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Celebrity NDEs offer hints of life after death

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TripGun

I have had two NDE's in my life, I can tell you that your consciousness is still active and you still have your emotions also

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spud the mackem
On ‎06‎/‎01‎/‎2019 at 1:35 PM, preacherman76 said:

I came pretty close to a full blown NDE back when I was 14 or so. Damn near drowned in a flooded stream. I remember looking up and seeing the sunlight through the white water bubbles. The yellow sunlight suddenly became white, and this crazy peace came over me. I suddenly didn't even care that I was about to die. I was just a few seconds away from taking water in my lungs when suddenly, and I have no idea how, but next thing I knew my head was like pushed above the water. I got one good breath, and went under again. Lucky for me the stream soon began to widen and the currents subsided and I was able to get out. I'll never forget that peaceful feeling.

That's because at the last moment before drowning your brain decided to fight back instead of giving in. 

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spartan max2
1 hour ago, TripGun said:

I have had two NDE's in my life, I can tell you that your consciousness is still active and you still have your emotions also

You should share the stories, I always find them interesting 

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White Crane Feather
5 hours ago, Gecks said:

So if Im to find the basics in your argument....  your putting foward the notion that even though theres no proof or scientific reasoning, you believe due to peoples accounts who have experienced a near death event, this is logical reasoning of a soul moving on to its next stage?

Have I understood this correctly?

Not at all. It’s only one part of a body of elements, and it’s quite a bit more complicated than just accepting what people say. I would almost characterize that as the beginning of a straw man. What is proof? A captured soul to test in a lab? An instrument that can measure a spirit? A magic trick performed by somone who is in cardiac arrest? We measure phenomenon by their effects. An afterlife would be a consciousness phenomenon. The circumstances we are faced with is only part of a body of evidence. 

Lets look at gravity for example. There is zero evidence that gravity is anything, yet we are 100% sure of it’s exitance. Why?  Because we measure it’s effects on matter. There is no gravitron, there is no gravity material, we can’t see it, touch it, and we don’t really even know what it is. Einstein characterized it as the warping of spacetime, but he is just saying it’s warping something else that is intangible. How is it warping and what is it actually warping. Dark matter? Another thing we know exists based on its effects only. Dark energy, the strong force, the week force, the uncertainty principle which gives rise to zero point energy... etc etc. We don’t have to empirically know Home soemthing works to know that it exists.

An after life is a consciousness condition. We are going to have to use consciousness as our tool to explore if it exists when the brain is no longer functioning. This has the undesirable necessity of listening to what people experience. At least until we have technology that can scan and show someone’s memories. Even then we know that memories can be misleading. ( thats why we get many accounts and compare them as any decent investigator would do) It’s all a moot point, because mostly we don’t think people are making these things up. I think some people have embellished their experiences for attention, but that is a different issue. 

What we really want to know is if these experiences are happening when the brain has zero blood pressure in it and no activity. To recognize speech, or create a virtual environment, to even store something to memory requires very complex cohesive brain activity that generates brain waves during its process. You can’t have a conversation with dead uncle joe, or even dream about it, and then store it to memory without a functioning brain. Even speech recognition in humans is a very complex feet. 

We know that without a doubt that there are no brainwaves upon cardiac arrest. We know that the biological brain cannot do these things without blood pressure. We can measure brain waves and do during these episodes, and we can put poor animals with biologies similar to ours to death and watch what happens.

If human beings are having complex conscious experiences during a time when the brain is not functioning in a capacity that can support those experiences, then the obvious conclusion is that consciousness which includes the storage and recall of memories can exist independent of the brain. We also know that the brain holds and stores memories, so we also must conclude that that there is an interface  or a downloading process that goes both from the brain and to the spirit body ( for lak of a better term). This should leave an energy signature in the brain when the spirit would leave the body, and when it returned. There is a predictable measurement opportunity here. 

Rememner we measure things by effects. Just because we can’t measure a “spirit” floating around the room dosn’t mean we can’t measure its effects. The effect in the NDE case is the undisputed knowledge that people can acuratly describe what was going on around them in detail while in cardiac arrest. 

