Who will the Democratic nominee be?

[acidhead]

Rent control.. which leads to........

 

[Tatetopa]

On 9/21/2019 at 1:44 AM, Raptor Witness said:

Trump is a thousand times the liar that Warren is, and he got elected. It’s a Forest Gump type, white lie, which amounts to nothing in the big picture of life. It wouldn’t influence my vote for the 1st female US President, and I doubt I’m alone.

I won't argue that point, and I am sure you are not alone.  Something less than half the country think Trump is a good president  and about a quarter to a third think he might just about be the second coming.  Go figure.

I would disagree that it is a Forest Gump white lie though.    There are probably a million voters across the country who think it is not trivial.  

A lot of people seem to want that Indian in their family tree.  Indians call them wannabes sometimes.  Angry Indians say we nearly exterminated them, took their land, repressed their culture, and now we want to pretend an affinity.  It doesn't sit well with some.

Elizabeth Warren has done a pretty good job trying to mend the divide.  If she lives up to her promises. she will a good president for Indians as well as everybody else.

Trump has not been anything special for natives.  

So to you it does not matter, and to me, I would accept it if she does a good job for America.  For a million or so people out there, they either make the effort, maybe driving 30 miles to vote, or they say she is no different than Trump and stay home.   That is the prize at stake for Elizabeth Warren depending on how she handles things.

She is a serious nerdy woman, and being a serious nerdy engineer, I have a natural affinity for her that I don't have for Biden.  I am hoping she shows that she has courage and honor and integrity.  That would definitely put me over the top.  Right now, I think mayor Pete or Kamala Harris or Tulsi Gabbard might also make good presidents.

.  

[Raptor Witness]

I think Elizabeth Warren has the ability to take on the friendly grandmother persona, which will starkly contrast with Trump. I will force people to say them to themselves, do we want the grandmother or do we want this dangerous person.

[RoofGardener]

Hmmm... the friendly grandmother persona ? 

[+and-then]

On 9/21/2019 at 3:44 AM, Raptor Witness said:

There was a backlash against Nixon. This backlash will be far greater.

You might want to remember the polling data and all the rock-solid predictions from the Left in 2016.  Ponder the success of the economy and the fact that he has worked diligently to keep his promises despite being jammed up by Dems and Repubs for 3 years.  

I have no doubt that hate and media driven hysteria will cause a record turnout on the Left but being from that side of the spectrum you have no appreciation for just how nutty most of the rest of us think those candidates to be.  Trump in 2020 will be more urgently necessary for us than he was in 2016.  If any of the current crop of Socialists become the nominee and remain even slightly honest about their agenda during the general election, the anger on the Left will be more than matched by the disgust and fear from the Right.

[Farmer77]

1 hour ago, and then said:

You might want to remember the polling data and all the rock-solid predictions from the Left in 2016. 

You mean the ones that all said Hillary would get more votes....before she did?

1 hour ago, and then said:

Ponder the success of the economy and the fact that he has worked diligently to keep his promises despite being jammed up by Dems and Repubs for 3 years.  

 

You mean how he has helped the farmers thrive...oh wait

Coal miners!!!!  His XO's have made them thrive, oh not so much

Manufacturing!!!  Oh wait thats down too...

Sure is crazy how the dems made Mexico not pay for that wall

Its absolutely been amazing how he made the deficit disappear like he promised too huh? (psst its doubled )

Christian Morals !! He has returned Morality to the WH after 8 years of Obama and his evil muslimness !!!!! (Of course you and your ilk know thats nowhere near true yet continue to support him)

Law and Order!! Well thats almost as laughable as the morality one.

 

 

 

[+DieChecker]

1 hour ago, Farmer77 said:

You mean the ones that all said Hillary would get more votes....before she did?

 

You mean how he has helped the farmers thrive...oh wait

Coal miners!!!!  His XO's have made them thrive, oh not so much

Manufacturing!!!  Oh wait thats down too...

Sure is crazy how the dems made Mexico not pay for that wall

Its absolutely been amazing how he made the deficit disappear like he promised too huh? (psst its doubled )

Christian Morals !! He has returned Morality to the WH after 8 years of Obama and his evil muslimness !!!!! (Of course you and your ilk know thats nowhere near true yet continue to support him)

Law and Order!! Well thats almost as laughable as the morality one.

 

 

 

Is there a trope you didnt touch on... sexism maybe. Need to figure out how to get that in there too...

[Farmer77]

1 minute ago, DieChecker said:

Is there a trope you didnt touch on... sexism maybe. Need to figure out how to get that in there too...

Those were Trump's campaign promises. Try and pay attention to the conversation.

You've just totally shut the brain down at this point huh?

