Can wind farms sap the rain from hurricanes?

[Eldorado]

"The idea of deliberately modifying the weather with wind turbines has been around for decades, but little work has been done to calculate whether or not it could really work. In 2014, a group of researchers including Cristina Archer, a civil and environmental engineer from the University of Delaware, showed how using an army of wind turbines to extract kinetic energy from the air could potentially pacify hurricanes. The team calculated that a massive array of 78,000 turbines could reduce coastal storm surges—such as the one Hurricane Katrina shoved onto New Orleans in 2005—by up to 79 percent.

In new follow-up work, Archer and her colleagues have shown the potential for wind turbines to sap the rain from hurricanes, too.

Archer’s calculations were done using a weather forecasting model into which she plugged atmospheric data from Hurricane Harvey, which drowned the southeastern United States with 100 trillion liters of water in August 2017. She also included calculations reflecting how wind turbines affect the local atmosphere by increasing turbulence and drag. The results reveal how an array of wind turbines would affect the wind speed and direction of the oncoming hurricane, potentially reducing the downstream rainfall."

Full article: https://www.smithsonianmag.com/innovation/could-offshore-wind-farms-actually-sap-rain-from-hurricanes-180970448/

[Myles]

1 hour ago, Eldorado said:

"The idea of deliberately modifying the weather with wind turbines has been around for decades, but little work has been done to calculate whether or not it could really work. In 2014, a group of researchers including Cristina Archer, a civil and environmental engineer from the University of Delaware, showed how using an army of wind turbines to extract kinetic energy from the air could potentially pacify hurricanes. The team calculated that a massive array of 78,000 turbines could reduce coastal storm surges—such as the one Hurricane Katrina shoved onto New Orleans in 2005—by up to 79 percent.

In new follow-up work, Archer and her colleagues have shown the potential for wind turbines to sap the rain from hurricanes, too.

Archer’s calculations were done using a weather forecasting model into which she plugged atmospheric data from Hurricane Harvey, which drowned the southeastern United States with 100 trillion liters of water in August 2017. She also included calculations reflecting how wind turbines affect the local atmosphere by increasing turbulence and drag. The results reveal how an array of wind turbines would affect the wind speed and direction of the oncoming hurricane, potentially reducing the downstream rainfall."

Full article: https://www.smithsonianmag.com/innovation/could-offshore-wind-farms-actually-sap-rain-from-hurricanes-180970448/

Interesting, but probably not feasible.   The cost to build, maintain and repair the turbines may not outweigh the cost of damage done. 

[Doug1029]

On 10/9/2018 at 10:31 AM, seanjo said:

I think wind farms if large enough could reduce the energy of the winds in Hurricanes, which is the dangerous bit really.

That would take one helluva wind farm.

Doug

[freetoroam]

On 09/10/2018 at 12:27 PM, Eldorado said:

The team calculated that a massive array of 78,000 turbines

How many??!!!!! 

Quote

The world's largest wind farm is up and running.

Bigger than San Francisco, 

The Walney Extension

 Its 87 turbines, which stand up to 640 feet tall, are some of the world's biggest in operation. 

http://uk.businessinsider.com/largest-wind-farm-in-the-world-2018-9

Have i read something wrong...78,000? The largest in the world has 87, 

78,000?  I am with Myles on this one.

 

Sorry folks, i still can not believe the number, surely they would not consider such a ridiculous amount. 

[freetoroam]

Just now, seanjo said:

Indeed, but if there are lots of them around the place, and at sea...

The biggest so far is 87 turbines, they are talking about 78,.....bare with me while i double check that again

And again

And again

Yep....78,000.

Jeezzeee! Wtf are they thinking!!!

[rashore]

78,000 turbines... That's a lotta turbines. And looking at the source paper, that's for just New Orleans. It would be a lot more to do more of the coastline.

And though it's an interesting notion if we could slow down/disrupt a bad hurricane if we needed to.... what about when it's not hurricane time? Wouldn't a wind farm big enough to do that to a hurricane also disrupt the regular air flow in the area at other times? Or would most of the array be shut down during non-hurricanes, or what?

Found this link, has a ton of informational discussion and links. Have to say, a lot of it goes right over my head. https://physics.stackexchange.com/questions/197010/can-we-reduce-a-hurricanes-power-using-wind-turbines/216133#216133

[freetoroam]

6 minutes ago, seanjo said:

Wind farms are the most efficient offshore.

78,000....not sure the sea life would see it that way. 

I am just thinking this being done 78.000 times:

Quote

The steel cylinder is piled into the sea floor by a specialist hydraulic ram.

https://www.groundsure.com/blogs/offshore-wind-turbines

The above project will consist of 116 turbines...and that is a lot of work and £2.5 billion. 

I do not even need to do the maths to see that 78.000 would be a ridiculous amount of money. 

[Doug1029]

45 minutes ago, freetoroam said:

Sorry folks, i still can not believe the number, surely they would not consider such a ridiculous amount. 

Wind Catcher in the Oklahoma Panhandle will have 800 2.5 megawatt turbines upon completion.  That's a 2000-megawatt facility.  It's capacity will be more than twice the new facility in the Irish Sea.

Even if we convert totally to wind, we are not likely to need more than 5000 turbines in any one wind farm.

Too many turbines in one area make the grid subject to disruption by earthquakes and major storms.  I see major risks with 78,000 turbines - including being destroyed by the very hurricanes they are supposed to be modifying.

Just a pie-in-the-sky pipe dream.

Doug

[Myles]

55 minutes ago, Doug1o29 said:

Wind Catcher in the Oklahoma Panhandle will have 800 2.5 megawatt turbines upon completion.  That's a 2000-megawatt facility.  It's capacity will be more than twice the new facility in the Irish Sea.

Even if we convert totally to wind, we are not likely to need more than 5000 turbines in any one wind farm.

Too many turbines in one area make the grid subject to disruption by earthquakes and major storms.  I see major risks with 78,000 turbines - including being destroyed by the very hurricanes they are supposed to be modifying.

Just a pie-in-the-sky pipe dream.

Doug

I agree.     It's like saying - If we turn 62 trillion household box fans towards the hurricane, it could have an affect.