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docyabut2

Caravan migrants stopped at Mexico border

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Hammerclaw
1 hour ago, Farmer77 said:

Honestly I don't think either are true.

Then your argument is stuck in the mud, spinning it's wheels. Trump's basic political philosophy is--America and Americans first, our true friends and allies second. Everyone else can get in line. To call him isolationist and xenophobic is a base canard; he engages the world on terms beneficial to his country and legal immigration and  it's paths to citizenship are as open as ever. He just has this nutty idea foreign nationals have no right to break our laws and enter and live in our country illegally. 

Edited by Hammerclaw
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Farmer77
13 minutes ago, Hammerclaw said:

Then your argument is stuck in the mud, spinning it's wheels. Trump's basic political philosophy is--America and Americans first, our true friends and allies second. Everyone else can get in line. To call him isolationist and xenophobic is a base canard; he engages the world on terms beneficial to his country and legal immigration and  it's paths to citizenship are as open as ever. He just has this nutty idea foreign nationals have no right to break our laws and enter and live in our country illegally. 

To claim his entire campaign isnt built around the great fear of the "other" is simply to deny reality at this point.  Being pro America is great, having strong borders is great, hell despite losing the popular vote the vast majority of the country including myself agree with Trump that strong borders are important.

The constant obsession over the issue however is really quite transparent. Its the right wing version of "identity politics" where everyone is out to get ya and being the victim is all the rage.

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Hammerclaw
6 minutes ago, Farmer77 said:

To claim his entire campaign isnt built around the great fear of the "other" is simply to deny reality at this point.  Being pro America is great, having strong borders is great, hell despite losing the popular vote the vast majority of the country including myself agree with Trump that strong borders are important.

The constant obsession over the issue however is really quite transparent. Its the right wing version of "identity politics" where everyone is out to get ya and being the victim is all the rage.

Defending our borders is no obsession--it's his responsibility. Timing this massive organized incursion with the election is to take advantage of the political situation, thinking he won't have the political will to orchestrate an aggressive and decisive response. They must not know him very well. When it comes to the welfare of his country, as he sees it, it's politics be damned!

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Farmer77
6 minutes ago, Hammerclaw said:

When it comes to the welfare of his country, as he sees it, it's politics be damned!

Or a slightly different perspective is that Cambridge Analytica told him that acting like a xenophobe would be good politics, which it clearly has been.

 

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spartan max2
21 minutes ago, Farmer77 said:

To claim his entire campaign isnt built around the great fear of the "other" is simply to deny reality at this point.  Being pro America is great, having strong borders is great, hell despite losing the popular vote the vast majority of the country including myself agree with Trump that strong borders are important.

The constant obsession over the issue however is really quite transparent. Its the right wing version of "identity politics" where everyone is out to get ya and being the victim is all the rage.

Just cuiours, if you were president right now, what would your response be to this carvan? 

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Hammerclaw
Just now, Farmer77 said:

Or a slightly different perspective is that Cambridge Analytica told him that acting like a xenophobe would be good politics, which it clearly has been.

 

If being a patriot and championing the American people is being a xenophobe, then Godspeed to him. 

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Farmer77
20 minutes ago, spartan max2 said:

Just cuiours, if you were president right now, what would your response be to this carvan? 

If it were just sprung on me probably not a whole lot different than Trumps response was if im honest. I wouldnt have changed the definition of who can apply for asylum like Trump did though so many more in the caravan would be eligible to legally apply.   

Big picture I would find a way to engage and divert the flow of caravans such as these. Things like working with Mexico and the smaller Caribbean states and territories to invest in infrastructure there creating an alternative location for these folks to set up their lives.

 

Edited by Farmer77
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Farmer77
14 minutes ago, Hammerclaw said:

If being a patriot and championing the American people is being a xenophobe, then Godspeed to him. 

If being a xenophobe is now considered being a patriot then god help all of us

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WickedMick

If any of you think this caravan is being led by poor, desperate, illegals, then you are delusional. This whole "immigration event" is being led by some insane liberal activist group much like the whole Free Palestine mess. This has Democrat hands all over it. Kind of odd it happens right at the point of midterm elections. 

