Donald Trump and a world of disorder

[Gromdor]

46 minutes ago, RavenHawk said:

Where did I say anything about "government"?  I said "with our creativity and the free market".  That's not necessarily 'government'.  Government can certainly be a part of it, but there is no government takeover or redistribution.  Now Trump has stimulated the sciences with the Space Force and it will be reminiscent with the Golden Age of NASA.  The majority of today's Military-Industrial Complex are civilian contractors that also work in the public sector, so the power of government today will not be as controlling as it was decades earlier.

Why would a company ever work to get a customer/country off dependency on it's product?  That's just bad business.

 

[+DieChecker]

14 hours ago, Stardrive said:

Funny thing is, I found out, by accident, how to double a cars mpg. I'm not going to say how, but once I figured it out, I realized it has to be known about already, it's just hushed up.

I've read that such can be done. I've also read that many inventors who have gotten copyrights to such inventions get "bought out", and the technology disappears into one car corporation or another and disappears. 

[Stardrive]

14 minutes ago, DieChecker said:

I've read that such can be done. I've also read that many inventors who have gotten copyrights to such inventions get "bought out", and the technology disappears into one car corporation or another and disappears. 

I think it's a matter of time now before it gets out on the web. Once it does, it's on.

[Gromdor]

I would imagine if you got rid of everything (like emissions control) and concentrated on efficiency, you could double mileage pretty easy.

Even something as simple as a catalytic converter puts a load on the engine: https://www.quora.com/How-true-is-it-that-a-catalytic-converter-reduces-the-fuel-consumption-in-a-car

[aztek]

yea, you could, but you would hate to be driving such car

[Unusual Tournament]

15 hours ago, Gromdor said:

Why would a company ever work to get a customer/country off dependency on it's product?  That's just bad business.

 

private - public sector collaboration is nothing new. create a better energy product that's good for the consumer and your country and your government will support it and making it harder for the oil and gas industry by raising environmental issues and forcing them to keep oil and gas prices down. to me that's good business and good government and nothing to do with politically defunct labels like socialism. 

Edited October 26, 2018 by Captain Risky

[RavenHawk]

19 hours ago, Gromdor said:

Why would a company ever work to get a customer/country off dependency on it's product?  That's just bad business.

 

For a better product, to keep up with the times, or keep up with demand.  These are the attributes of the Invisible Hand.  In a free market, it is the consumer that drives the economy, not the government.  Creativity satisfies the drive.  Government driven economy is Socialism.  Socialism is the antithesis of creativity and the Invisible Hand.  Bad business is the crony capitalism of Socialism.

[Stardrive]

17 hours ago, Gromdor said:

I would imagine if you got rid of everything (like emissions control) and concentrated on efficiency, you could double mileage pretty easy.

Even something as simple as a catalytic converter puts a load on the engine: https://www.quora.com/How-true-is-it-that-a-catalytic-converter-reduces-the-fuel-consumption-in-a-car

It didn't have anything to do with the emission system or engine, but I did eventually have to get it repaired.

[Farmer77]

On 10/26/2018 at 9:50 AM, Gromdor said:

I would imagine if you got rid of everything (like emissions control) and concentrated on efficiency, you could double mileage pretty easy.

Even something as simple as a catalytic converter puts a load on the engine: https://www.quora.com/How-true-is-it-that-a-catalytic-converter-reduces-the-fuel-consumption-in-a-car

10 years or so ago a coupleo f guys at work and I found directions for a hydrogen generator add on. I dont remember the specifics but it near doubled MPG in one of our cars. The rest of us were under warranty and scared to try it out.

IDK that this was the exact site but its the same concept http://discoverhydrogen.com/

[Phaeton80]

Heres an interesting piece..
 

 

Quote

How To Identify The People Who Truly Do NOT Get It

After many, many years in the “patriot” movement, it is my studied opinion that most of the so-called patriots who claim to “get it” really don’t. Ditto for most of the “patriot” radio talk show hosts, columnists and Internet bloggers. The reality is that there are very few people who seem to truly understand the big picture and who possess the sagacity to discern the real war that is raging around us—which helps to explain, of course, why nothing much ever changes.

What follows are three of the tell-tale signs that people truly do NOT get it.

https://chuckbaldwinlive.com/Articles/tabid/109/ID/3799/How-To-Identify-The-People-Who-Truly-Do-NOT-Get-It.aspx

 

[+DieChecker]

1 hour ago, Phaeton80 said:

Heres an interesting piece..
 

https://chuckbaldwinlive.com/Articles/tabid/109/ID/3799/How-To-Identify-The-People-Who-Truly-Do-NOT-Get-It.aspx

 

Interesting piece. I noticed the author put a "©" at the end. Probably thinks a lot of himself. Thinks he "gets it". Funny that he says what he thinks indicates people "Don't get it", but he doesn't tell us what the "real war" really is about. Maybe it is in the sub-text of his preaching?

