Luca-RoseElsie-Raemom1921 Posted March 17, 2019 #101 Share Posted March 17, 2019 Just now, Aquila King said: I'd like to know what all the 4 year olds sold into sex slavery for the rest of their lives did to deserve it. EXACTLY what I’m on about or even a baby the most innocent being. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aquila King Posted March 17, 2019 #102 Share Posted March 17, 2019 1 minute ago, Ruby04 said: EXACTLY what I’m on about or even a baby the most innocent being. I just don't subscribe to the philosophy that this world is naturally or inherently inclined towards fairness, justice, equality, etc. You can't just assume it exists. You have to actually make this world fair and just, etc. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Walker Posted March 17, 2019 #103 Share Posted March 17, 2019 (edited) 6 hours ago, Ruby04 said: 90% get what they deserve? Ok so people who constantly have crap or abusive relationships deserve them? Or those of us who finally start having things go well then have crap happen deserve it? Those of of us who don’t cheat, steal, try to not harm others and avoid lying deserve it? If you do NOT do the things in your last sentence then your life will be much better than person who DOES cheat steal and harm others Yep, like it or not, the law of natural consequence means that almost everyone almost all the time lives the life they "deserve " Deserve may be the wrong word. I don't mean it in a judgemental way, but a logical way. ALL our actions and even our thoughts create consequences for every human being Why is a person in an abusive relationship why haven't they chosen to end it or to do something about it (and yes i know that such decisions may come at a high cost, but they are still available You cant do much if you are kidnapped by the lords army and forced to be child soldier but even there you do have choices I dont know why crap happens to you, In my life, every bad thing has been the result of a certain bad decision or set of bad decisions Eg we chose to live in a remote farm home for 20 years because we loved the isolation and lifestyle, We knew there was a small risk of bushfire, one having swept around the house in the late 1970s We lived there, did not do everything we could have done to protect ourselves and eventually lost everything in a bushfire in 2005. BUT we were fully insured and the way we behaved saved our lives where others lost their's We can pick the people we live with and deal with, and if we pick wisely we reduce the danger of harm to ourselves We can obey the law, and if we do we greatly reduce risks to ourselves **** happens to good people and to smart people, but it happens a lot more to bad people and dumb people Edited March 17, 2019 by Mr Walker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Walker Posted March 17, 2019 #104 Share Posted March 17, 2019 6 hours ago, Aquila King said: I'd like to know what all the 4 year olds sold into sex slavery for the rest of their lives did to deserve it. They make up the 10% who had limited options. Most people however, especially those in the west or other developed countries get the life that results from their choices Eg to leave school early and get a job (this might mean you end up a highly paid and skilled plumber, but it might also mean you end up unemployed for most of your life. The difference depends on the subsequent choices you also make ) Children are the exception. By nature and law the y are the most vulnerable and with the least rights, yet even they have some power over their lives and the choices they make. I know many people, as young as 12 or 13, who made radical choices such as leaving home or entering a relationship, because they wished to be in charge of their own lives and were prepared to pay the substantial costs involved in achieving this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luca-RoseElsie-Raemom1921 Posted March 17, 2019 #105 Share Posted March 17, 2019 16 minutes ago, Mr Walker said: If you do NOT do the things in your last sentence then your life will be much better than person who DOES cheat steal and harm others Yep, like it or not, the law of natural consequence means that almost everyone almost all the time lives the life they "deserve " Deserve may be the wrong word. I don't mean it in a judgemental way, but a logical way. ALL our actions and even our thoughts create consequences for every human being Why is a person in an abusive relationship why haven't they chosen to end it or to do something about it (and yes i know that such decisions may come at a high cost, but they are still available You cant do much if you are kidnapped by the lords army and forced to be child soldier but even there you do have choices I dont know why crap happens to you, In my life, every bad thing has been the result of a certain bad decision or set of bad decisions Eg we chose to live in a remote farm home for 20 years because we loved the isolation and lifestyle, We knew there was a small risk of bushfire, one having swept around the house in the late 1970s We lived there, did not do everything we could have done to protect ourselves and eventually lost everything in a bushfire in 2005. BUT we were fully insured and the way we behaved saved our lives where others lost their's We can pick the people we live with and deal with, and if we pick wisely we reduce the danger of harm to ourselves We can obey the law, and if we do we greatly reduce risks to ourselves **** happens to good people and to smart people, but it happens a lot more to bad people and dumb people Ok so by your logic my ex going behind my back to start the plans of building a house without me, then him raising a fist to punch me when I found out what he planned and for telling him to leave. That was my bad decision? Family members and friends who were abused at different ages (INCLUDING CHILDREN!) that was their bad decisions? You know NOTHING of what it takes for someone to leave an abusive relationship, I’ve had family try leaving and almost be killed for leaving. I DONT cheat or steal and avoid lying. Simply because: I don’t see the point in cheating. Stealing isn’t worth it. Lying avoid because it’s easier to keep track of the truth. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Walker Posted March 17, 2019 #106 Share Posted March 17, 2019 (edited) 47 minutes ago, Ruby04 said: Ok so by your logic my ex going behind my back to start the plans of building a house without me, then him raising a fist to punch me when I found out what he planned and for telling him to leave. That was my bad decision? Family members and friends who were abused at different ages (INCLUDING CHILDREN!) that was their bad decisions? You know NOTHING of what it takes for someone to leave an abusive relationship, I’ve had family try leaving and almost be killed for leaving. I DONT cheat or steal and avoid lying. Simply because: I don’t see the point in cheating. Stealing isn’t worth it. Lying avoid because it’s easier to keep track of the truth. No I dont know your life well enough to comment BUT, using my life to answer I would never have married a violent person or one whose ethics moralities etc were different to my own I spent 5 years getting to know my wife from the time i met her until we married (and indeed until we entered a sexual relationship) i checked out her parents to see what the y were like and all her family. I would have either sought counselling or walked out at the first sign of violence ( No I am not saying these were choices available to you It is what I would have done) You are a victim of others BUT how you respond and react is entirely up to you Children have little or no power but generally SOME adult could have intervened to stop the abuse. So it is never a child's fault but sometimes a responsible adult could have done more My wife and i spent over 30 years providing a home and refuge for children and teenagers, including mothers as young as 15. Some of their problems were indeed the result of their own choices such as a refusal to accept loving parental control of their behaviours eg wanting to have sex or take drugs aged 14 and leaving home when their parents tried to stop them but still the y had little power and required protection As i said; By not cheating or lying, your life is immeasurably better, and will always continue to be better, than the life of a person who cheats and lies If you were a cheater or liar your other problems would not go away, you would just have a lot more new ones I am not well placed to comment but if it was me I would look at the good/positive and bright sides to your life and begin now to make choices designed to improve the rest of your life which hopefully will be many more decades I have one niece, now almost 50, who had a horrendous life as a yong woman Pregnant and kicked out of home in her mid teens, abusive, drug taking, and criminal husbands and fathers to her children. A real struggle in her 30s and forties to get an education raise her 3 kids and 4 grand-kids and also earn an living. She sent her kids to private schools while a single mother and we helped her, where we could, financially For the last 10 years she has been in a loving relationship with a jet black Nigerian bloke (Australian citizen) who is kind, loving, gentle and supportive Life can still be a struggle but her efforts are beginning to pay off. Your life does not have to be how it is now, in 10 or 20 years time Edited March 17, 2019 by Mr Walker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luca-RoseElsie-Raemom1921 Posted March 17, 2019 #107 Share Posted March 17, 2019 6 minutes ago, Mr Walker said: No I dont know your life well enough to comment To that line I can’t help but laugh, you don’t know well enough to comment on mine or others life. You are a RANDOM person on the internet, not friends with myself or others. However there are about 6-7 UM members who actually do know me and 2 of them know me well due to friendships. Those 2 know more about me then you ever would. Back on topic karma is a nice thought however it doesn’t work like that in life, if it did more people would learn from mistakes 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Walker Posted March 17, 2019 #108 Share Posted March 17, 2019 (edited) 29 minutes ago, Ruby04 said: To that line I can’t help but laugh, you don’t know well enough to comment on mine or others life. You are a RANDOM person on the internet, not friends with myself or others. However there are about 6-7 UM members who actually do know me and 2 of them know me well due to friendships. Those 2 know more about me then you ever would. Back on topic karma is a nice thought however it doesn’t work like that in life, if it did more people would learn from mistakes Karma works even for stupid people. However they may be unaware that this is why their life is as it is. I dont mean karma in the religiosity eastern sense, just that all thoughts and actions have consequences, CREATING our karma So we agree i don't know you but i was answering the question you opened your post with. ie Ok so by your logic my ex going behind my back to start the plans of building a