Your question is do I believe because of what people say? My answer is that I have a Yes/No meter on a scale. The needle on the meter leans in the direction of likely hoods based on the body of evidence as a whole. I don’t make absolute decisions or follow philosophies or platforms. I like to evaluate issues based on their own merits. My meter is leaning significantly into the yes category and for very good logical reasons. And yes it’s science based. I don’t need a fully tested and proven theory to lean yes. I’m not fundamentalist. I don’t have psychological hang ups about the possibility of a spiritual reality. I follow the evidence. ;) 

 

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Sheltie

I believe very strongly that the NDE phenomenon is real and I always enjoy hearing people share their stories.  I also believe there is an afterlife and a godlike force that we are all connected to.  I don't force my viewpoint on anyone.  

That said, I feel no obligation or responsibility to convince anyone on forums such as this to believe something one way or the other.  If someone chooses to believe that nothing can be absolutely proven and that everyone who has ever publicly presented an idea is just trying to sell a book and make money, than so be it.      

   

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Gecks
On 08/01/2019 at 2:17 AM, White Crane Feather said:

Not at all. It’s only one part of a body of elements, and it’s quite a bit more complicated than just accepting what people say. I would almost characterize that as the beginning of a straw man. What is proof? A captured soul to test in a lab? An instrument that can measure a spirit? A magic trick performed by somone who is in cardiac arrest? We measure phenomenon by their effects. An afterlife would be a consciousness phenomenon. The circumstances we are faced with is only part of a body of evidence. 

Lets look at gravity for example. There is zero evidence that gravity is anything, yet we are 100% sure of it’s exitance. Why?  Because we measure it’s effects on matter. There is no gravitron, there is no gravity material, we can’t see it, touch it, and we don’t really even know what it is. Einstein characterized it as the warping of spacetime, but he is just saying it’s warping something else that is intangible. How is it warping and what is it actually warping. Dark matter? Another thing we know exists based on its effects only. Dark energy, the strong force, the week force, the uncertainty principle which gives rise to zero point energy... etc etc. We don’t have to empirically know Home soemthing works to know that it exists.

An after life is a consciousness condition. We are going to have to use consciousness as our tool to explore if it exists when the brain is no longer functioning. This has the undesirable necessity of listening to what people experience. At least until we have technology that can scan and show someone’s memories. Even then we know that memories can be misleading. ( thats why we get many accounts and compare them as any decent investigator would do) It’s all a moot point, because mostly we don’t think people are making these things up. I think some people have embellished their experiences for attention, but that is a different issue. 

What we really want to know is if these experiences are happening when the brain has zero blood pressure in it and no activity. To recognize speech, or create a virtual environment, to even store something to memory requires very complex cohesive brain activity that generates brain waves during its process. You can’t have a conversation with dead uncle joe, or even dream about it, and then store it to memory without a functioning brain. Even speech recognition in humans is a very complex feet. 

We know that without a doubt that there are no brainwaves upon cardiac arrest. We know that the biological brain cannot do these things without blood pressure. We can measure brain waves and do during these episodes, and we can put poor animals with biologies similar to ours to death and watch what happens.

If human beings are having complex conscious experiences during a time when the brain is not functioning in a capacity that can support those experiences, then the obvious conclusion is that consciousness which includes the storage and recall of memories can exist independent of the brain. We also know that the brain holds and stores memories, so we also must conclude that that there is an interface  or a downloading process that goes both from the brain and to the spirit body ( for lak of a better term). This should leave an energy signature in the brain when the spirit would leave the body, and when it returned. There is a predictable measurement opportunity here. 

Rememner we measure things by effects. Just because we can’t measure a “spirit” floating around the room dosn’t mean we can’t measure its effects. The effect in the NDE case is the undisputed knowledge that people can acuratly describe what was going on around them in detail while in cardiac arrest. 

Your question is do I believe because of what people say? My answer is that I have a Yes/No meter on a scale. The needle on the meter leans in the direction of likely hoods based on the body of evidence as a whole. I don’t make absolute decisions or follow philosophies or platforms. I like to evaluate issues based on their own merits. My meter is leaning significantly into the yes category and for very good logical reasons. And yes it’s science based. I don’t need a fully tested and proven theory to lean yes. I’m not fundamentalist. I don’t have psychological hang ups about the possibility of a spiritual reality. I follow the evidence. ;) 

 

Well thanks for the civilised conversation. Its always interesting to learn others thoughts and viewpoints. 

