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Farmer77

GOP Angry Dems Are Investigating Voter Fraud

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Farmer77

House Republicans Are Upset Democrats Are Investigating Voter Suppression Allegations

Quote

The Republicans on the House Oversight and Reform Committee voiced their objections Monday in a letter to Rep. Elijah Cummings (D-Md.), the committee chairman, and Rep. Jamie Raskin (D-Md.), who chairs a subcommittee on civil rights and civil liberties. The two Democrats sent letters to officials in Georgia, Texas and Kansas earlier this year asking for documents related to controversial election decisions in 2018.

 

Seems about par for the course at this point.

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Hammerclaw
13 minutes ago, Farmer77 said:

While at the same time, they don't want the voters in their districts ask whether or not they're citizens. Yeah, par for the course.

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Farmer77
Posted (edited)
7 minutes ago, Hammerclaw said:

While at the same time, they don't want the voters in their districts ask whether or not they're citizens. Yeah, par for the course.

You mean the people being polled for the census. Heckuva try though :tu:

 

Edited by Farmer77

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RoofGardener

Hmm.. this seems like a procedural issue ? The Committee (the Republicans claim) have no jurisdiction over elections, which are carried out by the individual States. Hence the Dems running the committee's have exceeded their statutory authority. This raises the shadow of witch hunts, or McCarthyism.

To quote Jim Jordan,

We have serious concerns that your letters appear to be an attempt to insert the Committee into particular state election proceedings, for which we do not see a legitimate legislative purpose,” 

Now, one of the Democrats (Jamie Raskin) has responded, saying... 

"...The U.S. Congress has the power and obligation to enforce the voting rights of the people as spelled out in the 14th, 15th, 17th, 19th, and 24th Amendments to the U.S. Constitution, a power we have exercised repeatedly in statutes like the Voting Rights Act of 1965 and the Americans with Disabilities Act to shut down state action hostile to democratic participation,” 

Now, here's the thing. I've looked at the text of these amendments, and none of them seem to apply to this situation, which makes me think that Mr Raskin is blowing smoke. They MAY be abusing their position to try and get material for the sole purposes of embarrassing the President. That is NOT a legitimate function of their subcommittees. 

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Farmer77
Posted (edited)
14 minutes ago, RoofGardener said:

The Committee (the Republicans claim) have no jurisdiction over elections, which are carried out by the individual States.

Not correct https://constitutioncenter.org/interactive-constitution/interpretations/elections-clause-morley-tolson

 

Quote

The Elections Clause is the primary source of constitutional authority to regulate elections for the U.S. House of Representatives and U.S. Senate. The Clause directs and empowers states to determine the “Times, Places, and Manner” of congressional elections, subject to Congress’s authority to “make or alter” state regulations.

 

Although the Elections Clause makes states primarily responsible for regulating congressional elections, it vests ultimate power in Congress. Congress may pass federal laws regulating congressional elections that automatically displace (“preempt”) any contrary state statutes, or enact its own regulations concerning those aspects of elections that states may not have addressed. The Framers of the Constitution were concerned that states might establish unfair election procedures or attempt to undermine the national government by refusing to hold elections for Congress. They empowered Congress to step in and regulate such elections as a self-defense mechanism.

 

14 minutes ago, RoofGardener said:

Now, here's the thing. I've looked at the text of these amendments, and none of them seem to apply to this situation, which makes me think that Mr Raskin is blowing smoke. They MAY be abusing their position to try and get material for the sole purposes of embarrassing the President. That is NOT a legitimate function of their subcommittees. 

What on earth are you talking about?  The elections the dems are looking at were quite publicly stricken with irregularities that had nothing to do with Trump.

 

14 minutes ago, RoofGardener said:

To quote Jim Jordan,

We have serious concerns that your letters appear to be an attempt to insert the Committee into particular state election proceedings, for which we do not see a legitimate legislative purpose,” 

If you ever want to see a horrible human being putting a horrible display of acting watch Jim Jordan in session some time. The dude is an extremist clown. 

Now as to his point its pretty much nullified by the elections clause AND article 1 of the constitution

 

 

Edited by Farmer77
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Dumbledore the Awesome

well,the "Democrats" have been whining since at least 2016. If anyone should be investigated for voter fraud it should be them,  for giving all the votes that were given to Bernie Sanders to the Blessed H. Clinton. 