EDIT: Is this the same Chuck Baldwin?

https://www.splcenter.org/fighting-hate/extremist-files/individual/chuck-baldwin

EDIT: EDIT: Funny that I used the term "preaching", since the guy is a pastor and preaches for a living.

Edited October 28, 2018 by DieChecker

[TigerBright19]

Just watched the latest episode of SJW Doctor Who.  Quite sickening really.  They attacked Trump again and again with constant references to his administration and even parodied the President with a character who is a corrupt trigger happy American businessman who is running for President in 2020.  They even joked about ways to kill him by putting a poisonous spider in his bed.  A quick recap.

Episode 1 - Was focused on multiculturalism

Episode 2 - Was focused on equal pay and same sex marriage

Episode 3 - Was focused on racism in 1955 America.

Episode 4 - Was focused on attacking Trump and protecting the environment.

Doctor Who really has gone down the SJW pan.

 

Edited October 28, 2018 by Aaron2016

[bee]

6 minutes ago, Aaron2016 said:

Just watched the latest episode of SJW Doctor Who.  Quite sickening really.  They attacked Trump again and again with constant references to his administration and even parodied the President with a character who is a corrupt trigger happy American businessman who is running for President in 2020.  They even joked about ways to kill him by putting a poisonous spider in his bed.  A quick recap.

Episode 1 - Was focused on multiculturalism

Episode 2 - Was focused on equal pay and same sex marriage

Episode 3 - Was focused on racism in 1955 America.

Episode 4 - Was focused on attacking Trump and protecting the environment.

Doctor Who really has gone down the SJW pan.

 

 

thanks...

I don't bother with Doctor Who nowadays... but it is sickening to hear how the program is being used
in that way... for social engineering .... and propaganda against Trump

jeeeezus can't they leave anything alone... they want to turn everyone into dumbed down sheep...

FFS

 

 

 

[Stardrive]

If they don't get their way nothing is safe. And that would include the thought manipulation by the media we are seeing today. Which includes using sensationalized headline grabbers all competing for a share of their remaining and declining viewership. The same thing is happening with late night television. Jay Leno had more viewers than all 3 of the biggies do now combined. But yet they persist.

[Sir Wearer of Hats]

2 hours ago, Aaron2016 said:

Just watched the latest episode of SJW Doctor Who.  Quite sickening really.  They attacked Trump again and again with constant references to his administration and even parodied the President with a character who is a corrupt trigger happy American businessman who is running for President in 2020.  They even joked about ways to kill him by putting a poisonous spider in his bed.  A quick recap.

Episode 1 - Was focused on multiculturalism

Episode 2 - Was focused on equal pay and same sex marriage

Episode 3 - Was focused on racism in 1955 America.

Episode 4 - Was focused on attacking Trump and protecting the environment.

Doctor Who really has gone down the SJW pan.

 

Focused on multiculturalism? Why, because there hsppened to be a Muslim and a black kid as two of the characters?

focused on sane sex marriage? Because one character, in passing said she had a wife?

focused on protecting the environment? Well no ****, Who has been doing that since the 60s.

 

you’d have had kittens if you were watching in the 70s whwn there were episodes written by actual card carrying members of the Communist Party.

[Phaeton80]

On 28-10-2018 at 1:45 PM, DieChecker said:

Interesting piece. I noticed the author put a "©" at the end. Probably thinks a lot of himself. Thinks he "gets it". Funny that he says what he thinks indicates people "Don't get it", but he doesn't tell us what the "real war" really is about. Maybe it is in the sub-text of his preaching?

EDIT: Is this the same Chuck Baldwin?

https://www.splcenter.org/fighting-hate/extremist-files/individual/chuck-baldwin

EDIT: EDIT: Funny that I used the term "preaching", since the guy is a pastor and preaches for a living.

 

Lets focus on what the man has to say about the subject at hand, I certainly dont agree with him on other aspects referred to in the link you provided here. That doesnt mean he doesnt verbalise some obvious logical fallacies regarding considerable parts of the socalled patriot movement.

In any case, Id love to see some comments on the actual content of the piece I provided instead of trying to assassinate the character - in any shape or form - of the author.

 

Edit: Id pose the 'real war' is the one waged against you and yours, your perception, your 'reality'. This goes for all of us, not only US nationals, but Westerners in general.

