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the13bats

What goes around comes around, karma?

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the13bats

In case you dont know my stance im a pseudoskeptic, i want to believe but need Proof.

So ive been up too long and my days and nights sleep is off, i am all ADD OCD, and had a bad experence today which set off my nerves so i run to burn it off making a post because my overtired mind is so racy.

My grandmother was superstitious to a degree, i was raised by her and she while was a bit vauge she tried to tell me not ever to get very mad at a person, let things go because all her life she saw people who wronged her have really bad stuff happen to them, i did and do write it off as coincidence.

She passed in her early 90s in 90s but of course i remember her daily, and many people i have talked to really will push the idea of what many people label "karma" although i do not believe my gmother even knew the word,

so ive noticed a lot of people more than i would have thought do subscribe to the idea if someone does them wrong or anyone wrong they will get what they deserve, where does this idea generate from?

Sure i have had people wrong me and seen bad happen to them but ive seen people wrong me or just bad in general live charmed lives. Personally i dont want anyone to come to harm not my way, i am curious though why some people really believe what goes around comes back on you, i just dont see it.

Edited by the13bats
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Piney

I don't either. Although the Universe does try to "maintain balance" at a certain level, thieves and liars prosper and no good deed goes unpunished. 

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sci-nerd

The simulation conjecture (better known by the incorrect term "hypothesis") can actually explain "karma" and why a$$holes seems to thrive.

I will not dive into any details, but I can reveal that it's not about right and wrong, but about attitude and determination by the individual and society as a whole.

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Piney
7 minutes ago, sci-nerd said:

The simulation conjecture (better known by the incorrect term "hypothesis") can actually explain "karma" and why a$$holes seems to thrive.

 

"Kinda @#$%ed up how people who lie are loved and people who tell the truth are hated"- Tupac Shakur

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sci-nerd
1 minute ago, Piney said:

"Kinda @#$%ed up how people who lie are loved and people who tell the truth are hated"- Tupac Shakur

The truth is almost always ugly. And people hate ugly. If you want people's love, tell them what they want to hear!

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travelnjones

Looking at this world and coming up with the concept of Karma is crazy.  Wishing for it, I understand, but not looking how things go and suggesting Karma is taking place.  

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the13bats
16 minutes ago, sci-nerd said:

The simulation conjecture (better known by the incorrect term "hypothesis") can actually explain "karma" and why a$$holes seems to thrive.

I will not dive into any details, but I can reveal that it's not about right and wrong, but about attitude and determination by the individual and society as a whole.

You might be on to something because it would seem the people who rate highest on my uncool list are the most ego driven self righteous only see it their way types.

 

Travelnjones,

I wish i had of had deeper discussions with my gmother why she did firmly believe it,

Perhaps her way of thinking she won over the wrongdoer. But i would have loved to have her explain then why some who wronged her lived charmed lives,

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Coil
48 minutes ago, the13bats said:

Sure i have had people wrong me and seen bad happen to them but ive seen people wrong me or just bad in general live charmed lives. Personally i dont want anyone to come to harm not my way, i am curious though why some people really believe what goes around comes back on you, i just dont see it.


If you think that karma is an inexorable mechanical law of retribution, then it is not. This is just an action and the results of this action. For example, you learn something and want to master it and without karma as an action and result, it would be impossible for a person to learn, to develop and progress in general in evolution in the universe.
Karma or fate can be changed if you radically change your views on life, habits, beliefs, actions but not immediately karma changes the old will prevail over you for a while until it is exhausted. Therefore, karma is a flexible law of action, you change and change karma.

And the fact that the man returns what he did, how else? If you plant a tree, a tree will grow if you plant a weed, then a weed will grow, so if a person does a bad thing, then it returns to him.

 

 

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aztek
1 hour ago, the13bats said:

 

so ive noticed a lot of people more than i would have thought do subscribe to the idea if someone does them wrong or anyone wrong they will get what they deserve, where does this idea generate from?

