The source of the ancient 360-day calendar

[Harte]

Quedlinburgenses.

Some sort of Germanic language translation of quarter pounder.

Harte

[jesshill]

For a few readers Mr. Messick’s observations were deflected by several critical typographical errors made by me that gave them pause. Unfortunately, this forum does not provide an edit feature.

Those points notwithstanding, Mr. Messick offers the following response regarding the Sumerian—Babylonian debate.

He says that he has no idea who the first astronomers were or where they lived and had originally formed his opinions regarding the chronological applications of astronomic methods based on the work of Alan Bond and Mark Hempsell.

• Alan Bond was predicted to be one of the 'who's who' of the 21st century by the Sunday Times. His early career was in trajectory analysis and is now MD of Reaction Engines Limited developing technologies for launch vehicles. Mark Hempsell was a lecturer in Astronautics and is a past president of the British Interplanetary Society.

It seems that around 700 BC an Assyrian scribe in the Royal Place at Nineveh made a copy of one of the most important documents in the royal collection. Two and a half thousand years later it was found by Henry Layard in the remains of the palace library. It ended up in the British Museum’s cuneiform clay tablet collection as catalogue No. K8538 (also called “the Planisphere”), where it has puzzled scholars for over a hundred and fifty years. 

Bond and Hempsell provided the first comprehensive translation of the tablet, showing it to be a contemporary Sumerian observation of an Aten asteroid over a kilometer in diameter that impacted Köfels in Austria in the early morning of 29th June 3123 BC.
 

The tablet is an “Astrolabe,” and is said to be the earliest known astronomical instrument. It consists of a segmented, disk-shaped star chart with marked units of angle measure inscribed upon the rim.

Bond and Hempsell co-authored the book A SUMERIAN OBSERVATION OF THE KÖFELS’ IMPACT EVENT.

Jess

[danydandan]

20 minutes ago, jaylemurph said:

I’m an academic who uses Wikipedia. Not as a direct source, obviously, but I use the work cited/references of good articles as I research — earlier this week, I used the site to find publication data for a modern edition of the Annales Quedlinburgenses. 

Also, I just discovered my iPhone can autofill “Quedlinburgenses” which I think is pretty nifty. 

—Jaylemurph 

That's my point, all through college up until I was lecturing I was told and I told students never directly cite Wikipedia. It's a great tool to research other academic papers and articles, but because it can be edited with out peer review it's obviously a poor choice to cite directly. It's a brilliant centralised resource.

 

[Windowpane]

18 minutes ago, jesshill said:

...

Bond and Hempsell co-authored the book A SUMERIAN OBSERVATION OF THE KÖFELS’ IMPACT EVENT.

 

 

The book is discussed in some detail here (scroll down to "Appendix 1: A Recent Fantasy Interpretation of K 8538").

[Kenemet]

On 10/11/2018 at 1:43 PM, jesshill said:

Welcome, 

Ever since my collage years, where I majored in Ancient History, I have been fascinated by the ancient 360-day calendars that were being used through-out the world until the 8th century BCE. In fact, http://360dayyear.com/ provides evidence that the Mayan Empire, Egypt, Aztec Empire, India, Sumeria, Babylonia, Armenia, Greece, Rome, China and Hebrews had all used 360-day calendars. For what purpose? 

For agricultural-based societies, the accurate timing of seasons is essential to life as well as prosperity. A 360-day calendar would be out of sink by a full month after just 5-years and would have been discarded. But, that is not what happened. 360-day calendars were in use for at least 1500-years. 

As a student and being aware of these, supposed, coincidences was a very frustrating experience for me and everyone else in my class and provided a real-life example of the major time-gaps in ancient history. I have been searching, as time permits, for an answer to this mystery every since. 

Recently, an article titled "Solving the mystery of the ancient 360-day calendar" was recommended by a colleague and, after reading the article, it felt like a load had finally been lifted from my shoulders. The article is copyrighted material and With the author's written permission and the approval of ancient-astronomer.com, I have inserted below significant parts of that article. 