"Dear Leader Good, must defend, will use words Levin gave me"

 

[spartan max2]

11 hours ago, acidhead said:

Rent control.. which leads to........

 

Next step after that is government ran housing.

After all the companies give up on renting because of rent control making it unsustainable.

There would then be a shortage.

So the people would demand the government to do it.

[Farmer77]

8 minutes ago, spartan max2 said:

Next step after that is government ran housing.

Why? Why is that the "next step"? 

We have a housing affordability crisis that needs to be addressed somehow . Do you have any solutions?

America's Housing Affordability Crisis Only Getting Worse

 

 

[+Desertrat56]

9 minutes ago, Farmer77 said:

Why? Why is that the "next step"? 

We have a housing affordability crisis that needs to be addressed somehow . Do you have any solutions?

America's Housing Affordability Crisis Only Getting Worse

 

 

What's weird is that I don't think there has been a shortage of housing in Albuquerque for decades, yet the cost of rent and buying a house is the same as in Dallas, THE SAME, yet wages are almost half across the board.  It is a manufactured inflation for housing in this area.  My daughter works for Fidelity Investments and recently at a meeting where the big wigs from Boston came the main guy let slip (becaucse some one asked him out right and he knee jerk answered then regretted it) that the employees in Albuquerque are not paid as much as their counter parts in other states doing the same job.

I know that this is because our state does not have labor laws like Texas and other states, companies can come in and pay less than national standard and no one will do anything about it.

 

Edited September 23, 2019 by Desertrat56

[spartan max2]

22 minutes ago, Farmer77 said:

Why? Why is that the "next step"? 

We have a housing affordability crisis that needs to be addressed somehow . Do you have any solutions?

America's Housing Affordability Crisis Only Getting Worse

 

 

Rent control has never worked. I shouldn't have to have a solution to be against an idea that would make the problem WORSE.

https://amp.businessinsider.com/does-rent-control-work-no-it-actually-increases-rent-prices-for-most-people-2015-9

Freakenomics podcast even had a whole episode on it lol(not exactly a conservative podcast).

 

Even NPR talks about how it dosent work

https://www.npr.org/2019/03/29/707908952/the-evidence-against-rent-control

To sum the NPR up for everyone. What the economists have found from rent control attempts in the past is that one of two things happen.

Either A there becomes an even higher shortage of low income housing because with rent control everyone stops building them, they make almost no proift. So instead they ironically start only building really expensive units for higher income people 

Or B. They raise rents on everyone else. Making it more expensive for everyone but the lowest of incomes in rent controlled housing. 

Once again they have found this from watching what happened the countless times cities have tried rent control in the past. 

Edited September 23, 2019 by spartan max2

[Farmer77]

2 minutes ago, Desertrat56 said:

What's weird is that I don't think there has been a shortage of housing in Albuquerque for decades, yet the cost of rent and buying a house is the same as in Dallas, THE SAME, yet wages are almost half across the board.  It is a manufactured inflation for housing in this area.  My daughter works for Fidelity Investments and recently at a meeting where the big wigs from Boston came the main guy let slip (becaucse some one asked him out right and he knee jerk answered then regretted it) that the employees in Albuquerque are not paid as much as their counter parts in other states doing the same job.

 

We see the same in small town AZ. Housing costs near the same as in Vegas yet we have damn near zero industry

[Farmer77]

26 minutes ago, spartan max2 said:

Rent control has never worked. I shouldn't have to have a solution to be against an idea that would make the problem WORSE.

https://amp.businessinsider.com/does-rent-control-work-no-it-actually-increases-rent-prices-for-most-people-2015-9

Freakenomics podcast even had a whole episode on it lol(not exactly a conservative podcast).

 

Even NPR talks about how it dosent work

https://www.npr.org/2019/03/29/707908952/the-evidence-against-rent-control

To sum the NPR up for everyone. What the economists have found from rent control attempts in the past is that one of two things happen.

Either A there becomes an even higher shortage of low income housing because with rent control everyone stops building them, they make almost no proift. So instead they ironically start only building really expensive units for higher income people 

Or B. They raise rents on everyone else. Making it more expensive for everyone but the lowest of incomes in rent controlled housing. 

Once again they have found this from watching what happened the countless times cities have tried rent control in the past. 

We have lots of models as to how not to do it. Thats a great starting point and certainly not a reason to not try and do something.  I do like Booker's idea of tax credits for renters but it kind of trips me up because on a certain level that kind of feels like nothing more than government subsidizing greed.

 

 

[spartan max2]

3 minutes ago, Farmer77 said:

We have lots of models as to how not to do it. Thats a great starting point and certainly not a reason to not try and do something.  I do like Booker's idea of tax credits for renters but it kind of trips me up because on a certain level that kind of feels like nothing more than government subsidizing greed.