 

from desperation and helplessness,

Edited by aztek
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the13bats

Coil while i like the band of your screen name i think you lost what i was pondering,

Quote

 if a person does a bad thing, then it returns to him.

No, it doesnt always.

The concept some call "karma" or reap what you sow, or goes around comes around, however its worded some hold fast to it but its flawed, very flawed.

As i typed this i believe aztek nailed it

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justin3651
32 minutes ago, the13bats said:

But i would have loved to have her explain then why some who wronged her lived charmed lives

Hypothetically, the higher up you are the further you have to fall and the more you have to lose maybe. My mom believes something similar.  To give an example, on South park the worst of the boys, Eric cartmen, is given 1 million dollars from a will while the nicest boy kyle gets horrible painful infected hemorrhoids . Eric uses the money he got to buy a theme park, his ultimate dream while Kyle nearly dies. In the end though Eric loses his park in a deserved cruel trick of fate and is more miserable than he's ever been before since he'd had so much and lost it.

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Coil
14 minutes ago, the13bats said:

No, it doesnt always.

 
Roughly speaking, since a person does different actions, bad and good, he has a mixed action of karma and not uniquely always bad or good.
 
Also, various tests are being adjusted on a person that he has planned before being embodied in the body and a person born about them will not even know.
 
 
 
Edited by Coil

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Goddess of the Mist

Hmmmm.....I don't know - I've seen karma in action so I have to say I think it's a real thing. To me, if you're living right, treating others right, and trying to be a good person, then good things will come back to you. I know that sometimes it seems like bad people are the fortunate ones, but we may not see every aspect of their lives. Things may not be going so great for them, on some other level that we don't see. Or, maybe they just haven't gotten what's coming... yet. 

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Essan

It's nice to think that karma happens.   In my life, a number of people who have done me wrong have ended up in a bad place themselves, recently one ended up in hospital a few days later and was very lucky to live; some years ago one ended up in prison (on a different matter) where he committed suicide.  But would these things have happened to them had they not done me wrong?  Almost certainly yes.  

And for every time someone does a good deed and in return have something good happen to them, how many do not?  Most.

It;s just perception,   Much as I'd like to believe otherwise.

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freetoroam
2 hours ago, the13bats said:

she saw people who wronged her have really bad stuff happen to them, i did and do write it off as coincidence.

Not just coincidence, but for many inevitable. 

We live in a world where we thrive for goodness, those who wrong others stand out and  are a mar. 

Generally, unless it is absolurely personal against a person for a reason, those who do wrong, 'are' wrongens.

Criminals do wrong and chances are they will get caught, likewise if someone does bad things to others because that is the kind of person they are, eventually someone will put a stop to them.

People who think they can get away with doing wrong to others will eventually have their come uppance, this will be because of their complacency and others finally having enough and doing something about it.

Call it karma Or call it justice? 

 

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Podo

The idea of Karma is a very nice one, but I think it only makes sense if you look at life as a series of reincarnations, like the Hindus and Buddhists do. If you accept that Karma resolves itself on the scale of innumerable LIFETIMES in an eternal cycle, then it can make sense because the clear untruth of "what goes around comes around" is apparent to anyone with basic pattern recognition. It's easy to handwave the observable reality if you expect things to even out next time around.

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joc

Karma...the myth, the man, the legend.

It's no different than any other cockamamy belief out there.  All originated in the same manner...asking the question...where did we come from and why are we so screwed up!?

 

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Guyver

I think the idea of karma has to do with catching it in the next life if you slip by it in this one.  Colloquially, we tend to think of it as recompense in this life for what you’re doing.  Sometimes that happens and sometimes it doesn’t.

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Coil


Without karma can not do in any way:
 

The power, or the energy of formation of Being, turns into a universal action, Karma, predetermined in the spirit. All creation is Karma, the action of primordial nature.

