Doing God's will.

[Will Due]

 

Doing God's will (the will of the universe) does not take anything away from a person's free will. It only adds to it.

 

 

[danydandan]

5 minutes ago, Will Due said:

 

Doing God's will (the will of the universe) does not take anything away from a person's free will. It only adds to it.

 

 

Are you telling us or do you want to discuss your statement?

[Will Due]

2 minutes ago, danydandan said:

Are you telling us or do you want to discuss your statement?

 

What is God's will? It can be pretense to make believe it isn't knowable. 

Tell me how it changes your free will to seek and do God's will?

 

 

[zep73]

 

[Guyver]

11 minutes ago, Will Due said:

 

Doing God's will (the will of the universe) does not take anything away from a person's free will. It only adds to it.

It sounds like you believe that God and the universe are one and the same thing.  This differs from my belief in that I view the universe as an inanimate thing that contains living things.  Kind of like a pond.  A pond is not a living thing, but there is life inside it.  The pond doesn't give the living creatures anything aside from it's own existence because it's not self-aware and therefore doesn't actually exist at all in that sense.  

[Guyver]

14 minutes ago, Will Due said:

 

Doing God's will (the will of the universe) does not take anything away from a person's free will. It only adds to it.

How do you know what God's will is?

[Will Due]

8 minutes ago, Guyver said:

How do you know what God's will is?

 

Because God via the universe has provided me with a mind (just like everyone's) that's highly capable of determining what God's will is.

 

 

[danydandan]

16 minutes ago, Will Due said:

 

What is God's will? It can be pretense to make believe it isn't knowable. 

Tell me how it changes your free will to seek and do God's will?

 

 

First of all I believe you posted this in the wrong section. I believe it should be in the Religious and Spirituality section if you want to discuss this from a purely Spiritual perspective. But since it's posted in the sceptical section your opening statement leads you to make a number of assumption you can not provide evidence for.

1. What's God? 2. Is there a God? 3. Does God possess a Will? 4. Can God impose that Will? 5. Are God and the Universe a single entity? 6. Do use humans truly have free Will? 7. How or what can be added to or subtracted from it, if it exists? 8. How can we know we are subjected to God's will? 9. From a Christian perspective God created the Universe so did he create himself? 

Now your second post, well I can't answer them questions neither can anyone else. 

I suggest you repost this in the Spiritual and Religious section where sceptically minded people like myself won't question every aspect of your premise. 

 

Edited February 5, 2019 by danydandan

[Guyver]

1 minute ago, Will Due said:

 

Because God via the universe has provided me with a mind (just like everyone's) that's highly capable of determining what God's will is.

Thank you.  So, God's will exists in your mind then.  

[zep73]

Well, if the universe is God, and I am a part of the universe, I am a part of God, so that makes my will equal to God's will.

Basically I can't go wrong. And now that I've discovered my own divinity, I need to go make plans for world domination.

[danydandan]

Just now, sci-nerd said:

Well, if the universe is God, and I am a part of the universe, I am a part of God, so that makes my will equal to God's will.

Basically I can't go wrong. And now that I've discovered my own divinity, I need to go make plans for world domination.

Not if I'm planning MY world domination! 

[Guyver]

2 minutes ago, danydandan said:

First of all I believe you posted this in the wrong section. I believe it should be in the Religious and Spirituality section if you want to discuss this from a purely Spiritual perspective. But since it's posted in the sceptical section your opening statement leads you to make a number of assumption you can not provide evidence for.

1. What's God? 2. Is there a God? 3. Does God possess a Will? 4. Can God impose that Will? 5. Are God and the Universe a single entity? 6. Do use humans truly have free Will? 7. How or what can be added to or subtracted from it, if it exists? 

Now your second post, well I can't answer them questions neither can anyone else. 

I suggest you repost this in the Spiritual and Religious section where sceptically minded people like myself won't question every aspect of your premise. 

 

Yes.....but even if he moved it....it would be the same basic thing.  He (like any good debater) is going to have to define his terms.  It seems he views God and the universe as the same thing, but without the specifics, we're all just speculating.  I would be surprised if any two of us have the same idea about what or who God is.  

[Guyver]

3 minutes ago, sci-nerd said:

Well, if the universe is God, and I am a part of the universe, I am a part of God, so that makes my will equal to God's will.

Basically I can't go wrong. And now that I've discovered my own divinity, I need to go make plans for world domination.