house without me, then him raising a fist to punch me when I found out what he planned and for telling him to leave. That was my bad decision? in the only way possible (by explaining how I would see this if it happened to me) Given the little info available from you I would probably have acted just as you did. But i would see it as a good, positive and necessary choice, allowing me to move on with my life Edited March 17, 2019 by Mr Walker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reignite Posted March 17, 2019 #109 Share Posted March 17, 2019 (edited) On 3/13/2019 at 11:47 PM, the13bats said: Perhaps i never should have included "karma" i was using it as a label of what i gathered it means to people who seem to believe strongly what goes around comes around, and that is karma, i wasnt talking in the Buddhist sense or definition or reincarnation. While i still believe aztek nailed it on the being done wrong side, i see the positive side a bit ego driven many times, saying ive done right by others and my good rewards flowed...are you boasting? Or suggesting you only did right to others for reward or out of fear? I do right by others not to brag and not expecting it to boomerang i do it because to me it is "right". I made the thread really to see if anyone would jump in with a closed mindset like my gmother had, no one really seems to seems most people so far more or less look at it as i do. Then what do you mean? Karma is a Sanskrit word and should be understood according to the Indian philosophies in which it is used as a technical term. The literal translation of karma is either “action” or “result”. In a general metaphysical sense, it's all about balance. It's kind of like a seesaw. When you want to obtain certain results, you have to perform some kind of action; an action strong enough to overcome the force that opposes you from obtaining those results. This symbolizes you sitting on a seesaw which in turn goes down to the ground. In order to restore balance, the seesaw must come up again. That's balance. That's karma. However, keep in mind that every philosophy (Buddhism, Hinduism, Jainism) has a different flavour of understanding and interpreting karma. Karma usually only defines the technical interpretation of the process (of disturbing and restoring balance), not the actual result, as in, the fate of mankind. It's not about left or right, good or wrong, past or future. It's about two opposing forces. Edited March 17, 2019 by Reignite 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoldenWolf Posted March 17, 2019 #110 Share Posted March 17, 2019 16 hours ago, Ruby04 said: 90% get what they deserve? Ok so people who constantly have crap or abusive relationships deserve them? Or those of us who finally start having things go well then have crap happen deserve it? Those of of us who don’t cheat, steal, try to not harm others and avoid lying deserve it? Victim blaming is a hallmark of psychopaths. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aquila King Posted March 17, 2019 #111 Share Posted March 17, 2019 32 minutes ago, GoldenWolf said: Victim blaming is a hallmark of psychopaths. I was gonna respond to @Mr Walker's hateful rants above, but I'd say that ^ sentence sums it up quite beautifully. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Walker Posted March 18, 2019 #112 Share Posted March 18, 2019 8 hours ago, GoldenWolf said: Victim blaming is a hallmark of psychopaths. Its interesting that you saw it that way when i explicitly explained that it is not victim blaming. ie there are a few things we cannot control in our lives But most we can control. Some people are genuine victims of other people or of nature (although i think victim is an unfair word which disempowers such people) However, some people CHOOSE to remain in situations where they are being harmed (or where there is significant risk of harm) While I can understand and even empathise with them, I recognise that the y have other choices, hard as those choices may be. Some people ARE victims because they choose to remain victims As dangerous as a psychopath id a human being who acts on beliefs and emotional responses rather than on logical thought, evaluation of actual data, and planing optimal choices They do what they think is right, and what FEELS good and right to them from an emotional pov., rather than acting to produce the best result possible without being so affected by emotional responses that they cause more harm. One example It feels right and good to let as many refugees (or indeed any immigrants) into a country as one can. But you cant be governed by that good feeling You have to look at how many can be cared for, assimilated taught your language etc. and how many the country can accommodate, before the social and economic cost begins to break the county apart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luca-RoseElsie-Raemom1921 Posted March 18, 2019 #113 Share Posted March 18, 2019 3 hours ago, Mr Walker said: However, some people CHOOSE to remain in situations where they are being harmed (or where there is significant risk of harm) While I can understand and even empathise with them, I recognise that the y have other choices, hard as those choices may be. Some people ARE victims because they choose to remain victims An abuse victim stays due to fear (for themselves, their family, friends or that the abuser will harm themselves) or belief the person will change. Its easy to say oh they have help and ways out, if you haven’t been there first hand or witnessed it first hand. 21 hours ago, Mr Walker said: Children