North Korean Defector Says Trump Played

[aztek]

4 minutes ago, Captain Risky said:

and?

that is all. no need for more, all crystal clear here,

[Gromdor]

1 hour ago, aztek said:

so you are so smart, educated, yet your accomplishment and worth are fraction of a fraction, of a percent compared to the guy, who is us president no less,    hmm, tell me more how stupid he is. lol it is  so hilarious coming from you, 

 

There is actually a very high probability that Trump has a negative net worth.  He is extremely leveraged and unless he were to disclose his financial information, we will never know for sure.  So it is quite possible that Captain Risky is wealthier than Trump. 

[aztek]

lol, sure, of course he is. 

[Unusual Tournament]

25 minutes ago, Gromdor said:

There is actually a very high probability that Trump has a negative net worth.  He is extremely leveraged and unless he were to disclose his financial information, we will never know for sure.  So it is quite possible that Captain Risky is wealthier than Trump. 

in your face Trump. 

[Farmer77]

Trump aides worry he’ll get outfoxed in North Korea talks

 

Quote

President Donald Trump is eagerly anticipating his second summit with Kim Jong Un, touting his “really meaningful” relationship with the North Korean strongman and insisting he’s ready to give up his nuclear arsenal.

In Washington, he’s pretty much the only one who feels that way.

Many, including several of the president’s top advisers, are less excited. Some have expressed trepidation not only that the summit, scheduled to take place next week in Hanoi, may not yield big results. They worry, too, that Trump, eager to declare victory on the world stage, could make big concessions in exchange for empty promises of denuclearization.

The push for a second summit came almost entirely from the president himself, according to current and former White House officials — but Trump remains undeterred.

 

[Black Red Devil]

I really don't understand how anyone can believe fatboy.  He can never discuss reconciliation or even worse, rejoin with South Korea, because as soon as North Koreans get a whiff of what a murderous dictator he is and how things work in the real world, they'll leave in droves.  The more rebellious will probably revolt against his regime and start a civil war. 

He has no other option than to continue to suppress, suppress and suppress and keep them living in a bubble, which also precludes him from joining the world community, improving economic conditions with trade partnerships etc.  For how long he can keep this going, who knows, but it's like he's living in a house of cards with only one trump card.  No, not the Trump card with a capital T..... his nukes.  So why would he give up the only thing going for him?

[Farmer77]

10 minutes ago, Black Red Devil said:

I really don't understand how anyone can believe fatboy.  He can never discuss reconciliation or even worse, rejoin with South Korea, because as soon as North Koreans get a whiff of what a murderous dictator he is and how things work in the real world, they'll leave in droves.  The more rebellious will probably revolt against his regime and start a civil war. 

He has no other option than to continue to suppress, suppress and suppress and keep them living in a bubble, which also precludes him from joining the world community, improving economic conditions with trade partnerships etc.  For how long he can keep this going, who knows, but it's like he's living in a house of cards with only one trump card.  No, not the Trump card with a capital T..... his nukes.  So why would he give up the only thing going for him?

Very well said.

 

[Raptor Witness]

Trump knows he’s being played.

Handling Kim as an equal changes the odds of an eventual breakthrough.

I give Trump an A on this. The status quo wasn’t working.

[Tatetopa]

On 2/21/2019 at 6:14 PM, Big Jim said:

It's sad that you have more faith in a N. Korean defector than you do in your own President.

Sorry, where does the President come into this?  It is about Kim and a defector that was in the North Korean government.  Why do you make everything about President Trump.  This guy  is saying that the North Korean government may not be negotiating in good faith. I fail to see based on North Korea's history why that is so hard to believe.  And I fail to see why that is some sort of insult to the President.  Get a grip.  You can believe in the President and still accept the reality that North Korea is trying to survive and get the sanctions lifted by any means possible including deception.

[Tatetopa]

22 hours ago, Big Jim said:

One defector, who obviously has his own axe to grind, hardly represents "the Korean mindset".   He's a traitor to his country and can't be trusted to have an objective point of view about his country or ours.

