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Scudbuster

Religion........ and its Deep Roots of Fear

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XenoFish

The same fill in the blank I've seen forever.:rolleyes:

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Habitat
35 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

The same fill in the blank I've seen forever.:rolleyes:

That is because you are looking for a rational answer, and there isn't one. The progress away from the ego and its accomplice Reason, has to be a slow and cautious one, and it isn't a matter of ditching either, but of gradually taking to heart, truths that your ego resists. For example, in the total scheme of things, how can I be more important than some random person from the other side of the world, I have never met ?  Do you find yourself resisting that ? That would be your ego, but deep down, we know it to be true, logically applied. There is a little clue in that, that the ego is really censoring your faculty of reason, by quelling that notion, that maybe you aren't really more important than the next person. It is a matter of jettisoning all the little vanities ( maybe a few bigger ones are present) that we have been host to (and they will have been useful to us in getting established in the world), in the interests of greater awareness, and fidelity to the Truth. Cherished ideas and attitudes, that are really falsehoods, however well disguised, will stop any progress. Thus it is seen, that the true pathway, is one of growth and resolution of psychological conflicts and illusions, and nothing can be exempted from the bargain.

Edited by Habitat
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psyche101
22 hours ago, Habitat said:

Guyver is not at all fanatical, neither am I.

Yes you both are. Very much so. IMO you would both be better suited to a blog where you can rearrange science to conform to your own beliefs and dictate the replies. You both go on the offensive as soon as anyone dents your pet theories. 

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He goes on the evidence as he finds it, much as I do, seemingly.

Uteer nonsense. You both eschew science for your own bizarre twisted version created to support your own pet theories based on superstition. You are both as credible as Walker and his alien God. 

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But, as I say, those that are looking to others for "spiritual" guidance, whether it be the dictates organized religion, or the dictates of people pretending to know religion is all falsehood, you are in deep do-do, and naturally aren't even aware you are. You may climb out of the mire, but there is a kind of evolutionary movement in the psyche, that whilst tending to greater integration, can stall, or be very slow in the happening.

Making stuff up only validates it to yourself  and has the side effect of looking like a a kook to go along with it. Anyone who makes stuff up when there is knowledge to be gained isn't in deep dodo, they have real world problems and are grasping at the easiest answer. It's rather obvious that many turn to religion because they re too lazy to learn real world answers through the sciences. Religion is a one size fits all because it doesn't matter if one goes to an organised church, the experience still tends to be personal. You guys think your special and have found the light. It's laughable. 

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Oh, and did I mention you have the whole situation inverted here, psyche 101 ? 

Yes, but let's face it, you say apt of things and yet not much of what you say is logical or adds to a discussion. Your just a belligerent Belief basher. 

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psyche101
54 minutes ago, Habitat said:

That is because you are looking for a rational answer, and there isn't one. 

Yes there is. You refuse it and tell everyone to ignore them and play dumb. 

Morse code from the dead sure isn't rational, so you have to abandon common sense and logic and are trying to drag others down to buoy up your beliefs. What you propose is nonsensical and you know it, so you rely on the appeal to authority of religion to float your whacky theories. 

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Guyver
23 hours ago, psyche101 said:

Bwahaha, that could have been written by Will Due, you should have made a pointless and stupid comment with a roundabout and it would be almost identical to some of those fanatical posts. 

All your expressing here is that the enemy of your enemy makes you comrades. If Xeno and Davros weren't showing you basic truths about how things really are you would be fighting amongst yourselves. Just a bunch of very silly peas in a pod. All making stuff up and supporting each others imaginations. It's a joke really. 

And Xenos desception of Guyver is, spot on. None of you fanaticals are here to learn or share, your all here to challenge for some preacher/shaman position, validate your beliefs and oust the evil atheism. It's 11th century thinking challenging 21st century thinking. It's only you fanaticals who don't see how fanatical you all are. 

If you think that failing is funny; then the only person you should be laughing at is yourself for the high level of fail you just pulled with your post.  Funny thing is, there are some people who gave you props for it.  So, just like the lab rats pumping dopamine from Davros' video....you just got yours.  All the while you reinforce your gigantic wall of denial supported by your over-the-top cognitive bias.  There's no fanaticism here, there's no shamans or preachers here, and this most certainly is NOT an 11th century verses 21st century thread.  

What a joke.  You probably didn't even read the thread yourself.  But you had to stomp in here and attempt to insult everyone.  You must think nothing but stupid people are reading this thread.  I checked the post count.  Since I was last posting, yesterday morning.....about 500 people have read the thread.  Or, 500 minus the number of people who have read these recent responses more than once.  

