Charlottesville Remembered

[Farmer77]

Charlottesville remembered: 'A battle for the soul of America'

 

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On 12 August, the small, serene city of Charlottesville, Virginia will mark the anniversary of a deadly white nationalist rally that shocked the nation.

The violence that day cost the life of a young counter-protester and scarred Charlottesville. An official report condemned city officials for failing to adequately prepare and police for standing by as confrontation turned to chaos.

In the year since, some residents have attempted to reckon with the legacy of that weekend and the racial inequality that persists in the city. Others have sought to consign the violence of last summer to the past, in an effort to restore to Charlottesville a lost reputation as a peaceful, progressive place - 2014's official Happiest City in America.

Here, in their own words, some of those closest to the events of that weekend tell the story of what happened, why it happened, and what it meant to a city and a nation.

 

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Dr Michael Williams, surgeon, UVA hospital We got a plan in place in anticipation, but I got a fair amount of push-back from my colleagues in surgery. They said "This is going to be a big nothing."

Seth Wispelwey, local minister It felt to me like a profound test. But there was no question about where I belonged and what I wanted to do.

Brenda Brown-Grooms, local minister We'd been monitoring the social media posts of the alt-right and they were detailing their hopes for the weekend, hopes for inciting a race war in the country, so we knew it was going to be dire.

Jalane Schmidt The crazy thing is we tried to warn the city. We had infiltrated chat rooms, taken screenshots. We made six dossiers, presented them to police, the city council, anyone who would listen. We said, "This is not a First Amendment rally. They are literally coming to kill us."

Emily Gorcenski, local activist There were explicit calls for violence there. We presented them to the city in the hope they would shut the rally down before it began.

 

 

Edited August 11, 2018 by Daughter of the Nine Moons
Fixed formatting

[GlitterRose]

It was astounding to me that law enforcement allowed a handful of people with signs to be surrounded by the other side (who vastly outnumbered them and were holding lit torches).

I was like...what were they even thinking? 

During any protest/counter-protest situation, you always want to keep them separated from each other. 

Otherwise, it's an inevitable **** show...really, no matter what the two factions are. And of course, even more if you add Nazis into the mix. 

 

[ExpandMyMind]

41 minutes ago, Farmer77 said:

Charlottesville remembered: 'A battle for the soul of America'

 

 

 

That's a couple of your posts that now appear on my mobile as hieroglyphics format. The quote bubble has one letter per line and the page requires more scrolling than the WW2 Wiki page 

All good when I change to desktop view though so must be my browser.

[CMPG]

I had to post it. No one is/was listening to my research and discovery. I will post all my independent views and research on a separate post. 

[Farmer77]

2 minutes ago, ExpandMyMind said:

That's a couple of your posts that now appear on my mobile as hieroglyphics format.

Oh **** grab the tinfoil …….clearly im being censored 

[ExpandMyMind]

25 minutes ago, Farmer77 said:

Oh **** grab the tinfoil …….clearly im being censored 

I'll see if the guy above you has a spare.

[Uncle Sam]

3 hours ago, Farmer77 said:

Oh **** grab the tinfoil …….clearly im being censored 

Hey now, everyone's views deserved to be heard. Let him post his views and opinions.

[Still Waters]

4 hours ago, CMPG said:

I had to post it. No one is/was listening to my research and discovery. I will post all my independent views and research on a separate post. 

Hello and welcome to UM.

We ask members not to post the same thing in more than one forum. I've removed your post because you've already started a topic about it. Your thread is here:

 

[+OverSword]

7 hours ago, GlitterRose said:

It was astounding to me that law enforcement allowed a handful of people with signs to be surrounded by the other side (who vastly outnumbered them and were holding lit torches).

I was like...what were they even thinking? 

During any protest/counter-protest situation, you always want to keep them separated from each other. 

Otherwise, it's an inevitable **** show...really, no matter what the two factions are. And of course, even more if you add Nazis into the mix. 

 

You're high:

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According to CNN, there were approximately 50 rally people, and approximately 1000 counter-protesters.

This is how CNN reported it:

About 50 guys in pajamas showed up for a rally, and they marched to a park. One thousand other people showed up to harass and intimidate them, and video shows that the crowd tried to prevent the pajamamen from entering the park.