Enjoy, 

Author: Ron Messick ((c)copyright 2018 by Ronald G. Messick--all rights reserved) 

"By 3,100 BC, the ancient Sumerians had already become a highly advanced and sophisticated civilization. They had a writing system (cuneiform script) and a library containing hundreds of thousands of historical documents. They also had a governmental structure and legal system and were building bridges, dams, aqueducts and irrigation systems. They also invented the wheel and plow. Mathematics appeared to be their Forte as they could perform advance arithmetic calculations and solve quadratic equations. They developed (apparently from scratch) the science of astronomy-- dividing the heavens into a circle of 360 degrees, which they subdivided into 12 intervals of 30 degrees each. They also developed the Sexagesimal structure for measuring time--using sixty-second minutes and sixty-minute hours (like we use today). Furthermore, they created our current measure of distance based of miles, feet and inches. They mastered geometry, calculating areas of rectangles, triangles and trapezoids (as well as their volumes) and were using Pythagorean therm over a thousand years before Pythagoras was even born. And, there is solid evidence that sophisticated geometrical calculations were being used to track the movement of planets (estimating the area under a curve by drawing a trapezoid or four-sided figure underneath). Using this method, they could track the position, speed and the distance of planets--a technique that is fundamental to physics and was previously believed to have originated only about 600-years ago in 14th century Europe." 

"Unraveling the puzzle 

Over the next several years an original concept slowly began to emerge. 

I discovered right away that the Sumerians divided the the day into intervals of 4-minutes (1440-minutes÷4 = 360). The resulting 360, I assumed, were degrees of rotation. They also had reckoned that the Earth’s circumference is 21,600 nautical miles (about the same value we use today). Dividing 21,600 nautical miles by 360 told me that the Earth traveled 60-nautical miles in 1-degree of rotation and that 60÷4 = 15-nautical miles per-minute (15 X 1440 = 21,600).. 

The sacred cube 

At that point I had discovered that 4 X 360 = 1440-minutes or 1-day (in minutes). Then, I discovered that 4 X 360 X 360 = 518,400-minutes or 1-year (in minutes). The next major breakthrough was learning that 4 X 360 X 360 X 360 is 186,624,000 (the same value described in the canonized book of ancient numbers as the Earth's orbital diameter or major axis. (360 cubed x 4 = Earth's orbital diameter) 

• As a side note, the orbital diameter of 186,624,000 divided by two makes the orbital radius 93,312,000-miles. A google search of the phrase “93,312,000 + distance” has 394 listings. That means that others before me have gone down this same path. And, as author Thomas Karl Dietrich pointed out in his book (The Culture of Astronomy), the number 108 is sacred in Vedic science, which says that 108 X the diameter of the Sun equals the average radius of the Earth’s orbit—our average distance from the Sun (108 X 864,000 miles = 93,312,000 miles.)

At that point and time I hypothesized that 186,624,000 was the Earth's orbital diameter (expressed in miles) and when the miles were divided by an orbital velocity of 360-miles per-minute the value was converted to minutes (518,400÷1440 = 360-days). In other words, to the Sumerians, minutes were synonymous with miles." 

"To test that supposition I did the following: 

186,624,000-miles÷360 = 518,400-minutes÷24-hours = 21,600-nautical miles per-hour÷60-minutes = 360-nautical miles per-minute÷60-seconds = 6-nautical miles per-second (The same as the frequency described by Nicola Tesla). 
 

In other words, the sacred cube (4 X 360 X 360 X 360) produces the Earth's orbital diameter and reversing that value (using the structure of an Earth day) identifies the harmonic structure of the ancient Sexagesimal system and the source of the 360-day calendar systems." 

Continued at ancient-astronomer.com 

I hope you enjoyed this article as much as I did. 

Jess

There's some real problems with this that you, as a history major, SHOULD have noticed right off the bat.  The first is that the examples are drawn from many cultures at many different time points over a 3,000 year time period.  This should have been an immediate "red flag" .  The second is that your primary source actually says they used 365 day calendars but tries to shoehorn them into 360 day calendars.  By the way, you're not going to see any pharonic decree about the length of a year... that was determined by astronomers observing the rising of the star, Sirius.  Your historical sources should show you that one immediately along with the importance of not using a 360 day calendar without the intercalary days tacked on.

