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Davros of Skaro

Urantia Book Poll

The UB. Made up, or inspired?   

51 members have voted

This poll is closed to new votes
  1. 1. Is the Urantia Book fact, or fake?

    • Real channeled knowledge ?
    • Person, or people fakery?


1,010 posts in this topic

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Piney
7 minutes ago, cormac mac airt said:

Or he suffers from MPD. 

cormac

No, he's in communication with Halbert Katzen.  Who isn't a scientist either but wrote that canned response about genetics and race.

http://ubannotated.com/main-menu/animated/more-about-and-by-halbert-katzen/

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Will do
3 minutes ago, Piney said:

No, he's in communication with Halbert Katzen.  Who isn't a scientist either but wrote that canned response about genetics and race.

http://ubannotated.com/main-menu/animated/more-about-and-by-halbert-katzen/

 

Halbert Katzen? Never heard of him.

 

 

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Piney
1 minute ago, Will Due said:

 

Halbert Katzen? Never heard of him.

 

:rolleyes: Uh huh......

He only speaks all over California and at every meeting. 

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Davros of Skaro

@Will Due

On a scale from 0-100% how sure are you that the UB is not made up by humans? 100% being a total assurance that it's completely written by what's claimed. 75% some doubt, but mostly as claimed. 50% and so on.

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Will do
4 minutes ago, Piney said:

:rolleyes: Uh huh......

He only speaks all over California and at every meeting. 

 

I've never heard of him. That's the truth.

Over the years I've attended few meetings. A handful in almost 40 years.

I'm interested mainly in just simply becoming a better person. And I try to learn how to do it more whenever I can. 

 

 

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Jodie.Lynne
21 hours ago, Will Due said:

It destroys my sense that I have a degree of choice

I don't grasp this. Are you saying that you have a choice in the way you are born?

Assuming for a moment that everything in the UB is true (and I admit I haven't read all of it, so forgive if I am asking something already answered) what "choice" are you referring to?

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Will do
3 minutes ago, MERRY DMAS said:

@Will Due

On a scale from 0-100% how sure are you that the UB is not made up by humans? 100% being a total assurance that it's completely written by what's claimed. 75% some doubt, but mostly as claimed. 50% and so on.

 

100.

 

 

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Jodie.Lynne
19 hours ago, joc said:

It has been my experience that...people don't change.  Not like that.  I hope I'm wrong...

I think you are wrong, and that people can and do change.

sometimes for the better, sometimes, not so much.

 

I think that @Will Due is trying to be more expressive, and provide more insight into his beliefs. I, for one, applaud his efforts and I think folks should encourage him rather than shut him down.

 

Just my 2 centavos, YMMV

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Jodie.Lynne
6 minutes ago, Will Due said:

 

100.

 

 

why?

pleaseexplain how you can read this book and decide its absolutely truthful and accurate, and I can look at it and see something completely different

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cormac mac airt
9 minutes ago, Will Due said:

100.

So, lying and racist ET's then? :rolleyes:

cormac

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Will do
1 minute ago, Jodie.Lynne said:

Are you saying that you have a choice in the way you are born?

 

Yes that's exactly what I'm saying. But not in the material sense. 

 

 

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Davros of Skaro
8 minutes ago, Will Due said:

 

100.

 

 

 

1 minute ago, Jodie.Lynne said:

why?

pleaseexplain how you can read this book and decide its absolutely truthful and accurate, and I can look at it and see something completely different

Same here. Other than it "Rings true to you", and simular sentiments. 

For example do you think it's impossible to be written by human hands?

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Jodie.Lynne
2 minutes ago, Will Due said:

 

Yes that's exactly what I'm saying. But not in the material sense. 

 

 

Pardon, but what other sense is there?

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Will do
46 minutes ago, MERRY DMAS said:

do you think it's impossible to be written by human hands?

 

Yes, that's exactly what I think.

I cannot fathom how a human being could ever write something like the UB. I'll do my best to explain.

The science, the history, and so forth. As these things are presented in the UB, they're anything but conventional. They're not mainstream at all.

It isn't one thing that is unconventional, it's everything. Everything from A to Z. Yet it's all presented cohesively. Seamless.

And to me that's the indication that the authors are who they say they are. Because if the book had a human author it would be more likely that unconventionality would be limited to just one subject. Maybe two. And if the UB was written by commitee, there would be far more likelihood that it wouldn't have been completed at all. Given how we all have strong opinions. Especially about ourselves. And how our opinions are better and more important than the opinions of others. 

When you investigate what those who aim to debunk the UB have said, they point out that this fact, or that fact is wrong (I'll discuss this aspect later). But never have I found a debunker claim that the UB contradicts itself. I find that very interesting. Even Martin Gardner, perhaps the most prominent UB debunker to date, also said this.

And in my opinion, this is the overwhelming essence that stands out most of all, when the book is finally read front to back (it took me a couple of years to do). Nowhere does it say something in one place that contradicts what it says in another.

 

 

Edited by Will Due

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Will do
32 minutes ago, Jodie.Lynne said:

Pardon, but what other sense is there?

 

In the spiritual sense. 

 

 

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Jodie.Lynne
3 minutes ago, Will Due said:

 

In the spiritual sense. 

 

 

Ah, yes. Of course. Enjoy your 'truth' Will, may it bring you peace and aid you in becoming a better person.

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Will do
44 minutes ago, Jodie.Lynne said:

why?

pleaseexplain how you can read this book and decide its absolutely truthful and accurate, and I can look at it and see something completely different

 

Give me a few minutes and I'll attempt to explain this. And some other things. I need to think how best to do it first.