Edited by WickedMick
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aztek
Just now, WickedMick said:

If any of you think this caravan is being led by poor, desperate, illegals, then you are delusional.

some of us sure try to sell it as such.  but majority here see it for what it really is, and you are correct about what it really is,

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joc
2 hours ago, Farmer77 said:

On a serious level this same group has been arranging caravans for almost a decade and its cooling down making it a good time of year to do so.

But I will stand by my position that it makes as much sense for Trump and company to have organized the caravan as it does for the left to have done so. Either way it would be a calculated gamble that the response to the caravan would be in your favor.

For Trump his entire campaign and presidency have been based on xenophobia, what better way to stoke that and ensure the base gets out to vote than providing an example of what there is to fear out there. For the left their entire shtick has been that Trump is an irrational bigot what better way to show that than force him into a situation where he may overreact.

Honestly I dont think either are true.

 

It will be interesting to see how the media narrative is going to play out...I mean...can you imagine... the military on the border...shooting starts and some kids are killed or wounded by Amercan troops...it is as much a recipe for disaster for Trump than it is to help him.

And... I just had a thought, what if it is the Mexican Government behind the Caravans? 

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Farmer77
1 minute ago, joc said:

It will be interesting to see how the media narrative is going to play out...I mean...can you imagine... the military on the border...shooting starts and some kids are killed or wounded by Amercan troops...it is as much a recipe for disaster for Trump than it is to help him.

That would be horrific. Thats kind of what I was saying about it being a gamble though, can you imagine the fallout if an immigrant killed a service member? I just dont see any mainstream political forces from either side taking that kind of a chance.

3 minutes ago, joc said:

And... I just had a thought, what if it is the Mexican Government behind the Caravans? 

This is an interesting thought. What purpose would that serve them? (i know basically zero about mexican politics or governments)

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joc

On  a different note.  There is a big controversy over 5G networks going on. Are you familiar with that? I wasn't until I read about it but part of the controversy is regarding the FCC and how they seem to be nationalizing local infrastructures.

The other part of the controversy is safety concerning 5G Networks. Because 5G networks use the same as a weapon that our military uses for crowd control. It's basically a weapon that when pointed at a person or crowds causes them to get extremely hot and they simply just turn around and run the other way. Have you heard of that weapon? If not look it up it's very interesting. And I can see how that could be used effectively against a crowd of 5,000 trying to cross your border.

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joc
4 minutes ago, Farmer77 said:

That would be horrific. Thats kind of what I was saying about it being a gamble though, can you imagine the fallout if an immigrant killed a service member? I just dont see any mainstream political forces from either side taking that kind of a chance.

This is an interesting thought. What purpose would that serve them? (i know basically zero about mexican politics or governments)

Well for one thing the Mexican Government is heavily influenced by major drug cartels and the drug cartels are very interested in moving large quantities of drugs across our borders. Also Trump More or less dissed Mexico all through the election by telling everybody that we were going to build wall and that Mexico was going to pay for it! This did not sit well at all with Vicente Fox the previous president of Mexico.

Edited by joc
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Farmer77
4 minutes ago, joc said:

This did not sit well at all with Vicente Fox the previous president of Mexico.

Haha that's right. That dude made some absolutely hilarious videos talking trash about Trump.

6 minutes ago, joc said:

Well for one thing the Mexican Government is heavily influenced by major drug cartels and the drug cartels are very interested in moving large quantities of drugs across our borders.

Thats a fair point. Do you think the cartels really care about the wall though?

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Hammerclaw
49 minutes ago, Farmer77 said:

If being a xenophobe is now considered being a patriot then god help all of us

If expecting foreign nationals to obey our laws is xenophobia, I'm all for it. The idea they can dictate to us what our laws are suppose to be is ludicrous. 

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aztek
Just now, joc said:

On  a different note.  There is a big controversy over 5G networks going on. Are you familiar with that? I wasn't until I read about it but part of the controversy is regarding the FCC and how they seem to be nationalizing local infrastructures.

The other part of the controversy is safety concerning 5G Networks. Because 5G networks use the same as a weapon that our military uses for crowd control. It's basically a weapon that when pointed at a person or crowds causes them to get extremely hot and they simply just turn around and run the other way. Have you heard of that weapon? If not look it up it's very interesting. And I can see how that could be used effectively against a crowd of 5,000 trying to cross your border.

it's called microwaves, has nothing to do with 5g.