Edited November 2, 2018 by Phaeton80

[+DieChecker]

21 hours ago, Phaeton80 said:

Lets focus on what the man has to say about the subject at hand, I certainly dont agree with him on other aspects referred to in the link you provided here. That doesnt mean he doesnt verbalise some obvious logical fallacies regarding considerable parts of the socalled patriot movement.

In any case, Id love to see some comments on the actual content of the piece I provided instead of trying to assassinate the character - in any shape or form - of the author.

Fair enough. I'll look at it again and see what I think of just the content. Off hand, I seem to remember that he brought up a lot of valid points.

I only commented on the copyright because you generally only see that in individuals who think what they say is Extremely valuable. 

And I do see a LOT of people saying what they think is "wrong", but very few who actually say what the alternatives are, or how to fix said wrong things. Was just trying to point out that he says certain people are wrong, but he doesn't say what is right.

Quote

Edit: Id pose the 'real war' is the one waged against you and yours, your perception, your 'reality'. This goes for all of us, not only US nationals, but Westerners in general

Hummm.... I'll think about that as I go back to your link.

[+DieChecker]

38 minutes ago, DieChecker said:

Fair enough. I'll look at it again and see what I think of just the content. Off hand, I seem to remember that he brought up a lot of valid points.

I only commented on the copyright because you generally only see that in individuals who think what they say is Extremely valuable. 

And I do see a LOT of people saying what they think is "wrong", but very few who actually say what the alternatives are, or how to fix said wrong things. Was just trying to point out that he says certain people are wrong, but he doesn't say what is right.

Hummm.... I'll think about that as I go back to your link.

Your link again.... 

https://chuckbaldwinlive.com/Articles/tabid/109/ID/3799/How-To-Identify-The-People-Who-Truly-Do-NOT-Get-It.aspx

Quote

What follows are three of the tell-tale signs that people truly do NOT get it.

1. They believe that the Deep State is mostly confined to the Democrat Party and people such as George Soros.

In essence, these folks are totally immersed in the Republican-Democrat, left-right, conservative-liberal false paradigm. Soros has helped finance both Democrats and Republicans (including Donald Trump). And while so-called conservative Republicans use George Soros as a poster child of the enemy, they RUN to Las Vegas to meet with Sheldon Adelson in hopes of procuring his financial and political blessings. And, frankly, between the two, Adelson is a hundred times more dangerous to our liberties than Soros. Yet, “conservatives” love Adelson and despise Soros.

These people truly do NOT get it.

....

Deep State moguls couldn’t care less about all of the arguing and bickering going on between the two parties, except as it provides them with an effective distraction from the things they really care about, knowing that at the end of the day, both parties will continue to further their agenda.

People who are caught up in the phony left-right paradigm truly do NOT get it.

Basically, how I am reading this is... The problem isn't the Deep State Democrats, it is self interested government leaders. Who may be D, or R, but who are only in it for power for themselves.

Quote

2. They believe that Islamists are our enemies and Zionists are our friends.

On this subject, the vast majority of evangelical Christians are proving themselves to be absolute dupes. Think this through:

...

The truth is, the most violent, bloodthirsty people in the Muslim world today are the Wahhabi Muslims in Saudi Arabia.

...

Where is the fear mongering and hate mongering toward the Wahhabi Muslims of Saudi Arabia from America’s “conservatives” and “Christians?”

Not only do “conservatives” and “Christians” make (non-Wahhabi) Muslims their perpetual scapegoats; they totally and thoroughly embrace Jewish Zionists as their best friends. Never mind that Zionists have done more to destroy America’s historic Christian culture than any group of people on the planet; never mind that Zionists have taken control of the mainstream media (that “conservatives” and “Christians” love to hate); never mind that Zionist money and influence have polluted America’s entertainment industries and political institutions; never mind that the Zionist State of Israel is a bloodthirsty apartheid state; never mind that Zionist Israel is (along with Wahhabi Muslim Saudi Arabia) the biggest sponsor of terrorism in the Middle East. Never mind that Christians have been duped and deceived by C.I. Scofield’s Israel-based prophecy propaganda; never mind that under Christ’s New Covenant, the Zionists of Israel are no more “God’s chosen people” than the Wahhabis of Saudi Arabia. Never mind any of that. To “conservatives” and “Christians” everywhere, Israel is our “friend.”

I’m telling you: People who want to demonize the Muslim states (except Saudi Arabia, of course) and idolize the State of Israel do NOT get it—not in any form or fashion.

...

So, he doesn't hate Muslims and love Jews. He hates only SOME Muslims and ALSO hates the Jews. I'd argue with some of the points he is making, that it is based on spin, rather then pure fact.

Quote

3. They believe that Donald Trump is a superhero who is fighting the Deep State.

These people truly do NOT get it.