have little or no power but generally SOME adult could have intervened to stop the abuse. Not always, often that child is told you tell and I’ll hurt you or your family or no one will believe you or they’ve been groomed into thinking it’s normal what’s happening to them. An adult can not step in unless they suspect something, the child says something or something is seen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Walker Posted March 18, 2019 #114 Share Posted March 18, 2019 (edited) 57 minutes ago, Ruby04 said: An abuse victim stays due to fear (for themselves, their family, friends or that the abuser will harm themselves) or belief the person will change. Its easy to say oh they have help and ways out, if you haven’t been there first hand or witnessed it first hand. Not always, often that child is told you tell and I’ll hurt you or your family or no one will believe you or they’ve been groomed into thinking it’s normal what’s happening to them. An adult can not step in unless they suspect something, the child says something or something is seen. And i have. As a protector and refuge, and as an uncle to abused children. As a man who has protected women from their partners and taken them to refuges or provided them with a home in our own home in some cases for years at other times only temporarily. It is true the choices can be hard, but they exist. Still, generally an adult could have intervened. Australia is a bit unique in this. We have huge numbers of children taken from parents, sometimes at birth, and put in state care, often on very slim evidences, just to ensure the safety of a child There are about 50000 children in state care representing about 1% of ALL children Modern practice is to teach even very young children that, when they feel bad or uncomfortable, to tell others, and to KEEP telling them until the pain, or discomfort, or hurt/bad feeling, stops But children a re less responsible for their lives choices and outcomes than an adult because they have less power freedom knowledge or choice. That is is why they require the most protection, with women running a close second. Edited March 18, 2019 by Mr Walker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LightAngel Posted March 18, 2019 #115 Share Posted March 18, 2019 On 13.3.2019 at 8:09 PM, the13bats said: she tried to tell me not ever to get very mad at a person, let things go because all her life she saw people who wronged her have really bad stuff happen to them Your grandmother sounds wise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coil Posted March 18, 2019 #116 Share Posted March 18, 2019 On 13.03.2019 at 10:09 PM, the13bats said: so ive noticed a lot of people more than i would have thought do subscribe to the idea if someone does them wrong or anyone wrong they will get what they deserve, where does this idea generate from? If you meant a situation when you did not cause a person evil and he causes you, then there are a lot of people who do this using our weakness, lack of information, trust.Maybe it meant aztec on the first page. To be human is generally to be a weak being. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke Wellington Posted March 18, 2019 #117 Share Posted March 18, 2019 On 16/03/2019 at 6:55 PM, the13bats said: Rabid, while i believe i see your point way down in there somewhere. If you knew me you would see just how off you were..... We all choose what we are and become in life. The universe knows our thoughts and mirrors them back to us with the experiences we have. So if you spend a lot of time wishing you were rich the universe mirrors that back by sending you lots of experiences which continue to make you wish you were rich. So the trick with that one is to wish you were poor (and stack getting rich further in your favour by including others ones too like wishing you were insignificant). I wish gets I wish back, I wish I wasn't gets I wish I wasn't back. I am gets I am back, I am not gets I am not back. The question is can something we assume to be fixed for our lives be altered with these Laws of Attraction? Can someone who has lost both legs get them back as an example. I have never tried anything like that. With everything I have done it has been with things that I considered could be changed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the13bats Posted March 18, 2019 Author #118 Share Posted March 18, 2019 Rabid, thanks you removed any doubts i had about you. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baronesslucy Posted April 2, 2019 #119 Share Posted April 2, 2019 When I was a child there was a man who ripped off several elderly people in the town where my grandmother lived. My grandmother didn't trust him and didn't give him any money to invest. My grandmother said that the man who did this (he had the nerve to send Christmas card to at least one of his victims) would get his at some point. It might not have been that day, that month or year, but it comes around. I don't know what karma this man got. When someone does something bad and they end up getting theirs, everyone cheers. What is hard to understand is that I've known people, good people who didn't do anything terrible or wrong and they have had terrible things happen to them (illness, death or just plain bad luck) and then someone who did terrible things doesn't have things happen to them. My grandmother's answer to that is someone who got away with stuff will not get away with it once they have to answer to God. If they make amends on earth, it will be a lot easier for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now