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macqdor

Attempting 2 merge physics and the paranormal

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macqdor

The man attempting to merge physics and the paranormal

Nobel laureate Brian Josephson is a controversial figure in quantum circles. Jeff Glorfeld reports.

https://cosmosmagazine.com/physics/science-history-the-man-attempting-to-merge-physics-and-the-paranormal

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In 1962, Brian D. Josephson, a 22-year-old graduate student at England’s Cambridge University, born on January 4, 1940, in Cardiff, Wales, predicted that electrical current would flow, or tunnel, between two superconducting materials – things that at low temperatures lack electrical resistance, even when they are separated by a non-superconductor, or insulator.

In quantum physics, matter can be described as both waves and particles. Emerging from this is the phenomenon of tunnelling, which sees particles pass through barriers that according to classic physics should be impassable.

Josephson’s tunneling theory was later confirmed, and in 1973 he was one of three scientists who shared the Nobel Prize in physics. (The others were Leo Esaki and Ivar Giaever)

 

 

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In the late 1970s, Josephson’s work took a turn that was looked upon unfavourably by some peers. He began to focus on the human brain and links between quantum physics and parapsychological or paranormal phenomena such as telepathy and extra-sensory perception.

He became director of the Mind-Matter Unification Project of the Theory of Condensed Matter Group at the Cavendish Laboratory, within Cambridge University. Josephson’s homepage describes it as “a project concerned primarily with the attempt to understand, from the viewpoint of the theoretical physicist, what may loosely be characterised as intelligent processes in nature, associated with brain function or with some other natural process”.

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“physicists have an emotional response when they hear anything connected with parapsychology. Their opinion of parapsychology research is not based on evaluation of the evidence but on a dogmatic belief that all research in this field is false.”

 

 

Quote

 

"I began to sense that conventional science is inadequate for situations where the mind is involved, and the task of clarification became a major concern of mine,” he said.

“Ultimately, my work on the brain is more significant than my Nobel-prize winning research.”

 

@papageorge1

@Habitat

https://cosmosmagazine.com/physics/science-history-the-man-attempting-to-merge-physics-and-the-paranormal

 

 

FREQUENCY.jpg

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macqdor
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Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds. The mediocre mind is incapable of understanding the man who refuses to bow blindly to conventional prejudices and chooses instead to express his opinions courageously and honestly.  Author: Albert Einstein

 

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stereologist

The simple issue is that there is no evidence for poltergeists. I have asked for an evidence and no evidence has been given.

 

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stereologist

You would think that evidence i important. Well, it is.

 

Instead of evidence posters proudly state they will not provide anything at all.

 

Fine. It tells all of us that there is nothing to their rather dismal and boring tales.

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Not A Rockstar

I think the best hope for science to start waking up to aspects of what is deemed "paranormal" today is through quantum research, I just am not sure we are there, yet. Closer than we may have ever been for something along those lines, but, not there yet.

Quantum physics is the most exciting area in Physics today for me, to extent I grasp all the ramifications. Where it may be in another decade or two is potentially entire new arenas for science to explore, imo.

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macqdor

Quantum physics is where it all comes together.  The simularaties of the phenomena being reported is striking. 

Exciting times.

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Habitat

 

2 hours ago, stereologist said:

It tells all of us that there is nothing to their rather dismal and boring tales.

As I often say, "so you surmise". I really think if what allows these phenomena wanted them known to all and sundry, it would have happened long ago. You may argue if they were real, it would have been so proven, long ago. Not if the phenomena has both the ability to prevent that, and the intent of making it so. If you dismiss that as impossible, that may reflect more on the limitations of your thinking, than the limitations of the actual reality. And as I also often say, the wise man will suspend judgement, and what is there to lose by doing just that ?

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Horta
Posted (edited)

It would be good if someone were to bring some scientific rigour to this field. It will be interesting to see how this is done though, as generally the entire field consists of large numbers of anecdotes and honest believers amid a sprinkling of charlatans.

Will look forward to his paranormal experiments and resulting papers being submitted to peer reviewed journals, though it seems doubtful that will happen.

 

Quote

“physicists have an emotional response when they hear anything connected with parapsychology. Their opinion of parapsychology research is not based on evaluation of the evidence but on a dogmatic belief that all research in this field is false.”

Quote

"I began to sense that conventional science is inadequate for situations where the mind is involved, and the task of clarification became a major concern of mine,” he said.

 

I highly doubt these quotes are generally accurate. Most in the physical sciences will feel it isn't relevant, as there isn't really anything to study other than stories. Also the paranormal is already studied both directly and indirectly by various far more relevant branches of science, who offer very plausible general explanations. The problem is that they aren't the branches of science, nor the explanations, believers would like them to be.