Uh....that's not far off the mark from what many people (new agers) actually believe.  

[Will Due]

 

Nevermind.

 

 

[danydandan]

11 minutes ago, Guyver said:

Yes.....but even if he moved it....it would be the same basic thing.  He (like any good debater) is going to have to define his terms.  It seems he views God and the universe as the same thing, but without the specifics, we're all just speculating.  I would be surprised if any two of us have the same idea about what or who God is.  

Yes I agree the vagueness would still be questioned in either section. But in the religious section the premise would be accepted, and soley discussed from a spiritual perspective. I believe in this section my questions would be asked along with requests of objective and tangible evidence to support the initial premise. 

We all know the same thing about God. And that's absolutely nothing.

Edited February 5, 2019 by danydandan

[zep73]

11 minutes ago, Guyver said:

Uh....that's not far off the mark from what many people (new agers) actually believe.  

You're right. World domination is kinda limited, when there's a whole universe filled with billions of galaxies.

Gonna need a flying limo. A fast one. Maybe I should give Elon Musk a call.

[Will Due]

6 minutes ago, danydandan said:

We all know the same thing about God. And that's absolutely nothing.

 

Thinking everyone knows absolutely nothing about God might just be whole lot of pretense.

 

 

[danydandan]

6 minutes ago, Will Due said:

 

Thinking everyone knows absolutely nothing about God might just be whole lot of pretense.

 

 

How so.?

I don't think God's existence has been proven nor can it be proven that he/it/them has ever contacted anyone. So to say my comment is ' a whole lot of pretense' is erroneous. 

Edited February 5, 2019 by danydandan

[Will Due]

11 minutes ago, danydandan said:

How so.?

I don't think God's existence has been proven nor can it be proven that he/it/them has ever contacted anyone. So to say my comment is ' a whole lot of pretense' is erroneous. 

 

Anyone can pretend there isn't evidence for God's existence and that the business of living isn't exactly what the business of a toddler is.

To learn to do their Father's will. 

When a toddler pretends that he cannot learn it, the universe through its father let's it know who's in control.

 

 

Edited February 5, 2019 by Will Due

[Stubbly_Dooright]

53 minutes ago, Will Due said:

 

Doing God's will (the will of the universe) does not take anything away from a person's free will. It only adds to it.

And thus making a person with a very busy schedule. So it depends on what God's will is, right? 

And I'm going to assume you know how God sends the message that it is his will he wants you to perform, right? 

43 minutes ago, Will Due said:

50 minutes ago, danydandan said:

Are you telling us or do you want to discuss your statement?

 

What is God's will? It can be pretense to make believe it isn't knowable.

 

I'm going to assume telling us. 

Now, why would God make his will a pretense to make believe it isn't knowable. I mean, I would see that as a big waste of time. Why doesn't he just come out and say what it is? Saves time, wouldn't it? 

Why the pretense? That seems a bit.................... to me..................................... childish. 

Quote

Tell me how it changes your free will to seek and do God's will?

How would anyone would know, if there is no definite proof or sign that it's God's will.

32 minutes ago, Will Due said:

45 minutes ago, Guyver said:

How do you know what God's will is?

 

Because God via the universe has provided me with a mind (just like everyone's) that's highly capable of determining what God's will is.

 

How do you know for sure, your mind was provided by God? Where are the signs, that your mind is not just what happens to show up, along with everything else, biologically? 

 

29 minutes ago, Guyver said:

34 minutes ago, danydandan said:

First of all I believe you posted this in the wrong section. I believe it should be in the Religious and Spirituality section if you want to discuss this from a purely Spiritual perspective. But since it's posted in the sceptical section your opening statement leads you to make a number of assumption you can not provide evidence for.

1. What's God? 2. Is there a God? 3. Does God possess a Will? 4. Can God impose that Will? 5. Are God and the Universe a single entity? 6. Do use humans truly have free Will? 7. How or what can be added to or subtracted from it, if it exists? 

Now your second post, well I can't answer them questions neither can anyone else. 

I suggest you repost this in the Spiritual and Religious section where sceptically minded people like myself won't question every aspect of your premise. 

 

Yes.....but even if he moved it....it would be the same basic thing.  He (like any good debater) is going to have to define his terms.  It seems he views God and the universe as the same thing, but without the specifics, we're all just speculating.  I would be surprised if any two of us have the same idea about what or who God is.  

