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Venezuelan Revolt on the Horizon?


Earl.Of.Trumps

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10 hours ago, Golden Duck said:

Actually, when have I said the US is the source of Ve's troubles. 

I'm not protecting socialism. I'm advocating sovereignty.

Since when has anyone been calling to take Vn's sovereignty away?  They have a right to do what they want to themselves. The US never invaded Cuba and I guess that's a good thing. Let the Cubans define their own government. So I say, same thing here. If the Vn's want to continue to hail Maduro and socialism, let them.  Just don't blame the US for it. Just don't defend Maduro and goo goo socialism.

10 hours ago, Golden Duck said:

Ve has been on a precarious course since the discovery of oil even more so since they switched to democracy. The oil boom has sucked Ve resources out of every other industry. 

The only remedy is to divert oil revenues into developing other areas that are suffering scarcity.

Did you know that the Vn's *give* oil away to selected US oil programs tin  order o help emigree SA people?  They can afford to do that? Amazing.

Must be nice to be a rich socialist leader. You get to give the poor people's needed resources away.  

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59 minutes ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

Since when has anyone been calling to take Vn's sovereignty away?  They have a right to do what they want to themselves. The US never invaded Cuba and I guess that's a good thing. Let the Cubans define their own government. So I say, same thing here. If the Vn's want to continue to hail Maduro and socialism, let them.  Just don't blame the US for it. Just don't defend Maduro and goo goo socialism.

Did you know that the Vn's *give* oil away to selected US oil programs tin  order o help emigree SA people?  They can afford to do that? Amazing.

Must be nice to be a rich socialist leader. You get to give the poor people's needed resources away.  

Bay of Pigs?

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16 hours ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

 

Phaeton,  I know for sure just how bad the US screwed up democracy in Iran, and the Iranians now have a theocracy complete with ruling mullahs reigning instead. Shameful.

PLEASE...  do not expect me to believe that the starvation and mass exodus of Vn people is America's fault. It is failed socialism as it was in Cuba, NKorea, USSR, China, East Europe, and everywhere else that it failed.

Communism/socialism always promises a chicken in every pot. Promises promises. The reality is, nobody has a chicken, nobody has a pot.

 

.


Sir, surely; the economic sanctions, freezing of billions in assets, OPEC lowering oil prices in coordination with POTUS.. surely you would recognize the stranglehold effect this has on an already bleeding economy. I never stated the USA is the soul source of the present troubles.. But to claim the US is innocent in all this is obviously, factually, rationally unsound.

I would be interested to see your reaction if your nation was in comparable economic downfall, and a foreign entity did what the US does to Vn now.. Id be inclined to bet you would be raging against such a foreign entity, and you would be right to do so.

This isnt about black & white, casting a 100% blame to anyone; Chavez/Maduro or the US. This is about the US engaging in the affairs of yet another foreign sovereign nation under the guise of altruism to gain certain geo strategical aspirations. This is about the US pulling the bad regime card to rationalise and capitalize on yet another intervention, again trampling on international law when it suits her.. (while still whining about a few Russian bots supposedly influencing US election). This is about the sheer unadulterated criminal hypocrisy that seeps through any- and every action she takes in the foreign policy landscape.. This is about OIL, nothing else.

 

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2 hours ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

Since when has anyone been calling to take Vn's sovereignty away?  They have a right to do what they want to themselves. The US never invaded Cuba and I guess that's a good thing. Let the Cubans define their own government. So I say, same thing here. If the Vn's want to continue to hail Maduro and socialism, let them.  Just don't blame the US for it. Just don't defend Maduro and goo goo socialism.

Asserting Guiado is the legitimate president is not respecting sovereignty. 

2 hours ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

Did you know that the Vn's *give* oil away to selected US oil programs tin  order o help emigree SA people?  They can afford to do that? Amazing.

Must be nice to be a rich socialist leader. You get to give the poor people's needed resources away.  

Have you got a source?

Edited by Golden Duck
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  • 2 weeks later...
On 9-4-2019 at 5:28 AM, and then said:

I'm quite satisfied with my worldview and with those, I've chosen to respect.  In showing more respect and credibility to the members of a regime that casually tortures and imprisons political dissidents as well as hanging homosexuals from cranes for no offense other than their homosexuality, I'd say your choices say a lot about you as well.  To each his own.  There is a LOT about me that offends people, I get that.  No harm, no foul.  When disgust for an individual is based on the fact that you disagree with their worldview then that also makes a statement about you.  FWIW, I don't hate you for your opinions or passions about Israel or America.  I get angry and disgusted at times here but I don't revel in the toxicity as much anymore.  Life's too damned short.  What will be will be.

