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Still Waters

Dogs weren't man's only best friend

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Still Waters

For centuries dogs and humans have developed close relationships, that in many cases, have solidified each other as family. The close bond between humans and domesticated dogs can be traced back to some of New Mexico's earliest settlers. But what interests anthropologists at The University of New Mexico is whether or not these dog were in fact what we consider dogs.

https://phys.org/news/2018-10-domesticated-dogs-werent-friend.html?

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Piney

Coyotes among the Lakota were called "camp dogs" and some were semi-domesticated or outright domesticated.  

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Piney
Posted (edited)

The Lakota used Carolina dogs like we Algonquians did. But they were mangier and rangier. I think if somebody did a DNA rundown on one it would have quite a bit of coyote DNA. 

Webp.net-resizeimage (8).png

Edited by Piney
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Dejarma
3 hours ago, Still Waters said:

For centuries dogs and humans have developed close relationships

 

not through choice= a forced relationship-- slavery imo

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jaylemurph
On 10/6/2018 at 4:50 PM, Dejarma said:

not through choice= a forced relationship-- slavery imo

Here I was thinking Guy the Basset was happy to see me when I come home.

--Jaylemurph

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NicoletteS
Posted (edited)

So are you trying to say the person or the dog is the slave?

Edited by NicoletteS
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jaylemurph
2 minutes ago, NicoletteS said:

So are you trying to say the person or the dog is the slave?

All I know is Guy the Basset never picked up any of /my/ poop in a little bag and disposed of it neatly.

--Jaylemurph

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openozy
On ‎7‎/‎10‎/‎2018 at 10:49 AM, Piney said:

The Lakota used Carolina dogs like we Algonquians did. But they were mangier and rangier. I think if somebody did a DNA rundown on one it would have quite a bit of coyote DNA. 

Webp.net-resizeimage (8).png

Almost identical to our red heeler dogs in oz who have dingo blood.

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openozy
On ‎7‎/‎10‎/‎2018 at 10:50 AM, Dejarma said:

not through choice= a forced relationship-- slavery imo

My understanding is wild canids started hanging around primitive camps for scraps and were eventually selectively bred for different traits.Hunting then herding and provided a lookout for danger from predators and rival tribes.

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RoofGardener

Hmm.. interesting. 

If these animals where coyotes, then they share a common ancestor with the Grey Wolf, which is the ancestor of the European domesticated dog. 

Coyote's seem to share many characteristics with both wolfs and dogs, so I can easily believe that they where partially domesticated. 

 

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DirtyDocMartens

Not being a geneticist, this seems to be semantic. 

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Coil
Posted (edited)

There is information that the dogs were not domesticated, therefore they are not domesticated wolves or coyotes, and the DNA of the wolves in the dogs was introduced after domestication. It is also concluded that the ancestors of dogs lived in an extremely closed and small population.It is possible that these "impurities" prevented other geneticists from building the exact tree of the evolution of dogs and wolves, the authors conclude.

https://kp.ua/life/433573-uchenye-vyiasnyly-ot-koho-proyzoshly-sobaky

Well, we are moving further to mythology and religion, to the gods, if anyone is interested:

Spoiler

 

The dog is an attribute of Hermes (Mercury) as the messenger of God and the Good Shepherd, accompanied by his dog Sirius, the "all-seeing guardian"

The most ancient symbolic representations include:

-association of the dog with the afterlife and the deities of death;
-the role of psychopomp, conductor, guard and protector of souls (Ancient Mexico and
-guardary function (transition) on the border of worlds.

It is noteworthy that in the Vedic literature, which, as a rule, is considered the oldest literature in India, many deities have dogs as companions and riding animals.

12963357_825066537626686_656635165496660


It turns out the dog has always been as an independent species from the beginning of the gods and the first race!


Some legends say that because of the dog’s oversight, a person lost the gift of immortality.

This is very interesting because symbolically in the Vedas the dog is intuition and  is a man’s companion respectively .  Apparently, in those times of the first races, the inuition blinked away and the person having committed something sinful became mortal, and now the inuition-dog must find those sacred cows in the cave that hid the Panis from people.The cow and milk are the light of Truth and the immortality that a person will receive which will be found by his friend-intuition dog.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vala_(Vedic)

Sarama-the mother of all dogs

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sarama

In the Kumi myths (in the north-east of India), a huge snake is destroying people every night. A dog created by God, enters into a fight with a snake and wakes up God. And a creature with a dog's head kills or imprisons the enemies of light.

And the Hindu enemies of truth just Vala and Vrtra have the image of a serpent. So the Bible is still right when it says that the serpent deceived Adam and Eve. Although there is some other serpent that leads human evolution further.

 

 

Edited by Coil

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jaylemurph
Posted (edited)

...we can always trust coil to ignorantly pass along error and misinformation. Sirius is a star, not a constellation. And the constellations Canes Maior Minusque belong to Orion the Hunter, next to whom they appear in the sky. 

Errors that basic tell you the worth of anything else quoted.