I had a large response in the other thread....................*ahem*   Anyways, I was trying this very thought of getting answers to why someone knows for sure of the message, and not assuming it's about the curiosity of one particular subjective experience. 

Anyhow, if it's God's will, I would think everyone would want to know for sure, in the objective sense, it actually is. I'm not saying this to judge and discourage singular individuals from that in their own time, I'm just voicing my opinion that those that don't believe a statement without clear cut evidence, is understandable. 

27 minutes ago, danydandan said:

Yes I agree the vagueness would still be questioned in either section.

Exactly my point. 

20 minutes ago, Will Due said:

28 minutes ago, danydandan said:

We all know the same thing about God. And that's absolutely nothing.

 

Thinking everyone knows absolutely nothing about God might just be whole lot of pretense.

Why pretend that?

[Stubbly_Dooright]

10 minutes ago, Will Due said:

15 minutes ago, danydandan said:

How so.?

I don't think God's existence has been proven nor can it be proven that he/it/them has ever contacted anyone. So to say my comment is ' a whole lot of pretense' is erroneous. 

 

Anyone can pretend there isn't evidence for God's existence and that the business of living isn't exactly what the business of a toddler is.

To learn to do their Father's will. 

When a toddler pretends that he cannot learn it, the universe through its father let's it know who's in control.

 

I'm finding quite a few wrongs here. (well, the way I see it) 

So, you think people pretend there is no evidence. How did you come to that conclusion? And why would people pretend evidence doesn't exist? It would make more sense, that there really isn't evidence of existence in the first place. Especially, if the description of said evidence is coming across vaguely. (I wonder if Captain Picard's vision of four lights would make a great example here....  ) 

And the use of the toddler and learning and assuming it's pretending................... I find that a worse example to use. A toddler doesn't have the experience and the mental function to assume it wants to pretend it can't learn from it's parents. Considering the parents are the first individuals in it's new and confusing world, it's more likely full blown wanting to learn from them. Unless, if they can't, due to biological factors, then it's not pretending, it's having trouble doing so. Probably, what could be a good learning example here, is that if you want someone to learn, you make it accessible to be learned. Meaning, don't be vague. 

Plus, 

Quote

Anyone can pretend there isn't evidence for God's existence and that the business of living isn't exactly what the business of a toddler is.

I think this line, adding the toddler into it at the end, seems to throw it off the point, since the toddler wasn't discussed at the beginning of the sentence. 

[Will Due]

6 minutes ago, Stubbly_Dooright said:

Now, why would God make his will a pretense to make believe it isn't knowable.

 

Stubbly, you have a habit of completely misunderstanding what I'm trying to say. 

God doesn't pretend.

People pretend they don't know how he wants them to behave. They pretend they don't know what God's will is for them. They pretend there isn't evidence for God's existence. Etc.

 

 

6 minutes ago, Stubbly_Dooright said:

Why pretend that?

 

You tell me. Because I'm having a hard time comprehending why anyone would pretend they don't know what God's will is for them to do.

 

 

[Will Due]

9 minutes ago, Stubbly_Dooright said:

Probably, what could be a good learning example here, is that if you want someone to learn, you make it accessible to be learned. Meaning, don't be vague. 

 

To me, the least vague thing of all is what God's will is for me to do.

It has never been vague. Even when I was a youngster. Even when I was an atheist.

God's will has always been the clearest thing for me to do. Difficult maybe, but not so much anymore. I get tired of ending up standing in the corner for pretending I didn't know what God's will was for me.

 

 

[Essan]

1 hour ago, Guyver said:

It sounds like you believe that God and the universe are one and the same thing.  This differs from my belief in that I view the universe as an inanimate thing that contains living things.  Kind of like a pond.  A pond is not a living thing, but there is life inside it.  The pond doesn't give the living creatures anything aside from it's own existence because it's not self-aware and therefore doesn't actually exist at all in that sense.  

Good analogy

[Essan]

12 minutes ago, Will Due said:

 

To me, the least vague thing of all is what God's will is for me to do.

It has never been vague. Even when I was a youngster. Even when I was an atheist.

God's will has always been the clearest thing for me to do. Difficult maybe, but not so much anymore. I get tired of ending up standing in the corner for pretending I didn't know what God's will was for me.

 

 

But what, in your opinion, is God's will?