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Dark_Grey

"Masculinity is harmful" According to APA

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Imaginarynumber1
4 minutes ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

 

THe whole idea of holding men as "toxic" is a leftists ideal, in case you didn't realise it.

No. It's not. It's a very specific set of traits, beliefs, and actions that have been present in societies for many thousands of years and has been studied in depth in the fields of anthropology and to a lesser extent, sociology. 

The term itself is new and a very poor descriptor for the exact reasons of the way you perceive it now. AS I HAD EXPLAINED EARLIER IN THIS VERY THREAD

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Aquila King
1 minute ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

the left IS at war with men. Yes.

As a male member of the left, as well as someone with ears and brain capable of actually listening to and understanding what the most prominent voices on the left are actually saying on the matter, I can tell you through experience that that's demonstrably false.

You're making this s**t up out of thin air.

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Earl.Of.Trumps
3 minutes ago, Imaginarynumber1 said:

No. It's not. It's a very specific set of traits, beliefs, and actions that have been present in societies for many thousands of years and has been studied in depth in the fields of anthropology and to a lesser extent, sociology. 

And we all can get specific about  toxic "traits" of blacks in the 'hood, illegal immigrants, gender feminists, any group you want! TRY IT.

Unless it is specific bad male traits you refer to, you'll be labeled racist, anti-women, etc etc, and told never to judge ALL xyz by the actions of a few.

THAT is liberalology. you people just don't get it.

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Aquila King
1 minute ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

And we all can get specific about  toxic "traits" of blacks in the 'hood, illegal immigrants, gender feminists, any group you want! TRY IT.

Those sound more like the groups you want to have singled out.

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aztek
Just now, Aquila King said:

As a male member of the left, as well as someone with ears and brain capable of actually listening to and understanding what the most prominent voices on the left are actually saying on the matter, I can tell you through experience that that's demonstrably false.

You're making this s**t up out of thin air.

 

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Imaginarynumber1

I give up. 

You keep missing the point

Edited just so I can add how dumb aztek always is

Edited by Imaginarynumber1
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Aquila King
5 minutes ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

And we all can get specific about  toxic "traits" of blacks in the 'hood, illegal immigrants, gender feminists, any group you want! TRY IT.

That's the main crux of it isn't it? You'd be more than happy to single out any toxic traits expressed by certain people groups, whilst ignoring those traits in others. Typical.

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Earl.Of.Trumps
Just now, Aquila King said:

Those sound more like the groups you want to have singled out.

AGAIN, you miss the point. We must be consistent - no discrimination!. Either it is Ok to point out "toxic traits" in a group, or it is NOT.

And you are refusing to admit it. that's politics. And thanks for the race baiting, too BTW. that's liberalology, too. If you can't beat 'em, call 'em a racist"

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Aquila King
1 minute ago, aztek said:

 

I have no clue who that is or what they're arguing about, but regardless, I'm damn near certain that's out of context. :huh:

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Earl.Of.Trumps
1 minute ago, Aquila King said:

That's the main crux of it isn't it? You'd be more than happy to single out any toxic traits expressed by certain people groups, whilst ignoring those traits in others. Typical.

And you're just happy being a liberal lair and race baiter. 

Isn't it fun? Wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!

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Aquila King
2 minutes ago, Imaginarynumber1 said:

I give up. 

You keep missing the point

Edited just so I can add how dumb aztek always is

I know. It's pointless. Just responding out of boredom at this point.

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Earl.Of.Trumps
2 minutes ago, Aquila King said:

That's the main crux of it isn't it? You'd be more than happy to single out any toxic traits expressed by certain people groups, whilst ignoring those traits in others. Typical.

No, see... this is YOUR modus operandus, not mine. 

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Aquila King
2 minutes ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

AGAIN, you miss the point. We must be consistent - no discrimination!. Either it is Ok to point out "toxic traits" in a group, or it is NOT.