The only thing you have done (for anyone with half a brain who actually thinks about anything) is demonstrate how completely closed-minded and aggressive an ego driven atheist can be who longs only to get some props from the peanut gallery while huffing and puffing, sticking his chest out, and pointing the finger at other people who have said nothing to you; nothing about you and didn't even ask for your input.  I wouldn't be surprised if you read this response, blink twice, and literally have nothing but a cranial blur that resets you to your standard default position like some kind of 90's IBM computer.  

So whatever dude.  

 

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joc
1 hour ago, Habitat said:

 

 There really is no other message in it, although we are told God is love, it is really another way of saying that togetherness, inclusiveness, unity, are  the ultimate, true reality.

Yep, making it up as you go along...humerous... but it is getting boring.

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psyche101
4 hours ago, Will Due said:

 

How about the myth that the universe does not have a center. :D

 

 

That's not a myth and despite making this false claim again and again you have provided no evidence to support your lie. 

That's deliberate misinformation Will. Isn't that against the rules? 

How do you expect people to respect your beliefs if you have to lie for them? How do you find respect them when you lie for them? 

Edited by psyche101
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ChrLzs
On 9/15/2018 at 10:26 AM, Habitat said:

Some don't like anchovies on their pizza, but they don't stand outside the pizza parlour...

Wow, that's such a great analogy.  Yep anchovies have wars against sardines, they kill people in their name, they have ill-founded rules about homosexuality and lots of other topics, they demand sacrifices, etc...

Yep, eggzackerly the same.

 

Sheesh.

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psyche101
55 minutes ago, Guyver said:

If you think that failing is funny; then the only person you should be laughing at is yourself for the high level of fail you just pulled with your post. 

Where was the mirth in my post? You making that up too? 

Because a belligerent story teller who fears science said so??  LOL in your head and those if your little group of story tellers maybe. You can't point out anything inaccurate you can only ad hom because you got nothing. 

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Funny thing is, there are some people who gave you props for it. 

Because your right and the rest of the world is wrong again I suppose. 

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So, just like the lab rats pumping dopamine from Davros' video....you just got yours. 

Those posters are quite welcome to pull me up in anything inaccurate I say, they don't because I don't make crap up like you and your merry little band of myth makers and worshipers. Just like you can't find inaccuracies in my posts so you throw insults hoping some will stick while you turn tail and run, all the whole deflecting that fact that you've just been presented with real evidence that refutes your personal narratives. Like I told your buddy, you guys need a blog. You don't want to discuss anything you want to preach your personal beliefs.

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All the while you reinforce your gigantic wall of denial supported by your over-the-top cognitive bias.  There's no fanaticism here, there's no shamans or preachers here, and this most certainly is NOT an 11th century verses 21st century thread.  

It sure as heck is. You're obviously offended at me simply pointing it out. Yes, the myths you 'spiritual lot' call 'ancient knowledge' (LOL) are purely 11th century thinking. The 21st century thinking of the cutting edge in physics outright disproves your pet theories fashioned from myth. Insults doesn't change that. 

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What a joke.  You probably didn't even read the thread yourself.  But you had to stomp in here and attempt to insult everyone.

The difference between you and I reading a thread is I take it all in without a filter to remove any realistic possibilities and concentrating on myths and superstitions. 

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  You must think nothing but stupid people are reading this thread. 

Not everyone. You mentioned Davros yourself. He is a lot more switched on than you hab and will tied together and folded over. 

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I checked the post count.  Since I was last posting, yesterday morning.....about 500 people have read the thread.  Or, 500 minus the number of people who have read these recent responses more than once.  

And yet your still babbling on with the same self serving crap rather than entering a real discussion that goes forward. 

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The only thing you have done (for anyone with half a brain who actually thinks about anything) is demonstrate how completely closed-minded and aggressive an ego driven atheist can be who longs only to get some props from the peanut gallery while huffing and puffing, sticking his chest out, and pointing the finger at other people who have said nothing to you; nothing about you and didn't even ask for your input.  I wouldn't be surprised if you read this response, blink twice, and literally have nothing but a cranial blur that resets you to your standard default position like some kind of 90's IBM computer.  

And yet I'm only getting reactions from the people with brains, and protests form those with half a brain! You have along way to go about educating yourself before you could hold a real discussion with me. You aren't even aware of the factors that obliterate your superstitious myths and you turn with your tail between your legs and run like a greyhound whenever real science shows up in a discussion. Your best talent is insulting those who show how 11th century your thinking really is. 

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So whatever dude.  

Oh yeah dude your so cool. So much street cred. 

Old people thinking they are teenagers. How sad indeed. Seems prevalent amongst the hard core believers. 

You couldn't make it through a single paragraph on physics without getting upset and resorting to insult. You're not alone though, posters like you are dime a dozen. 