Its similar to why few scientists bother studying bigfoot (who is obviously a paranormal beastie) lack of anything to study that isn't already already explainable via mistake, hoax and delusion. So surely the first step would be to demonstrate that any real world paranormal phenomena actually exists to be able to study it in the first place?

Will be interesting to see how this goes, but it also has the possibility to be another fringe pseudoscience used to justify "belief".

edit. after reading further, it seems far more than a possibility, and has been for quite a while lol.

Edited by Horta
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Horta
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"I began to sense that conventional science is inadequate for situations where the mind is involved, and the task of clarification became a major concern of mine,” he said.

Seems like a strange thing to say. Neuroscience has a way to go (as do most sciences) but is doing just fine so far. Does this mean that he will be using "unconventional science"? What on earth does that even mean? How many types of science are there (I thought there was one)?

I also wonder what makes him think being a retired theoretical physicist qualifies him in cognitive sciences/neuroscience, any more than anyone else who isn't qualified? Needs a hobby? Or do they amount to the "conventional science", that he feels is inadequate (while also having no relevant qualifications and study in this field to know this)?

The more I read about this, the less hopeful I get. Seems he has been a paranormal fan and believer for quite some time and has taken fringe science up as a hobby in his old age.

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stereologist
4 hours ago, Habitat said:

 

As I often say, "so you surmise". I really think if what allows these phenomena wanted them known to all and sundry, it would have happened long ago. You may argue if they were real, it would have been so proven, long ago. Not if the phenomena has both the ability to prevent that, and the intent of making it so. If you dismiss that as impossible, that may reflect more on the limitations of your thinking, than the limitations of the actual reality. And as I also often say, the wise man will suspend judgement, and what is there to lose by doing just that ?

So you are in the camp of excuses. There are plenty of excuses and you posted one of them "Not if the phenomena has both the ability to prevent that"

Nice excuse. I love all of the excuses people come up with. That is what paranormal faux-research is all about - making up new excuses.

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stereologist

When all else fails pull out the word quantum. This suggest of QM being an explanation for paranormal events is what is known as quantum flapdoodle.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quantum_mysticism#Modern_usage_and_examples

Quote

In contrast to the mysticism of the early twentieth century, today quantum mysticism typically refers to its New Age incarnation that combines ancient mysticism with quantum mechanics.[11] Called a pseudoscience and a "hijacking" of quantum physics, it draws upon "coincidental similarities of language rather than genuine connections" to quantum mechanics.[8] Physicist Murray Gell-Mann coined the phrase "quantum flapdoodle" to refer to the misuse and misapplication of quantum physics to other topics.

So please give us all a hearty chuckle by using your version of quantum flapdoodle.

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Habitat
2 minutes ago, stereologist said:

So you are in the camp of excuses. There are plenty of excuses and you posted one of them "Not if the phenomena has both the ability to prevent that"

Nice excuse. I love all of the excuses people come up with. That is what paranormal faux-research is all about - making up new excuses.

Well, if you were me, you'd have moved on from imagining "witnesses" to be a cabal of liars and fabricators,( not that I ever thought that, it really wasn't something I ever worried about) to wondering how the **** this stuff had not slipped up, and been nailed down. But it seems not to happen, in a way that would represent convincing proof. How that can be, why it is so, I can't say. But it causes me to think it won't ever happen, and "research" of it, is doomed.

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Coil
Posted (edited)
9 hours ago, stereologist said:

The simple issue is that there is no evidence for poltergeists. I have asked for an evidence and no evidence has been given.

 

I read about the case when one scientist came to a poltergeist house and people suffered hardships from this creature, sat on a chair and began to prove that there was nothing in their house and they carry complete nonsense, so, something lifted the chair on which he sat on the height of the meter and let him go that the scientist painfully hit the ground with a chair and ran out of the room.You see, these scientists can only in such a way to make believe that there is something what has an impact on the physical things and until glasses drop from their faces they will continue to believe that these are inventions of people.

Edited by Coil
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macqdor
Posted (edited)

@Coil

Story well told.

 

@stereologist

NEWS FLASH!

The poltergeist is not something you can trap in mason jar and bring to show in tell LOL Or capture on video and say look here, I captured the poltergeist on video. see?

You gotta stop thinking in this "show me" two dimensional (in this box) thinking.     No one can prove to you what a poltergeist is.  You have to experience the experience yourself and percentage wise thats not going to happen.   Less than 1% of the worlds population has had encounters with the Mr. Poltergeist.