Again, the Deep State is apolitical. Left and right, conservative and liberal mean nothing to the Deep State. Until the American people wake up to that fact—and wake up to the fact that the primary focus and agenda of the Deep State is PERPETUAL WAR—they will always be in the dark about the Deep State.

For the Deep State, the name of the game is WAR. War advances the goals and enriches the pockets of Deep State moguls more than anything else in the world. “Nation-building,” “regime-change,” “fighting terror,” “exporting democracy,” etc., are the rubrics under which the Deep State wages its perpetual never-ending wars. This is what the Deep State is all about.

To know whether a politician—especially a President—is in the pocket of the Deep State, look no further than the way he or she wages war. And anyone who is even halfway objective and awake can see that Donald Trump has become one of the Deep State’s most effective servants.

I’ll say it straight out: The Deep State doesn’t hate or fear Donald Trump; it loves Donald Trump, because Donald Trump is the warmonger’s warmonger.

...

The Zionist neoconservatives now have their hope rekindled of re-establishing American and Israeli hegemony with an undetected first strike nuclear cruise missile attack on Russia.

The vast majority of the peoples in the world have no idea what is happening. They are trying to find or to keep jobs, to provide housing and food, to find the money for a mortgage or car or credit card payment in the US, and in much of the world water to drink and a bit of food to eat. They are stressed out. They have no energy to confront bad news or to figure out what is happening.

Donald Trump’s war fever is dangerously high. No wonder quintessential war hawk Senator Lindsey Graham suddenly loves Donald Trump. Trump is pushing the war envelope to every part of the globe. Iran, Syria, Pakistan, India, Russia, China and Venezuela are all under threat of imminent military—or even nuclear—attack by Donald Trump. Is Trump a madman, or is he merely the Deep State’s most loyal subject? It really won’t matter when the mushroom clouds start going up.

Anyone who believes that Donald Trump is fighting the Deep State truly does NOT get it.

Humm..... I find a lot of this hard to swallow. 

Trump apparently did drop a lot of bombs in 2017, 10% more then Obama did... On ISIS. https://www.newsweek.com/trump-era-record-number-bombs-dropped-middle-east-667505

I guess stopping ISIS was a horrible thing to do. 

What Wars are we involved in right now? A warmonger's warmonger should have doubtless gotten us into some really good wars by now. Korea is lit up, right? Oh, it's going peaceful? Afghanistan? Same... Iraq? Same... Iran? No war yet, though the Left said we'd be at war during the Campaign season two years ago, if Trump got elected. Didn't happen.

If Trump is working for the Military Industrial Complex, he's doing a p*** poor job of it, IMHO.

Aside from the whole MIC thing, I don't think Trump is at war with the Deep State. If he was, we'd see tens of thousands of Federal Workers being let go and replaced by "loyal" workers. Since that isn't happening, then such a war doesn't exist. Again, IMHO.

So, aside from a bit of difference is interpretation about the Far Right Militia Scriptures and Beliefs, I think Mr Baldwin fits in rather well with those he is accusing of Not Getting It. He's arguing a level of semantics, rather then saying the Militia culture is way off base.

[Farmer77]

8 minutes ago, DieChecker said:

What Wars are we involved in right now? A warmonger's warmonger should have doubtless gotten us into some really good wars by now. Korea is lit up, right? Oh, it's going peaceful? Afghanistan? Same... Iraq? Same... Iran? No war yet, though the Left said we'd be at war during the Campaign season two years ago, if Trump got elected. Didn't happen.

Not really peaceful in Afghanistan its basically become a full quagmire and we're at this point basically just hoping the Taliban will negotiate with us so we can exit while claiming some sort of a victory. Now none of that is Trump's fault but to add that to the W column for him isnt quite accurate

There is also our African misadventures which for some reason dont get much press

Trump’s Military Escalation in Somalia Is Spurring Hope and Fear

The US Military’s Best-Kept Secret

I dont think Trump is necessarily a warmonger per se........the problem is he has zero fundamental stances beyond liking himself so if he thought becoming a warmonger would benefit him I have no doubt that is the move he would make.

11 minutes ago, DieChecker said:

If Trump is working for the Military Industrial Complex, he's doing a p*** poor job of it, IMHO.

A 200 billion dollar raise isnt exactly working against them either.

