Essan Posted January 22, 2019 #451 Share Posted January 22, 2019 (edited) Oh dear ..... The book says the sun generates energy by combining four hydrogen atoms to form one helium atom, using carbon as a catalyst. This is a mass-to-energy conversion. Science worked out this technology in 1939. This prediction also came true. Clearly based on the work of Eddington (1920) - we now know it's a bit more complicated than that Not sure where they got the idea carbon is involved from? Perhaps they thought the sun was made of coal? What is clear is that whoever wrote the UB based a lot of it on scientific discoveries and theories from the 1910s and 20s - so may have had access to scientific journals from that period. And I love this one: Quote In the 1930s, one of science's proposed theories was that a massive body came close to the sun and tore out huge amounts of matter which later coalesced to form the planets. This theory is no longer accepted, and the best theory now says that the planets were created by the coalescence of matter adjacent to the sun at the same time the sun coalesced. The book says that the giant Angona Nebula came close to the sun and tore away lots of matter which coalesced to form the planets. This particular theory explains the additional seven-degree tilt of the sun's axis to the plane of the planets. The best science theory, above, does not explain this tilt. In this case, the book and science originally agreed, but science has changed its mind. However, agreement may return in the future. Remember that there are several hundred astronomer/ cosmologists in the world, and they reach a consensus about which theory best fits all the available scientific data; changes in this theory can occur. Basically they admit that the UB is based on out of date theories that were popular in the 1930s, when it was written, but now wholly discredited (even more so now we know how common solar systems are) Edited January 22, 2019 by Essan 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danydandan Posted January 22, 2019 #452 Share Posted January 22, 2019 54 minutes ago, eight bits said: (With thanks to @Habitat for the reply) Hoaxing is an underappreciated art form. The good hoax has to be plausible enough to draw people in, but not so good that nobody ever appreciates the accomplishment. That may nor may not involve the hoax-meister being personally recognized (there is, as far as I know, no "Hoaxers Hall of Fame"), but the appreciation of artistry is what distiguishes hoax from fraud. The hoaxer wants to be caught, but not immediately. Recall "Christians against Dinosaurs." They deliberately promoted the dead-mouse-on-the-kitchen-floor proof of their hoaxery: a photoshopped picture of a public demonstration ostensibly denouncing dinosaurs. Apparently, the really hip crowd caught the fake right away, one of the demonstrators' placards had some logo that made some "insider reference" (not being hip myself, I can't say that I ever got the reference, even after it was pointed out to me). More patient debunkers found the original picture (but then for whatever reason decided not to say where they found it - leading to a round of which picture was 'shopped?). Finally, somebody did the long slog and sourced the thing, with supporting documentation that the demonstration in the picture actually happened, with the people in the picture actually onsite. So why did the hoaxers do that? Except for that one thing (and eventually, long afterwards, a confession from the most public face of the hoax), everything else was circumstantial. "Explanations" were offered when lesser pieces of evidence surfaced (e.g. what else was on the photobucket of another public face of the hoax - dude just didn't understand which of his pix were public; no hacking, just asking for what was in plain sight). I think the hoaxers wanted to make fools of the believers. If somebody believes a "perfect" hoax, then they're just fraud victims. Nothing funny about that. But if "they should have known," then they're dupes - and that's a riot. Even if the dupes never know your name, you still got your jollies. Not saying that UB is a hoax, as opposed to a fraud, or an innocently mistaken profession of faith, but you did ask why something odd might matter. I'm not saying that it's a hoax nor that if it is a hoax that it doesn't matter. I was referring to the claims made within the book , stating that the contents are revelation. I agree with you in your above comment, however looking at the whole subject of the Urantia Book and Foundation I believe that it was initially designed as a social experiment then, the powers to be noticed the monetary gains possible from such an enterprise and it's now a Religion. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eight bits Posted January 22, 2019 #453 Share Posted January 22, 2019 3 hours ago, danydandan said: I agree with you in your above comment, however looking at the whole subject of the Urantia Book and Foundation I believe that it was initially designed as a social experiment then, the powers to be noticed the monetary gains possible from such an enterprise and it's now a Religion. Christians against Dinosaurs persisted long enough to start a crowdfunding site. Just sayin' https://uncertaintist.wordpress.com/2015/03/03/christians-against-dinosaurs-message-to-indiegogo/ 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cormac mac airt Posted January 22, 2019 #454 Share Posted January 22, 2019 5 hours ago, Essan said: Not that I am aware of. But there is plenty in the book that has since been shown not to be true, Almost all of the first section on the history of the world, evolution etc Some of this was already known to be wrong at the time, but maybe not to the general public ..... Which is why the rest (that cannot be verified) is so suspect. When someone tells you a story that contains verifiable facts, all of which are shown to be false, why would you believe anything else they say? Because it sounds cool and makes them feel like they know what they're talking about apparently. cormac 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davros of Skaro Posted January 24, 2019 Author #455 Share Posted January 24, 2019 On 1/21/2019 at 6:26 PM, Jodie.Lynne said: @MERRY DMAS what, no torpedoes? Damn the torpedoes! There's no one else to shoot at anyway. It's freaken circa 1500 BCE for crying out loud! On 1/21/2019 at 9:56 PM, jmccr8 said: Hi MERYY DMAS Makes a guy wonder how they propelled and navigated, chanting or crystals? jmccr8 I don't know. God did supply them with a glowing rock from an active volcano to illuminate the sub's interior. It's all too fantastic to be false.... Right @Will Due ????? On 1/22/2019 at 1:31 AM, Will Due said: Yes. I've read somewhere years ago that it was done. With computers I think. What I remember is that the results indicated that it was highly likely that more than one author was involved. Can't remember how many they came up with though. I think they said three or four. The book's table of contents lists dozens I believe. I'd have to check to be sure. But there's a certain significance there I think. That dozens appear to a computer to be three or four which implies there's a universality to it. Something universal is involved. To me that's significant because as I've already stated, groups of people working together to write different parts of a thing that covers as wide a range of topics and as diverse, as complicated (and seamlessly) as the UB does (2097 pages) is highly unlikely in my opinion to occur without some things being contradicted. You don't see this in the Urantia Book. Nowhere does it say something in one place that is contradicted in another. This has been studied and is well documented. In the UB you have universe cosmology way beyond what has ever been postulated before. Science, philosophy, religion, history, all laid out as a foundation if you will, in preperation for the restatement of the life and teachings of Jesus. There is an amazing cohesiveness to it all. Vividly presented. From the inception of the universe through the early times of man and Jesus to the current events of the first third of the twentieth century. To me a commitee of human authors could never accomplish this. To write it as if it were fictional. No way. No pun intended but that would be superhuman. Even if they did, why wouldn't those folks from Chicago claim group authorship of such an unusual accomplishment? Wouldn't at least some of them come forward to do this? All this is possible by a focus group of varied profession humans especially over a 20 year period. Yet you continue to ignore the false parts, and try to go the "alternate facts" route. On 1/22/2019 at 1:31 AM, Will Due said: Again, all that the Urantia Book says is like an announcement. An announcement that all is well. It means..... 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jodie.Lynne Posted January 24, 2019 #456 Share Posted January 24, 2019 18 minutes ago, MERRY DMAS said: Damn the torpedoes! There's no one else to shoot at anyway. It's freaken circa 1500 BCE for crying out loud! Oh Yeah? What about those "great fishes" that were wont to swallow people whole? Huh? Huh? what about them? 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davros of Skaro Posted January 24, 2019 Author #457 Share Posted January 24, 2019 1 minute ago, Jodie.Lynne said: Oh Yeah? What about those "great fishes" that were wont to swallow people whole? Huh? Huh? what about them? Just think "Goofy and Wilbur". Then you can figure out how they acquired food on their year long journey. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c.s.lewis Posted May 25, 2019 #458 Share Posted May 25, 2019 (edited) URANTIA has Never been racist, as this independent author's Report/research showed back in 2011: Quote 'Eugenics, Race, and The Urantia Book' http://ubannotated.com/ubthenews/Eugenics_Race_Urantia_Book/ January, 2011... Edited May 25, 2019 by Luis Marco Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danydandan Posted May 25, 2019 #459 Share Posted May 25, 2019 Independent?? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c.s.lewis Posted May 25, 2019 #460 Share Posted May 25, 2019 2 minutes ago, danydandan said: Independent?? yes, why, Dany¿. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danydandan Posted May 25, 2019 #461 Share Posted May 25, 2019 43 minutes ago, Luis Marco said: yes, why, Dany¿. Verify it! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c.s.lewis Posted May 25, 2019 #462 Share Posted May 25, 2019 1 hour ago, danydandan said: Verify it! UBannotated.com 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danydandan Posted May 25, 2019 #463 Share Posted May 25, 2019 12 minutes ago, Luis Marco said: UBannotated.com So you can't? Because I know that chap has written about four or five books on UB propaganda. It's not independent, nor is it un-biased. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Due Posted May 25, 2019 #464 Share Posted May 25, 2019 5 hours ago, danydandan said: It's not independent, nor is it un-biased. When it comes to people, nothing is independent and unbiased. We all stand up for one thing or another. But I suppose there's room in between. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XenoFish Posted May 25, 2019 #465 Share Posted May 25, 2019 I wonder if there is some deep emotional need that makes people fanatical? What in life is so utterly lacking that believing in complete nonsense is the answer. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Due Posted May 25, 2019 #466 Share Posted May 25, 2019 15 minutes ago, XenoFish said: I wonder if there is some deep emotional need that makes people fanatical? What in life is so utterly lacking that believing in complete nonsense is the answer. You mean like believing there is no God? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XenoFish Posted May 25, 2019 #467 Share Posted May 25, 2019 (edited) 18 minutes ago, Will Due said: You mean like believing there is no God? What reason is there to believe in god? We have to be told to believe, to be given a reason to believe. Yet without those things, belief in god is meaningless. So belief in god is artificial. It's a lot like telling someone they're stupid over and over, eventually they begin to believe that lie and it messes them up. When there is no evidence that they are stupid. Telling people they need god, over and over, and that they are a disgusting sinner, will either incite rebellion against that idea or acceptance, that's how cults work. Religion just like your book is nothing more than a cult of ego. Written by people who thought they knew something, but it's just the same nonsense over and over again. And you spread it like a mental virus. Edited May 25, 2019 by XenoFish 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XenoFish Posted May 25, 2019 #468 Share Posted May 25, 2019 You, like so many others wish to sell people lies and call it divine. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Due Posted May 25, 2019 #469 Share Posted May 25, 2019 3 minutes ago, XenoFish said: You, like so many others wish to sell people lies You mean like people who sell the idea that there is no God? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XenoFish Posted May 25, 2019 #470 Share Posted May 25, 2019 1 minute ago, Will Due said: You mean like people who sell the idea that there is no God? We're all atheist by default. It's only until someone start telling us lies that we start believing in god. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Due Posted May 25, 2019 #471 Share Posted May 25, 2019 1 minute ago, XenoFish said: We're all atheist by default. It's only until someone start telling us lies that we start believing in god. That has worked for many. Some people aren't afraid to tell the truth that teaching that there is no God is false. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XenoFish Posted May 25, 2019 #472 Share Posted May 25, 2019 Just now, Will Due said: That has worked for many. Some people aren't afraid to tell the truth that teaching that there is no God is false. Thank you for being a fine example of the indoctrinated mind. You have this strong emotional need to believe such things. That's why you can't look past it. It's the reason you adhere so strongly to that book of yours. You've closed your mind off from new and better information. So you preach it, over and over and over again as if it were the truth, it's not. And it never will be. It's your lie to believe in Will. Many of us here are tired of you preaching it. Yet you won't stop. You'll keep affirming it, validating it, preaching it. All because it satisfies that emotional need. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Due Posted May 25, 2019 #473 Share Posted May 25, 2019 38 minutes ago, XenoFish said: All because it satisfies that emotional need. You mean like preaching about the belief that there is no God? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XenoFish Posted May 25, 2019 #474 Share Posted May 25, 2019 32 minutes ago, Will Due said: You mean like preaching about the belief that there is no God? If that's the extent of your counter argument, then you don't have a counter argument. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c.s.lewis Posted May 26, 2019 #475 Share Posted May 26, 2019 19 hours ago, danydandan said: So you can't? Because I know that chap has written about four or five books on UB propaganda. It's not independent, nor is it un-biased. why are you lying again, @danydandan¿, to see you are lying, name the five books that independent author Halbert Katzen (see my post above) supposedly wrote on URANTIA propaganda, you can't, can you¿. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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