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Tatetopa
18 minutes ago, Vlad the Mighty said:

well,the "Democrats" have been whining since at least 2016. If anyone should be investigated for voter fraud it should be them,  for giving all the votes that were given to Bernie Sanders to the Blessed H. Clinton. 

Talk about a bitter lesson to learn the hard way, that was surely one. 

Hope you are feeling OK Farmer..  Haven't seen you around much for the last few days, or maybe we are just spending time on different threads.

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Farmer77
12 minutes ago, Tatetopa said:

Hope you are feeling OK Farmer..  Haven't seen you around much for the last few days, or maybe we are just spending time on different threads.

Hey thanks for asking!  Im doing good I work a week on and a week off and I try and focus on family and fishing during my time off (the fishing was horrible BTW) . Today is my Monday so unless work starts hopping ill be around for the week.

 

19 minutes ago, Tatetopa said:

Talk about a bitter lesson to learn the hard way, that was surely one. 

As much as I despise whataboutism I actually appreciate that this point keeps getting brought up. In today's environment it seems like it would be really easy to fall into the trap of believing the "lesser of two evils" wasnt "evil" at all. 

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RoofGardener
1 hour ago, Farmer77 said:

Not correct https://constitutioncenter.org/interactive-constitution/interpretations/elections-clause-morley-tolson

 

 

What on earth are you talking about?  The elections the dems are looking at were quite publicly stricken with irregularities that had nothing to do with Trump.

 

If you ever want to see a horrible human being putting a horrible display of acting watch Jim Jordan in session some time. The dude is an extremist clown. 

Now as to his point its pretty much nullified by the elections clause AND article 1 of the constitution

 

 

Yes.... CONGRESS can pass LEGISLATION to mandate the manner in which elections should be held. But can a congressional subcommitee arbitrarily decide to investigate ? 

I guess time will tell on that one :) 

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Farmer77
1 minute ago, RoofGardener said:

Yes.... CONGRESS can pass LEGISLATION to mandate the manner in which elections should be held. But can a congressional subcommitee arbitrarily decide to investigate ? 

That was why I referenced article 1 which grants congress the authority to investigate anything they have oversight of.

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RoofGardener
37 minutes ago, Farmer77 said:

That was why I referenced article 1 which grants congress the authority to investigate anything they have oversight of.

Which begs the question.. does the Committee on civil rights have specific oversight of the electoral process of Texas, Kansas and Georgia ? Especially when federal judges have already ruled on the elections there ? 

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Farmer77
1 minute ago, RoofGardener said:

Which begs the question.. does the Committee on civil rights have specific oversight of the electoral process of Texas, Kansas and Georgia ? Especially when federal judges have already ruled on the elections there ? 

Absolutely,  in fact that question is kind of a slam dunk, stopping voter suppression is a key component of ensuring the rights for all.

 

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RoofGardener
7 minutes ago, Farmer77 said:

Absolutely,  in fact that question is kind of a slam dunk, stopping voter suppression is a key component of ensuring the rights for all.

Well, I can see your point on that. However, the Republican's obviously disagree - they seem to think the committee is interfering in something that is beyond its remit. Lets see what happens, and what they do with these papers ? 

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Buzz_Light_Year
16 minutes ago, Farmer77 said:

Absolutely,  in fact that question is kind of a slam dunk, stopping voter suppression is a key component of ensuring the rights for all.

 

Yet the Demorats will do nothing to investigate voter fraud. And no it's not a myth and plenty of videos on youtube of people caught in the act and other articles out there that highlight the problem.

 

 

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Farmer77
1 minute ago, RoofGardener said:

they seem to think the committee is interfering in something that is beyond its remit.

 If you honestly believe that then please PM me so we can get together and discuss those investment opportunities :lol:.

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RoofGardener
3 minutes ago, Buzz_Light_Year said:

Yet the Demorats will do nothing to investigate voter fraud. And no it's not a myth and plenty of videos on youtube of people caught in the act and other articles out there that highlight the problem.

I think the committee in question where chasing the chimera of "voter suppression", rather than voter fraud ? 

