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markdohle

God and science

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Guyver
1 minute ago, XenoFish said:

It's the inevitable. Nothing we do matters. Life is nothing more than consumption, reproduction, and death. 

Eh....I’m not so sure about that.  That’s like going for the low hanging fruit, IMO - but I certainly understand your perspective.  I just disagree with it.

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Guyver
3 hours ago, sci-nerd said:

Mathematically it does, and math is the language of science and of the universe.

I don’t know how it does, or how it could.  Math is only as good as the variables it’s based on.  I’m not speaking against math, because I’m a fan and believer in it.  But, let’s take as an example the existence of dark matter.  Mathematically, it has more effect on the universe than normal matter does, according to some recent models I’ve seen, yet it’s not understood.  That makes it an unknown variable.  A single unknown variable changes any confidence in math attempting to describe something, doesn’t it?

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danydandan
5 minutes ago, Guyver said:

I don’t know how it does, or how it could.  Math is only as good as the variables it’s based on.  I’m not speaking against math, because I’m a fan and believer in it.  But, let’s take as an example the existence of dark matter.  Mathematically, it has more effect on the universe than normal matter does, according to some recent models I’ve seen, yet it’s not understood.  That makes it an unknown variable.  A single unknown variable changes any confidence in math attempting to describe something, doesn’t it?

It could be multiple unknowns too. 

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sci-nerd
4 minutes ago, Guyver said:

yet it’s not understood.  That makes it an unknown variable

It is fully understood. We know exactly how much there is, and how it behaves and interacts. We just haven't made a direct physical detection. We hope that will change very soon, when our Milky Way collides with a neighbor.

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danydandan
4 minutes ago, sci-nerd said:

It is fully understood. We know exactly how much there is, and how it behaves and interacts. We just haven't made a direct physical detection. We hope that will change very soon, when our Milky Way collides with a neighbor.

Agreed, it's not really an unknown variable because of what you just said.

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sci-nerd
49 minutes ago, danydandan said:

there is no place for bringing your beliefs (no matter what they are) into any scientific research. Science must be unbiased.

Agree, but he wasn't doing that (it wasn't what I referred to). He used science as a thing to attack, like some scientists attack religion.

Religion hates being attacked, because it is the highest holiest truth, but science loves it, because we can then get rid of bad ideas.

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Truthseeker007
25 minutes ago, Guyver said:

Well, I guess that depends upon your perception of time.

As far as I know time does not actually exist. Everything in the past, present and future are all happening at the same moment it is just that we are conscious and focused on this present moment.

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StarMountainKid

I'm wondering how consciousness plays a part in all this. We only know what we are conscious of, in science and in religion. So our conscious mind determines our knowledge. 

I'm wondering if the limits of human consciousness is the real roadblock to a more complete understanding of the nature of reality. To the question here of God and science. 

I think our consciousness is an untapped element. We speak of knowledge of science and of religion or of God, but knowledge is separate from consciousness. 

In Buddhism, the conscious mind is the key to understanding. Perhaps mind itself, not knowledge, is capable of some understanding knowledge cannot reach.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Truthseeker007
28 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

It's the inevitable. Nothing we do matters. Life is nothing more than consumption, reproduction, and death. 

In this 3rd dimensional reality but I do suggest there are many dimensions and an infinite number of realities our consciousness can participate in.

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Guyver
10 minutes ago, sci-nerd said:

It is fully understood. We know exactly how much there is, and how it behaves and interacts. We just haven't made a direct physical detection. We hope that will change very soon, when our Milky Way collides with a neighbor.

IDK, it seems to me that not having a direct physical interaction with it means we don’t know what it is.  Not only that, I don’t agree that we know exactly how much of it there is, and that we understand how it interacts.  My understanding is that our knowledge of it is in its infancy and that all theories related to it are based on computer models.  These, as you know, change as variables change.  

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danydandan
6 minutes ago, Truthseeker007 said:

As far as I know time does not actually exist. Everything in the past, present and future are all happening at the same moment it is just that we are conscious and focused on this present moment.

Rather than go over this again in a new thread can I direct you to this thread in the science section.

If you read on from that comment I give a good explanation on time.

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Guyver
5 minutes ago, Truthseeker007 said:

As far as I know time does not actually exist. Everything in the past, present and future are all happening at the same moment it is just that we are conscious and focused on this present moment.