 

 

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Davros of Skaro
22 minutes ago, Will Due said:

 

Yes, that's exactly what I think.

I cannot fathom how a human being could ever write something like the UB. I'll do my best to explain.

The science, the history, and so forth. As these things are presented in the UB, they're anything but conventional. They're not mainstream at all.

It isn't one thing that is unconventional, it's everything. Everything from A to Z. Yet it's all presented cohesively. Seamless.

And to me that's the indication that the authors are who they say they are. Because if the book had a human author it would be more likely that unconventionality would be limited to just one subject. Maybe two. And if the UB was written by commitee, there would be far more likelihood that it wouldn't have been completed at all. Given how we all have strong opinions. Especially about ourselves. And how our opinions are better and more important than the opinions of others. 

When you investigate what those who aim to debunk the UB have said, they point out that this fact, or that fact is wrong (I'll discuss this aspect later). But never have I found a debunker claim that the UB contradicts itself. I find that very interesting. Even Martin Gardner, perhaps the most prominent UB debunker to date, also said this.

And in my opinion, this is the overwhelming essence that stands out most of all, when the book is finally read front to back (it took me a couple of years to do). Nowhere does it say something in one place that contradicts what it says in another.

 

 

Maybe you should read the Dune, and Lord of the Rings series of books? Two different authors create whole worlds that people are still analysing to this day.

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dune_(novel)

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Lord_of_the_Rings

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cormac mac airt
3 minutes ago, MERRY DMAS said:

Maybe you should read the Dune, and Lord of the Rings series of books? Two different authors create whole worlds that people are still analysing to this day.

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dune_(novel)

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Lord_of_the_Rings

Those books couldn’t have been written by humans either then becomes the argument. :w00t:

cormac

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Davros of Skaro
7 minutes ago, cormac mac airt said:

Those books couldn’t have been written by humans either then becomes the argument. :w00t:

cormac

Yes. They were written by Hobbits, and Spice traders.

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joc
49 minutes ago, Will Due said:

The science, the history, and so forth. As these things are presented in the UB, they're anything but conventional.

And Dune was conventional?

J.R.R. Tokein's Trilogy was conventional?

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joc
1 hour ago, Jodie.Lynne said:

I think you are wrong, and that people can and do change.

sometimes for the better, sometimes, not so much.

 

I think that @Will Due is trying to be more expressive, and provide more insight into his beliefs. I, for one, applaud his efforts and I think folks should encourage him rather than shut him down.

 

Just my 2 centavos, YMMV

According to my mileage chart....yeah, I gave credence to the possibility of his having an epiphany...I also said I hope that was the case...I also said I wasn't accusing anyone of anything. :)

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Will do
14 hours ago, Jodie.Lynne said:

Ah, yes. Of course. Enjoy your 'truth' Will, may it bring you peace and aid you in becoming a better person.

 

Let me see if I can explain better what I was trying to say. Two things:

 

 

First, in my opinion language sometimes acts as a barrier to fluent communication. (It's in this way that the words written in the Urantia Book don't automatically register their meaning as intended in my opinion.)

Sometimes certain words and phrases get worn out in life. They become embedded with prejudgement and fail to allow for the flow of ideas accurately. At some point in our conversation the word "born" came up and I think this is where it happened this time.

Things become born in us all the time. Like becoming "born to be wild" for example or when we are suddenly inspired to be passionate about a specific thing or issue more positive or constructive than that. This is when birth occurs. Something becomes "born" in us. And I hope you can give the term "born" another chance.

 

 

Second, the discussion up until we got talkin was going along the lines of how our environment, whether it be the one we grew up in or the one we find ourselves in now, limits what we can do, decide to do or be unchangeably subject to in the abject. To me this is not true.

I've overcome a lot in this regard (like many have also) and I'm always inspired to make more progress personally when I see someone else who's obviously overcome worse things than me. Things I can't even begin to imagine sometimes.

 

 

Edited by Will Due

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Piney
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52:1.5 (590.1) Early evolutionary man is not a colorful creature. In general, these primitive mortals are cave dwellers or cliff residents. They also build crude huts in the large trees. Before they acquire a high order of intelligence, the planets are sometimes overrun with the larger types of animals. But early in this era mortals learn to kindle and maintain fire, and with the increase of inventive imagination and the improvement in tools, evolving man soon vanquishes the larger and more unwieldy animals. The early races also make extensive use of the larger flying animals. These enormous birds are able to carry one or two average-sized men for a nonstop flight of over five hundred miles. On some planets these birds are of great service since they possess a high order of intelligence, often being able to speak many words of the languages of the realm. These birds are most intelligent, very obedient, and unbelievably affectionate. Such passenger birds have been long extinct on Urantia, but your early ancestors enjoyed their services.

Oh my! This was stolen right from Tolkien......and so wrong in so many ways.....

 

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Piney
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It is the false sentiment of your partially perfected civilizations that fosters, protects, and perpetuates the hopelessly defective strains of evolutionary human stocks.

52:2.12 (592.5) It is neither tenderness nor altruism to bestow futile sympathy upon degenerated human beings, unsalvable abnormal and inferior mortals. There exist on even the most normal of the evolutionary worlds sufficient differences between individuals and between numerous social groups to provide for the full exercise of all those noble traits of altruistic sentiment and unselfish mortal ministry without perpetuating the socially unfit and the morally degenerate strains of evolving humanity.

@Jodie.Lynne

@cormac mac airt 

Lookie here! Eugenics! :rolleyes:  

I guess I should of been killed as soon as they found that broken chromosome. :yes:

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