Robert Reich: Trump Increased Military Spending By Over $200 Billion. Here's How That Money Could Be Spent | Opinion

Not to mention a 350 billion dollar arms deal with a terrorist supporting (and reporter killing) state  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2017_United_States–Saudi_Arabia_arms_deal

All rather run of the mill stuff for a president, the problem from my perspective is he still has people believing he is an "outsider" working against the MIC and the "deep state" , despite bending the knee to the MIC and Saudi Arabia just like any other POTUS before him

[Phaeton80]

1 hour ago, DieChecker said:

Your link again.... 

https://chuckbaldwinlive.com/Articles/tabid/109/ID/3799/How-To-Identify-The-People-Who-Truly-Do-NOT-Get-It.aspx

Quote

1. They believe that the Deep State is mostly confined to the Democrat Party and people such as George Soros.

In essence, these folks are totally immersed in the Republican-Democrat, left-right, conservative-liberal false paradigm. Soros has helped finance both Democrats and Republicans (including Donald Trump). And while so-called conservative Republicans use George Soros as a poster child of the enemy, they RUN to Las Vegas to meet with Sheldon Adelson in hopes of procuring his financial and political blessings. And, frankly, between the two, Adelson is a hundred times more dangerous to our liberties than Soros. Yet, “conservatives” love Adelson and despise Soros.

These people truly do NOT get it.

By definition, the Deep State is not conspicuous. It is hidden deeply out of sight where it can work unobserved and unfettered. Furthermore, the Deep State moves comfortably and seamlessly among both the Democrat and Republican parties. The Deep State will use conservatives as effectively as liberals and vice versa. It uses Democrats to attack our 2nd Amendment liberties and Republicans to attack our 4th Amendment liberties. No matter which party is in control of the Congress or the White House, the Deep State agenda presses on almost unimpeded—and, yes, that includes having Donald Trump in the White House.

People such as George Soros are merely headliners to give “patriots” a visible target to shoot at, while the real power brokers infiltrate many of the very organizations that are openly opposing people such as Soros.

Understand this: All of the bitterness and political hate speech going on between liberals and conservatives, between Democrats and Republicans, is nothing but public theater. Some of the rancor and bitterness is indeed genuine, of course, while some of it is as phony as a three dollar bill. But ALL of it only serves to provide cover for the real power brokers who are manipulating the left and the right for their own purposes.

Basically, how I am reading this is... The problem isn't the Deep State Democrats, it is self interested government leaders. Who may be D, or R, but who are only in it for power for themselves.\

Well, what Im taking from this is the (to me rather obvious) notion the Democrat Vs Republican paradigm is a false paradigm, that behind both these parties thesame elements wield an subversive, unconstitutional control over national policy - no matter which side is in the driverseat. The rather obvious notion neither the Republican or Democratic parties / candidates will ever change the present pattern of governning in structural favor of corporations and against the interests of the American People. The rather obvious fallacy in regarding George Soros as the be all end all of evil, while regarding Adelson as a harmless, endearing old man (to be ignored). In short; fomenting the self delusion Republicans are good, Democrats are bad (or vice versa), Trump is good, Obama is bad (or vice versa), Soros is bad, Adelson is good (or vice versa). False left-right, conservative-liberal paradigms. Posing the also rather obvious notion that as long as the masses believe in these false narratives, no change is forthcoming any time soon (= 'the problem').

 

Quote

2. They believe that Islamists are our enemies and Zionists are our friends.

On this subject, the vast majority of evangelical Christians are proving themselves to be absolute dupes. Think this through:

On the one hand, “Christians” and “conservatives” spend countless hours, expend limitless energy and spend millions of dollars demonizing Muslims. The threat of Muslims justifies the “War on Terror.” The threat of Muslims justifies a burgeoning Police State. The threat of Muslims is promoted in fundraising letters, periodicals, books, radio broadcasts, TV shows, etc., by practically every “conservative” political and religious organization in the country.

Part of Donald Trump’s popularity among “conservatives” and “Christians” is the manner in which he invokes fear of and hatred toward Muslims. Ditto for the vast majority of Christian pastors and television evangelists. They all promote the mass killing of Muslims in Afghanistan, Iraq, Syria, Iran, Lebanon, Somalia, Pakistan, etc.

But on the other hand, they all happily endorse sending billions of dollars in arms and munitions to the Muslims in Saudi Arabia. Muslims in Iran are said to be our enemies, but Muslims in Saudi Arabia are our “allies.” REALLY? What kind of hallucinogenic are they ingesting?

The truth is, the most violent, bloodthirsty people in the Muslim world today are the Wahhabi Muslims in Saudi Arabia. Wahhabis are the ones who were used to form terror groups such as ISIS, al-Nusra, etc. Wahhabis are the ones who are murdering thousands of innocent men, women and children in Yemen and throughout the Middle East and Northern Africa. Wahhabis are the ones who round up and torture, maim, dismember, imprison and murder Christians, Jews AND non-Wahhabi Muslims within Saudi Arabia. If you believe the official story of 9/11, it was Wahhabi Muslims from Saudi Arabia that flew those jets into the Twin Towers.

