Dark Energy Increasing Over Time?

[bison]

Dark Energy, which is believed to account for 68 percent of the energy in the universe, may have been increasing over a very long period of time. Up until now it has been widely believed to be constant. Astronomers used observations of very distant Quasars to obtain evidence of this increase. Dark Energy is an unknown sort of energy, which acts on matter as a repelling force. It appears to be responsible for the increasing rate of expansion of the universe.

 An article, linked below, provides more details:

https://www.space.com/43166-dark-energy-increasing-time-quasars.html 

[zep73]

This is actually consistent with an old theory of mine, that I called "bright energy".

The theory is simple. "Dark energy" is just photons. Their combined energy is what we call "dark energy".

They provide the universe with a lot of heat, and my theory is that, this heat makes the universal expansion accelerate.

[bison]

seanjo;   Yes, of course the scientific description of the universe is built up as we go along. The more we learn, the more 'clues' we have, the better, the more accurate the description. Quite serious, responsible scientists once believed any number of things we know today to be mistaken. The information to tell them otherwise simply didn't exist at one time. At any time, we must do the best we can with what we know, and always strive to learn more. 

Edited February 1, 2019 by bison

[bison]

Where dark matter, dark energy, and controlled nuclear fusion are concerned, we will know the answers, in the fullness of time. These new observations of Quasars are a  step in this process, where dark energy is concerned. A thing of importance is not accomplished easily or quickly. Ad Astra per Ardua. 

[zep73]

4 minutes ago, seanjo said:

I agree, In history, "Scientists" have mostly been wrong, especially "conservative" scientists. But despite that, inciteful Scientists and Engineers have improved our lives immeasurably and continue to do so thanks to Western culture, free markets and democracy...and dare I say it...conflict... But right now science is at an impasse; when dark matter and dark energy are mentioned, that's just code for 'we don't know'. I've heard of computing leaps forward for over a decade now...nothing, I've been hearing about fusion energy for 30 years...nothing...much. We are either due a leap or we are stagnant.

We only hear about the breakthroughs, because scientists wants to be sure before publishing. And when it comes to technology, there's the whole profit and secrecy thing.

You don't hear things, but that's not because nothing is going on. It's because there's reputation and money at stake. Trust me, a lot is going on!

[Dejarma]

quote from the article:

Quote

Scientists first proposed the existence of this invisible force two decades ago, to explain the surprising discovery that the universe's expansion is accelerating.

surprising?? is it not basic physics why the universe is expanding!? ya know= throw a stone into water & the ripples expand?

edit to add that i'm an idiot

yep= the acceleration of it.. my apologies 

Edited February 1, 2019 by Dejarma

[zep73]

17 minutes ago, Dejarma said:

quote from the article:

surprising?? is it not basic physics why the universe is expanding!? ya know= throw a stone into water & the ripples expand?

Not that simple. The newtonian laws we have on earth does not entirely apply to space.

We know that photons can provide propulsion with solar sails. I say that this propulsion can apply to the boundaries of our universe as well.

But that's not all. We know that particles pop in and out of existence all the time. Quantum fluctuation. My theory is that when photons hit those particles, they gain a Higgs field, and stay. Thus adding substance to the universe, and pushing the expansion.

Edited February 1, 2019 by sci-nerd

[Dejarma]

3 minutes ago, seanjo said:

Inertia from the big bang in a frictionless expanse?

that has always been my theory but this thread is suggesting something is accelerating it= who knows/ who cares!?

all i know is i've got a crap day tomorrow= accelerated growth of the universe or not

[Dejarma]

1 minute ago, seanjo said:

13.5 billion years is nothing in Universe time, the acceleration could be due to the big bang...

imo it is= then gravity can't hold it together & collapses creating the next big bang & it all starts again==== a cycle that's been going on infinitely 

[zep73]

2 minutes ago, seanjo said:

13.5 billion years is nothing in Universe time, the acceleration could be due to the big bang...

You don't think that has been considered? Of course it has!

By now, after 13.8 billion years it should have a momentum, not an increase.

[Dejarma]

1 minute ago, sci-nerd said:

You don't think that has been considered? Of course it has!

By now, after 13.8 billion years it should have a momentum, not an increase.

where did @seanjo suggest it hasn't? we're just reiterating 

[zep73]

1 minute ago, Dejarma said:

where did @seanjo suggest it hasn't? we're just reiterating 

11 minutes ago, seanjo said:

the acceleration could be due to the big bang

 

[Dejarma]

@sci-nerd oh yeah= i see your point   silly me

[bison]

The amount of expansion of the universe seems to be more than that provided by the Big Bang alone. The excess is thought to require an additional force, hence Dark Energy. I don't expect that astronomers would trouble to propose a whole new kind of energy, which they can't even explain, if it didn't seem entirely necessary.  

