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Jodie.Lynne

I don't believe you

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third_eye
11 hours ago, Piney said:

I just thought of something....What exactly would I do with my seminarian certificate?

Build a altar out of Lego, make my Satanist chick harem wear nun hats and start the "Church of Cute and Fluffy Murderous Chainsaw Bunnies"?  :o

 

 

......wait a minute.....:huh:

No... no....  please do continue, it has taken a rather intriguing turn, very interesting,  tell more about these Satanist chicks of yours and their Nun hats, anywhere else fluffy on them? 

~

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Desertrat56
14 hours ago, XenoFish said:

Compared to some of you, I have such a mediocre life.

Mediocre or sane?

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Desertrat56
12 hours ago, XenoFish said:

I wonder that in some cases another person beliefs "harm" us in some way. I don't mean all the time, but in certain cases and in certain ways. What is it about various beliefs that urk us so?

I know that the brain treats belief as fact. When a belief is challenged it creates a threat response. Which usually ends up in an argument about said belief. I know that beliefs typically have an emotional value. In the case of religious/spiritual beliefs it probably purely emotional. But why? Why hold onto a belief so firmly that anything that challenges it, is consider a violation?

We all saw what political beliefs can do in this thread. (Lets not repeat that okay)

So,  on  a forum where no one knows each other or interacts in person with anyone one else on the forum there is no way anyone's beliefs could "harm" another, however, face to face if one believes he is ordained by "god" to make sure his family members and extended family members do what he thinks is "god's will" and that punishing is his right there is a lot of harm.  Some of us have been abused in many ways by people claiming to be christian and so that word or any language indicating that is a trigger for knee jerk reactions, usually expressed by irrational anger.   I have faced that trigger but I often catch myself reacting when it seems like someone is judging in an unkind way another, based on illogical beliefs of any kind.  So, there can be "harm" in some beliefs.  The Salem witch trials is a very good example.  Another is the Ku Klux Klan hangings, the "random" killings of gay men in city alleys, convincing otherwise reasonable people that we have to go exterminate groups of people across the ocean in the interest of national security, etc.

Do you see that the word "harm" and beliefs triggered something for me?  If we pay attention to our triggers we can disarm them or at least express them in a way that no one can be offended unless they really really want to be offended.

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Desertrat56
12 hours ago, Piney said:

My beliefs changed as I learned new things, so I never understood this. I think it might be because I was taught early to question everything and not have blind faith. 

But people should still have a little bit of pragmatism and see facts but they don't, and I could never wrap that around my head. 

I was born questioning everything and as a child in a family that has secrets and addictions and extreme fear that is a dangerous way to grow up, but no one could stop me asking questions.  For a while before I left home I did try to keep quiet, but that doesn't work either.  There has to be balance and actual thought, reasoning out what makes sense and why.

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XenoFish

I wouldn't say they can't "harm" (more like offend) others. I've seen the politics section of this site. It has to be 10X worse than this area in regards to angry or upset people. 

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Piney
35 minutes ago, third_eye said:

No... no....  please do continue, it has taken a rather intriguing turn, very interesting,  tell more about these Satanist chicks of yours and their Nun hats, anywhere else fluffy on them? 

~

Well, why don't I turn "Saturday night sex and Lego with the Satanist chicks" Into a profitable church? :o

It would be far superior to those Falun Dafa freaks. :yes:

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Piney
49 minutes ago, Desertrat56 said:

I was born questioning everything and as a child in a family that has secrets and addictions and extreme fear that is a dangerous way to grow up, but no one could stop me asking questions.  For a while before I left home I did try to keep quiet, but that doesn't work either.  There has to be balance and actual thought, reasoning out what makes sense and why.

Well, I got a large dose of Japanese pragmatism from a stepfather and another dose from a non-theistic Quaker great aunt. Also my mother was a Newager who believed a lot of crap. I instinctively knew it was crap even when my shaman grandfather wasn't telling me it was crap. 

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Desertrat56
55 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

I wouldn't say they can't "harm" (more like offend) others. I've seen the politics section of this site. It has to be 10X worse than this area in regards to angry or upset people. 

Offense is taken, not given.