Hating political conservatives and the state of Israel (far from being conservative) is a muddled approach, though, IMO.  By tacitly supporting the Tehran Regime (that now regularly speaks of annihilating the "Zionist" State of Israel) that puts you on the record as approving of the desire for the genocide of a whole people.  Play with the words all you like but the reality is the Twelver Shias that run that nation make no secret of their desire to fulfill the text of the Qur'an concerning the fate of the Jews - and Christians.  

Hate whoever you choose but you should remember that it's like drinking poison and expecting someone else to die.  

 

:D Oh lawd.. you gotta be kidding me. The single biggest hypocrit on this forum - structurally feigning ethical highground (well, he is 'a Christian' you know) while passionately rationalizing / supporting the worst crimes against humanity, drooling over images of impending war - is trying to force feed his inverted image of himself again, as well as those he sees as the opposition.

Hate is not applicable, its a well balanced mix of disgust and pitty. And not because of disagreement, but purely because of the sickening hypocricy, sheer double measures, feigning of moral highground.. as well as complete idiotic, utterly biased slander of everything Islamic (like the ridiculous "Play with the words all you like but the reality is the Twelver Shias that run that nation make no secret of their desire to fulfill the text of the Qur'an concerning the fate of the Jews - and Christians").

Hypocrisy, like lamenting 'the approval for the genocide of a whole people' (while this is completely off the mark, especially juxtaposed to the 'wipe the Zionist regime of the map' (incidentally supported by numerous orthodox Jewish congregations) quote - which has nothing to do with genocide but with the opposition to a political ideology), while you yourself are avidly supporting the ONGOING genocide of the Palestinians - whom you indiscriminately label terrorist as a whole.

Youre a sad, comical, toxic individual. And luckily, life has a nack of letting such toxicity flow right back to the source, in a myriad of different forms.

 

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29 minutes ago, Phaeton80 said:

Hypocrisy, like lamenting 'the approval for the genocide of a whole people' (while this is completely off the mark, especially juxtaposed to the 'wipe the Zionist regime of the map' (incidentally supported by numerous orthodox Jewish congregations) quote - which has nothing to do with genocide but with the opposition to a political ideology), while you yourself are avidly supporting the ONGOING genocide of the Palestinians - whom you indiscriminately label terrorist as a whole.

Do you REALLY believe that, Phaeton80 ? Do you REALLY believe that the "wipe the Zionist regime off the map" does NOT refer to intended genocide ? 

Oh... and WHAT "ongoing genocide of the Palestinians" ? You ignore a genuine threat of genocide, whilst simultaneously inventing a genocide that does not exist ? 

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2 hours ago, RoofGardener said:

Do you REALLY believe that, Phaeton80 ? Do you REALLY believe that the "wipe the Zionist regime off the map" does NOT refer to intended genocide ? 

Oh... and WHAT "ongoing genocide of the Palestinians" ? You ignore a genuine threat of genocide, whilst simultaneously inventing a genocide that does not exist ? 

That's precisely what he believes.  He has repeated it in one form or another for years.  Israel and America are the two greatest threats in the world today and are both guilty of most of the chaos and atrocities on the planet.  He has a really bad case of it.

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Ahhhh to be young and stupid again .........

 

Mercenaries, Spies, and Double Agents Gather En Masse in Bogotá

Quote

In the Casablanca of the Andes, seemingly everyone’s plotting—or counterplotting—for control of neighboring Venezuela.

 

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5 hours ago, Farmer77 said:

Ahhhh to be young and stupid again .........

 

Mercenaries, Spies, and Double Agents Gather En Masse in Bogotá

 

I'm sure that Russia and Iran have the most pious of motives in their work there.  Don't be too sad, youth is fleeting but stupid can be Fo Evah, apparently...

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17 hours ago, and then said:

Don't be too sad, youth is fleeting but stupid can be Fo Evah, apparently...

Well I hate to give you ammunition but I have to confess you are right on this point. I fell asleep last night scheming of  ways I could get my foot in the door down there :no:

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On 20-4-2019 at 3:30 PM, RoofGardener said:

Do you REALLY believe that, Phaeton80 ? Do you REALLY believe that the "wipe the Zionist regime off the map" does NOT refer to intended genocide ? 