It is quite obvious that we must discard and forget the widespread theory of Karma, with its simple attempts to explain the development of the Cosmic Spirit, identifying them in a primitive way with human notions of law and justice, encouragement and punishment that are so dear to our surface intelligence. The basis of the actions of Nature is largely the original spiritual Truth, and to a much lesser extent, the activity of Nature is a mechanical predictable movement. There is no place in Nature for the limited and rigid laws of morality to which people are so strongly tied, just as there is no blind and cruel wheel of cosmic justice, acting in the image and likeness of ignorant judgments of man, his earthly desires and instincts. There is nothing artificial in our world; on the contrary, it is based on a spiritual principle that corresponds to the true and hidden intentions of Nature. The process of the ascent of the human soul from the subconscious world of matter to the shining divine heights itself determines the permissible norms and constantly expands the established law, or, in other words, the truth of Karma, since the law is a concept that is too mechanistic ... Therefore, it would be more accurate to define Karma not as Law, but as a multilateral, dynamically manifested truth of action and life, as an infinite movement organically woven into our world.

 

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the13bats

Perhaps i never should have included "karma" i was using it as a label of what i gathered it means to people who seem to believe strongly what goes around comes around, and that is karma, i wasnt talking in the Buddhist sense or definition or reincarnation.

While i still believe aztek nailed it on the being done wrong side, i see the positive side a bit ego driven many times, saying ive done right by others and my good rewards flowed...are you boasting? Or suggesting you only did right to others for reward or out of fear?

I do right by others not to brag and not expecting it to boomerang i do it because to me it is "right".

I made the thread really to see if anyone would jump in with a closed mindset like my gmother had, no one really seems to seems most people so far more or less look at it as i do.

 

 

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papageorge1
3 hours ago, the13bats said:

In case you dont know my stance im a pseudoskeptic, i want to believe but need Proof.

 

Just a terminology thing: you are describing yourself as a skeptic that would prefer to believe.

A pseudo-skeptic is one who claims to be a skeptic (which is a respected method for determining the truth) but in reality is simply anti-paranormal.

3 hours ago, the13bats said:

 

So ive been up too long and my days and nights sleep is off, i am all ADD OCD, and had a bad experence today which set off my nerves so i run to burn it off making a post because my overtired mind is so racy.

My grandmother was superstitious to a degree, i was raised by her and she while was a bit vauge she tried to tell me not ever to get very mad at a person, let things go because all her life she saw people who wronged her have really bad stuff happen to them, i did and do write it off as coincidence.

She passed in her early 90s in 90s but of course i remember her daily, and many people i have talked to really will push the idea of what many people label "karma" although i do not believe my gmother even knew the word,

so ive noticed a lot of people more than i would have thought do subscribe to the idea if someone does them wrong or anyone wrong they will get what they deserve, where does this idea generate from?

Sure i have had people wrong me and seen bad happen to them but ive seen people wrong me or just bad in general live charmed lives. Personally i dont want anyone to come to harm not my way, i am curious though why some people really believe what goes around comes back on you, i just dont see it.

I personally believe in karma but it is not the simple 'what goes around comes around' concept it is often reduced to. I think karma works as a learning and corrective process in which by engaging in certain good/bad behavior one creates a chain reaction of more of the same. The process may extend over multiple lifetimes such that things happen in this lifetime for which we can't discern the cause.

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the13bats

George,  like i said, i wasnt talking karma in the Buddhist sense, but thanks.

As far as describing what kind of skeptic i am i know me better than you do, and you missed that by more than a few degrees...

Oh, i think someone posted a cigarette exhale...go call it 78% likely paranormal.

 

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papageorge1
28 minutes ago, the13bats said:

 

As far as describing what kind of skeptic i am i know me better than you do, and you missed that by more than a few degrees...

 

 

I was simply explaining that you misunderstood a word's definition. But you are free to carry on in your …...er, word choices

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and then

The greatest revenge is forgiveness.

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the13bats

The prefix pseudo- is used to mark something that superficially appears to be one thing, but is something else.

 

skep·tic
/ˈskeptik/
noun

    a person inclined to question or doubt accepted opinions.

 

Now run sling George a mist needs your attention

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