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lightly
12 hours ago, Hammerclaw said:

Only smart people think they're stupid. 

       OhOh,  I must be stupid then!   Cuz I always thought I was smart!    Damm

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XenoFish
34 minutes ago, Desertrat56 said:

Offense is taken, not given.

The ideas shared are given. 

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Desertrat56
41 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

The ideas shared are given. 

But they are not given to offend, usually, and even if so, the offense is still optional.

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Sherapy
Posted (edited)
9 hours ago, eight bits said:

You should think about why nastiness attracts you,

But the Walker phenomenon isn't a deep mystery. Much of what skeptics get out of the UM game is solving puzzles. Day in and day out are the short-form kibble puzzles: the errant camera straps, the ouija boards that ... well, anything with a ouija board. They're fun, but not a nourishing diet, and let's face it, when you've seen one orb, you really have seen 'em all.

In contrast, Mr Walker offers a Russian novel of woo. Where else can you find in the same thread God manifesting as truck headlights, the scoop on how slavery is an enlightened but misunderstood institution, why Eve didn't mind Adam throwing her under the bus, plus a tutorial on maximizing your tax advantage when making charitable gifts in Australia? There's nothing else like it on the whole web!

And while on other boards here at UM there is constant complaining about "drive-by" posters, Mr Walker has been at this for years and years. There's always something new - it looks like maybe we're going to have a gangster story arc sometime soon. All that, and he can prove that ten years ago he was sane.

What is rare is valued, and only a very few other posters have ever put half as much effort into playing the fox for us beagles to chase. I assume that from the foxy point of view, the fun is in making the beagles work (and that ultimately, we can't really bite).

You know this is BS; it couldn't possibly be anything but BS, BUT you can't prove that it's BS, so I win.

Or can we? And the game is on.

It's a sport, Habbie. You're at a football (soccer) match, and you're wondering "Why do all those folks in the red shirts want to kick the ball at the nice man in the blue shirt who's dancing in front of the net?"

It's fun. Fun for the folks in the red shirts, and I suspect fun for the nice man in the blue shirt, too. In all these years, he's only been scored upon twice. Prove him wrong about that.

Excellent post! 

Only you could have summed up the GOW ( Game of Walker) so eloquently. 

 

Edited by Sherapy
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Hammerclaw
1 hour ago, lightly said:

       OhOh,  I must be stupid then!   Cuz I always thought I was smart!    Damm

You're smart enough to know the difference. Don't take yourself so lightly.

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danydandan
4 hours ago, Hammerclaw said:

You're smart enough to know the difference. Don't take yourself so lightly.

Such low hanging fruit there Hammer. 

You went from the best comment ever made. The full stop one, to this. 

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Hammerclaw
4 minutes ago, danydandan said:

Such low hanging fruit there Hammer. 

You went from the best comment ever made. The full stop one, to this. 

Should I lighten up?

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Jodie.Lynne
5 hours ago, Desertrat56 said:

But they are not given to offend, usually, and even if so, the offense is still optional.

I kind of disagree here.

There are plenty of people who seem to go out of their way to either say, or demonstrate things that are designed to be offensive.

An easy example, the WBC. Do you think that they are unaware that their actions are offensive? Imagine that you were attending graveside services for a friend or loved one, and that group showed up to spew their invective at the attendees. Would you shrug nonchalantly and say "they have the right to their opinion"?

Back in the late '70's or early '80's, the KKK filed an application for a march and assembly in Skokie Illinois, a predominantly Jewish community. The organizers weren't locals, but decide that Skokie was the 'perfect' venue to vent their theories of 'racial superiority'. If I remember correctly, their application was turned down. Do you think that the klansmen weren't aware of how deliberately offensive they were trying to be?

And any time that someone begins a statement with the terms "With all due respect...", or "I don't mean to be offensive, but...", you know that what they are about to say will be either disrespectful, offensive, or both.

 

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Desertrat56
Posted (edited)
2 minutes ago, Jodie.Lynne said:

I kind of disagree here.

There are plenty of people who seem to go out of their way to either say, or demonstrate things that are designed to be offensive.

