Attempting 2 merge physics and the paranormal

[stereologist]

6 hours ago, Habitat said:

What we have here, and I will give them that tiny bit of credit, is people like Stereologist and Chrslzs saying everything negative except outright "non-existent". The true scholar will say "I  just can't say".

I've said that twice. What are you missing?

[stereologist]

6 hours ago, macqdor said:

That's not an excuse. That's an observation.  You'd know that if you studied more.  Instead of being outright dismissive. Why dont u spend a year reading about the phenomena. 

What's written, witness testimony and research papers.   What are you afraid of? Loosing your world view?  

" A wise man changes his mind sometimes, but a fool never. To change your mind is the best evidence you have one."

No. You've been trumpeting that excuse for a long time.

Well, you can't fool me with your quote which is not applicable to the situation where one person is dishonest and is perpetrating a hoax.

 

[macqdor]

Quote

Not saying it is all hoaxed. Just asking for evidence, not tall stories.

 

This is not an evidence forum.  You're asking for evidence where evidence is not required. I think you subscribed to the wrong thread.       This thread was created to discuss paranormal vs. physics.  There are multiple phenomenon that are paranormal related that the author, myself and others believe physics should speak to.

If you dont believe in the paranormal period or require evidence 1st to have a dialogue then you subscribed to the wrong thread. If evidence is what you seek then I suggest you subscribe to a thread where the word Evidence is listed in the description.  THAT or buy some books on poltergeist or watch some videos or lectures.

No one's going to do your foot work for you. I know I'm not.

There are countless poltergeist cases on the net where evidence is provided.  You want them. Go find them. OR start a thread yourself asking for the evidence.

 

 

This thread was created under the paranormal investigation and rightly so.  Its not titled SHOW ME EVIDENCE.  

you skeptics are just hijackers.

 

@stereologist

Edited March 25, 2019 by macqdor

[stereologist]

2 hours ago, esoteric_toad said:

Conclusion: Either believe in poltergeists with no real evidence or be labeled an close minded skeptic.

This what separates science from the paranormal. Science cannot be about just believing.

[Habitat]

21 minutes ago, stereologist said:

It's a great excuse to attempt to cover up for failure.

No failure, I have simply added my story to a legion of others, there is no record I could have provided, that someone could not say, was faked.

[stereologist]

6 minutes ago, macqdor said:

This is not an evidence forum.  You're asking for evidence where evidence is not required. I think you subscribed to the wrong thread.       This thread was created to discuss paranormal vs. physics.  There are multiple phenomenon that are paranormal related that the author, myself and others believe physics should speak to.

If you dont believe in the paranormal period or require evidence 1st to have a dialogue then you subscribed to the wrong thread. If evidence is what you seek then I suggest you subscribe to a thread where the word Evidence is listed in the description.  THAT or buy some books on poltergeist or watch some videos or lectures.

No one's going to do your foot work for you. I know I'm not.

There are countless poltergeist cases on the net where evidence is provided.  You want them. Go find them. OR start a thread yourself asking for the evidence.

This thread was created under the paranormal investigation and rightly so.  Its not titled SHOW ME EVIDENCE.  

you skeptics are just hijackers.

 

@stereologist

Once again you reveal why the paranormal cannot ever be scientific.

Science is all about evidence. Evidence is used to determine facts. Facts are explain by theories. Theories are tested and retested in science.

The paranormal can't even get step 1 done - getting evidence.

There is no hijacking. The poltergeist promoters simply have no idea what science is. These are concepts that should have been learned in middle school.

[stereologist]

28 minutes ago, macqdor said:

@ChrLzs

 

I sense an ounce of "hoax" paranoia.   Extreme ounce of skepticism. And no proof whatsoever of "someone trying to make a buck of it it."

Hmmmm hint of envy.  None of what u just said tethers with the title of the thread.  You're soooooooooooooooo off topic

Pointing out hoaxes is simply. You do it. No paranoia. No fear.

Are you saying that the book you so heavily promote is a failure?

[stereologist]

24 minutes ago, macqdor said:

@Habitat is right do you deep down believe.     I since of hint of belief in you.     Where's the evidence?  The evidence is all around you.  I'll give you the same advice I gave ChrLzs - research, study, analyze, ask questions, get nosy and dissect the accounts, data already in existence. In short. Read more.  Google is your friend if you'd let.  