You might find it interesting to read the views of other defectors.  Of course it may be a utopian shangri-la but the numerous defectors paint a picture of a starving repressed people under three generations of the same family.  I would not go so far as to say they cannot be trusted when they tell what their lives and conditions were like.  Are you a traitor to your country when you escape a repressive regime or is the country a traitor to ts citizens?

[Tatetopa]

9 hours ago, aztek said:

but you have a point, i should have said how much are you worth, so how much? what have you accomplished in your life?

Well I guess El Chapo with a net worth of 15 billion must be 3 times the man Donald Trump is if that is how you measure things.

 

[Big Jim]

7 hours ago, Tatetopa said:

Sorry, where does the President come into this?  It is about Kim and a defector that was in the North Korean government.  Why do you make everything about President Trump.  This guy  is saying that the North Korean government may not be negotiating in good faith. I fail to see based on North Korea's history why that is so hard to believe.  And I fail to see why that is some sort of insult to the President.  Get a grip.  You can believe in the President and still accept the reality that North Korea is trying to survive and get the sanctions lifted by any means possible including deception.

I didn't make this about Trump, the OP did.  The title is the first clue "North Korean defector says Trump played."  He follows it up a few posts later with "I post entirely too much anti Trump stuff to expect anyone to think my post was anything but a hit. "

[Big Jim]

7 hours ago, Tatetopa said:

You might find it interesting to read the views of other defectors.  Of course it may be a utopian shangri-la but the numerous defectors paint a picture of a starving repressed people under three generations of the same family.  I would not go so far as to say they cannot be trusted when they tell what their lives and conditions were like.  Are you a traitor to your country when you escape a repressive regime or is the country a traitor to ts citizens?

This topic isn't about what he said about living conditions but what he claimed to know about private meetings between the two leaders and their personal motivations in the negotiations, two things he couldn't possibly know.

[Gromdor]

7 minutes ago, Big Jim said:

This topic isn't about what he said about living conditions but what he claimed to know about private meetings between the two leaders and their personal motivations in the negotiations, two things he couldn't possibly know.

He's a high ranking, career, North Korean Diplomat isn't he?

[Big Jim]

2 hours ago, Gromdor said:

He's a high ranking, career, North Korean Diplomat isn't he?

That's what it says.  It doesn't say he was in the room with the two leaders during negotiations or that he was the confessor or confidant of Kim Jong-Un.  Would it surprise anyone to find that Jong-Un tells his subjects one thing and President Trump something different?

[Tatetopa]

3 hours ago, Big Jim said:

I didn't make this about Trump, the OP did.  The title is the first clue "North Korean defector says Trump played."  He follows it up a few posts later with "I post entirely too much anti Trump stuff to expect anyone to think my post was anything but a hit. "

OK, I read the posts again.  Still, I am not going to blame President Trump for the North Korean regime being desperate and using any trick they can to hold on to power.

Other people have said it, the NK government would crumble if the barrier between north and south were removed.  It is not in Kim's interest to open his border.  He wants sanctions removed to bring in materials and food to placate his people and stay in power.  He holds the nuclear threat as the only thing he has got that would prevent all other nations in the world from cutting off relations and just leaving him to his fate.  Why would he give it up?   Kim may have to die of old age without an heir or obvious successor for much to change.

Somebody else mentioned parasites in the defector's stomach.  (A different defector I believe)  How do you get in such bad shape except with limited food and no medical care?  What does that tell you about a country when even its soldiers are malnourished?.  What does it tell you when the soldier defector shot by his comrades said they had to do it or their families would have suffered?  What does it tell you when North Korean defectors  in China think it is a material paradise with plenty of food and amazing consumer goods they have never had access to at home?

 

 

[AstralHorus]

Isn’t this what always happens though? NK thumps it’s chest and makes empty threats, we threaten them and send them aid, and they quiet down while pretending to close their sites? 