Yet, America sends billions of dollars in weapons to the Wahhabi Muslims in Saudi Arabia—and “conservatives” and “Christians” are all for it. A few days ago, TV evangelist Pat Robertson used his vast Christian Broadcasting Network (CBN) to defend America’s friendship and partnership with the Wahhabi Muslims in Saudi Arabia.

Why must Americans hate and bomb and kill Shia Muslims in Iran and Syria, while at the same time, we must befriend, partner with, and finance Wahhabi Muslims in Saudi Arabia—and even look the other way as they inflict the cruelest and most evil acts of barbarity and bloodshed?

So, he doesn't hate Muslims and love Jews. He hates only SOME Muslims and ALSO hates the Jews. I'd argue with some of the points he is making, that it is based on spin, rather then pure fact.

Thats an erm.. interesting summary.. One might also conclude the man is pointing out the raging hypocrisy - complete and utter up side down irrational - in claiming to fight Wahhabi ISIS on the one hand, while constituting the foremost political and military ally of the main ideological source of Wahhabism; Saudi Arabia. Well known for disseminating Wahhabi extremist school of thought throughout the ME as well as the West (funding madrasses and Mosques throughout both regions). The sheer idiocy in focussing on Shia Islam and Iran as the great terror threat, while providing military hardware, funds and unwavering political / even religiously zealous support to Sunni Wahhabi states.

 

Quote

3. They believe that Donald Trump is a superhero who is fighting the Deep State.

These people truly do NOT get it.

Again, the Deep State is apolitical. Left and right, conservative and liberal mean nothing to the Deep State. Until the American people wake up to that fact—and wake up to the fact that the primary focus and agenda of the Deep State is PERPETUAL WAR—they will always be in the dark about the Deep State.

For the Deep State, the name of the game is WAR. War advances the goals and enriches the pockets of Deep State moguls more than anything else in the world. “Nation-building,” “regime-change,” “fighting terror,” “exporting democracy,” etc., are the rubrics under which the Deep State wages its perpetual never-ending wars. This is what the Deep State is all about.

To know whether a politician—especially a President—is in the pocket of the Deep State, look no further than the way he or she wages war. And anyone who is even halfway objective and awake can see that Donald Trump has become one of the Deep State’s most effective servants.

I’ll say it straight out: The Deep State doesn’t hate or fear Donald Trump; it loves Donald Trump, because Donald Trump is the warmonger’s warmonger.

Donald Trump is on a pace to drop more bombs and kill more innocent people during his first four years in office than Barack Obama did during eight years in office. In fact, Trump is dropping a bomb somewhere in the world every 12 minutes. This report notes:

We now know that Donald Trump’s administration puts all previous presidents to shame. The Pentagon’s numbers show that during George W. Bush’s eight years he averaged 24 bombs dropped per day, which is 8,750 per year. Over the course of Obama’s time in office, his military dropped 34 bombs per day, 12,500 per year. And in Trump’s first year in office, he averaged 121 bombs dropped per day, for an annual total of 44,096.

If the Deep State loved Obama, it absolutely adores Trump, because Donald Trump is escalating the Warfare State “to infinity and beyond.” Last Tuesday, Vice President Mike Pence even suggested that the Trump administration is considering deploying nuclear weapons into outer space.

Humm..... I find a lot of this hard to swallow. 

Trump apparently did drop a lot of bombs in 2017, 10% more then Obama did... On ISIS. https://www.newsweek.com/trump-era-record-number-bombs-dropped-middle-east-667505

I guess stopping ISIS was a horrible thing to do. 

Oh come on, the US and her allies were caught red handed supporting ISIS groups like al Nusra in another passionate attempt to topple another ME head of state, lets not try and make it look like the US heroically defeated ISIS in Syria shall we? If it werent for Russia, Assad would have fallen and ISIS affiliated groups would now reign supreme in the region.

What Wars are we involved in right now? A warmonger's warmonger should have doubtless gotten us into some really good wars by now. Korea is lit up, right? Oh, it's going peaceful? Afghanistan? Same... Iraq? Same... Iran? No war yet, though the Left said we'd be at war during the Campaign season two years ago, if Trump got elected. Didn't happen.

"Though President Donald Trump campaigned on a more isolationist foreign policy platform, he’s largely expanded or reinvigorated his predecessor’s conflicts in Afghanistan, Iraq, Syria, Yemen, Somalia, Libya, and Niger. The report gives the clearest indication to date of America’s most pressing military conflicts under Trump, largely detailing an uptick in direct and indirect combat, as well as “advise and assist” operations across all regions.