And you are refusing to admit it. that's politics. And thanks for the race baiting, too BTW. that's liberalology, too. If you can't beat 'em, call 'em a racist"

Oh the irony... You're literally refusing to acknowledge the toxicity present in some forms of masculinity whilst touting some fake ass call for 'consistency'. 

You don't care about consistency, you only care about demonizing 'the other'.

5 minutes ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

And you're just happy being a liberal lair and race baiter. 

Isn't it fun? Wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!

:mellow: ...I don't know why you're upset about toxic masculinity since you're clearly just a child...

6 minutes ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

No, see... this is YOUR modus operandus, not mine. 

 

psychological-projection-is-a-defense-mechanism-people-subconsciously-employ-in-32641575.png

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and then
15 hours ago, Michelle said:

Most manly men are still chivalrous. Even having a welding shop, there are certain things they consider too dangerous or dirty for a woman to do. I don't mind getting down and dirty, but I do let men, on occasion, be gallant.

I haven't read the study but I think I will.  I really don't think masculinity is in any trouble, yet, in the deep south.  The women have always been strong enough to provide boundaries and let expectations be known. :)   The same guys that would get in a bar fight tonight would stop to help a lady with a flat or hold a door for her the next day.  I've always considered masculinity to be instilling a necessary degree of toughness to meet the real world while teaching boys they also have a responsibility to respect the women in their lives.  I believe that with this definition in mind, we have raised a lot of young men that would have "PTSD" after 11 weeks at Parris Island or even Fort Jackson.  The problem may well be that boys are too often being raised by half a set of parents.  They need molding by BOTH sexes to understand their place in the world.

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Earl.Of.Trumps
1 minute ago, Aquila King said:

Oh the irony... You're literally refusing to acknowledge the toxicity present in some forms of masculinity whilst touting some fake ass call for 'consistency'. 

I'm not refusing that, no. WHat I am saying is, it is at least MEAN SPIRITED to go after any one group. And basically, yeah, hate speech. But in this case, you wholeheartedly support it!  Congrats, lib!

1 minute ago, Aquila King said:

You don't care about consistency, you only care about demonizing 'the other'.

bullcrap. I didn't start the rhetoric.  the article in the OP DID.

1 minute ago, Aquila King said:

:mellow: ...I don't know why you're upset about toxic masculinity since you're clearly just a child...

I'm upset at liberal liars, bashers and hypocrites.   THat is what I Am pointing out. 

1 minute ago, Aquila King said:

 

psychological-projection-is-a-defense-mechanism-people-subconsciously-employ-in-32641575.png

And everything you have posted above applies to the BASHERS that acted first. not me.

You still don't get it do you?    Out of this thread.  you libs really have a hard head.

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and then
11 hours ago, Likely Guy said:

Back in the eighties I caught **** from two women holding a door open for them.

So I let it go and walked away. I thought that I was simply being polite.

You thought right.  We're only responsible for how we treat others.  Whatever problems or biases they have, are on them.  

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Aquila King
13 minutes ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

I'm not refusing that, no. WHat I am saying is, it is at least MEAN SPIRITED to go after any one group. And basically, yeah, hate speech. But in this case, you wholeheartedly support it!  Congrats, lib!

I suppose if you can't refute someone's actual position, you can always easily refute some lie you made up about them. 

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and then
13 hours ago, Likely Guy said:

Apeman is always sarcastic and always not subtle.

While he should come with a warning, that's what I love* about him.

*In the most masculine sense.

I wouldn't go as far as "love" but I can certainly agree that he's consistent and you always know where you stand with him.  I respect people like that, even if I don't agree with them.

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Dark_Grey
14 hours ago, Likely Guy said:

That's got nothing to do with masculinity.

Actually, it does. For a lot of the same reasons that prove the "wage gap" doesn't exist because of misogyny.