[Farmer77]

7 hours ago, AstralHorus said:

Isn’t this what always happens though? NK thumps it’s chest and makes empty threats, we threaten them and send them aid, and they quiet down while pretending to close their sites? 

Yeah but the difference this time is Trump sat down with Kim which only helps Kim become further entrenched as the great leader who brought the US to the negotiating table through his noble defiance of the evil Americans.

Its certainly debatable how much at home propaganda truly helps a third generation tyrant but its something we as a nation have strove to avoid in the past.

[Space Commander Travis]

3 hours ago, Farmer77 said:

Yeah but the difference this time is Trump sat down with Kim which only helps Kim become further entrenched as the great leader who brought the US to the negotiating table through his noble defiance of the evil Americans.

Its certainly debatable how much at home propaganda truly helps a third generation tyrant but its something we as a nation have strove to avoid in the past.

so you're against any kind of peace overtures that does anything other than completely crush the enemy and leave their country a smoking wasteland? That's a little vindictive approach isn't it?

[Space Commander Travis]

Or is it just if any kind of peace overtures involve the Hated Tyrant (Trump, that is), and if there might be any prospect of anything coming out of it that might reflect positively on him ? 

[Farmer77]

Just now, Vlad the Mighty said:

so you're against any kind of peace overtures that does anything other than completely crush the enemy and leave their country a smoking wasteland? That's a little vindictive approach isn't it?

No not at all. I actually was in favor of Trump sitting down with lil kim when he first floated the idea, hell I thought it was a good idea when Obama got slaughtered by the foxnews crowd for suggesting it in '08. Doing so however ups the ante quite a bit and I think we'd be foolish to ignore that in favor of political "wins". 

This second summit I am not personally in favor of. Kim is clearly "negotiating" in bad faith and, well I know youre gonna hate me for saying it but, considering his other outright rejections of our intelligence community  we should all be asking if Trump is there negotiating for the best case scenario for America, for Trump or for Russia.

[Space Commander Travis]

I think Russia would far prefer to see a stable Korea, whether or not it's still divided into two, that would relieve them of the concern of a potential flashpoint on their far eastern border. Just the same as China would. Such a thing would surely also be of benefit to the world as a whole. But I suppose in your world of conspiracy anything Russia might think beneficial would automatically be part of Putin's Plot to Rule the World, and so must be resisted by military force if necessary.  

[Space Commander Travis]

On 23/02/2019 at 5:16 AM, Black Red Devil said:

I really don't understand how anyone can believe fatboy.  He can never discuss reconciliation or even worse, rejoin with South Korea, because as soon as North Koreans get a whiff of what a murderous dictator he is and how things work in the real world, they'll leave in droves.

but enough about Trump, what do you think their view of Kim Whatever his name is would be?  

[bee]

17 minutes ago, Vlad the Mighty said:

Or is it just if any kind of peace overtures involve the Hated Tyrant (Trump, that is), and if there might be any prospect of anything coming out of it that might reflect positively on him ? 

 

in a nut shell..... ^^^

The MSM were enjoying themselves scaring everyone half to death with the Nuclear Threat
and North Korea until Trump spoiled it all and calmed it all down...

It obviously drove his detractors nuts - so they bided their time and are now dragging it all up again
with a new negative twist.. 

 

 

 

[Farmer77]

20 minutes ago, Vlad the Mighty said:

I think Russia would far prefer to see a stable Korea, whether or not it's still divided into two, that would relieve them of the concern of a potential flashpoint on their far eastern border. Just the same as China would. Such a thing would surely also be of benefit to the world as a whole. But I suppose in your world of conspiracy anything Russia might think beneficial would automatically be part of Putin's Plot to Rule the World, and so must be resisted by military force if necessary.  

Nah see you seem to always be overlooking he subtle arts of statecraft and spycraft. I would argue that a USA that appears to side against its allies at every turn, that a USA who is no longer trusted by her allies, has been a massive and growing boon for Russia. So it doesn't even take anything major happening for this summit to be a win for them and a loss for us, just a few carefully crafted phrases which further alienate and buillds distrust with our traditional western allies.