Heck become your independent researcher.  Visit homes where activity is being reported (yourself).   In short get in the trenches.

Anythings better than Monday quarterbacking.

And lastly. If "Geist" phenomena isn't real then why are you still responding to this post?

Which goes back to my agreement w/Habit

Thank for agreeing that there is nothing but tall stories. All there are in this poltergeist claim are tall stories and hoaxes.

What we see here is clearly a failure to provide evidence.

[stereologist]

Here is a great little write up scientific theories so everyone can see that the paranormal and especially the poltergeist stories cannot be science until evidence is available.

https://www.livescience.com/21491-what-is-a-scientific-theory-definition-of-theory.html

Quote

Any scientific theory must be based on a careful and rational examination of the facts. Facts and theories are two different things. In the scientific method, there is a clear distinction between facts, which can be observed and/or measured, and theories, which are scientists' explanations and interpretations of the facts. 

 

[macqdor]

Quote

This what separates science from the paranormal. Science cannot be about just believing.

NEWSFLASH

I'm not a scientist.  Never wanted to be.    There are things science can't explain that exist at this very moment.  

My observation?  You've haven't done a lot of research on poltergeist.   HINT#1 getting your "geist" info from communities such as this is not going convince you that poltergeist exist.  Or other paranormal occurrences for that matter.    There are a lot of organizations. Science organizations doing investigative work on "geist" phenomena.

You should join at least 2 of them.

 

 

[esoteric_toad]

Paranormal Investigation.

What is an investigation? Here's a definition:

noun

the act or process of investigating or the condition of being investigated.

a searching inquiry for ascertaining facts; detailed or careful examination.

 

Synonyms for investigation

 

1, 2. scrutiny, exploration. Investigation, examination, inquiry, research express the idea of an active effort to find out something. An investigation is a systematic, minute, and thorough attempt to learn the facts about something complex or hidden; it is often formal and official: an investigation of a bank failure. An examination is an orderly attempt to obtain information about or to make a test of something, often something presented for observation: a physical examination. An inquiry is an investigation made by asking questions rather than by inspection, or by study of available evidence: an inquiry into a proposed bond issue. Research is careful and sustained investigation.

From: https://www.dictionary.com/browse/investigation

 

Seems to me that this is anything but.

[stereologist]

9 minutes ago, macqdor said:

NEWSFLASH

I'm not a scientist.  Never wanted to be.    There are things science can't explain that exist at this very moment.  

My observation?  You've haven't done a lot of research on poltergeist.   HINT#1 getting your "geist" info from communities such as this is not going convince you that poltergeist exist.  Or other paranormal occurrences for that matter.    There are a lot of organizations. Science organizations doing investigative work on "geist" phenomena.

You should join at least 2 of them.

I can list things science cannot explain such as the form of dark matter. Is gravity quantum in nature?

When all there are in this poltergeist phenomenon are tall tales then that is the end of the story.

As you point out here poltergeist is just believing and hanging out with believers. It's tall stories and some are just lame and boring such as the hoax you promote.

[stereologist]

Seems that those that want to pretend that paranormal can be a part of science still don't understand the issue.

Let's try again with this link.

https://study.com/academy/lesson/what-is-the-scientific-theory-definition-characteristics-example.html

Quote

A hypothesis is basically an educated guess. For instance, a scientist observes something happening repeatedly over time, and a question or a group of questions begin to be formed. One question could be: 'Why am I observing this happening?' Another question might be: 'Could this be occurring every time, or is this just a coincidence?'

To answer these questions, a scientist, or a group of scientists, do an experiment to test the hypothesis. This is described as scientific research. Often, the research studies that are conducted with hypothesis testing happen over a long period of time. After many repeated research studies, a scientist would move to call the hypothesis a theory.

 

[macqdor]

Everything you skeptics, cynics say can be summed up in two words: SHOW ME.   Those two words blind you to the topic at hand.  As it stands now the paranormal is not a part of science. Correction: Not a part of modern day science. Science as we know it.  Which should be obvious duh!  Thats why it's called the paranormal.     The question is will some of the phenomena being reported ever be explained (not proven) by science?  Can science explain the workings of the poltergeist?  Or other things deemed paranormal?