[Dejarma]

6 minutes ago, bison said:

The amount of expansion of the universe seems to be more than that provided by the Big Bang alone. The excess is thought to require an additional force, hence Dark Energy. I don't expect that astronomers would trouble to propose a whole new kind of energy, which they can't even explain, if it didn't seem entirely necessary.  

the basics:

if you throw a glass bottle from a 20 story building onto concrete below; what will happen to the bottle?

[bison]

It will break, and the pieces will fly apart, of course.

[Dejarma]

5 minutes ago, Dejarma said:

The amount of expansion of the universe seems to be more than that provided by the Big Bang alone.

seems to be??= interesting words, but you know what will happen to the bottle- as you said...

physics works exactly the same throughout the universe imo.. there are no strange things happening <IN MY OPINION> & of course it just an opinion

<seems to be> is put forward as a way to suggest there's something unknown/ weird & wonderful happening... this is what keeps places like this alive- & why not? 

[bison]

Dark energy, as an explanation for what we find, is still in its very early days. It is at the very edge of our knowledge. It appears to be the correct explanation, but it seems fitting, considering the circumstances, to adopt a careful tone. 

Those shards of broken glass will fly apart in a manner based on the energy of the bottle striking the concrete. If it was found that they flew farther apart than this energy could explain, we would be obliged to look for another force to explain the extra distance traveled. Perhaps there was a strong wind as the bottle shattered.

Then, too, the pieces would slow down as they traveled outward from the point of impact. If they sped up instead, an extra force would have to be posited. These considerations appear reasonably analogous to what we observe in the universe at large.  

Edited February 2, 2019 by bison

[lightly]

13 hours ago, seanjo said:

It's the gravitational pull from other Universes surrounding our Universe.

Interesting thought,   but it is space which is expanding ??  Does gravity pull space ?

when it comes to unknown forces possibly at play in space/universe  I always end up asking what keeps ,our moon for example, In a stable orbit when struck by what have ,observably, been very large objects/meteorites...  The only known forces at work in the orbit of an object around another are Gravity and Momentum...which would seem to me to be an extremely delicate balance ?   Why wouldn't a huge meteorite knock our moon Out of orbit ? ? ?

it seems like there must be some stabilizing ,shock observing, cushioning,  force at work helping objects stay in orbits.   ???

 

[Derek Willis]

24 minutes ago, lightly said:

Interesting thought,   but it is space which is expanding ??  Does gravity pull space ?

when it comes to unknown forces possibly at play in space/universe  I always end up asking what keeps ,our moon for example, In a stable orbit when struck by what have ,observably, been very large objects/meteorites...  The only known forces at work in the orbit of an object around another are Gravity and Momentum...which would seem to me to be an extremely delicate balance ?   Why wouldn't a huge meteorite knock our moon Out of orbit ? ? ?

it seems like there must be some stabilizing ,shock observing, cushioning,  force at work helping objects stay in orbits.   ???

 

The inertia of the meteorites that have hit the Moon were tiny compared to the inertia of the Moon. A bit like hitting an elephant with a peanut. A huge meteorite - i.e. with mass and velocity comparable to those of the Moon - would have an effect the Moon's orbit.

[lightly]

Ah,   Thank you Derek.    I just skimmed through the entire Wikipedia page on Inertia , etc....   .I think I understand a bit better now.

 

 

[lightly]

The expansion in this thread seems to have stopped....so, may I ask.....does gravity have an affect on/pull on  space ?    ETA.  Oya, "they" do say gravity can Bend space/ time.   I don't get it...I can see why gravity would bend light....which has substance ?  ? ?  Lol I'm lost !....so anyway..

Many seem to be comparing the "Big Bang" to a typical Explosion...with a shock wave traveling out from a center. 

But the inflation/expansion has no center.   The expansion is occurring at every point/center in the Universe.  !!  ?...which creates a cumulative effect we see as  Acceleration.     ?

Inflation would include the space in your living room or even within our cells,  It's just that Local forces hold things in thier places. ?

Another point is....the universe probably has no boundary ,as we understand boundaries... And is not expanding  into  anything.

What?.... Absolute NOTHING ?    .impossible.     There is no such thing as nothing.

 

 

 

Edited February 3, 2019 by lightly

[lightly]

Ok, more on topic....where does dark energy come from ?   Not to mention ,as no one has, dark energy ?

i was wondering about black holes taking energy/matter from our universe.   Where does that go ?  Just hang out at the event horizon forever...or what?    Could black holes be stars in adjacent universes?  (Probably not.?)

could black holes give back anything to this universe ?   ....like dark energy/matter ? ?

some of you smarter guys willing to enlighten the rest of us a bit ?

[SHaYap]

Depends if the universe accelerating the expansion to end up as a Big Chill or a Big Rip ... nobody is sure enough to know yet ... as far as I know, which is very little

~
 

[lightly]

It's said that dark energy is less dense than our more familiar energy,   and that it is Evenly distributed throughout All of space, even in vacuous space.  (I always knew "empty" space was composed of  . . .Something!"    

It's being compared to Einstein's ,and other's, Cosmological constant.

.....dark matter is an even weirder idea than dark energy!?