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RoofGardener
4 minutes ago, Farmer77 said:

 If you honestly believe that then please PM me so we can get together and discuss those investment opportunities :lol:.

I honestly believe that is what these two Republicans think. 

Care to buy a bridge ? :D 

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Farmer77
Just now, Buzz_Light_Year said:

Yet the Demorats will do nothing to investigate voter fraud. And no it's not a myth and plenty of videos on youtube of people caught in the act and other articles out there that highlight the problem.

 

No its not a myth that voter fraud happens ........Yes its a myth that  voter fraud is happening at the large scale levels that the hyperbolic right wing mouthpieces want you to believe. The presidents laughable and failed "Witch Hunt" to try and prove he was the most popular really should have been the death knell for that conspiracy theory.

 

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and then

They seem hell-bent on spending the next two years stirring a stinking pot that has already boiled over and I suspect it's because they have no other electoral strategy for 2020.  It is my sincere wish that Americans thank them appropriately when the next election rolls around.  Meanwhile, Barr may well begin to investigate the entire premise for their activities since 2016.  If he moves in that direction officially, look for the REAL hysteria to break out ;) 

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and then
10 minutes ago, Farmer77 said:

 

No its not a myth that voter fraud happens ........Yes its a myth that  voter fraud is happening at the large scale levels that the hyperbolic right wing mouthpieces want you to believe. The presidents laughable and failed "Witch Hunt" to try and prove he was the most popular really should have been the death knell for that conspiracy theory.

 

If it were not benefitting the D's significantly in enough strategic precincts they would not fight the idea of positive voter identification.  We have it in Alabama and anyone who needs an official photo ID can get one free if they don't have the means.  We've had no problems with it here.  If we can get that done down here in deepest, darkest Alabama, surely Chicago and Detroit should have no issues.  I personally believe biometrics should be used and when someone is caught trying to vote a second time they should DO TIME.  Only one Party resists voter ID.  

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Farmer77
1 minute ago, and then said:

it were not benefitting the D's significantly in enough strategic precincts they would not fight the idea of positive voter identification.  We have it in Alabama and anyone who needs an official photo ID can get one free if they don't have the means. 

Oh I agree on that and when 100% of precincts offer free ID ill be 100% for it.  Im also OK with states that accept other forms beyond photo ID. 

 

2 minutes ago, and then said:

Only one Party resists voter ID

Hey I think I made the point earlier in this thread that the lesser of two evils is still evil but thats really besides the point of this thread isnt it?

We have one party openly doing two things at once. Working to obstruct another party from investigating possible civil rights violations as it applies to access to our democracy while openly encouraging the erosion of the power of congress on all fronts.

Honestly the latter that when taken in totality is simply astounding.

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and then
3 minutes ago, Farmer77 said:

Working to obstruct another party from investigating possible civil rights violations as it applies to access to our democracy while openly encouraging the erosion of the power of congress on all fronts.

Questioning the oversight role of a Congressional committee is entirely appropriate when that committee is overstepping its mandate.   

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Buzz_Light_Year
Quote

 

Professor J. Alex Halderman has made a career studying electronic voting security. His research has changed the concept of stolen elections from theory to reality.

“I know America’s voting machines are vulnerable,” J. Alex Halderman firmly stated, pausing to lift his head from the page he read to look up at a phalanx of U.S. senators, “because my colleagues and I have hacked them—repeatedly—as part of a decade of research studying the technology that operates elections and learning how to make it stronger.”

 

http://alumnus.alumni.umich.edu/hacking-the-vote/

What amazes me that with some of these voting machines they use an Access Database and even I can hack an Access Database.

This was first brought to light by a gentleman who I don't remember his name hacked a voting machine just using notepad. It not hard to figure out he wrote a VBscript and if IIRC he only used 3 lines of code.

Those that don't think voter fraud is rampant are simply delusional.

The only reason the Dems beat voter suppression to death is the simple fact that they can play their all in one trump card. RACISM.

 

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Dumbledore the Awesome
2 hours ago, Farmer77 said:

 

As much as I despise whataboutism 

Oh go on Farmer, you know you love it :P 

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aztek

i too would be p***ed if the side doing investigation are the one that violates the most, the investigation is a fraud in itself

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