The poltergeist has been existing for 1000 of years.    Its not waiting for science.  Hence the account that came out last week of another "geist" related event. 

Quote

I can list things science cannot explain such as the form of dark matter. Is gravity quantum in nature?

When all there are in this poltergeist phenomenon are tall tales then that is the end of the story.

As you point out here poltergeist is just believing and hanging out with believers. It's tall stories and some are just lame and boring such as the hoax you promote

that's your opinion...............................................everyone has one

science has their theories (bloviation)  that work off of (as it was fact).  Still is a theory.   And people who have encountered poltergeist have an equal footing based on what they and others have seen.  Its an opinionated standout. Having seen the "geist" in action. In real-time. I know it exists.

Strings?

 

Im still waiting on you to show me one   Just one is all I ask   ;-)   LOL

 

 

 

 

 

[stereologist]

Poltergeists are being explained today as hoaxes.

Poltergeists are nothing but tall stories. Why would anyone in science waste their time for something without evidence? They do check into it and have often found the poltergeist claim to be hoaxes. Sometimes they find nothing at all but stories.

Learn what a theory is in science is still failing. Proof: " Still is a theory.  "

You bet. That means it is still confirmed and has not been shown to be wrong. Can't say that for the paranormal. It has failed repeatedly.

Strings? A mathematical framework. Guess you still don't understand what that means.

https://science.howstuffworks.com/innovation/scientific-experiments/10-scientific-laws-theories.htm

Quote

A scientific theory often seeks to synthesize a body of evidence or observations of particular phenomena. It's generally — though by no means always — a grander, testable statement about how nature operates. You can't necessarily reduce a scientific theory to a pithy statement or equation, but it does represent something fundamental about how nature works.

 

[macqdor]

Dude you're going in circles.   

 

You're not convincing me. I know what a theory is. I know what a scientific theory is and I know the difference between theory and fact.

Having seen the "geist" up close and personal and having seen it defy the laws of physics. Or our understanding of the laws of physics. I know the poltergeist is real.

I doubt you've seen string or string.   You would have posted it here already.

 

If you feel as adamant as you do I love to see some works on the subject. Something you created.   Show me your works?  Your convictions. That's all I respect.  Even if I disagree with it.  I still have to respect it.I sense no works from you.  

 

 

[stereologist]

55 minutes ago, macqdor said:

Dude you're going in circles.   

 

You're not convincing me. I know what a theory is. I know what a scientific theory is and I know the difference between theory and fact.

Having seen the "geist" up close and personal and having seen it defy the laws of physics. Or our understanding of the laws of physics. I know the poltergeist is real.

I doubt you've seen string or string.   You would have posted it here already.

 

If you feel as adamant as you do I love to see some works on the subject. Something you created.   Show me your works?  Your convictions. That's all I respect.  Even if I disagree with it.  I still have to respect it.I sense no works from you. 

Actually little dude, you don't know what a scientific theory is. And no you don't know the difference between theory and fact.

Your post show you don't. That is what we call evidence. It is an observable, verifiable piece of evidence that anyone can check.

You can tell us all bout your hoax with all sorts of wacko stories about "defying the laws of physics". You have made it abundantly clear you don't know what that means either.

The simple fact is that your only thing to say is to go back to showing us that you have no idea what a scientific theory is. You keep referring to a mathematical framework which I  have already shown is not a scientific theory. Thanks for once again showing everyone that your claim to knowing what a scientific theory is, is hogwash. You don't. Please continue to embarrass yourself like.

I see all you re able to do is make glaring errors and whine.

 

Here is the recent proof that maqcdor does not understand the meaning of theory and fact. Post #189 for anyone to check out.

" science has their theories (bloviation)  that work off of (as it was fact).  Still is a theory.  "

Edited March 25, 2019 by stereologist

[stereologist]

Let's continue to help maqcdor who needs all the help they can get.

https://medium.com/science-journal/scientific-theory-vs-scientific-law-5624633a8f1b

Quote

There is a common misconception that a scientific law is a more sound version of a scientific theory. This is understandable, as without having these terms formally defined the English definition logically leads to the misconception. In addition to defining a scientific theory we will define the word theory in English and compare the two definitions. Finally, we will make a case for why the scientific method is the best tool we have to understand the natural world.

