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Van Gorp

Is this Atlantis ... at the coast of Spain?

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Piney
27 minutes ago, docyabut2 said:

 I  support Lillios's hypothesis that the plaques are genealogical mnemonic recording systems.  Could be in trying to find the first chiefs.

I don't. I agree with the linked paper that they weren't. They also show no signs of long term wear indicating they were made for the dead.

Which comes back to the owl motif, a psychopomp to act as a afterlife guide. 

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docyabut2
Posted (edited)

http://www.patrimoniocultural.gov.pt/media/uploads/revistaportuguesadearqueologia/5_2/5.pdf

The classic Iberian plaques have a bipartite compositional structure, consisting of a narrower

one-third (top) of the plaque and a wider bottom two-thirds of the plaque (base) (Fig. 3).

I refer to the narrower section as the ‘top’ because it is often perforated (with one or two holes),

and the plaques appear to have been hung from here (possibly on a person’s neck or a post)

 

Edited by docyabut2
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docyabut2
Posted (edited)

to me this ancient culture were the ancestors of the chiefs of  the Tartessians and were the Atlantians :)

Edited by docyabut2

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Piney
3 minutes ago, docyabut2 said:

to me this ancient culture were the ancestors of the chiefs of  the Tartessians and were the Atlantians :)

To me they were Neolithic farmers who combined with Celts and Phoenicians to form the various Iberian Cultures and contributed to the Atlantic Bronze Age Culture.

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docyabut2
Posted (edited)

also to me the Greeks just made up their names in the translations of the Egyptians of Atlantis, but it is in Gades

 

  Yet, before proceeding further in the narrative, I ought to warn you, that you must not be surprised if you should perhaps hear Hellenic names given to foreigners. I will tell you the reason of this: Solon, who was intending to use the tale for his poem, enquired into the meaning of the names, and found that the early Egyptians in writing them down had translated them into their own language, and he recovered the meaning of the several names and when copying them out again translated them into our language

http://classics.mit.edu/Plato/critias.html

 

075ca0b96c99f65be5f507b20fc53eb0.jpg

 a Egyptian plaque

Edited by docyabut2

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docyabut2
Posted (edited)
41 minutes ago, docyabut2 said:

also to me the Greeks just made up their names in the translations of the Egyptians of Atlantis, but it is in Gades

 

  Yet, before proceeding further in the narrative, I ought to warn you, that you must not be surprised if you should perhaps hear Hellenic names given to foreigners. I will tell you the reason of this: Solon, who was intending to use the tale for his poem, enquired into the meaning of the names, and found that the early Egyptians in writing them down had translated them into their own language, and he recovered the meaning of the several names and when copying them out again translated them into our language

http://classics.mit.edu/Plato/critias.html

 

075ca0b96c99f65be5f507b20fc53eb0.jpg

  Egyptian plaques

th?id=OIP.InQid9_cVmDl51Lrs85h0wHaER&pid

 zigs and zags of marriages

all the  zigs and zags

http://www.patrimoniocultural.gov.pt/media/uploads/revistaportuguesadearqueologia/5_2/5.pdf

 

 

Edited by docyabut2

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jaylemurph

Please stop reposting yourself. There’s no need to post the exact same material more than once. 

—Jaylemurph 

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docyabut2
Posted (edited)
11 minutes ago, jaylemurph said:

Please stop reposting yourself. There’s no need to post the exact same material more than once. 

—Jaylemurph 

this is not over and over I`l posting,  sorry it  did double  :)

Edited by docyabut2

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cormac mac airt
1 hour ago, docyabut2 said:

also to me the Greeks just made up their names in the translations of the Egyptians of Atlantis, but it is in Gades

 

  Yet, before proceeding further in the narrative, I ought to warn you, that you must not be surprised if you should perhaps hear Hellenic names given to foreigners. I will tell you the reason of this: Solon, who was intending to use the tale for his poem, enquired into the meaning of the names, and found that the early Egyptians in writing them down had translated them into their own language, and he recovered the meaning of the several names and when copying them out again translated them into our language

http://classics.mit.edu/Plato/critias.html

 

075ca0b96c99f65be5f507b20fc53eb0.jpg

 a Egyptian plaque

And yet the Egyptians NEVER had a story concerning Atlantis at any point of their 3000+ year history. 

cormac

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docyabut2
53 minutes ago, cormac mac airt said:

And yet the Egyptians NEVER had a story concerning Atlantis at any point of their 3000+ year history. 

cormac

So how was this story told to Solon if only the Egyptian language was in images ?

 

 

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jaylemurph
13 minutes ago, docyabut2 said:

So how was this story told to Solon if only the Egyptian language was in images ?

 

 

...the exact same way Hermione Grainger tells Harry Potter things. 

—Jaylemurph 

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cormac mac airt
17 minutes ago, docyabut2 said:

So how was this story told to Solon if only the Egyptian language was in images ?

Plato made it up. There is NOT A SHRED of evidence that Solon ever knew of any such story outside of Plato’s claim. Hear-say doesn’t make it true. 

cormac

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Hanslune
28 minutes ago, cormac mac airt said:

Plato made it up. There is NOT A SHRED of evidence that Solon ever knew of any such story outside of Plato’s claim. Hear-say doesn’t make it true. 

cormac

talking-to-the-wall.jpg

Excellent points but the wall isn't listening.