Beyond that, it's pretty simple.  365 has only four divisors (1, 365, 5 and 73) which doesn't tie in well with planting seasons or other work/agricultural flow.  The divisors or 360 are  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 8, 9, 10, 12, 15, 18, 20, 24, 30, 36, 40, 45, 60, 72, 90, 120, 180, 360 - which makes it convenient to set up a number of time periods, one of which roughly corresponds with the lunar cycle.

The sources that talk about Egypt also mention the Greek zodiac ... which was unknown in Egypt before 300 BC, when Ptolemy took control of Egypt.

Also. "miles" as a standard unit did not exist before the Romans (29 BC sort of standardized it the first time) so this could not have been part of any ancient calculation.  The Sumerians didn't create this.  Their divisions were different (as any basic historical research should have shown you... see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ancient_Mesopotamian_units_of_measurement#Length as a starting point) 

The designation of the Armenians as a "civilization" should have been a huge red flag for you as well.  It speaks poorly of your educational experiences that the professors did not teach you the difference between a culture and a civilization.

 

 

 

[Kenemet]

I think the bottom line is that there's no actual single source, other than the lunar cycles... and that all cultures experienced problems with the lunar calendar versus the solar calendar.

[jaylemurph]

7 hours ago, jesshill said:

Alan Bond was predicted to be one of the 'who's who' of the 21st century by the Sunday Times. His early career was in trajectory analysis and is now MD of Reaction Engines Limited developing technologies for launch vehicles. Mark Hempsell was a lecturer in Astronautics and is a past president of the British Interplanetary Society.
 

...and the reasons we should listen to his opinion of history is what, precisely? At  a guess, I'd put it at roughly the same reason to listen to my opinion on astrophysics.

--Jaylemurph

[Emma_Acid]

17 hours ago, jesshill said:

For a few readers Mr. Messick’s observations were deflected by several critical typographical errors made by me that gave them pause. Unfortunately, this forum does not provide an edit feature.

Those points notwithstanding, Mr. Messick offers the following response regarding the Sumerian—Babylonian debate.

He says that he has no idea who the first astronomers were or where they lived and had originally formed his opinions regarding the chronological applications of astronomic methods based on the work of Alan Bond and Mark Hempsell.

• Alan Bond was predicted to be one of the 'who's who' of the 21st century by the Sunday Times. His early career was in trajectory analysis and is now MD of Reaction Engines Limited developing technologies for launch vehicles. Mark Hempsell was a lecturer in Astronautics and is a past president of the British Interplanetary Society.

 

On 12/10/2018 at 2:59 AM, jesshill said:

But, after a series of personal communications with him, I was left with the impression that he is the real deal. He is now eighty years old and has had a long and successful business career—the last few years of which he was one of the top business turnaround specialists in the US.

None of these things make the people you're quoting historians. I have no idea why you keep reeling off bits of their CVs that sound impressive but are utterly irrelevant. 

[Piney]

On 10/12/2018 at 7:52 PM, Kenemet said:

The designation of the Armenians as a "civilization"

......

sorry....

[stereologist]

The Sumerians and Babylonians used a lunar calendar if I recall correctly. I see no mention of the importance of the Moon. The lunar periods were mixed with extra days to bring the lunar calendar into agreement with the solar calendar. There was and probably still is a lecture series about Sumer online.

Took forever to find this lecture. Had to fight past the frauds such as EVD, Tellinger, Hancock, Wilcock and the rest of the wackos.

The lecture discusses how the lunar calendar is toyed with to bring it into alignment with the solar calendar.

Here is a link to the speaker. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Neiman

[jesshill]

stereologist,

Thank you very much for Dr. Neiman's link. I'll watch it today.

In answer to your comments regarding the lunar calendar and its configuration, I have inserted below the rest of Mr. Messick's hypothesis (which includes his take on the Earth-Lunar configuration).