The police made sure the pajamamen were able to enter the park. Then after about 40 minutes, the pajamamen wanted to go home, so they turned around to get to their cars. The huge crowd then tried to prevent the pajamamen from leaving the park and going to their cars. This is also on video.

Once they got to the cars, the huge crowd then tried to prevent the cars from leaving. Then the police told the huge crowd that they were acting illegally and to go home. The crowd became angry and violent, and bullied the police, and they sprayed the police with pepper spray. In response, the police sprayed the crowd with tear gas. Most of the crowd left after that.

Here is CNN’s version of events: KKK rally outnumbered by counterprotesters

 

Link

 

The unpalatable truth is that the nazi's had a legal right and a permit for their gathering and the counter protesters had no right to be there.  That does not justify anyone running a car through a crowd.

[Paranormal Panther]

Trump told the truth. Never apologize for it. There were bad people and good people on both sides. It wasn't just a bunch of White supremacists on one side, and it wasn't just a bunch of violent commies on one side. I'll continue to shun false agendas and false narratives used as a means of appeasing the ignorant. I saw live streams. No side is blameless. The whole tragedy could have been avoided if the Democrat governor did what he should have done.

[Paranormal Panther]

29 minutes ago, OverSword said:

You're high:

Link

 

The unpalatable truth is that the nazi's had a legal right and a permit for their gathering and the counter protesters had no right to be there.  That does not justify anyone running a car through a crowd.

Most of them weren't Nazis. There were average protesters on both sides. I watched a clip of a pro-monument group who talked about what they experienced that day, and there were one or two Black guys in the group. Much of the Charlottesville gathering is used as agitprop by individuals with less than pure intentions.

[ExpandMyMind]

24 minutes ago, OverSword said:

You're high:

Link

 

The unpalatable truth is that the nazi's had a legal right and a permit for their gathering and the counter protesters had no right to be there.  That does not justify anyone running a car through a crowd.

That refers only to Klan members. Estimates are around 500 total for protesters, 1000 counter-protesters.

If you watch the VICE documentary where a journalist is with the white supremacists you can see clearly that it's way, way more than just 50. 

Assuming the 1000 aren't all grouped together, which they weren't, it's entirely conceivable that some counter-protesters could have been surrounded.

Also, kinda crazy that there are actually people who defend the 'death to the Jews' shouting white supremacists while condemning the Charlottesville residents who showed up to counter them. 

That's what a lot of people seem to gloss over. The counter-protesters weren't "Antifa". They were overwhelmingly residents of a town that had been invaded by racist, hateful white supremacists - many of whom had military-grade weaponry.

[ExpandMyMind]

2 minutes ago, Paranormal Panther said:

Most of them weren't Nazis. There were average protesters on both sides

I'm sorry, but if you're marching with a group of people who are shouting racist remarks, carrying racist signs and making their racist intentions known, then you absolutely lose any moral high ground. You cease to be 'good people'. 

The people who joined that rally knew they were joining with KKK members and other Nazi-type people. Literally no good person would ever in a million years do that.

Simply, there were zero good people on the side of the Nazi, KKK, white supremacists march.

And that is something I would never have thought I would ever in my life have to explain to anyone with a functioning moral compass.

[+OverSword]

22 minutes ago, ExpandMyMind said:

That refers only to Klan members. Estimates are around 500 total for protesters, 1000 counter-protesters.

If you watch the VICE documentary where a journalist is with the white supremacists you can see clearly that it's way, way more than just 50. 

Assuming the 1000 aren't all grouped together, which they weren't, it's entirely conceivable that some counter-protesters could have been surrounded.

Also, kinda crazy that there are actually people who defend the 'death to the Jews' shouting white supremacists while condemning the Charlottesville residents who showed up to counter them. 

That's what a lot of people seem to gloss over. The counter-protesters weren't "Antifa". They were overwhelmingly residents of a town that had been invaded by racist, hateful white supremacists - many of whom had military-grade weaponry.

Regardless G-Rose made it out to be a small group of noble counter protesters being burned alive with tiki torches from a huge mob of kkk nazis.  The truth is, were it not for the people there protesting a legal gathering there would be no violence. 