Oh... and WHAT "ongoing genocide of the Palestinians" ? You ignore a genuine threat of genocide, whilst simultaneously inventing a genocide that does not exist ? 


No, it means exactly what the individual words add up to; to remove a malicious and agressive ideology from the region. An agressive and malicious political entity which has been slowly but steadily committing cultural genocide against the Palestinian people.

Both the quotes used to rationalize the stated idiocy are patently and tendentiously false, construed in such a way as to fit your personal (utterly biased and skewed) toxic views. And while you folk are screaming about a possible future 'genocide', you are passionately defending the ongoing genocide of the Palestinian people, which are conveniently all regarded as terrorists - so as to mitigate the ethical problem of mass murdering hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians, women, children, men.

Disgusting, just disgusting. Especially from people having the absolute gall to call themselves Christian. A level of sickness Im hardpressed to fathom.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Ethnic_Cleansing_of_Palestine

https://ccrjustice.org/genocide-palestinian-people-international-law-and-human-rights-perspective

https://www.haaretz.com/opinion/.premium-the-israeli-mk-heralding-genocide-against-palestinians-1.5475561

https://mondoweiss.net/2017/11/liberal-contemplating-genocide/

In your twisted convenient world, explicit words (as well as a myriad of clearcut facts, figures) of genocidal intention against the Palestinians are laughable and/or void of meaning, while explicit words against a Zionist regime are proof of a scandalous genocidal intent against all Jewish people. Magical how that works..

Edited by Phaeton80
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On 20-4-2019 at 5:57 PM, and then said:

That's precisely what he believes.  He has repeated it in one form or another for years.  Israel and America are the two greatest threats in the world today and are both guilty of most of the chaos and atrocities on the planet.  He has a really bad case of it.


Two of the main destabilizing factors, one of which is directly responsible for the most wars (of agression under the guise of humanitarianism) as well as innocent / civilian deaths from the latter part of the 20th to the first 2 decades of the 21st, to which no other nation can be compared, by any means. Clearcut facts. Its all good and well to depict my position as fringe, or even crazy; but I would pose the direct opposite is the case, given readily available, abundant facts and figures underwrite my position rather strongly. Hell, your whole culture is based on war, your economy depends on it. No other nation even comes close in the manufacture and employment of military grade weapons, you are the quintessential warmerchant nation. See Yemen for one of your latest rotten fruits, if you can see through the Syrian / Lybian / Afghan / Iraqi smoke.

Empires have always committed crimes enmasse to gain, and subsequently maintain their position of power. To be able to ignore all these obvious facts (number of wars started, number of nations meddled with politically / socially and economically soully for own gains, the sheer number of innocent deaths and level of suffering fomented) as well as projecting this empire as a force of good in the world today.. Well, the level of self delusion needed for such a view must be impressive.

Having said this, its the unconstitutional, scandalous control of the Israeli state over your foreign policy why I mention Israel as well (she obviously hasnt started many wars herself). Which brings us to another up side down situation; where the explicit influence control over the USA by Israel is null and void, yet a few Russian tweets and rumors of collusion send the nation in pandemonium for years. Crazy stuff, then again; the US population must be(come) crazy to support her deranged policy. Luckily, things have a tendency to erm.. lets call it 'even out'.

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5 hours ago, Phaeton80 said:


No, it means exactly what the individual words add up to; to remove a malicious and agressive ideology from the region. An agressive and malicious political entity which has been slowly but steadily committing cultural genocide against the Palestinian people.

“to remove a malicious and aggressive ideology from the region”?  Seriously?  To be brutally honest, Islam is a malicious and aggressive ideology.  And if there is anything that needs to be removed it is that.  Ahmadinejad’s quote still carries the original intent.  Just as Naser’s intent when he stated that he would kick the Jew into the sea.  The meaning and intent of both is clear.  Without Zionism, Israel could never exist.  Jews would revert back to Dhimmis status. 

 

Genocide, cultural genocide, and ethnic cleansing are all different things.  Where genocide can be ethnic cleansing, ethnic cleansing is not genocide.  Israel is doing no more than what the Turks were doing to the Palestinians and quite a bit less than the Muslim culture did to Jews.  So it’s really a matter of who’s ethnic cleansing one can tolerate?  Israel looks to the day that the Palestinian seeks peace, not war but if only war, will push them back into the general Muslim populations.  On the other hand, Muslims seek genocide on the Jew.  That tells me all I need to know.