Enjoy, Jess  

 

To summarize what i'd learned up to that point;

1. The cube of 360 X 4 equals 186,624,000-miles (theoretical diameter of Earth's orbit).
2. 186,624,000-miles is the product of a Sexagesimal year.

At this point and time, I was convinced that the Sumerians were the legitimate source of the 360-day calendar, but I was troubled by the size of discrepancy between 186,624,000-miles, the proposed diameter of Earth's orbit, and the currently accepted value. So, once again I decided to let it set.

Several years later I came across a paper written by researcher Arnold D. Enge which got my attention. Mr. Enge had discovered that the ancient Mayan's primary calculation for Earth’s orbit was 365.625 days rather than the 365.2422 days that is the commonly attributed. Their name for this period was “uinalhaab” or one-year. The “uinalhaab” turned out to be the missing piece of my puzzle.

It now appeared that ancient astronomers may have viewed the Earth and Moon as a system or binary pair. What follows are a couple of facts in support that supposition.

A lunar-year of 354.375-days is consistent with the present-day Islamic calendar which has been in use since ancient times and the 365.625-day "uinalhaab" has now been verified by other qualified authorities. The mean of those two is precisely 360-days.

Verification

To verify the validity of the binary supposition I decided to utilize the time-distance formula that I had learned earlier (4-minutes X 360 X 360 = 518,400). But, instead of multiplying 518,400 by 360 as I had done earlier, I multiplied that figure instead by the number of days in the lunar year and the number of days in the uinalhaab.

The results as listed in the above table show that the closest approach to the Sun (semi-minor axis) is 91,854,000 miles and that the farthest approach (semi-major axis) is 94,770,000-miles. The sum of those two equal 186,624,000-miles (major axis). The preciseness of these calculations (using known values from independent sources) was enough to convince me that an Earth-Moon binary is a reasonable hypothesis.

Synodic implications

Apsidal motion of the binary pair produces twelve 30-day mini-cycles or months attributable to the Earth and thirteen 27.69230769-day mini-cycles or lunar months attributable to the Moon. The mean apsidal motion, however, is 28.8-days (see table).

The following diagram shows the outer perimeter of 365.625 days and the inner perimeter of 354.375 days with the mean solunar orbit of 360-days. The oscillating line illustrates the apsidal motion of 27.69230769 days.

Solunar-360-year

How significant are these so-called mini-cycles or months? 

You be the judge.

• 27.6923076923 X 260 = 7,200-days or 20 solunar years (Mayan Katun)
• 30 X 360 = = 10,800-days or 30-solunar years (Saturn orbital period)

Both are significant periods and when the solunar values are converted to the 365.242 format, it's obvious that the values reflect the Jupiter-Saturn synodic and the mean Saturn orbital period of 25.56943615 years.

Another important consideration is the synodic implication of the 354.375- and 365.625 day periods, which is 23,400-days or 65-Solunar years (below).

Why is that important?

The answer: harmonic resonance

• Earth-Mars synodic period is 780-days X 30 = 23,400
• Earth-Venus synodic period is 585-days X 40 = 23,400
• Uinalhaab orbital: 365.625-days X 364 = 23,400
• Solunar orbital: 360 X 65-days = 23,400
• Lunar orbital: 354.5454: 66 X 360 = 23,400
• Venus orbital: 225 X 104 = 23,400
• Mercury orbital: 87.96992481 X 266 = 23,400

The Grand Synodic

[Ove]

On 10/11/2018 at 7:43 PM, jesshill said:

The source of the ancient 360-day calendar

is a ancient 360-day year. At the time, the year was 360 days long, not as today 365 days long. A year was shorter than today.

[BorizBadinov]

I find myself having to give a lot more leeway to misplaced words due to the autocorrect syndrome. If the spelling is correct but the word is out of context I chalk it up to to auto correct.

I believe that it is probably going to eventually reshape the language simply because in our fast paced digital world, proof reading is either less prevalent or just not done. Being mildly dyslexic I have the dilemma of needing autocorrect and hating the errors it creates. Especially in news articles which I find quite disturbing. It does however create some funny texting situations. 