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psyche101
On 1/5/2019 at 11:58 PM, RabidMongoose said:

I have a theory about all of that. In the year 3000 civilization has stepped outside of space-time and can recover everybody who has ever lived. They are careful not to disrupt our timeline (by removing dead bodies) so they simply suck out peoples consciousnesses shortly after death. As civilization already exists outside of time at that point then it has always existed outside of time. So from our perspective there is not a 1000 year wait to be recovered, it happens instantly.

Or maybe something means that they can only suck us out, even just for momentary contact, when dead. Then if we are to live send us back. Or maybe its not about disrupting the timeline but not wanting to alter the experience of life for us unnecessarily.

Roughly Netflixs "Travellers" in reverse? 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Travelers_(TV_series)

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psyche101
On 1/6/2019 at 2:46 AM, Trenix said:

Just because you're famous, does not mean you have more credibility than those who aren't.

Exactly. It's an appeal to authority. 

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psyche101
On 1/7/2019 at 1:09 AM, preacherman76 said:

Well said White Crane.

Too much for me to bother with right now. I'm about to go to bed. 

On 1/7/2019 at 1:09 AM, preacherman76 said:

The science on this subject is more then lacking. Such a shame too, that our most brilliant minds dismiss this subject, or even actively work to side step it, instead of embracing every possibility. The way a scientist should.

That's simply not true. You're familiar with the AWARE project are you not? I'm sure we have discussed it. 

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RabidMongoose
16 minutes ago, psyche101 said:

Roughly Netflixs "Travellers" in reverse? 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Travelers_(TV_series)

Travellers takes Abrahamic mysticism and creates a tv series about time travellers based on it.

A traveller is a free mason, its one of the phrases they use to described themselves to identify each other. The director is God.

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psyche101
9 hours ago, RabidMongoose said:

Travellers takes Abrahamic mysticism and creates a tv series about time travellers based on it.

A traveller is a free mason, its one of the phrases they use to described themselves to identify each other. The director is God.

It sounds more like your first post than a religious take. I assume you have not seen an episode? It's like you just reversed the time travel concept of the show and boom. Theory. 

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RabidMongoose
13 hours ago, psyche101 said:

It sounds more like your first post than a religious take. I assume you have not seen an episode? It's like you just reversed the time travel concept of the show and boom. Theory. 

I have seen the lot and the masonic double meanings are literally everywhere.

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psyche101
9 hours ago, RabidMongoose said:

I have seen the lot and the masonic double meanings are literally everywhere.

I reckon your overthinking it. 

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Guyver
On 1/7/2019 at 6:44 AM, TripGun said:

I have had two NDE's in my life, I can tell you that your consciousness is still active and you still have your emotions also

I think that is fascinating.  Problem is, these experiences don’t seem to be consistent among all people.  There’s a skeptic here on the forum named Xenofish who claims to have also had two NDE’s, I believe, and he didn’t experience any afterlife, or even recollection at all.

PS.  I’m of the opinion that many or most celebrities are completely wacked, so....while I respect their experience and testimony, I agree with the poster who said their stories are no more or less credible than anyone else’s.

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Not A Rockstar
39 minutes ago, Guyver said:

 had two NDE’s, I believe, and he didn’t experience any afterlife, or even recollection at all.

confused here. If one has no recollection of anything, is it an NDE by definition or simply that a person died and was revived? I think in the projects trying to track NDEs over half of those who are brought back have no memories to report?

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Guyver
1 hour ago, Not A Rockstar said:

confused here. If one has no recollection of anything, is it an NDE by definition or simply that a person died and was revived? I think in the projects trying to track NDEs over half of those who are brought back have no memories to report?

Yes.  I think you are correct on that statistic as my memory serves, and probably correct on both points.  It is in fact an NDE if the person was revived, whether they remember anything or not.  It’s just interesting that some do have a memorable and life changing experience with the afterlife and others do not.

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preacherman76
On ‎1‎/‎7‎/‎2019 at 11:02 AM, spud the mackem said:

That's because at the last moment before drowning your brain decided to fight back instead of giving in. 

No I had been fighting back, hard, for what seemed like forever. I was in a moment of surrender when I came back above the water. Not saying it was divine intervention or anything, just saying I don’t know how it happened. 

I remember seeing that yellow sun turn white, and literally saying to myself that no matter what happened next, it was going to be alright. 