[Paranormal Panther]

1 hour ago, ExpandMyMind said:

I'm sorry, but if you're marching with a group of people who are shouting racist remarks, carrying racist signs and making their racist intentions known, then you absolutely lose any moral high ground. You cease to be 'good people'. 

The people who joined that rally knew they were joining with KKK members and other Nazi-type people. Literally no good person would ever in a million years do that.

Simply, there were zero good people on the side of the Nazi, KKK, white supremacists march.

And that is something I would never have thought I would ever in my life have to explain to anyone with a functioning moral compass.

If you march with hateful and violent commies, are you also a hateful and violent commie? If so, all of the anti-statue marchers were unhinged leftists who started violence. That would be in keeping with your "logic". You have no control over the beliefs of other people, and you have no proof (it still matters) that all of the pro-monument marchers shared the views of White nationalists. Even the majority of the *White nationalists* weren't in the Ku Klux Klan or Nazi Party, so get it straight. It's also BS to characterize all of the marchers as White supremacists, and I have absolutey no problem with calling you out on it. Try that nonsense with naive people who believe what they're fed by liars trying to score cheap political points in their zillionth effort to tarnish Donald Trump as the new David Duke. Take your dumb emotionalism somewhere else, as there's an appreciable amount of dishonesty in your alleged moral compass.

[Paranormal Panther]

1 hour ago, ExpandMyMind said:

That refers only to Klan members. Estimates are around 500 total for protesters, 1000 counter-protesters.

If you watch the VICE documentary where a journalist is with the white supremacists you can see clearly that it's way, way more than just 50. 

Assuming the 1000 aren't all grouped together, which they weren't, it's entirely conceivable that some counter-protesters could have been surrounded.

Also, kinda crazy that there are actually people who defend the 'death to the Jews' shouting white supremacists while condemning the Charlottesville residents who showed up to counter them. 

That's what a lot of people seem to gloss over. The counter-protesters weren't "Antifa". They were overwhelmingly residents of a town that had been invaded by racist, hateful white supremacists - many of whom had military-grade weaponry.

That is such bull****. You regularly quote biased leftist sources as if it means something. Next, you'll post links to columns and stories from the SPLC. It's akin to asking Stormfront for live reports from the next event. There was a tiny group of Ku Klux Klan and Nazi Party members, some of whom likely were planted. Even most of the White nationalists don't welcome them! The ordinary marchers definitely don't. By the way, leftists *started* the violence, so there's that. 

[Uncle Sam]

1 hour ago, ExpandMyMind said:

That refers only to Klan members. Estimates are around 500 total for protesters, 1000 counter-protesters.

If you watch the VICE documentary where a journalist is with the white supremacists you can see clearly that it's way, way more than just 50. 

Assuming the 1000 aren't all grouped together, which they weren't, it's entirely conceivable that some counter-protesters could have been surrounded.

Also, kinda crazy that there are actually people who defend the 'death to the Jews' shouting white supremacists while condemning the Charlottesville residents who showed up to counter them. 

That's what a lot of people seem to gloss over. The counter-protesters weren't "Antifa". They were overwhelmingly residents of a town that had been invaded by racist, hateful white supremacists - many of whom had military-grade weaponry.

You do realize that Vice routinely lies in their articles and videos? You are taking them as a source? You got to be kidding me...

Vice's Fall Counterculture Hipster Rag to Neoliberal Government Mouthpiece

Media Bias Fact Check: VICE

Working At Vice Media Isn't As Cool As It Seems

Vice Responds to Article Above This

This basically shows that it is a neoliberal government mouthpiece magazine that attacks whoever they think attacks their credibility. Might want to look for a different source... they are willing to write lies, slander, and attack anyone that opposes what they write in their articles.

Edited August 11, 2018 by Uncle Sam

[Agent0range]

36 minutes ago, Paranormal Panther said:

 Even the majority of the *White nationalists* weren't in the Ku Klux Klan or Nazi Party, so get it straight.

I mean, there is video of hundreds of men chanting "Jews will not replace us."  Whether they are part of the klan or the Nazi party, is in my opinion irrelevant.  We know what they stand for.  No, there were not fine people on both sides.  