--Jaylemurph

Edited by jaylemurph
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Coil

Canis Major /ˌknɪs ˈmər/ is a constellation in the southern celestial hemisphere

Its name is Latin for "greater dog" in contrast to Canis Minor, the "lesser dog"; both figures are commonly represented as following the constellation of Orion the hunter through the sky.Canis Major contains Sirius, the brightest star in the night sky, known as the "dog star"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canis_Major

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jaylemurph
On 10/9/2018 at 11:15 AM, Coil said:

Canis Major /ˌknɪs ˈmər/ is a constellation in the southern celestial hemisphere

Its name is Latin for "greater dog" in contrast to Canis Minor, the "lesser dog"; both figures are commonly represented as following the constellation of Orion the hunter through the sky.Canis Major contains Sirius, the brightest star in the night sky, known as the "dog star"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canis_Major

Yes. You have effectively repeated exactly the same information I presented, but with total ignorance of the Latin used. There is no letter "J" in Latin; the correct transcription of the term canis major would be Canis Maior, as presented above. Additionally, the inclitic "-que" means "and", so "Canis maior minorque" means "The Great Dog and the Lesser Dog" in correct Latin usage.

Anything else you'd like to get wrong and then get educated about?

--Jaylemurph

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Jenn8779
On 10/9/2018 at 1:58 PM, Coil said:

we are moving further to mythology and religion, to the gods, if anyone is interested:

  Reveal hidden contents

 

The dog is an attribute of Hermes (Mercury) as the messenger of God and the Good Shepherd, accompanied by his dog Sirius, the "all-seeing guardian"

The most ancient symbolic representations include:

-association of the dog with the afterlife and the deities of death;
-the role of psychopomp, conductor, guard and protector of souls (Ancient Mexico and
-guardary function (transition) on the border of worlds.

It is noteworthy that in the Vedic literature, which, as a rule, is considered the oldest literature in India, many deities have dogs as companions and riding animals.

12963357_825066537626686_656635165496660


It turns out the dog has always been as an independent species from the beginning of the gods and the first race!


Some legends say that because of the dog’s oversight, a person lost the gift of immortality.

This is very interesting because symbolically in the Vedas the dog is intuition and  is a man’s companion respectively .  Apparently, in those times of the first races, the inuition blinked away and the person having committed something sinful became mortal, and now the inuition-dog must find those sacred cows in the cave that hid the Panis from people.The cow and milk are the light of Truth and the immortality that a person will receive which will be found by his friend-intuition dog.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vala_(Vedic)

Sarama-the mother of all dogs

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sarama

In the Kumi myths (in the north-east of India), a huge snake is destroying people every night. A dog created by God, enters into a fight with a snake and wakes up God. And a creature with a dog's head kills or imprisons the enemies of light.

And the Hindu enemies of truth just Vala and Vrtra have the image of a serpent. So the Bible is still right when it says that the serpent deceived Adam and Eve. Although there is some other serpent that leads human evolution further.

 

 

I just want to know how we go from the evolution of the dog and their DNA to mythology, religion and gods...

Just....why? :wacko:

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internetperson
On 10/6/2018 at 7:49 PM, Piney said:

The Lakota used Carolina dogs like we Algonquians did. But they were mangier and rangier. I think if somebody did a DNA rundown on one it would have quite a bit of coyote DNA. 

You have any experience with dogs in mexico? From what I understand they're the same way but psychologically healthier than the average US dog. Apparently this is cause a lot of them are still used on the farm and aren't treated like babies. 

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jaylemurph
5 hours ago, Jenn8779 said:

I just want to know how we go from the evolution of the dog and their DNA to mythology, religion and gods...

Just....why? :wacko:

Because coil never passes up the opportunity to be wrong about something. It's rather astounding in its own way.

--Jaylemurph

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Coil
11 hours ago, jaylemurph said:

Yes. You have effectively repeated exactly the same information I presented, but with total ignorance of the Latin used.

--Jaylemurph

I do not know why you caught the star Sirius about which I did not speak as about the constellation; well, it is not as important as the purpose of the dog.

Since antiquity, Sirius was called the Dog star (like Procyon). Procyon and Sirius have long been considered two "dog" stars. According to Greek mythology, the star Sirius became the dog of Orion or Ikaria.

6 hours ago, Jenn8779 said:

I just want to know how we go from the evolution of the dog and their DNA to mythology, religion and gods...

Just....why? :wacko:

The studies above showed that the type of dogs and the type of wolves are different types and then it was interesting for me to find for myself who created the dog, what people need it for and in the spiritual sense what it means.One scripture further describes Sarama as the mother of all wild animals.

Thus, on a physical level, a dog is an assistant and a guardian to a person and on a spiritual level it searches for divine light and is, at the end, a just judge, Dharma. Interestingly, in the worlds of hell the servants of karma are depicted as creatures with the head of a dog.

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Captain Risky
On 09/10/2018 at 2:27 PM, NicoletteS said:

So are you trying to say the person or the dog is the slave?

Your name is Toby...

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jaylemurph
11 hours ago, Coil said:

I do not know why you caught the star Sirius about which I did not speak as about the constellation; well, it is not as important as the purpose of the dog..

Let's try this again, but with the verb you actually meant, as this makes no sense.

If you're saying "I didn't confuse the star Sirius for the constellation Canis Maior," I never said that. What you quote, however, does. Whether you simply posted something you didn't actually read (which wouldn't surprise me) or don't want to admit to the mistake, I neither know nor care.

And if you were concerned about the dogs' activities, why not cite the actual Hunting Dogs constellation, which are completely different asterisms.

--Jaylemurph

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