Edited by psyche101
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Habitat

Dearie me, such venom, the proof that "they" are invested, and  are anxious to protect that investment, from the intrusion of any doubts. A man secure in his own mind, would not be resorting to cheap shots.

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ChrLzs
4 minutes ago, Habitat said:

Dearie me, such venom, the proof that "they" are invested, and  are anxious to protect that investment, from the intrusion of any doubts. A man secure in his own mind, would not be resorting to cheap shots.

Dearie me, such avoidance of debate - a completely contentless post.  Why not ADDRESS and debate the 'cheap shots'?

(Don't bother answering, your ironic post told us..)

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joc
On 9/14/2018 at 8:09 PM, XenoFish said:

How many people on average do you think are damaged by religious ideologies? 1 out of every 10 people? More? If someone is given a guilt complex due to the idea that god will punish them for anything and everything they do. And they commit suicide because of this. What good has religion done for them? What good has it done to those so indoctrinated that they willfully blow themselves up for their religious belief?

And let's not forget the dear departed souls who departed willingly because they didn't want to wait to experience the wonders of God...so they offed themselves to be with God...NOW!   Fear is the great mind killer!  And Religion is based in Fear! If a = b and b = c then a = c.  Therefore...Religion is the great mind killer!

And there we have it folks.  The true reason for religion...to control the masses...through fear.  It's ingenious, it's diabolical, it's sick and twisted!  And it is legal...

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psyche101
13 minutes ago, Habitat said:

Dearie me, such venom, the proof that "they" are invested, and  are anxious to protect that investment, from the intrusion of any doubts. A man secure in his own mind, would not be resorting to cheap shots.

 

On 10/8/2018 at 12:42 PM, Habitat said:

You just wait till I publish my thesis about faeces being the centrepiece of physiological functions, I will cite your "evidence" about brain chemicals being central to psychology ! But I fear the peer reviewers will declare all of it, just **** !

tenor.gif

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Guyver
33 minutes ago, psyche101 said:

And yet I'm only getting reactions from the people with brains, and protests form those with half a brain! You have along way to go about educating yourself before you could hold a real discussion with me. You aren't even aware of the factors that obliterate your superstitious myths and you turn with your tail between your legs and run like a greyhound whenever real science shows up in a discussion. Your best talent is insulting those who show how 11th century your thinking really is. 

Reboot complete.  

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Guyver

Way to go Psyche.  You'll probably get this thread locked too.

 

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Guyver

Deleted by me.

Edited by Guyver
Delete on purpose

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Habitat

I have all the time in the world for science, not quasi-science where people think if they call it as being supported by science ( even if it isn't), it trumps whatever you say. Not so !

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kmt_sesh

People, dial it down. Your attitudes win points for neither side. You could at least try to look open minded rather than allowing juvenile aggression to lead you astray,

This thread is now being watched. Give us a reason for not closing it.

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danydandan
6 hours ago, Habitat said:

They are all fringe ideas that the majority of people don't buy, but the old "riddle of existence" is a perfect fit for mythology, because science has nothing to offer as a substitute.

Yes it has, and the Crux of the issue is you just don't like what your hearing.

Existence isn't a myth, we exist.

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psyche101
59 minutes ago, Habitat said:

I have all the time in the world for science, not quasi-science where people think if they call it as being supported by science ( even if it isn't), it trumps whatever you say. Not so !

Denying physics for superstition and myth is not a science. Nor is calling the best physicists in the world names. You don't even lend yourself to quasi science. You just make stuff up and attack anyone who questions your personal tales

 

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psyche101
1 hour ago, Guyver said:

Reboot complete.  

If that's as far as your mind can stretch  its no wonder that's what you think. 

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Habitat
55 minutes ago, danydandan said:

Yes it has, and the Crux of the issue is you just don't like what your hearing.

Existence isn't a myth, we exist.

We have known we exist since the year dot, and that isn't down to some scientific discovery. Perhaps you can join hands with brother Psyche 101, and chant the Hawking mantra, that the laws of physics allow the universe to arise spontaneously from nothing at all, but Oh Lord, we have a problem, how did those laws of physics arise ? One sees that it is an insoluble problem, if you deem it to be a problem, using the faculty of reason. Not that I am saying for one second, that mythic "explanations" of any religion, are any more useful, they aren't, but to the modern mindset, "laws of physics" is a more convincing sounding "reason" than "God", for many people, but of course it is similarly impotent. So the smart choice is either to quit worrying about it, or use that other faculty of the mind, that the mystics insist is the only way. Reason won't help, as indispensable as it otherwise is.

Edited by Habitat

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ChrLzs
28 minutes ago, Habitat said:

We have known we exist since the year dot, and that isn't down to some scientific discovery.