 

Palestinian really isn’t a culture.  Palestinian was just a label to represent a conglomeration of multiple tribes that came and went in the region (including Jews).  It wasn’t until the Mandate that people began to actually settle.  It wasn’t a real culture.  It didn’t have tenure.  The previous culture prevented that.  Not all cultures are meant to survive, just like any species on the planet.  The Palestinian was never organized as one people.  The land owners resisted in selling land to them.  The Ottomans practiced their own version of ethnic cleansing on the Palestinian. When the Ottoman’s were replaced by the Brits, all sorts of bogus land deeds surfaced.  But very few were legitimate. 

 

When the Brits left, the Mufti of Jerusalem ordered the Palestinians out so that the Arab armies would have a clear field of fire to eradicate (genocide) the Jew.  As long as the Palestinian continues to espouse hatred at the Jew (Sahih Muslim, Book 41, Number 6985), there will be no two-state solution.  And I think it has already gone past that.  It is going to be one or the other, not both and Israel has built up a very impressive society in just a short period of time.  Primarily because their culture is ancient.  The Palestinians have nothing.  And as long as a culture is based in hatred, it will never become anything.

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On 4/10/2019 at 11:35 AM, Gromdor said:

Bay of Pigs?

yup.

And it was wrongful, IMO.   Of course it failed because JFK yanked support out at the last minute.  In  the long run tho, glad we did not go in.  Another Korea.

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On 4/10/2019 at 12:48 PM, Phaeton80 said:


Sir, surely; the economic sanctions, freezing of billions in assets, OPEC lowering oil prices in coordination with POTUS.. surely you would recognize the stranglehold effect this has on an already bleeding economy. I never stated the USA is the soul source of the present troubles.. But to claim the US is innocent in all this is obviously, factually, rationally unsound.

I would be interested to see your reaction if your nation was in comparable economic downfall, and a foreign entity did what the US does to Vn now.. Id be inclined to bet you would be raging against such a foreign entity, and you would be right to do so.

This isnt about black & white, casting a 100% blame to anyone; Chavez/Maduro or the US. This is about the US engaging in the affairs of yet another foreign sovereign nation under the guise of altruism to gain certain geo strategical aspirations. This is about the US pulling the bad regime card to rationalise and capitalize on yet another intervention, again trampling on international law when it suits her.. (while still whining about a few Russian bots supposedly influencing US election). This is about the sheer unadulterated criminal hypocrisy that seeps through any- and every action she takes in the foreign policy landscape.. This is about OIL, nothing else.

 

You point out things that surely put a focus on the US. Fair enough.

I say the focus should be put on socialism, too, so that we learn once again how it can bring a country to rot.  So anyway, we have different aspects we wish to enhance and hold up for review. and maybe ion the long run, we are both correct for doing so.  maybe ;)

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On 4/10/2019 at 1:25 PM, Golden Duck said:

Asserting Guiado is the legitimate president is not respecting sovereignty. 

Golden, you may not like It but 50+ countries in the world do not recognize the election on Maduro as the leaser. They are still sovereign

 

On 4/10/2019 at 1:25 PM, Golden Duck said:

Have you got a source?

one example:  "Amid continuing economic turmoil, Venezuela skipped heating oil contributions to an energy assistance program based in Massachusetts for a second consecutive winter, imperiling the popular program."

boston globe link

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This article is about a week old but it is rather interesting, apparently what started as a fringe movement in the Venezuelan National Assembly to call for foreign military intervention has been growing steadily.  Interesting in the Venezuelan constitution the National Assembly has the authority to call for foreign nations to conduct military operations within Venezuela.

https://www.foreignaffairs.com/articles/venezuela/2019-04-17/will-guaido-call-us-military-intervention

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5 hours ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

Golden, you may not like It but 50+ countries in the world do not recognize the election on Maduro as the leaser. They are still sovereign

 

one example:  "Amid continuing economic turmoil, Venezuela skipped heating oil contributions to an energy assistance program based in Massachusetts for a second consecutive winter, imperiling the popular program."

boston globe link

Surprise, surprise! Those 50 have a history of of not jeopardising military aid. If you look a little deeper it's clear Guido's party tried their best to disrupt the elections.

