RavenHawk Posted October 7, 2018 #76 Share Posted October 7, 2018 13 hours ago, Tatetopa said: What does a representative democracy become when people and representatives can;t talk in safety? Socialism. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
White-Coyote Posted October 7, 2018 #77 Share Posted October 7, 2018 5 minutes ago, Captain Risky said: it was no court room. it was a hearing. Kavanaugh readily admitted afterwards that he went too far. shouldn't he have just told the truth that there was a big drinking culture around him and he liked the ladies? did Ford and the others have to provide evidence that he liked beer... btw, stay on topic. Freedom kinda is the topic, from my prospective 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RavenHawk Posted October 7, 2018 #78 Share Posted October 7, 2018 13 hours ago, Tatetopa said: In the interest of balance, I would like to say some of the right wing fantasies are as extreme. I recall how energized people were by the "Obama is going to take all of our guns." fever. that flies in the face of the Second Amendment and the power of the citizenry to resist that. Obama's angle was to take away the ammo. We could keep our guns but it would be illegal to have ammo. He and the Progressives were active in striping the 2nd. He had signed something like 23 EOs concerning gun control? Yes, it does fly in the face of the 2nd but nothing can be allowed to interfere with Fundamental Change. The power of the citizenry lies in the 2nd. You take that away, you enslave the people. Why wait until it is painfully obvious before something is done? Why not do something when it is plainly obvious? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoofGardener Posted October 7, 2018 #79 Share Posted October 7, 2018 Apparently the petition to get Weird Al Yankovitch to do the Super Bowl half-time show has reached 42,000 votes ! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmer77 Posted October 7, 2018 #80 Share Posted October 7, 2018 3 hours ago, RoofGardener said: Apparently the petition to get Weird Al Yankovitch to do the Super Bowl half-time show has reached 42,000 votes ! Beats the hell outta Maroon5 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tatetopa Posted October 7, 2018 #81 Share Posted October 7, 2018 9 hours ago, RavenHawk said: Obama's angle was to take away the ammo. We could keep our guns but it would be illegal to have ammo. He and the Progressives were active in striping the 2nd. He had signed something like 23 EOs concerning gun control? Yes, it does fly in the face of the 2nd but nothing can be allowed to interfere with Fundamental Change. The power of the citizenry lies in the 2nd. You take that away, you enslave the people. Why wait until it is painfully obvious before something is done? Why not do something when it is plainly obvious? Yeah, that is the point of the conversation. Lefties are afraid of Trump concentration camps and righties are afraid of guns being confiscated. Both viewed as irrational fears by the other side, and the real truth is too much stands in the middle of our current democracy to let it swing that far to either side. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tatetopa Posted October 7, 2018 #82 Share Posted October 7, 2018 10 hours ago, RavenHawk said: Socialism. Socialism is kinda your go to, but not maybe the most likely. How about anarchy, fascism, military dictatorship, theocratic dictatorship, oligarchy, monarchy. When public officials are under death threats, socialism and promises of it are not the first things that come to their minds. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Wearer of Hats Posted October 7, 2018 #83 Share Posted October 7, 2018 2 hours ago, Tatetopa said: Socialism is kinda your go to, but not maybe the most likely. How about anarchy, fascism, military dictatorship, theocratic dictatorship, oligarchy, monarchy. When public officials are under death threats, socialism and promises of it are not the first things that come to their minds. Those are all forms of socialism according to Raven. 1 1 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Setton Posted October 7, 2018 #84 Share Posted October 7, 2018 1 hour ago, Sir Wearer of Hats said: Those are all forms of socialism according to Raven. Don't forget the Daleks too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skliss Posted October 7, 2018 #85 Share Posted October 7, 2018 22 hours ago, Captain Risky said: i don't think riding on Obama's coat tails How on earth is he riding on Obama's coat tails?! LMAO....he's done exactly the opposite and nullified a lot of the things Obama put in to place and we can see the results. An economy that is booming...despite Obama saying it never would again....which was true with his policies..... jobs coming back, companies moving back. You have to suspend all notions of reality not to see it! 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unusual Tournament Posted October 8, 2018 Author #86 Share Posted October 8, 2018 1 hour ago, skliss said: How on earth is he riding on Obama's coat tails?! LMAO....he's done exactly the opposite and nullified a lot of the things Obama put in to place and we can see the results. An economy that is booming...despite Obama saying it never would again....which was true with his policies..... jobs coming back, companies moving back. You have to suspend all notions of reality not to see it! The U.S. economy is going great guns thanks to Obama. The only thing that Trump has managed to do is alienate friends, cozy up to dictators, kissed Russian **** and gut the stock market. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkHunter Posted October 8, 2018 #87 Share Posted October 8, 2018 Just now, Captain Risky said: The U.S. economy is going great guns thanks to Obama. The only thing that Trump has managed to do is alienate friends, cozy up to dictators, kissed Russian **** and gut the stock market. Cause arming Ukraine with anti tank missiles and doing military exercises with Ukraine is exactly what Russia wanted. Really interested in how Trump gutted the stock market 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unusual Tournament Posted October 8, 2018 Author #88 Share Posted October 8, 2018 1 minute ago, DarkHunter said: Cause arming Ukraine with anti tank missiles and doing military exercises with Ukraine is exactly what Russia wanted. Really interested in how Trump gutted the stock market Russia has already solidified its positions in eastern Ukraine and the Crimea. What does it matter what military sales they make if Trump continues to undermine NATO. The stock market is being hammered with all this talk of trade wars and isolationist trade. The stock market is suffering. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkHunter Posted October 8, 2018 #89 Share Posted October 8, 2018 1 minute ago, Captain Risky said: Russia has already solidified its positions in eastern Ukraine and the Crimea. What does it matter what military sales they make if Trump continues to undermine NATO. The stock market is being hammered with all this talk of trade wars and isolationist trade. The stock market is suffering. So now Trump is undermining NATO by trying to get what, the 2/3 of the members that pay less then 2% on defense to spend that amount. Would love to hear your reason why Germany, the biggest economy in Europe who imports a lot of its gas from Russia, should just be allowed to spend about 1% on defense. If I remember correctly not too long ago Germany only has like 120 combat ready tanks and like 20 fighter aircraft fit for combat. So since Russia in entrenched in parts of Ukraine we should just stop aiding Ukraine and let Russia take the rest These trade wars have to happen and it's better to have them sooner rather then later. For too long America has accepted unfair trade deals to try to get influence or further integrate countries into the global economy to make it easier to work with them. For example the idea with China was the richer and more interconnected they got the easier they would be to handle and would become less aggressive but it seems the richer they get the more they bully surrounding nations to advance their own interests. 2 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+and-then Posted October 8, 2018 #90 Share Posted October 8, 2018 18 hours ago, Captain Risky said: ex F.B.I director Comley seems to think differently. he found a bunch of holes in Kava's story that need Comley to believe that Kava is lying. Kavanaugh carried on like a pork chop with his screaming and shouting. age is supposed to mellow, yet Kava looked and acted like a crazy man. you ever stop to think what type of person nearly elected Kavanaugh would have been 35 years ago after a couple of beers? Do YOU ever stop to think that someday it could be YOU that has been falsely accused and convicted without EVIDENCE? What is so difficult about that concept, for you? I'd never even heard of Kavanaugh before this spectacle began. If she had accused him and had corroborating witnesses or evidence of any kind other than memories so vague that the man literally didn't have a chance of producing an alibi, I'd have said he needed to go. What these scum tried to do to this guy was FAR worse than anything Trump has done. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+and-then Posted October 8, 2018 #91 Share Posted October 8, 2018 40 minutes ago, Captain Risky said: The U.S. economy is going great guns thanks to Obama. The only thing that Trump has managed to do is alienate friends, cozy up to dictators, kissed Russian **** and gut the stock market. I think it's safe to say that you have stepped over into the surreal. 1 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skliss Posted October 8, 2018 #92 Share Posted October 8, 2018 47 minutes ago, Captain Risky said: The U.S. economy is going great guns thanks to Obama. The only thing that Trump has managed to do is alienate friends, cozy up to dictators, kissed Russian **** and gut the stock market. Explain why we had 8 years of horrible recession....which Obama told us we had to get used to.....And as soon as Trump got in office and got rid of all the stuff Obama did to put us there....the economy immediately started improving. Explain exactly how anything Obama did helped our economy....... 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hawken Posted October 8, 2018 #93 Share Posted October 8, 2018 The Walkaway Movement has increased dramatically since the Kavanaugh Confirmation. Seems that Libs are seeing the democrat party for who they are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agent0range Posted October 8, 2018 #94 Share Posted October 8, 2018 Impeachment? Lets all just come together, as he attacks anyone who is a Democrat every single day on Twitter. He obviously cares about us Democrats, although he calls us dangerous every day on Twitter. He obviously wants to unite the country, as he says us Democrats hate America every single day on Twitter. This draft dodging, tax evading, predator clearly loves America more than all of us combined! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agent0range Posted October 8, 2018 #95 Share Posted October 8, 2018 51 minutes ago, skliss said: Explain why we had 8 years of horrible recession....which Obama told us we had to get used to.....And as soon as Trump got in office and got rid of all the stuff Obama did to put us there....the economy immediately started improving. Explain exactly how anything Obama did helped our economy....... Can you show the numbers of that recession? Was it the stock market nearly tripling? Was it the unemployment rate down to 4. something percent? Was it decreasing the national deficit by 66%? Show me some numbers to show your horrible recession. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkHunter Posted October 8, 2018 #96 Share Posted October 8, 2018 58 minutes ago, Agent0range said: Can you show the numbers of that recession? Was it the stock market nearly tripling? Was it the unemployment rate down to 4. something percent? Was it decreasing the national deficit by 66%? Show me some numbers to show your horrible recession. On Obama's first day of office the DOW Jones was at 7,949.09 and on Obama's last day it was 19,732.4, which is an increase by a factor of 2.25 over 8 years and not the tripling you claim. So far for Trump he has inherited a DOW Jones at 19,732.4 and in slightly under 2 years it is now at 26,447.05 which is an increase of a factor of 1.34. But factors are a funny thing in that to have a higher factor number you need exponential growth which just isnt realistic so in 8 years Obama grew the DOW Jones by about 12,000 points while Trump has grown the DOW Jones by about 7,000 points in slightly under 2 years. Under Obama unemployment was at 4.8% with labor force participation at 62.9%. So far with Trump unemployment is at 4% with a labor force participation essentially unchanged. The decreasing the national deficit by 66% is technically accurate but ignores important details. Essentially that particular number of dropping the deficit comes from comparing the government deficit spending from the 2009 fiscal year to the 2016 fiscal year. Its important to note that the 2009 fiscal year started 4 months before Obama took office and that there was a massive spike in government spending to combat the recession which was inevitably going to drop over time. If you compare the deficit spending to 2008 instead of 2009 then Obama achieved the deficit spending Bush generally had by 2014 and kept it at that level till 2016. In terms of debt though when Obama took office it was about $10.7 trillion and when Obama left office it was about $19.5 trillion. Know the post wasnt directed at me but I had some free time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unusual Tournament Posted October 8, 2018 Author #97 Share Posted October 8, 2018 (edited) 10 hours ago, and then said: Do YOU ever stop to think that someday it could be YOU that has been falsely accused and convicted without EVIDENCE? What is so difficult about that concept, for you? I'd never even heard of Kavanaugh before this spectacle began. If she had accused him and had corroborating witnesses or evidence of any kind other than memories so vague that the man literally didn't have a chance of producing an alibi, I'd have said he needed to go. What these scum tried to do to this guy was FAR worse than anything Trump has done. or God forbid maybe it could be some female member of yours thats had to endure a sexual assault. of course true to the republican MO they would admit and agree that the assault took place, disagree with the perpetrator being guilty even though she knew him before the attack because she doesn't remember every detail of a horrific attack. does that make sense to you? Edited October 8, 2018 by Captain Risky Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myles Posted October 8, 2018 #98 Share Posted October 8, 2018 10 hours ago, skliss said: Explain why we had 8 years of horrible recession....which Obama told us we had to get used to.....And as soon as Trump got in office and got rid of all the stuff Obama did to put us there....the economy immediately started improving. Explain exactly how anything Obama did helped our economy....... Actually it has been trending up for several years. Trump has managed to keep it trending up despite all the people who claimed it would crash if he became president. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmer77 Posted October 8, 2018 #99 Share Posted October 8, 2018 10 hours ago, skliss said: Explain why we had 8 years of horrible recession The housing bubble popped under Bush and the economy tanked. Obama took over just after the "too big to fail" debacle and started an improving trend in the economy which Trump inherited. 10 hours ago, skliss said: And as soon as Trump got in office and got rid of all the stuff Obama did to put us there....the economy immediately started improving. Explain exactly how anything Obama did helped our economy....... This um, isnt exactly accurate. Note the trend of increasing construction spending and when it started https://www.nasdaq.com/article/data-points-to-an-improving-economy-cm1019183 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RavenHawk Posted October 8, 2018 #100 Share Posted October 8, 2018 20 hours ago, Tatetopa said: Socialism is kinda your go to, but not maybe the most likely. How about anarchy, fascism, military dictatorship, theocratic dictatorship, oligarchy, monarchy. It’s one of many that I have tried to keep as simple as possible. It is not rocket science and yet it seems beyond understanding of some. Anarchy, fascism, military dictatorship, theocratic dictatorship, oligarchy, monarchy, communism, including democracy are all forms of Socialism. Or if you like, Oligarchy in general, or even Authoritarianism or Totalitarianism. On the true political spectrum, all governments start somewhere on this line. There is no such thing as Left and Right. You have 0% government control at one end and 100% control at the other. Over time all governments traverse this line toward the 100% end taking more and more liberties from the people. Only one government devised by Man puts the brakes on this ‘progression’. But it takes an active body politic to apply the brakes. I do not understand what part of this you do not understand?? When public officials are under death threats, socialism and promises of it are not the first things that come to their minds. It’s the first thing I think of. Watching the Progressive muscle in action makes the promise of socialism all too real. The Soros-funded Antifa is no different than what was seen in Germany, Russia, Iran, or even China. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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