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Scudbuster

Religion........ and its Deep Roots of Fear

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Habitat
8 minutes ago, danydandan said:

In the grand scheme of things, does really bloody matter?

 

That is for you to decide if it matters to you, if it does matter to someone, science won't help, nor "creation" myths of any kind. But, amazingly, there is a way. 

 

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danydandan
2 minutes ago, Habitat said:

 

That is for you to decide if it matters to you, if it does matter to someone, science won't help, nor "creation" myths of any kind. But, amazingly, there is a way. 

 

It doesn't matter because its unanswerable. I'm interested in it, but I know full well it's irrelevant to our existence.

And no there is no way to answer it, with certainty and to say so is wrong.

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Habitat
3 minutes ago, psyche101 said:

How do physics exist without matter? 

Quite obviously there is an symbiotic relationship borne out of QM. It's not well understood, but there's absolutely no reason to invoke a god either, that's ridiculous. 

I didn't invoke God, I said mythic tales don't help, what might help is to ask whether ultimately, all distinctions are illusory, in which case there is no now or then, no here or there, and the chain of causality evaporates. It is a problem of the mind, that can be solved by the mind, but not via reason.

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Habitat
4 minutes ago, danydandan said:

And no there is no way to answer it, with certainty and to say so is wrong.

So all those have travelled that path, are liars, or delusional ?

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danydandan
13 minutes ago, Habitat said:

So all those have travelled that path, are liars, or delusional ?

Not liars, mostly delusional. Anyone tells you they know why we're really here, is either self deluded or, yes, a liar.

Edit: If they also tell you they know how we got here too, the above applies.

Edit, Edit: Before people jump on my back I'm not talking about our evolutionary history or our Galaxies evolutionary history. I'm talking about the spark that started it all.

Edited by danydandan
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Habitat
Just now, danydandan said:

Not liars, mostly delusional. Anyone tells you they know why we're really here, is either self deluded or, yes, a liar.

That is a guess, and not a good one. I tell you, the entire domain of religion, to the extent it is "non-fiction", hinges on what I am talking about, being true. Otherwise it would be nothing but creative writing. And not very interesting to me. What could be more enchanting, that it be true, and I consider it is, that anyone, in principle, can experience the All, that some call God.

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danydandan
Just now, Habitat said:

That is a guess, and not a good one. I tell you, the entire domain of religion, to the extent it is "non-fiction", hinges on what I am talking about, being true. Otherwise it would be nothing but creative writing. And not very interesting to me. What could be more enchanting, that it be true, and I consider it is, that anyone, in principle, can experience the All, that some call God.

I'm sorry thats nonsensical. Nothing suggests or supports that notion, other than delusional constructs or people lying.

Your also not addressing the point to be honest. Which is your tact as far as I can see.

There is no way of answering these questions, that includes your cosmic consciousness, with certainty. Show me how anyone can answer with certainty!

 

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Habitat
7 minutes ago, danydandan said:

I'm sorry thats nonsensical. Nothing suggests or supports that notion, other than delusional constructs or people lying.

Your also not addressing the point to be honest. Which is your tact as far as I can see.

There is no way of answering these questions, that includes your cosmic consciousness, with certainty. Show me how anyone can answer with certainty!

 

Not answerable by rational thinking. What a horrible connotation surrounds the word "irrational", but it really seems that ultimate reality is irrational, there are no divisions, the divisions are what we make, and as an everyday practical way of dealing with the world, it works, it is a model of reality that functions well, but not the "real" reality. To be enchanted with the "model", is to be estranged from the "master reality". But it is possible, and indeed necessary for this quest, to take a holiday from the "model", for as long as it takes. Easier said than done, and only to be done, by those that are so called, by the vagaries of their own nature, and other accidents of life.

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eight bits
48 minutes ago, Habitat said:

So all those have travelled that path, are liars, or delusional ?

Mistaken, perhaps. That, too, happens to people.

Quote

Not answerable by rational thinking.

Fixed that for you.

Edited by eight bits
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Habitat
4 minutes ago, eight bits said:

Fixed that for you.

Fixed nothing. An example, only those that have fallen in love, know the experience. It is not communicable, teachable, renderable in any way, other than direct experience. Those that think it may, have never been "in love". One may say, it requires a certain kind of heart, to have the possibility of falling in love. It requires a certain kind of heart, and mind, to be open to the possibility of the Divine.

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Habitat
1 hour ago, danydandan said:

Edit, Edit: Before people jump on my back I'm not talking about our evolutionary history or our Galaxies evolutionary history. I'm talking about the spark that started it all.

Causality only "works", when examining the relationships between elements of a system. The entire system can't be spoken of in causal terms. Our notion of causality relies on concepts of discrete elements within a system, the entire system, as an entirety, defies causality.

 

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XenoFish
5 hours ago, ChrLzs said:

Wow, that's such a great analogy.  Yep anchovies have wars against sardines, they kill people in their name, they have ill-founded rules about homosexuality and lots of other topics, they demand sacrifices, etc...

Yep, eggzackerly the same.

 

Sheesh.

I remember that war. The horror, the horror of it all.:lol:

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Habitat

Yes, old Charlie cropped that old post of mine, to erase the original sense of it, bravo, if you can't "win" by fair means, what's wrong with a bit of misrepresentation ?

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Will do

 

@psyche101

Can you name just one thing that exists that's made of matter and does not have a physical or geographic center?

There is no such thing. Everything has a center. That's how it's a myth that the universe does not have a center psyche101.

At the very minimum, it stretches to the extreme the basis of logic to deny that the universe does not have a center and is obviously rooted in a sort of quasi-religious fear that if the certain truth is admitted that the universe does have a center, then, there must be something there that controls and dominates everything.

And most people know what that is psyche101, and they're not fearful about it.

So, when science becomes a religion, which it has no business doing, it becomes fear based regarding the existence of God. 

 

 

Edited by Will Due
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Habitat

And what difference would that make, to you, Will, if there is a centre or not ?

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Will do
2 minutes ago, Habitat said:

And what difference would that make, to you, Will, if there is a centre or not ?

 

It makes a difference that the truth is true.

 

 

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XenoFish

Why do people so adamantly adhere to the idea of God? 

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Habitat
13 minutes ago, Will Due said:

 

It makes a difference that the truth is true.

 

 

Ploise eggsplain

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Habitat
5 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

Why do people so adamantly adhere to the idea of God? 

Why do you think ?

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XenoFish
Just now, Habitat said:

Why do you think ?

Dopamine kick.

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danydandan
24 minutes ago, Habitat said:

And what difference would that make, to you, Will, if there is a centre or not ?

In the Urantia Book it emphasises that Urantia (Earth) is the centre of the universe. So it's very important to Will.

There is no centre of infinity. I can prove that I'm the centre of the Universe, I can prove your also the centre of the Universe. I can prove any point in the visible universe is the centre.

Edited by danydandan

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danydandan
11 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

Why do people so adamantly adhere to the idea of God? 

For me I just like to believe there is a God.

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XenoFish
2 minutes ago, danydandan said:

For me I just like to believe there is a God.

Do you take this belief seriously? 

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Habitat
6 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

Dopamine kick.

Well, don't you like dopamine kicks ?

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XenoFish
Just now, Habitat said:

Well, don't you like dopamine kicks ?

If I did I wouldn't be a functional depressive now would I? 

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