In the Joe-for-oil issue - you're criticising Chavez for giving charity to poverty stricken US citizens? What point are your trying to make here? 

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5 hours ago, Golden Duck said:

Surprise, surprise! Those 50 have a history of of not jeopardising military aid. If you look a little deeper it's clear Guido's party tried their best to disrupt the elections.

So, it is your opinion that A)  Maduro *really* won the election, and B] 50+ nations are all just so wrong!  And of course, you can KEEP your unsubstantiated opinions.

Quote

In the Joe-for-oil issue - you're criticising Chavez for giving charity to poverty stricken US citizens? What point are your trying to make here? 

The point I am trying to make  is, if your own people need your country's resources, do NOT give them away to other people in less need just so you can show how nice aa guy you are.

Done busting my ballz yet?

Edited by Earl.Of.Trumps
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15 hours ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

You point out things that surely put a focus on the US. Fair enough.

I say the focus should be put on socialism, too, so that we learn once again how it can bring a country to rot.  So anyway, we have different aspects we wish to enhance and hold up for review. and maybe ion the long run, we are both correct for doing so.  maybe ;)


That isnt socialism, its bad management within the confines of a partly socialist system of government. My nation is partly socialist, that doesnt mean were going thesame course; although I could probably sum up an impressive list of money squandering within the socialist aspects of our society. Ive observed a trend here which increasingly labels socialism as an inherently bad thing. It isnt, just like capitalism isnt an inherently good thing. It stands or falls based on the decisions made by those in the political seat, wether its socialism or capitalism, left or right, liberal or conservative.

Ofcourse you are correct in pointing out the errs made within the socialistic Bolivar government. But I hope you'd agree there's a considerable difference between a nation making some unwise decisions, compared to full blown economic warfare from abroad. There are countless non Western nations that have made similar mistakes, even exponentially worse; these are not sanctioned like Venezuela has been and is.. There are countless of non Western nations with 'tyrants' or 'regimes' Maduro('s) pales to in comparison, these nations are not sanctioned like Venezuela has been and is.. not by a long shot.

So based on these apparant double measures (logically reconciled based on the fact this nation (Venezuela) has one of the biggest oil reserves in the world), in combination with obvious propaganda against Maduro demonizing him, selectively disregarding international law, as well as the fact this pattern is observed (selective demonization of the HoS which is used to rationalize economic and/or military intervention) in numerous 'US intervention' instances in the 21st century.. this can thus safely be categorised as yet another attempt at (malicious) statecraft with the soul intent to reap the fruits for own advantage (over the backs of the local population, under the guise of humanitarianism). This is, at the very least, extremely laudible, ethically unacceptable, morally deplorable.

If the US didnt just finish its ME campaign leaving that region in utter dismay, the wholesale destruction of the infra- as well as social structure, resulting in proof of self enrichment, proof of the altruistic motive being complete BS, as well as resulting in the exact opposite of the aspired goal (this region has never been a more apt terrorist breedingground), I probably wouldnt stand so critical in this context..

But she did, and I am. The US has become a rogue empire, it has shed all delusions of civility, ethics, morals, all feigns of being defenders of the rule of law. Your nation has been growing up side down for some time now, I think we are witnessing the last rows into full blown inversion. And as much as I used to love the USA, and all she stood for; no more.

Apologies for the slab of text, Im having one of those days again (where thoughts are hard to put into words). :D

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6 hours ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

So, it is your opinion that A)  Maduro *really* won the election, and B] 50+ nations are all just so wrong!  And of course, you can KEEP your unsubstantiated opinions.

How do you denounce an election is rigged before it is held? 

Maduro and Falcon asked for independent observers from the UN.

https://www.apnews.com/457e41bc296943b69a58b3506b1752ee

Guaido's party wanted everything hidden.

Remember how SUBSTANTIATED the WMD story was?

6 hours ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

The point I am trying to make  is, if your own people need your country's resources, do NOT give them away to other people in less need just so you can show how nice aa guy you are.

Done busting my ballz yet?

Maduro stopped the foreign aid in 2014.  Kind of what you're suggesting five years later.  But your assertion was that Maduro gave away the oil to help emigrees.  You still haven't substantiated that. 

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1 hour ago, Golden Duck said:

and How do you denounce an election is rigged before it is held? 