[Dark_Grey]

1 hour ago, Uncle Sam said:

You do realize that Vice routinely lies in their articles and videos? You are taking them as a source? You got to be kidding me...

Vice's Fall Counterculture Hipster Rag to Neoliberal Government Mouthpiece

Media Bias Fact Check: VICE

Working At Vice Media Isn't As Cool As It Seems

Vice Responds to Article Above This

This basically shows that it is a neoliberal government mouthpiece magazine that attacks whoever they think attacks their credibility. Might want to look for a different source... they are willing to write lies, slander, and attack anyone that opposes what they write in their articles.

It's a shame they sold out. They used to be on the edge of journalism. That being said, they still produce some great documentaries on things outside of politics.

[ExpandMyMind]

5 hours ago, Uncle Sam said:

You do realize that Vice routinely lies in their articles and videos? You are taking them as a source? You got to be kidding me...

Vice's Fall Counterculture Hipster Rag to Neoliberal Government Mouthpiece

Media Bias Fact Check: VICE

Working At Vice Media Isn't As Cool As It Seems

Vice Responds to Article Above This

This basically shows that it is a neoliberal government mouthpiece magazine that attacks whoever they think attacks their credibility. Might want to look for a different source... they are willing to write lies, slander, and attack anyone that opposes what they write in their articles.

You can just watch the video. At one point one of the supremacists is talking about sending 'hundreds' of his guys with guns. You can see - visually, with your own eyes - that there are way more than 50.

Hell, there were 250 marching the night before. 

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/d3/YOU_WILL_NOT_REPLACE_US_(-Charlottesville_-UniteTheRight).webm

6 hours ago, Paranormal Panther said:

That is such bull****. You regularly quote biased leftist sources as if it means something. Next, you'll post links to columns and stories from the SPLC. It's akin to asking Stormfront for live reports from the next event. There was a tiny group of Ku Klux Klan and Nazi Party members, some of whom likely were planted. Even most of the White nationalists don't welcome them! The ordinary marchers definitely don't. By the way, leftists *started* the violence, so there's that. 

See the link directly above. Hundreds of people marching, shouting 'jews will not replace us'.

Now you're even saying that challenging a group like that is 'starting' it? The 'leftists' you are referring to were Charlottesville townspeople who had literally been invaded by the lowest scum imaginable and decided to do something about it.

Why do conservatives go so far out of their way to support racists and their ilk?

Hiding behind free speech? "You are welcome to call me the N-word, and I am welcome to punch you in the face". People seem to think that they somehow can get away with saying anything with no consequences. Sure, the government might not throw you in jail, but there are a bunch of people more than within their rights to beat the **** out of you.

Continue with your defence of Nazis and white supremacists. Someone needs to stick up for the persecuted white man. 

[ExpandMyMind]

6 hours ago, Paranormal Panther said:

If you march with hateful and violent commies, are you also a hateful and violent commie? If so, all of the anti-statue marchers were unhinged leftists who started violence. That would be in keeping with your "logic". You have no control over the beliefs of other people, and you have no proof (it still matters) that all of the pro-monument marchers shared the views of White nationalists. Even the majority of the *White nationalists* weren't in the Ku Klux Klan or Nazi Party, so get it straight. 

Those 'hateful commies' as you call them exist for the sole reason to oppose the White supremacists. There is no moral equivalence to be made between the two. One group are *******s, the other group get together to challenge the *******s. Astounding that you think they can in any way be compared.

The vast, vast majority of the counter-protesters were residents of Charlottesville, not "Antifa". 

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It's also BS to characterize all of the marchers as White supremacists, and I have absolutey no problem with calling you out on it. Try that nonsense with naive people who believe what they're fed by liars trying to score cheap political points in their zillionth effort to tarnish Donald Trump as the new David Duke. Take your dumb emotionalism somewhere else, as there's an appreciable amount of dishonesty in your alleged moral compass.

Again, I don't care if they're there to protest billionaires, anyone who isn't racist would never in any way join a march with people like those. You lose the pretense of not being racist when you march with a group of exclusive racist people.

You can see it from the video posted above from the night before, hundreds of people carrying torches and chanting racist remarks. 