 

ETA- It could have been as simple as the current taking an upswing. My 14 year old mind did believe I had work yet to be done though I must admit. My 42 year old mind doesn't outright dismiss that possibility either.

Edited by preacherman76

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preacherman76
6 hours ago, Guyver said:

Yes.  I think you are correct on that statistic as my memory serves, and probably correct on both points.  It is in fact an NDE if the person was revived, whether they remember anything or not.  It’s just interesting that some do have a memorable and life changing experience with the afterlife and others do not.

From what I've seen the best cases are where people die quickly and unexpectantly. Heart attacks, car accidents, etc. Even in those cases only around 25% recall an experience. From the POV of an ER doctor that's still many cases over a career.

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TripGun

I was conscious both times, 1st time was more dream like and was more of an experience with prisms separating light and they were in the earths atmosphere. I didn't know my heart stopped and paddles were used till I woke up and puked all over myself...yeah. 2nd time I was in the passenger seat of my friends CJ7 Jeep and we were running from the law, yes we were going to lose them in the off road trails and avoid any DUI charges. He had a rebuilt 307 engine in it and it would fly, and then it did. We had the speedometer buried at 85 mph for about 20 seconds before the wreck, end over end 3 times and on the side 7 rolls, 1000 ft from where it started. I stayed in for two rotations, bashed my face against the windshield and was thrown 35 ft straight up. I woke up standing in front of myself and was confused because I didn't recognize myself from the angle and a man standing behind me was talking to me saying that I was dead, hope was lost and that I would be stuck right there just like him. So I panicked and laid down on top of myself and tried to match the way I was laying to get back in. Then I felt peaceful and woke up alive for real, I took a beating but I had no broken bones or concussions just lacerations to my face and a softball size knot on the back of my head. I only knew that I had momentarily died from the officers chasing us checked me and I had no pulse and so they moved on down to my friend who had broken his neck and was in the process of having to be life lined. I was not even slightly religious at this time in my life, I was raised atheist. This one changed my life because right before the accident I went to put my seat-belt on and I heard a voice say "don't", I was shocked, I even started to do it again and heard a loud "no" and I looked up and saw an angelic figure dressed in blue and white with swirls of kaleidoscopic colored energy radiating out around him. I said  "That's Jesus" and I looked at my friend and I said "I see Jesus" and he said "hold on" and we wrecked. I find myself reflecting on this one a lot. I am leaving out a few little things on purpose because I know that this experience was mine alone and in most cases volunteering information just allows it to be used against you. I am a Christian now and my relationship with God is a personal one just between He and I.

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spartan max2

Thanks for sharing, I hope you wear your seatbelt now though lol

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Pettytalk
On 1/9/2019 at 6:10 AM, psyche101 said:

Exactly. It's an appeal to authority. 

God is the ultimate and absolute authority!

You still, absolutely, don't show up as a chess player by the name of "psyche101".  Did you sign up at redhotpawn.com?

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Pettytalk

I had one hell of an OBE. An Out of Body Experience that had me going to hell for a whole night. I then saw her face, and now I'm a believer. The devil is a she, and wears Prada!

I feel sorry for those that will be going there more than just on a one night stand. It's all about absolute justice for those that gave none to others. And most of the members in hell where, are, and will be those that hated, rather than loved, and usually where the ones only concerned with number one...themselves, I mean, as number one.

 

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psyche101
9 hours ago, Pettytalk said:

God is the ultimate and absolute authority!

Indeed, its just what of that is in question. 

9 hours ago, Pettytalk said:

You still, absolutely, don't show up as a chess player by the name of "psyche101".  Did you sign up at redhotpawn.com?

Should be there now. 

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joc
On 1/6/2019 at 7:35 AM, preacherman76 said:

I came pretty close to a full blown NDE back when I was 14 or so. Damn near drowned in a flooded stream. ........... I was just a few seconds away from taking water in my lungs when....

Not doubting your story preach...just confused...How are you categorizing your experience as an NDE when you were no where near death?  if you never breathed water into your lungs you were never near death.  You came close to being near death.  But that's about it. Or, is that what you were meaning....that you came close to having a NDE?

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Pettytalk
3 hours ago, psyche101 said:

Indeed, its just what of that is in question. 

Should be there now. 

Very good...as soon as I finish one of my 4 ongoing matches we can start our 2 scheduled games.

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