Men are better at dedicating themselves to single tasks while women are better at multitasking. Men are willing to work longer, harder hours. Men are better at organizing and working in teams to accomplish a goal. Men are capable of harnessing sexual energy to fuel innovation, creativity and dedication (never underestimate the power of the mating ritual). All great traits to have when engineering concrete to hold it's shape in a freeze or designing and testing the first jet engine. Can women do those things? Sure. But the overwhelming majority of innovation and construction was and is done by men. The "traditional masculinity" outlined by the APA sounds like a function of higher testosterone (except the "anti-femininity"?). 

It is interesting that as the divide between the Left and the Right grows, the association between Liberals and low T is also growing. "Soy-boy" and "beta male" are some of my favorites. Living a sheltered life in a wealthy community doesn't prepare one for the "real world"; you're less likely to experience any kind of violence, resistance, discrimination or most importantly, hardship. The traits they describe as "toxic masculinity" are very likely a product of environment, IMO. What I'm getting at is the APA only published this ridiculous paper to take a swipe at the working class because they are too emasculated to stand up against radical feminist ideology. Schools are infested with destructive ideology precisely BECAUSE "traditional masculinity" has been pushed out. When the only men left are too beta to stand up for what is right, everyone loses. Strong leaders are essential for a cohesive and strong society, from the macro all the way down to the micro. 

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and then
6 hours ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

Not according to the left!  "masculine" = "evil"

It certainly seems like the more extreme parts of that movement are anti- anything traditional in our culture.  I can only speak for myself but that single characteristic of their movement causes me to distrust them and to resist.  No culture is so "wrong" that nearly every part of it can be seen as negative.  I'll say it again - we in the west seem to have reached the point where we've become too "civilized" to do what it takes to survive in the real world.  The same people that write these studies and look down the nose from the lofty peaks of Academe will be the first to seek the help of those too masculine men when their safe, comfortable world gets tossed in a storm someday.  

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sci-nerd

How many neutered men participated in that nonsense guideline? I'd hate to see the armies, defending our freedom and way of life, adapting to that oestrogen BS.

I'm teaching my son to respect all people, and to avoid fighting if at all possible. But also to strike first, hard and repeatedly, if its inevitable.
He loves playing with his softgun, his knives and his handcuffs, and nobody ever suggested those to him. He just likes it. He also loves to explore and investigate. That has cost countless toys to be dissected to millions of pieces, which is a bit annoying, but I appreciate the curiosity.

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Aquila King
1 minute ago, sci-nerd said:

I'm teaching my son to respect all people, and to avoid fighting if at all possible. But also to strike first, hard and repeatedly, if its inevitable.

Those are completely contradictory concepts, but whatever... :huh:

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sci-nerd
1 minute ago, Aquila King said:

Those are completely contradictory concepts, but whatever... :huh:

What contradiction? Sometimes you can't escape an aggressor, and you must be prepared to win the fight.

It's just: Choose A if possible. If not possible, choose B. No contradiction.

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and then
4 hours ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

BTW, we all ought to start a "toxic femininity" thread in here.   Now there's a topic you won't see in the media  lol

I stumbled on to a group on YT that have THAT covered, already.  It's hilarious to watch a couple of the vids but after that, it's just depressing.  The "group" call themselves MGTOW - Men Going Their Own Way.  They can seem nearly as unhinged as some feminists.  They all seem to have experienced a relationship or two, with a truly despicable woman and they've decided to "swear off" the sex in general, even if they still seek sex.  I hope there aren't too many teens or twentysomethings watching those things.  It'd scare the crap out of them.

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aztek
Just now, and then said:

I stumbled on to a group on YT that have THAT covered, already.  It's hilarious to watch a couple of the vids but after that, it's just depressing.  The "group" call themselves MGTOW - Men Going Their Own Way.  They can seem nearly as unhinged as some feminists.  They all seem to have experienced a relationship or two, with a truly despicable woman and they've decided to "swear off" the sex in general, even if they still seek sex.  I hope there aren't too many teens or twentysomethings watching those things.  It'd scare the crap out of them.

it would not be an issue if they did just that, but they scream in your face that your way is toxic and hateful, and they demand you  go their way.  not even realizing they are the ones who are toxic and hateful.

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