It doesn't get more simple than that.

"There were only a few racists"  Pull the other one. 

And while Trump might not be Duke, he is a demonstrable racist. It's documented record that he is undeniably racist. But even if he didn't outright support the white supremacists of Charlottesville, he did defend them, according to racists all over the internet. Those people are a significant part of his base and Republicans are largely sympathisers, as any of the right-wing replies to these threads demonstrate. I guess it must be tough going, living as a white man in the US these days 

I'm still astounded that so many people actually try to defend this march. It shows that even after half a century and a black President, the US hasn't moved on as far as some might think from the Civil Rights era.

 

 

Edited August 11, 2018 by ExpandMyMind

[Farmer77]

11 hours ago, Paranormal Panther said:

Trump told the truth. Never apologize for it. There were bad people and good people on both sides. It wasn't just a bunch of White supremacists on one side, and it wasn't just a bunch of violent commies on one side. I'll continue to shun false agendas and false narratives used as a means of appeasing the ignorant. I saw live streams. No side is blameless. The whole tragedy could have been avoided if the Democrat governor did what he should have done.

The entire thing was organized by white supremacists, thats undeniable fact.

A Guide to Who’s Coming to the Largest White Nationalist Rally in a Decade

 

If you choose to rally with white supremacists regardless of cause you are scum period end of discussion. 

 

Edited August 11, 2018 by Farmer77

[Farmer77]

 

 

9 hours ago, Uncle Sam said:

This basically shows that it is a neoliberal government mouthpiece magazine that attacks whoever they think attacks their credibility. Might want to look for a different source... they are willing to write lies, slander, and attack anyone that opposes what they write in their articles.

Yes theyre a government mouthpiece that is why they allowed Ruport Murdoch to purchase 5% of their company  

 

 

[Sir Wearer of Hats]

9 minutes ago, Farmer77 said:

Yes theyre a government mouthpiece that is why they allowed Ruport Murdoch to purchase 5% of their company  

Isn’t Darth Rupert funding your government as well? He’s certsinly got Teflon Turnbull by the short and curlies here.

[Farmer77]

9 hours ago, Paranormal Panther said:

That is such bull****. You regularly quote biased leftist sources as if it means something. Next, you'll post links to columns and stories from the SPLC. It's akin to asking Stormfront for live reports from the next event. There was a tiny group of Ku Klux Klan and Nazi Party members, some of whom likely were planted. Even most of the White nationalists don't welcome them!

So this is telling. You seem to delineate between white nationalists and Neo Nazi and KKK. Why the hell would you fall for that propaganda?

9 hours ago, Paranormal Panther said:

The ordinary marchers definitely don't. By the way, leftists *started* the violence, so there's that. 

There were no "ordinary" marchers. The entire thing , despite your revisionist history, was organized by racists in an attempt to mainstream their views. Based on your responses it looks like it worked. 

Jason Kessler is who applied for the permit these are his own words and those of his associates : 

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Isaac Smith, former ally of Jason Kessler Kessler's idea was to try to unite the alt-right with the mainstream right, and get regular Republicans to show up.

Jason Kessler The moderate speakers did not want to be on the same stage as Richard Spencer, so it ended up being much more far right than I intended it to be.

Organizer of Charlottesville white supremacist rally calls slain protester's death 'payback time'

 

So here is an article from before Charlottesville plainly detailing the folks you are arguing are "very fine people" 

A Guide to Who’s Coming to the Largest White Nationalist Rally in a Decade

 

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The Unite the Right rally, which will take place in Charlottesville, Virginia on August 12, 2017, looks like it will be the largest White Nationalist rally in the United States in more than a decade. Between 500 and 1,000 people are expected to participate, while up to 4,000 counter-protestors may come.

While there have been numerous Far Right rallies since Donald Trump’s inauguration in January 2017, this is the first major one that is led by fascists and other White Nationalists, which include Richard Spencer, Matthew Heimbach, Mike Enoch, and Michael Hill. It is also the third rally to be held in Charlottesville this year; the first one, in May, was marked by a torchlight rally at night, and was followed by a KKK march in July.

Again please do note the date in the above link. These people weren't bussed in as a "false flag" psyop operation. The scum were the organizers.