There is another chance to become educate about the very basics of science. This is middle school material but we apparently have to fill in the gaps missing in your understanding of basic issues.

 

 

[macqdor]

Let me break it down to you in one sentence. Ninja style

 

There's more data supporting the existence of poltergeist than their is of so called string theory.  

That's my position.   You can argue against it all you want.  String theory is just that a theory.  One theory out many that science uses to understand the Universe.  Its not FACT.

 

Not yet anyways  

 

 

 

 

 

[stereologist]

5 minutes ago, macqdor said:

Let me break it down to you in one sentence. Ninja style

There's more data supporting the existence of poltergeist than their is of so called string theory.  

That's my position.   You can argue against it all you want.  String theory is just that a theory.  One theory out many that science uses to understand the Universe.  Its not FACT.

Not yet anyways 

Let me repeat what is happening in one sentence.

There is zero evidence supporting poltergeists and plenty of confirmation for string theory.

Zero is always less than the support for any theory in mathematics or science.

If you had anything you could post it, but all you do is make juvenile excuses about not posting evidence.

Once again you reveal that you do not understand what a theory is you did it again.

Here is the latest glaring failure "One theory out many that science uses to understand the Universe.  Its not FACT."

We can add that to the previous flop you wrote " science has their theories (bloviation)  that work off of (as it was fact).  Still is a theory.  "

[stereologist]

Let's try again to help out maqcdor

https://www.dictionary.com/browse/scientific-theory

Quote

a coherent group of propositions formulated to explain a group of facts or phenomena in the natural world and repeatedly confirmed through experiment or observation: the scientific theory of evolution.

This is why the paranormal fails. There are ideas and tall tales for the paranormal, but that is the extent of it.

Then there are mathematical theories such as algebraic theory and number theory and the theory of manifolds and groups. A mathematical theory is not a scientific theory, nor is a scientific theory a mathematical theory.

 

[macqdor]

Quote

Let me repeat what is happening in one sentence.

There is zero evidence supporting poltergeists and plenty of confirmation for string theory.

• opinion based
• point of view based

 

same as mine.No more, no less.

We all have our loyalties.   Maybe you should check out more books on poltergeist. Leave the string theory books alone for awhile LOL

the data on poltergeist is staggering.

No one's going to bring it to you here.  U gotta go find it for yourself.   

 

[stereologist]

41 minutes ago, macqdor said:

• opinion based
• point of view based

 

same as mine.No more, no less.

We all have our loyalties.   Maybe you should check out more books on poltergeist. Leave the string theory books alone for awhile LOL

the data on poltergeist is staggering.

No one's going to bring it to you here.  U gotta go find it for yourself.   

 

No. Simple fact.

There is scientific evidence supporting string theory. There is zero evidence for poltergeists.

Poltergeist evidence does not exist. There are hoaxes such as the one you promote. There are other hoaxes such as Humpty Doo. There are tall tales.

And thanks for finishing with that childish excuse.

[esoteric_toad]

Saw the use of "data"

da·ta

/ˈdadə,ˈdādə/

Learn to pronounce

noun

1. facts and statistics collected together for reference or analysis.

   facts, figures, statistics, details, particulars, specifics, features Not seeing that here

Edited March 25, 2019 by esoteric_toad

[stereologist]

Here is one your favorite blunders discussed

https://www.thoughtco.com/criteria-for-science-and-scientific-theories-250570

Quote

Scientists don't use the term "theory" in the same way that it's used in the vernacular. In most contexts, a theory is a vague and fuzzy idea about how things work — one with a low probability of being true. This is the origin of complaints that something in science is "only a theory" and thus isn't credible.

For scientists, a theory is a conceptual structure used to explain existing facts and predict new ones.

There really is no way to merge the no evidence realm of the paranormal with the science based physics.

What is interesting there is that there is no mention of excuses as we see with those promoting the paranormal.