Under what authority?

The details revealed in this new report are likely to reinvigorate long-held concerns about the perceived overuse of AUMF, the sweeping post 9/11 legislation U.S. presidents have used to expanded existing wars or enter new conflicts without Congressional approval."

https://news.vice.com/en_us/article/a3ywd5/white-house-acknowledges-the-us-is-at-war-in-seven-countries

This, ofcourse, besides his incessant words - even acts of war against Iran.. Russia.. China; which are all filled to the brim with military potential, all possible WWIII initiators.

If Trump is working for the Military Industrial Complex, he's doing a p*** poor job of it, IMHO.

Is he really..

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/02/27/us/politics/trump-budget-military.html

 

Quote

Aside from the whole MIC thing, I don't think Trump is at war with the Deep State. If he was, we'd see tens of thousands of Federal Workers being let go and replaced by "loyal" workers. Since that isn't happening, then such a war doesn't exist. Again, IMHO.

So, aside from a bit of difference is interpretation about the Far Right Militia Scriptures and Beliefs, I think Mr Baldwin fits in rather well with those he is accusing of Not Getting It. He's arguing a level of semantics, rather then saying the Militia culture is way off base.

Well we certainly agree on one point DC (Trump not being at war with the deep state). You know its funny, to me you seem to conspiquously argue your way around the most blatant fallacies pointed out in the provided piece, to such a degree which, in all honesty, is nothing short of mindboggling. I do appreciate you taking the time to react to some actual content though, from which some actual meaningful discussions may arise (which is always a good thing, especially on a forum like this).

Edited November 3, 2018 by Phaeton80

[+DieChecker]

6 hours ago, Farmer77 said:

Not really peaceful in Afghanistan its basically become a full quagmire and we're at this point basically just hoping the Taliban will negotiate with us so we can exit while claiming some sort of a victory. Now none of that is Trump's fault but to add that to the W column for him isnt quite accurate

There is also our African misadventures which for some reason dont get much press

Trump’s Military Escalation in Somalia Is Spurring Hope and Fear

The US Military’s Best-Kept Secret

I dont think Trump is necessarily a warmonger per se........the problem is he has zero fundamental stances beyond liking himself so if he thought becoming a warmonger would benefit him I have no doubt that is the move he would make.

A 200 billion dollar raise isnt exactly working against them either.

Robert Reich: Trump Increased Military Spending By Over $200 Billion. Here's How That Money Could Be Spent | Opinion

Not to mention a 350 billion dollar arms deal with a terrorist supporting (and reporter killing) state  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2017_United_States–Saudi_Arabia_arms_deal

All rather run of the mill stuff for a president, the problem from my perspective is he still has people believing he is an "outsider" working against the MIC and the "deep state" , despite bending the knee to the MIC and Saudi Arabia just like any other POTUS before him

I'd agree that spending is up. But, I had thought it was sold as "updating", of equipment? Part of that 200 billion was increasing the pay of our military members by 2.5%. More then what has been seen in decades. I do suppose that it could be viewed as funding the MIC, but in my opinion, adding more advanced ships, adding more advanced fighters, adding more advanced bombers... is a better way to protect ourselves. What is the alternative? Spend nothing on defense materials? Because we don't want military industry bigwigs to get rich? That's like refusing to work, so you don't have to pay taxes. It doesn't help you in the long run.

A Saudi Arms deal... Sure, we can look at line items and say, "That shouldn't be happening...". 

Bottom line is still that if Trump is a warmonger's warmonger and working for the MIC, he's not doing a very good job of it. The MIC wants to replace stuff, which requires a war to use stuff, and little bush wars aren't going to do that.

[+DieChecker]

5 hours ago, Phaeton80 said:

 

Well we certainly agree on one point DC (Trump not being at war with the deep state). You know its funny, to me you seem to conspiquously argue your way around the most blatant fallacies pointed out in the provided piece, to such a degree which, in all honesty, is nothing short of mindboggling. I do appreciate you taking the time to react to some actual content though, from which some actual meaningful discussions may arise (which is always a good thing, especially on a forum like this).

As to the 1st of the three parts. I don't think we're of dissimilar thought on that. You simply are expanding on what I said at a much more basic level. The political dichotomy is false, and it is simply individuals seeking power within the government which are the real enemy of the people.

As to the second of the three parts... You are right there is hypocracy. But as a friend of mine often has said... "You don't fight fanatics directly, you fight them with other fanatics.", and, "You don't try to stop fanatics, you point them where you want them to fight your other enemies.". And that's what I believe about the Saudis. They are a sword that we have a strong grip on that can be flailed around and used to fight our enemies. That the sword occationally comes around and nicks us too is, I'm assuming, damages that the US government is willing to accept.

