network receives $500,000 from Peter Thiel, president of Clarium Capital. end quote... ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ A quick look into Peter Thiel and if he has connections with the CIA reveals that Yes he has... https://www.forbes.com/profile/peter-thiel/#3b176b6533a3 "PayPal cofounder Peter Thiel became a venture capitalist and early investor in Facebook. He also cofounded CIA-backed big data startup Palantir, recently valued at $20 billion; his estimated 10% stake makes up two-thirds of his wealth." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ more about Palantir... https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4250750/Peter-Thiel-s-company-Palantir-built-CIA-funding.html "Palantir's role in helping the National Security Agency's domestic surveillance program was revealed in documents leaked by Edward Snowden. Palantir's initial funding came from Thiel, who is a chairman in the company and who invested $30 million after Palantir was founded in 2004. Another $2million came in 2005 from CIA's venture arm In-Q-Tel, which uses Palantir's products to help the intelligence agency break down large amounts of data. A private 2013 document which was leaked on Monday by TechCrunch shows that Palantir's other clients include the FBI, NSA, DHS and at least nine other US government groups." And information about the Investment Capital arm of the CIA ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ aaaaanyway - that's all for now - but a cursory look taking just a few minutes has revealed a connection between the person who first financed and elevated Facebook... and the CIA... not the kind of hard evidence you are demanding... but a positive move towards circumstantial evidence... (one is extremely unlikely to be able to provide hard evidence for something like that on the internet..... wouldn't you agree? ) And circumstantial evidence is just that - circumstantial. It wouldn't stand up in court and shouldn't in debate either. If, as you now seem to be saying, the evidence doesn't exist, you should stop stating your circumstantial evidence as fact. It's blatantly obvious to anyone intelligent enough not to blindly fall for rhetoric. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
preacherman76 Posted October 16, 2018 #218 Share Posted October 16, 2018 On 10/14/2018 at 7:32 AM, Farmer77 said: The alternative being that you are supporting communist style government intervention into the free market because your ideas are losers in the marketplace. If that were true, there would be no need to censor. Problem is these idea's are to popular. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Setton Posted October 16, 2018 #219 Share Posted October 16, 2018 1 hour ago, preacherman76 said: If that were true, there would be no need to censor. Problem is these idea's are to popular. No, the problem is these people break the terms of service. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bee Posted October 16, 2018 #220 Share Posted October 16, 2018 18 hours ago, Obviousman said: Okay, so by Bee's logic: Person A donates $20,000 to the American Communist Party. Person A donates $10,000 to the Salvation Army. Therefore the Salvation Army is a communist-backed organisation. Yeah, right...... I'm sorry but YOUR logic is faulty as you try to disprove MY logic.... If the Communist Party and the Salvation Army were very similar organizations you may have a point... but they are Apples and Oranges... I'm talking Apples and Apples when it comes to Facebook and Palantir .... as both are organizations used by the CIA for Surveilance.. and large scale data collection (etc) Perhaps you think it's a coincidence...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bee Posted October 16, 2018 #221 Share Posted October 16, 2018 3 hours ago, Setton said: No, the problem is these people break the terms of service. No... it's the major internet 'Social Media' sites etc colluding for political purposes... The timing of the Purge just before the US Mid Term elections is significant.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Setton Posted October 16, 2018 #222 Share Posted October 16, 2018 27 minutes ago, bee said: No... it's the major internet 'Social Media' sites etc colluding for political purposes... You've still shown nothing to support that accusation either. Remember, evidence not your 'interesting' version of logic. Quote The timing of the Purge just before the US Mid Term elections is significant.... He was banned over 3 months before the mid terms. That's 1/4 of a year. If you think that's 'just before', you'd have been able to find a close event whenever he'd been banned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bee Posted October 16, 2018 #223 Share Posted October 16, 2018 1 minute ago, Setton said: He was banned over 3 months before the mid terms. That's 1/4 of a year. If you think that's 'just before', you'd have been able to find a close event whenever he'd been banned. Yes weeks before a crucial mid term election - in the case of Alex Jones - And as predicted (by AJ and others) it was just the start and now others are getting the same treatment - From what I gather it is mainly conservative accounts but also some liberal ones.... who are opposed to the Corporate Democrats like Clinton and are anti war... It looks like a stealth operation... the censorship.... and is being rolled out in stages... But has gone up a gear just before the Mid Term Elections... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bee Posted October 17, 2018 #224 Share Posted October 17, 2018 14 hours ago, bee said: From what I gather it is mainly conservative accounts but also some liberal ones.... just to expand on this.... this is a short video from Jimmy Dore....a comedian and political commentator who is an anti war liberal progressive - They mention and at times discuss Alex Jones because they know that it is a principle at stake that is much bigger that the plight of AJ and InfoWars - (profanity warning) Facebook Censors 800 Anti-Establishment Pages As Predicted Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmer77 Posted October 17, 2018 #225 Share Posted October 17, 2018 23 hours ago, preacherman76 said: If that were true, there would be no need to censor. Problem is these idea's are to popular. If the rhetoric was popular enough companies would change their terms of service to accommodate the bigoted and socially unacceptable. Its not so it gets removed. Again , its not about politics, its about behavior. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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