If you came to this community.  This forum thinking one day someone's going to enter this community and provide you with evidence of a poltergeist haunting.  Evidence that you can believe.  You came to the wrong place..  You set yourself up for failure thinking those terms.

But you do have an opportunity. An out if you will.  What's your opportunity?  Your opportunity is to listen to reports, claims being made.   You wanna look at story coming while your arms are folded?  Fine.   Whatever.    My recommendation if this is sincerely your interests.  Key word is sincere.  Study the historical documentation.   Exercise a little bit of intellectual curiosity by asking thought provoking questions.  How much does that cost?    ZERO.   That costs you nothing.

If you goal is to learn then thats whats you should do.  If your goal is to serve as gate keeper as means keeping others from learning.   Then as you were.  We all have our lot in life.

 

 

 

 

Edited by macqdor
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stereologist
3 hours ago, Habitat said:

Well, if you were me, you'd have moved on from imagining "witnesses" to be a cabal of liars and fabricators,( not that I ever thought that, it really wasn't something I ever worried about) to wondering how the **** this stuff had not slipped up, and been nailed down. But it seems not to happen, in a way that would represent convincing proof. How that can be, why it is so, I can't say. But it causes me to think it won't ever happen, and "research" of it, is doomed.

Why would anyone think there has to be a cabal of liars and fabricators?

People have all sorts of ideas and explanations for things they do not understand. Sometimes they come up with ideas based on what they wish were true. They come up with ideas and explanations that are acceptable in their minds even if there is evidence against their explanation. People come up with explanations when there is no evidence to support anything they say.

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stereologist
1 hour ago, Coil said:

I read about the case when one scientist came to a poltergeist house and people suffered hardships from this creature, sat on a chair and began to prove that there was nothing in their house and they carry complete nonsense, so, something lifted the chair on which he sat on the height of the meter and let him go that the scientist painfully hit the ground with a chair and ran out of the room.You see, these scientists can only in such a way to make believe that there is something what has an impact on the physical things and until glasses drop from their faces they will continue to believe that these are inventions of people.

You are doing what exists when it comes to poltergeists. You tell a story.

These stories are fun to read. Unnamed person. Unnamed location. But you label them a scientist.

It's a story, a typical story.

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stereologist
11 minutes ago, macqdor said:

@Coil

Story well told.

 

@stereologist

NEWS FLASH!

The poltergeist is not something you can trap in mason jar and bring to show in tell LOL Or capture on video and say look here, I captured the poltergeist on video. see?

You gotta stop thinking in this "show me" two dimensional (in this box) thinking.     No one can prove to you what a poltergeist is.  You have to experience the experience yourself and percentage wise thats not going to happen.   Less than 1% of the worlds population has had encounters with the Mr. Poltergeist.

If you came to this community.  This forum thinking one day someone's going to enter this community and provide you with evidence of a poltergeist haunting.  Evidence that you can believe.  You came to the wrong place..  You set yourself up for failure thinking those terms.

But you do have an opportunity. An out if you will.  What's your opportunity?  Your opportunity is to listen to reports, claims being made.   You wanna look at story coming while your arms are folded?  Fine.   Whatever.    My recommendation if this is sincerely your interests.  Key word is sincere.  Study the historical documentation.   Exercise a little bit of intellectual curiosity by asking thought provoking questions.  How much does that cost?    ZERO.   That costs you nothing.

If you goal is to learn then thats whats you should do.  If your goal is to serve as gate keeper as means keeping others from learning.   Then as you were.  We all have our lot in life.

Hilarious. More excuses. Didn't I just post the following:

 

I love all of the excuses people come up with. That is what paranormal faux-research is all about - making up new excuses.

 

Everyone has to love the failure of the poltergeist crowd where they want to foolishly believe without evidence. They are almost reveling in the fact that their stories are really, bad stories with nothing to back up their stories.

There is no evidence. There is nothing but rather boring stories followed by copious excuses.

It's not really poltergeists activity, it's excuse making activity.

 

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macqdor

 

Quote

Everyone has to love the failure of the poltergeist crowd where they want to foolishly believe without evidence. They are almost reveling in the fact that their stories are really, bad stories with nothing to back up their stories.

There is no evidence. There is nothing but rather boring stories followed by copious excuses.

It's not really poltergeists activity, it's excuse making activity.

 

You sure put a lot time and energy in hoaxes, and excuses being given. WOW!

Evidence?   That's a relative term.  There's more evidence about poltergeist than there is about string theory.   Than there is about lack holes being at the center of a every galaxy.  You amaze me (not really) with your so called love and devotion of the word evidence.