An easy example, the WBC. Do you think that they are unaware that their actions are offensive? Imagine that you were attending graveside services for a friend or loved one, and that group showed up to spew their invective at the attendees. Would you shrug nonchalantly and say "they have the right to their opinion"?

Back in the late '70's or early '80's, the KKK filed an application for a march and assembly in Skokie Illinois, a predominantly Jewish community. The organizers weren't locals, but decide that Skokie was the 'perfect' venue to vent their theories of 'racial superiority'. If I remember correctly, their application was turned down. Do you think that the klansmen weren't aware of how deliberately offensive they were trying to be?

And any time that someone begins a statement with the terms "With all due respect...", or "I don't mean to be offensive, but...", you know that what they are about to say will be either disrespectful, offensive, or both.

 

I am not talking about hate groups like you describe, I am talking about posters on this forum.  And of course if you have to start a sentence with "all due respect" or "I don't mean to be offensive" what follows may be questionable, OR "all due respect" could mean "I disagree and I am going to tell you whether you want me to or not" 

Edited by Desertrat56

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Jodie.Lynne
15 minutes ago, Desertrat56 said:

I am not talking about hate groups like you describe, I am talking about posters on this forum. 

Even here it happens. Just recently, in this very thread, where a poster deliberately 'flamebaited' the community, just to see the sparks fly.

Some posters, I truly believe, will state the most deliberately insulting comments, basically to get people upset. They may or may not, sincerely believe their position, but they like to cause a commotion.

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Desertrat56
9 minutes ago, Jodie.Lynne said:

Even here it happens. Just recently, in this very thread, where a poster deliberately 'flamebaited' the community, just to see the sparks fly.

Some posters, I truly believe, will state the most deliberately insulting comments, basically to get people upset. They may or may not, sincerely believe their position, but they like to cause a commotion.

And when you know that is the case, this is a forum, you can ignore it.  It's not like someone burning a cross on your lawn or picketing your loved one's funeral, it is an anonymous person trying to pick a fight.  There is no rational reason to rise to the bait.

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Jodie.Lynne
Just now, Desertrat56 said:

And when you know that is the case, this is a forum, you can ignore it.  It's not like someone burning a cross on your lawn or picketing your loved one's funeral, it is an anonymous person trying to pick a fight.  There is no rational reason to rise to the bait.

You seem to be trying to play both side of the volleyball net here....

First you disallow hate groups as an example, then you cite the very same examples.

And while it is true that we are all anonymous (more or less), does that mean that we shouldn't counter hateful or offensive comments?

If a poster made hateful, or ignorant statements regarding an ethic group, or political group, or any group, doesn't good moral behavior demand that we try to correct them?

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XenoFish
4 minutes ago, Desertrat56 said:

There is no rational reason to rise to the bait.

And yet people do. Even interaction on the internet bleed over into the real world. This virtual reality is still a social one.

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docyabut2

Gee all study all the religions and you will come to a right conclusion.

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XenoFish
Just now, docyabut2 said:

Gee all study all the religions and you will come to a right conclusion.

That every one of them is made up.

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Hammerclaw

Who gets to decide what is offensive?

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Desertrat56
Just now, Jodie.Lynne said:

You seem to be trying to play both side of the volleyball net here....

First you disallow hate groups as an example, then you cite the very same examples.

And while it is true that we are all anonymous (more or less), does that mean that we shouldn't counter hateful or offensive comments?

If a poster made hateful, or ignorant statements regarding an ethic group, or political group, or any group, doesn't good moral behavior demand that we try to correct them?

No, my original point is that a lot of stuff people are offended by are their choice.  I  know people try to purposely cause offense and when it is obvious that is their purpose then why take the bait.  And then there are those who are just ignorant and judgmental thinking they are speaking for everyone.  If it is going to fall on deaf ears, on a forum, why bother, just move on.  If it actually is in public, in person aimed at an individual of course I would speak up as I am sure you would.  If it is something that evokes anger in you and no one else seems to be bothered then one of two things is going on, 1. you are in the wrong group/hanging out with people you don't belong with, 2. your anger is based on some past unresolved anger.  You can't save the world by yourself and sometimes there is no saving someone from themselves.  And in an environment like this forum you have an opportunity to figure out what your triggers are and disarm them so that you have more peace in your life.

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