I’m certainly open to considering the possibilities of what it is.  According to Einstein, it’s actually part of the fabric of the universe.

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Truthseeker007
5 minutes ago, StarMountainKid said:

I'm wondering how consciousness plays a part in all this. We only know what we are conscious of, in science and in religion. So our conscious mind determines our knowledge. 

I'm wondering if the limits of human consciousness is the real roadblock to a more complete understanding of the nature of reality. To the question here of God and science. 

I think our consciousness is an untapped element. We speak of knowledge of science and of religion or of God, but knowledge is separate from consciousness. 

In Buddhism, the conscious mind is the key to understanding. Perhaps mind itself, not knowledge, is capable of some understanding knowledge cannot reach.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

And that is the matrix we are faced with and the veil of forgetfulness. What and who in fact are we really? Are we just a human body that is conscious or consciousness experiencing a human body?

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Truthseeker007
3 minutes ago, danydandan said:

Rather than go over this again in a new thread can I direct you to this thread in the science section.

If you read on from that comment I give a good explanation on time.

Thanks for sharing.:D

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danydandan
14 minutes ago, sci-nerd said:

Agree, but he wasn't doing that (it wasn't what I referred to). He used science as a thing to attack, like some scientists attack religion.

Religion hates being attacked, because it is the highest holiest truth, but science loves it, because we can then get rid of bad ideas.

I don't think Guyver is like that. He doesn't attack things because they are scientific. 

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danydandan
1 minute ago, Truthseeker007 said:

Thanks for sharing.:D

Your very welcome.

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Truthseeker007
4 minutes ago, Guyver said:

I’m certainly open to considering the possibilities of what it is.  According to Einstein, it’s actually part of the fabric of the universe.

We do know the sun goes up and down every day on this Earth and it becomes day and night. The reality is though that the sun is always shining so we get the illusion at night that it stops. So we certainly do get a perception of an illusion of time living on this Earth.

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sci-nerd
3 minutes ago, danydandan said:

I don't think Guyver is like that.

It wasn't him, it was Avinash Suresh.

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Guyver
17 minutes ago, danydandan said:

Agreed, it's not really an unknown variable because of what you just said.

Disagreed.  If you look it up you’ll see that dark matter is a hypothetical type of matter that is only theoretically assumed to exist because of large scale motion in the universe.  It can be observed or detected by us at this time.  

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XenoFish
10 minutes ago, Truthseeker007 said:

In this 3rd dimensional reality but I do suggest there are many dimensions and an infinite number of realities our consciousness can participate in.

There is no evidence of this and even if there were that doesn't matter at all. In the end entropy wins.

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Guyver
2 minutes ago, Truthseeker007 said:

We do know the sun goes up and down every day on this Earth and it becomes day and night. The reality is though that the sun is always shining so we get the illusion at night that it stops. So we certainly do get a perception of an illusion of time living on this Earth.

Yes.  From our perspective, the only time we can experience is the present moment.

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Truthseeker007
3 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

There is no evidence of this and even if there were that doesn't matter at all. In the end entropy wins.

Do you not go into another reality when you sleep at night?

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danydandan
11 minutes ago, Guyver said:

Disagreed.  If you look it up you’ll see that dark matter is a hypothetical type of matter that is only theoretically assumed to exist because of large scale motion in the universe.  It can be observed or detected by us at this time.  

I was talking about it as purely mathematical. Mathematically it's not an unknown variable it's pretty well accounted for actually.

Considering it's taken into account for many many predictions that have been verified. 

Edited by danydandan
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danydandan
5 minutes ago, sci-nerd said:

It wasn't him, it was Avinash Suresh.

When someone is expecting you to go read a book to discuss something with them it's annoying.

"Oh yeah wait there for two days I'll purchase the book you said I should read and I'll discuss it with you then after I'm done with it." 

Why not just give me a little paragraph on what your talking about. Has anyone read a book on Biocentrism? Not the philosophical argument, apparently it's a biological Theory of Everything that has exactly zero peer reviewed academic papers on the topic.

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Dejarma
14 minutes ago, Truthseeker007 said:

We do know the sun goes up and down every day on this Earth and it becomes day and night.

the sun does not go up and down;)

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