@Coil summed it up well.  Till the "geist" actually bites you in the a$$ you're not going to believe anything.   Its folly for you think the proof that poltergeist  are real is going to suddenly appear one day on a message board.     I have no choice but you label you gate keeper.  An inhibitor for intellectual discussion. 

LMAO

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stereologist
Posted (edited)
42 minutes ago, macqdor said:

 

 

You sure put a lot time and energy in hoaxes, and excuses being given. WOW!

Evidence?   That's a relative term.  There's more evidence about poltergeist than there is about string theory.   Than there is about lack holes being at the center of a every galaxy.  You amaze me (not really) with your so called love and devotion of the word evidence.

@Coil summed it up well.  Till the "geist" actually bites you in the a$$ you're not going to believe anything.   Its folly for you think the proof that poltergeist  are real is going to suddenly appear one day on a message board.     I have no choice but you label you gate keeper.  An inhibitor for intellectual discussion. 

LMAO

 

Are you trying to show little you understand about the world?

Yes you are. String theory is a mathematical construct that is used to test problems. No one really knows how well it matches reality.

But, there is actual evidence for string theory in the form of predictions. There is no evidence for poltergeists. You are wrong about string theory

The existence of black holes at the center of some, not every galaxy, is well demonstrated. Again the evidence is overwhelming and poltergeist have zero evidence. Again you fail.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supermassive_black_hole

The evidence for a black hole at the center of the Milky Way goes back to 1974.

The one thing we know for sure is that there cannot truly be an intellectual discussion concerning poltergeists since there is no evidence. There can be meaningless chatter about anecdotes. There can be funny commentary about a "geist" biting people's bottoms. There can be humorous excuses. This thread is getting plenty of the funny excuses.

Edited by stereologist
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macqdor

String "theory" 

Bet your bottom dollar Poltergeist isn't a theory . 

Pls send a photo of this string theory lol

From the CIA media spokesperson if u can. ;)

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stereologist

Poltergeist is not a theory. It is a story.

String theory is a huge mathematical framework.

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/is-string-theory-science/

Quote

But in the opening talk at the workshop, David Gross, a theoretical physicist at the University of California, Santa Barbara, drew a distinction between the two theories. He classified string theory as testable “in principle” and thus perfectly scientific, because the strings are potentially detectable.

As I have already stated

Quote

String theory is a mathematical construct that is used to test problems. No one really knows how well it matches reality.

https://www.theguardian.com/science/life-and-physics/2012/apr/01/1

Quote

However, string theorists have pointed out that a firm prediction of string theory is the existence of extra space-time dimensions. In a space which is curved into a higher dimension, the apparent value of pi can deviate from that seen in real life. And thus the LHC may have proved that they were right all along. More data are needed before we can be sure.

There is evidence in the form of predictions that show string theory is workable.

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macqdor

It's a theory.  One out of many.  May be proven true one day. For now it's a theory.  

I know of no scientists that's seen one.

Show me a string lol

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Coil
1 hour ago, macqdor said:

It's a theory.  One out of many.  May be proven true one day. For now it's a theory.  

I know of no scientists that's seen one.Show me a string lol


There are invisible threads that connect each object with other objects like webs and spiritual people saw them, and science indirectly groped them. And if one person does something wrong, then it spreads through invisible channels to all sides and can infect others.

 

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stereologist
1 hour ago, macqdor said:

It's a theory.  One out of many.  May be proven true one day. For now it's a theory.  

I know of no scientists that's seen one.

Show me a string lol

I guess you don't know the meaning of scientific theory, or a mathematical theory.

A scientific theory cannot be proven true.

A mathematical theory is a collection of theorems, i.e. a collection of proofs.

As I have pointed out in my links, string theory is not a physics theory.

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macqdor
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A scientific theory cannot be proven true.

A mathematical theory is a collection of theorems, i.e. a collection of proofs.

As I have pointed out in my links, string theory is not a physics theory.

STOP THE PRESS

A scientific theory can't be proven to be true?  Uh huh!

Neither can a poltergeist by scientific means   ;-)

Gotcha, you walked right into that one.    Thanks for playing............................................................

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/String_theory

Quote

In physics, string theory is a theoretical framework in which the point-like particles of particle physics are replaced by one-dimensional objects called strings. It describes how these strings propagate through space and interact with each other. On distance scales larger than the string scale, a string looks just like an ordinary particle, with its mass, charge, and other properties determined by the vibrational state of the string. In string theory, one of the many vibrational states of the string corresponds to the graviton, a quantum mechanical particle that carries gravitational force. Thus string theory is a theory of quantum gravity.

have a nice day !

B)

@stereologist

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