Same basically with Israel. We fund them and they fight/act for us as a proxy. And we get the good will of the Jewish Old Money.

As to the third part... Personally, I think we need to abandon Iraq and Afghanistan. And I think we've done much in breaking ISIS and in regards to Syria. It was said that Obama had to eat a big crap sandwich that he inherited in the Middle East from Bush. But the same can be said of Trump. Obama handed him just as big, or bigger, of a crap sandwich.

[Farmer77]

7 hours ago, DieChecker said:

I'd agree that spending is up. But, I had thought it was sold as "updating", of equipment? Part of that 200 billion was increasing the pay of our military members by 2.5%. More then what has been seen in decades. I do suppose that it could be viewed as funding the MIC, but in my opinion, adding more advanced ships, adding more advanced fighters, adding more advanced bombers... is a better way to protect ourselves. What is the alternative? Spend nothing on defense materials? Because we don't want military industry bigwigs to get rich? That's like refusing to work, so you don't have to pay taxes. It doesn't help you in the long run.

You can do both though. We could shrink our global footprint cut our DOD budget by a couple of billion or so and still have the most advanced military on earth.......... by far. 

7 hours ago, DieChecker said:

Bottom line is still that if Trump is a warmonger's warmonger and working for the MIC, he's not doing a very good job of it. The MIC wants to replace stuff, which requires a war to use stuff, and little bush wars aren't going to do that.

You're not wrong but at the end of the day I called Obama a mass murderer for the numbers he bombed and killed and Trump is currently headed down that same path.

[Gromdor]

7 hours ago, DieChecker said:

Bottom line is still that if Trump is a warmonger's warmonger and working for the MIC, he's not doing a very good job of it. The MIC wants to replace stuff, which requires a war to use stuff, and little bush wars aren't going to do that.

Space Force?  Arms deals to Saudi Arabia and the like which are actually consuming stuff? Deployment of troops to non-war zones (Mexico border)? Leaving nuclear treaties and developing more nukes?

There are plenty of ways to please the MIC without getting our boys shot. 

[Phaeton80]

17 hours ago, DieChecker said:

As to the 1st of the three parts. I don't think we're of dissimilar thought on that. You simply are expanding on what I said at a much more basic level. The political dichotomy is false, and it is simply individuals seeking power within the government which are the real enemy of the people.

As to the second of the three parts... You are right there is hypocracy. But as a friend of mine often has said... "You don't fight fanatics directly, you fight them with other fanatics.", and, "You don't try to stop fanatics, you point them where you want them to fight your other enemies.". And that's what I believe about the Saudis. They are a sword that we have a strong grip on that can be flailed around and used to fight our enemies. That the sword occationally comes around and nicks us too is, I'm assuming, damages that the US government is willing to accept.

Same basically with Israel. We fund them and they fight/act for us as a proxy. And we get the good will of the Jewish Old Money.

As to the third part... Personally, I think we need to abandon Iraq and Afghanistan. And I think we've done much in breaking ISIS and in regards to Syria. It was said that Obama had to eat a big crap sandwich that he inherited in the Middle East from Bush. But the same can be said of Trump. Obama handed him just as big, or bigger, of a crap sandwich.

So in your opinion, the US is using SA sourced extremists to fight ISIS.. Would you care to specify what SA extremists are battling other extremists? Because from where Im standing, it seems like its actually ISIS being used to further the US and her allies geo political aspirations. There are no 'good extremists' fighting 'bad extremists', theres mainly only ISIS and AQ; both made from thesame mall, both funded and raised by thesame hands to envigorate, consolidate the endless War on Terror; thereby reshuffling the ME to fit certain endgoals. To downplay / rationalise the toxic relation with SA as 'using fanatics to fight other fanatics', like its some shrewd play using SA proxies to fight ISIS - which is completely unfounded imho - is very dangerous. All the evidence points to SA being the main and foremost ideological and financial homeland of the groups known as ISIS, thinking SA is helping you against them seems like a convenient pipedream to me.

..Which brings us to Israel, your second point here. From where Im standing, it seems as though its the (complete) other way around; you fund them allright, but they are using the US as a proxy to achieve certain strategical aspirations (not only the US but the West in general, the US especially though). The level of control Israel has over US politics has been well documented, her government richly seeded with Israeli - US dual nationals, and her foreign policy could be easily placed as extremely advantageous for Israel. Not so much the other way around. As for 'the good will of Jewish Old Money'; I think that good will is relative, and I think it will mainly buy good will for Israeli / Zionist aspirations. The loyalty of these dual national citizens lie with Israel, and Israel alone.. Im quite sure.