Got that from the bible perhaps?  Have you actually read the historical account, and worked out how the years 'fall'?  There seems to be a few problems aligning that with reality.  But never mind.

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Perhaps you can join hands with brother Psyche 101, and chant the Hawking mantra

GROW UP and stick to the topics.

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 that the laws of physics allow the universe to arise spontaneously from nothing at all, but ...Oh Lord, how did those laws of physics arise ?

Seems to be exactly the same problem as How did God arise?  Anudda God?  Can you explain how this differs, other than in your case, you simply refuse to consider it?

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One sees that it is an insoluble problem, if you deem it to be a problem, using the faculty of reason.

But it's not actually a problem.  Things can balance, there can be an anti-matter universe to see to that, and no matter what you come up with for either side, that origin of everything (including your God) arises.  You can't escape that.  The difference is that we accept that it is something we will probably never know, but will keep looking and getting closer and closer...  Your approach is to call up some mythical hammer wielding engineer from the sky.

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Not that I am saying for one second, that mythic "explanations" of any religion, are any more useful, they aren't

How about you admit that right up front and don't claim some superior position when you haven't a leg to stand on?  Would save us a bit of time.

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but to the modern mindset, "laws of physics" is a more convincing sounding "reason" than "God", for many people, but of course it is similarly impotent.

Physics, cosmology etc always explains ACTUAL OBSERVATIONS.  The stuff we see happening.  We are not seeing the Red Sea part, so we don't need to explain that.  We are not seeing evolution do anything that evolution doesn't do, so we don't need to explain that   We are not seeing any trace of anything super-normal.  Until we do, there's nuthin much to investigate - this 'God' thingy is very quiet, isn't it?  Also very invisible.  Doesn't even smell...  Might as well not exist.

Anyways, when you have something that you don't destroy in your own post, let us know.

Edited by ChrLzs
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danydandan
46 minutes ago, Habitat said:

We have known we exist since the year dot, and that isn't down to some scientific discovery. Perhaps you can join hands with brother Psyche 101, and chant the Hawking mantra, that the laws of physics allow the universe to arise spontaneously from nothing at all, but Oh Lord, we have a problem, how did those laws of physics arise ? One sees that it is an insoluble problem, if you deem it to be a problem, using the faculty of reason. Not that I am saying for one second, that mythic "explanations" of any religion, are any more useful, they aren't, but to the modern mindset, "laws of physics" is a more convincing sounding "reason" than "God", for many people, but of course it is similarly impotent. So the smart choice is either to quit worrying about it, or use that other faculty of the mind, that the mystics insist is the only way. Reason won't help, as indispensable as it otherwise is.

Ultimately God isn't necessary, for the creation of life nor is he necessary for the creation of the Universe.

Perhaps you should read up on the BBT a bit more, it just describes the expansion of the earliest time we can rewind to regarding expansion. It makes no claims what so ever on what happened at 0 or why what happened, happened or why it's still happening. For all anyone knows it might have been a devine spark or whatever but it probably was not.

Now before the big bang, personally I am in favour of the chaotic expansion theory, very quantum mechanics heavy and a mixture of Rodger Penrose's cycling universe theory. Will we ever know, probably not. No need for God in any of these.

And as far as the universe spontaneously arising, ask yourself the question. Did God spontaneously arise?

But then your left with a single question. "What started it all?" Who feck knows. But jumping to an being, which all evidence suggests, is probably an imaginary construct is ridiculously absurd. Don't you think?

Regarding actual life, it's been shown that life can and will spontaneously arise from primary elements. So our existence is not depended on God. Unless of course you delve back to "What started it all?"

In the grand scheme of things, does really bloody matter?

Edited by danydandan
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psyche101
46 minutes ago, Habitat said:

We have known we exist since the year dot, and that isn't down to some scientific discovery. Perhaps you can join hands with brother Psyche 101, and chant the Hawking mantra, that the laws of physics allow the universe to arise spontaneously from nothing at all, but Oh Lord, we have a problem, how did those laws of physics arise ? One sees that it is an insoluble problem, if you deem it to be a problem, using the faculty of reason. Not that I am saying for one second, that mythic "explanations" of any religion, are any more useful, they aren't, but to the modern mindset, "laws of physics" is a more convincing sounding "reason" than "God", for many people, but of course it is similarly impotent. So the smart choice is either to quit worrying about it, or use that other faculty of the mind, that the mystics insist is the only way. Reason won't help, as indispensable as it otherwise is.

How do physics exist without matter? 

Quite obviously there is an symbiotic relationship borne out of QM. It's not well understood, but there's absolutely no reason to invoke a god either, that's ridiculous. 

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