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cormac mac airt
23 minutes ago, Hanslune said:

talking-to-the-wall.jpg

Excellent points but the wall isn't listening.

She’s not a brick wall Hans. 

9749943F-181A-465C-972E-78AF55E55FBA.thumb.jpeg.0cbb6841254ea92ae195f44e266fd3a9.jpeg

cormac

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Jarocal
12 hours ago, jaylemurph said:

...the exact same way Hermione Grainger tells Harry Potter things. 

—Jaylemurph 

In English?

Using the haughty tone of a "know it all" academic?

In between sessions of snogging Viktor Krum?

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Harte

It's perfectly fine to sound like a know it all if you do, in fact, know it all.

Harte

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Noteverythingisaconspiracy
7 minutes ago, Harte said:

It's perfectly fine to sound like a know it all if you do, in fact, know it all.

Harte

I know everything worth knowing. If I dont know it, its clearly not worth knowing.

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jmccr8
1 hour ago, Noteverythingisaconspiracy said:

I know everything worth knowing. If I dont know it, its clearly not worth knowing.

I knew that.;)

jmccr8

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jmccr8
On 8/20/2019 at 12:57 AM, Pettytalk said:

You are so vain, you have taken it to mean you. My dear Jay is not a ball.

Hi Pettytalk

Well fortunately the last couple of days on the project have been kickass and given my vanity my disappointment goes unnoticed. By the way Petty that's not talk why is it that when you say dear to me that I envision your desire to firmly hug my neck? :lol:

jmccr8

 

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atalante
On 8/20/2019 at 11:21 AM, cormac mac airt said:

From what I can tell, using Liddell and Scott's Greek and English Lexicon, the following phrase: 

Loosely translates as:  "the furthest point/portion in the direction of the Pillars of Hercules" which has NOTHING to do with the 'end of the world' as you claim. And even then, said part is only concerning the part of Plato's Atlantis that belongs to Eumelus and NOT Atlantis in its entirety. 

cormac

cormac,
You blanked out the most relevant part of this passage - about Gadeira.  To cover the passage's info about Gadeira, Bury's translation applied the sense for "epi' that the LSJ lexicon calls A.I.3.b.  

The Atlantis story is being narrated by Critias/Plato from the viewpoint of Solon (570 BC).  In that regard, from the time of Homer (ca 800 BC) to Pindar (ca 480 BC), Gadeira had been legendary, among Greeks, as the the western end of the world. 

But, as I pointed out previously, modern brains tend to be distracted by a modern idea that Gadeira/Gades/Cadiz is not the end of the world.

 

Bury translation:

the extremity of the island near the pillars of Heracles "up to" [=epi] the part of the country now called Gadeira after the name of that region

 

Thus the Atlantis island was east of Gadeira, which Greeks in Solon's era considered to be positioned at the western end of the world.

 

 

 

 

 

 

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cormac mac airt
18 minutes ago, atalante said:

cormac,
You blanked out the most relevant part of this passage - about Gadeira.  To cover the passage's info about Gadeira, Bury's translation applied the sense for "epi' that the LSJ lexicon calls A.I.3.b.  

The Atlantis story is being narrated by Critias/Plato from the viewpoint of Solon (570 BC).  In that regard, from the time of Homer (ca 800 BC) to Pindar (ca 480 BC), Gadeira had been legendary, among Greeks, as the the western end of the world. 

But, as I pointed out previously, modern brains tend to be distracted by a modern idea that Gadeira/Gades/Cadiz is not the end of the world.

 

Bury translation:

the extremity of the island near the pillars of Heracles "up to" [=epi] the part of the country now called Gadeira after the name of that region

 

Thus the Atlantis island was east of Gadeira, which Greeks in Solon's era considered to be positioned at the western end of the world.

Except that's NOT what it says as it places EUMELUS' PORTION east of Gadeira. You're reinterpreting it to mean what you 'want' it to mean. 

cormac

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jaylemurph
3 hours ago, cormac mac airt said:

Except that's NOT what it says as it places EUMELUS' PORTION east of Gadeira. You're reinterpreting it to mean what you 'want' it to mean. 

cormac

That happens when you’re translating out of a language you don’t actually speak. 

—Jaylemurph

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jaylemurph
9 hours ago, Harte said:

It's perfectly fine to sound like a know it all if you do, in fact, know it all.

Harte

Just ask a Hound....

—Jaylemurph 

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Sir Wearer of Hats
On 8/21/2019 at 9:56 AM, cormac mac airt said:

And yet the Egyptians NEVER had a story concerning Atlantis at any point of their 3000+ year history. 

cormac

It’s because Solon literally stole the story, he stole everything about it, even the people’s memories of the story.

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jaylemurph
1 hour ago, Sir Wearer of Hats said:

It’s because Solon literally stole the story, he stole everything about it, even the people’s memories of the story.

Atlantis: first victim of the Last Great Time War. 

—Jaylemurph 

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