[Piney]

4 hours ago, Ove said:

is a ancient 360-day year. At the time, the year was 360 days long, not as today 365 days long. A year was shorter than today.

Link? 

[cormac mac airt]

1 hour ago, Piney said:

Link? 

His claim would appear to be incorrect. 

cormac

[jesshill]

2 hours ago, BorizBadinov said:

I find myself having to give a lot more leeway to misplaced words due to the autocorrect syndrome. If the spelling is correct but the word is out of context I chalk it up to to auto correct.

I believe that it is probably going to eventually reshape the language simply because in our fast paced digital world, proof reading is either less prevalent or just not done. Being mildly dyslexic I have the dilemma of needing autocorrect and hating the errors it creates. Especially in news articles which I find quite disturbing. It does however create some funny texting situations. 

Thank you for that

[Piney]

1 hour ago, cormac mac airt said:

His claim would appear to be incorrect. 

 

I know. I just want to know who's selling what line of bull****.

[jesshill]

2 hours ago, Piney said:

is a ancient 360-day year. At the time, the year was 360 days long, not as today 365 days long. A year was shorter than today.

Thanks for your feedback. Did you read his article? At first, I had a vary hard time with the idea of a Earth-Moon binary. But, as I studied the orbital precession of the two bodies (apsidal motion), I was convinced that he was right.

As for an actual 360-day year for planet Earth, I have no idea how that could have happened. I have read the theory and, personally, found it unconvincing.

Jess  

[jesshill]

7 hours ago, Ove said:

is a ancient 360-day year. At the time, the year was 360 days long, not as today 365 days long. A year was shorter than today.

Thanks for your feedback. Did you read his article? At first, I had a vary hard time with the idea of a Earth-Moon binary. But, as I studied the orbital precession of the two bodies (apsidal motion), I was convinced that he was right.

As for an actual 360-day year for planet Earth, I have no idea how that could have happened. I have read the theory and, personally, found it unconvincing.

Jess  

[cormac mac airt]

2 hours ago, cormac mac airt said:

His claim would appear to be incorrect. 

https://spacemath.gsfc.nasa.gov/earth/6Page58.pdf

cormac

[jesshill]

13 minutes ago, cormac mac airt said:

His claim would appear to be incorrect. 

Thanks for attaching the article (Earth’s Rotation Changes and the Length of the Day)

Isn't the article suggesting that 70-million years in the future the number of days in an Earth year maybe 360-days?

Jess

 

[+Noteverythingisaconspiracy]

9 hours ago, Ove said:

is a ancient 360-day year. At the time, the year was 360 days long, not as today 365 days long. A year was shorter than today.

The days were shorter in the past, so there would have been more days in a year, not fewer.

The changes in the length of a day in the timescale we are talking about is negligible.

Do you have any evidence that the orbit of the earth have changed on a timescale that is relevant here? 

Edited October 22, 2018 by Noteverythingisaconspiracy

[cormac mac airt]

1 hour ago, jesshill said:

Thanks for attaching the article (Earth’s Rotation Changes and the Length of the Day)

Isn't the article suggesting that 70-million years in the future the number of days in an Earth year maybe 360-days?

Jess

As it makes no specific mention it may even be less than 360 days, but that's irrelevant to what the length of a year was in the past. 

cormac

[jesshill]

52 minutes ago, Noteverythingisaconspiracy said:

Do you have any evidence that the orbit of the earth have changed on a timescale that is relevant here?

The idea that has been proposed is an Earth-Moon binary system with a mean orbit period of 360-days. The author of the article "Solving the mystery of the ancient 360-day calendar" provides his rationale and was enough to convince me. Of course i'm no astronomer or a scientist for that matter.

Jess

[+Noteverythingisaconspiracy]

13 minutes ago, jesshill said:

The idea that has been proposed is an Earth-Moon binary system with a mean orbit period of 360-days. The author of the article "Solving the mystery of the ancient 360-day calendar" provides his rationale and was enough to convince me. Of course i'm no astronomer or a scientist for that matter.

You have all ready been told about the origins of our calendar system. You are essentially trying to solve a "mystery" that isn't a mystery in the first place.