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bee
27 minutes ago, joc said:

On  a different note.  There is a big controversy over 5G networks going on. Are you familiar with that? I wasn't until I read about it but part of the controversy is regarding the FCC and how they seem to be nationalizing local infrastructures.

The other part of the controversy is safety concerning 5G Networks. Because 5G networks use the same as a weapon that our military uses for crowd control. It's basically a weapon that when pointed at a person or crowds causes them to get extremely hot and they simply just turn around and run the other way. Have you heard of that weapon? If not look it up it's very interesting. And I can see how that could be used effectively against a crowd of 5,000 trying to cross your border.

 

just a quick comment about this..... I'm worried about how the 5G network will affect animals,
birds and insects... :(

but that's another topic...

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Hammerclaw
Farmer77
5 minutes ago, Hammerclaw said:

If expecting foreign nationals to obey our laws is xenophobia, I'm all for it. The idea they can dictate to us what our laws are suppose to be is ludicrous. 

Again everyone thinks thats a good idea. So much so that incessantly talking about it, and ensuring your media apparatus does the same,  reveals something about those obsessed with it.

 

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joc
16 minutes ago, Farmer77 said:

Haha that's right. That dude made some absolutely hilarious videos talking trash about Trump.

Thats a fair point. Do you think the cartels really care about the wall though?

I think it would be easier for them to do what they do if there were no law.

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Hammerclaw
1 minute ago, Farmer77 said:

Again everyone thinks thats a good idea. So much so that incessantly talking about it, and ensuring your media apparatus does the same,  reveals something about those obsessed with it.

 

That they are law-abiding citizens expecting other to obey the law? Oh, horrors!:rolleyes:

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RoofGardener
3 hours ago, Farmer77 said:

On a serious level this same group has been arranging caravans for almost a decade and its cooling down making it a good time of year to do so.

But I will stand by my position that it makes as much sense for Trump and company to have organized the caravan as it does for the left to have done so. Either way it would be a calculated gamble that the response to the caravan would be in your favor.

For Trump his entire campaign and presidency have been based on xenophobia, what better way to stoke that and ensure the base gets out to vote than providing an example of what there is to fear out there. For the left their entire shtick has been that Trump is an irrational bigot what better way to show that than force him into a situation where he may overreact.

Honestly I dont think either are true.

 

No. It's not xenophobia. It's a phobia about a group of 1-2k individuals who have been coerced (or at least, encouraged and organised) into leaving their country en-masse, travelling across another SAFE country, with intent to force an entrance into a third country (America). 

1 hour ago, Farmer77 said:

To claim his entire campaign isnt built around the great fear of the "other" is simply to deny reality at this point....

That is an inversion of the truth. It simply is NOT true. In terms of immigration policy, President Trump's 'entire campaign' is about highlighting the difference between American Citizens, and Illegal Aliens, a distinction that his predecessor - and some US States (notably California) - don't seem capable of making. 

1 hour ago, Farmer77 said:

If being a xenophobe is now considered being a patriot then god help all of us

Again, that is a malicious inversion. It would be more accurate to say - of the left - that they regard "being a Patriot is redefined as being a Xenophobe. Or a Racist. "

Why does the Left hate their own country so much, and love anything alien ? 

At the end of the day, this is really simple. A very large group of people are conspiring to enter the USA illegaly. The US government - both federal and state - have a legal obligation to their citizens to keep these people out. 

Edited by RoofGardener
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joc
12 minutes ago, bee said:

 

just a quick comment about this..... I'm worried about how the 5G network will affect animals,
birds and insects... :(

but that's another topic...

Well...5G is another topic...but my reason for mentioning it is Crowd Control at the border.

 

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Hammerclaw
19 minutes ago, RoofGardener said:

Why does the Left hate their own country so much, and love anything alien ? 

This article explains it in a rather droll way.

https://townhall.com/columnists/kurtschlichter/2018/10/15/liberal-americans-hate-america-first-because-they-hate-normal-americans-n2528242

Edited by Hammerclaw
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