Maduro and Falcon asked for independent observers from the UN.

https://www.apnews.com/457e41bc296943b69a58b3506b1752ee

Guaido's party wanted everything hidden.

This is from YOUR link, duck:   "Officials loyal to Maduro have banned the largest opposition parties from participating and the most popular opposition candidates are imprisoned or in exile."

Do I need to see any more, Duck...?   NYET!!!

And YES, Duck, the election was PROPERLY denounced as rigged before it was held and if you can't see why exiling and imprisoning the most popular opposition candidates is rigging the election BEFOREHAND, then I'll just chalk it up to you being you.

Quote

Remember how SUBSTANTIATED the WMD story was?

Maduro stopped the foreign aid in 2014.  Kind of what you're suggesting five years later.  But your assertion was that Maduro gave away the oil to help emigrees.  You still haven't substantiated that. 

No, and I won't try to, either.   Maduro and Chavez  gave away Vn resources while their own people go hungry... that's TREASON!

Edited by Earl.Of.Trumps
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1 hour ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

This is from YOUR link, duck:   "Officials loyal to Maduro have banned the largest opposition parties from participating and the most popular opposition candidates are imprisoned or in exile."

Do I need to see any more, Duck...?   NYET!!!

And YES, Duck, the election was PROPERLY denounced as rigged before it was held and if you can't see why exiling and imprisoning the most popular opposition candidates is rigging the election BEFOREHAND, then I'll just chalk it up to you being you.

No, and I won't try to, either.   Maduro and Chavez  gave away Vn resources while their own people go hungry... that's TREASON!

And there we have you resorting to the ad hominem. These popular Popular Will candidates weren't even named in that link. That's a pretty big detail if you're really motivated by human rights.  I guess there's some other motivation.

And there's still no reason for the UN declining the invitation to observe the Venezuelan elections.

The chronology of J4O goes over your head. Maduro stops foreign aid to US poverty and he's guilty of giving aid and treason.  Text book non sequitur.

 

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5 hours ago, Golden Duck said:

And there we have you resorting to the ad hominem.

I AM NOT RESORTING TO AD HOMINEM

 

 These popular Popular Will candidates weren't even named in that link. That's a pretty big detail if you're really motivated by human rights.  I guess there's some other motivation.

And there's still no reason for the UN declining the invitation to observe the Venezuelan elections.

The chronology of J4O goes over your head. Maduro stops foreign aid to US poverty and he's guilty of giving aid and treason.  Text book non sequitur.

 

- Oh, I see, the Candidates weren't named in the link….???  OMG.OMG.OMG!!   That means the whole thing is a big lie!!!!  OMG!!!!     Duck, do you really think I am StOoPid enough to go fishing for those names for you??  When I get them, you'll just move the goal posts again.  And you know what, Duck...?  You could have looked those names up yourself if it was that important to you but you chose to make a big issue out it so that you can b'yotch about it. Keep walking that high road, Duck. 

- And now, just WHY should the UN observe this election if the Maduro cronies have already frauded the voters in Vn by not letting the best candidates run. AND YOU SIT HERE TAKING THEIR SIDE???  You are a piece of work.

I don't know about you, Duck, but I have seen more than enough of our sub thread. :td:

 

Edited by Earl.Of.Trumps
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12 minutes ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

- Oh, I see, the Candidates weren't named in the link….???  OMG.OMG.OMG!!   That means the whole thing is a big lie!!!!  OMG!!!!     Duck, do you really think I am StOoPid enough to go fishing for those names for you??  When I get them, you'll just move the goal posts again.  And you know what, Duck...?  You could have looked those names up yourself if it was that important to you but you chose to make a big issue out it so that you can b'yotch about it. Keep walking that high road, Duck. 

- And now, just WHY should the UN observe this election if the Maduro cronies have already frauded the voters in Vn by not letting the best candidates run. AND YOU SIT HERE TAKING THEIR SIDE???  You are a piece of work.

I don't know about you, Duck, but I have seen more than enough of our sub thread. :td:

 

"You being you" is clearly intended as an ad hominem.

You're firing from the hip again Trump. I know the names - I named their party. 

Name a party who said they don't have the best party. This another appeal to false authority by you.

The point is all these international sanctions allegedly because the human rights abuses and political prisoners.  People so important we can't even bother with their names.

Try standing some time. Maybe not so much will go over your head.

You should know that when you keep peddling fallacy you'll be called out.

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