 

 

I'm open to solutions, I just think rent control is a bad one.

 

I personally think having strong regulations on how high percentage of housing one company can own in a given area. Sort like am "anti-trust" thing. 

Force companies to actually compete to get renters instead of our current situation where everything is being bought up by megalithic companies. 

[Earl.Of.Trumps]

10 hours ago, Tatetopa said:

Elizabeth Warren has done a pretty good job trying to mend the divide.  If she lives up to her promises. she will a good president for Indians as well as everybody else.

LOL  C'mon, man!  They hate her. Something to do with "Cultural Appropriation"  

[Tatetopa]

1 hour ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

LOL  C'mon, man!  They hate her. Something to do with "Cultural Appropriation"  

Yeah maybe. Some of them are pretty mad at her, especially the Cherokees. I wish she hadn't done it, failing that I wish she had made a better effort at amends.  But then the current Prez has a long history of law suits against Indian Casinos and pushed through the Dakota access pipeline.  So like with all of us, the choice often comes down not to who is the best candidate but who is the least  harmful to our interests.  

[+Desertrat56]

26 minutes ago, Tatetopa said:

Yeah maybe. Some of them are pretty mad at her, especially the Cherokees. I wish she hadn't done it, failing that I wish she had made a better effort at amends.  But then the current Prez has a long history of law suits against Indian Casinos and pushed through the Dakota access pipeline.  So like with all of us, the choice often comes down not to who is the best candidate but who is the least  harmful to our interests.  

I am just hoping we can get a 3rd party choice in there that is more appealing than either of the party candidates.  It will eventually happen, sooner better than later.  And the democrats will not be running Elizabeth Warren.  Maybe it will be some dark horse that actually has a chance against T.

[Farmer77]

9 minutes ago, Desertrat56 said:

I am just hoping we can get a 3rd party choice in there that is more appealing than either of the party candidates.  It will eventually happen, sooner better than later.  And the democrats will not be running Elizabeth Warren.  Maybe it will be some dark horse that actually has a chance against T.

 

This is not the year for a third party candidate.  Unless Ventura wants to make another run , hed take about half of Trumps CT believing base with him

I am coming around to hoping they do run Warren. I think she could provide the perfect foil to Trump's antics. He wont be beaten by trying to out Trump him like Biden and Harris seem inclined to do. However a calm and mature adult like Warren or even Pete would make a striking contrast to the Trumpian hysteria and antics on stage.

 

[+Desertrat56]

17 minutes ago, Farmer77 said:

 

This is not the year for a third party candidate.  Unless Ventura wants to make another run , hed take about half of Trumps CT believing base with him

I am coming around to hoping they do run Warren. I think she could provide the perfect foil to Trump's antics. He wont be beaten by trying to out Trump him like Biden and Harris seem inclined to do. However a calm and mature adult like Warren or even Pete would make a striking contrast to the Trumpian hysteria and antics on stage.

 

If Elizabeth Warren gets the nomination it will be a sure thing that Trump will win.

[RoofGardener]

6 minutes ago, Desertrat56 said:

If Elizabeth Warren gets the nomination it will be a sure thing that Trump will win.

Weeeell.. couldn't you say the same thing about MOST of the runners ? I mean.. they're all creepy WEIRDOES. 

Edited September 23, 2019 by RoofGardener

[Farmer77]

5 minutes ago, Desertrat56 said:

If Elizabeth Warren gets the nomination it will be a sure thing that Trump will win.

IMO in the age of anti bullying she probably stands the best chance at appearing a sympathetic figure for the American public.  Do you think any of the candidates have a shot?

[+Desertrat56]

2 minutes ago, RoofGardener said:

Weeeell.. couldn't you say the same thing about MOST of the runners ? I mean.. they're all creepy WEIRDOES. 

I think I did say so when I mentioned that the only way the democrats could win is if they find some dark horse candidate.

[+Desertrat56]

3 minutes ago, Farmer77 said:

IMO in the age of anti bullying she probably stands the best chance at appearing a sympathetic figure for the American public.  Do you think any of the candidates have a shot?

Yes, but remember, so did Bernie.  Trump was supposed to win so they ran Hillary, who is hated by most young voters I know.  I even had a conversation with my nephew who thought he could only vote for the better of the two evils.  I pointed out that there was a third choice and I prefered a happy clown to a scary clown, which is how I felt about both Hillary and Trump.

[RoofGardener]

1 minute ago, Desertrat56 said:

I think I did say so when I mentioned that the only way the democrats could win is if they find some dark horse candidate.

Well, perhaps you are right. But... how did America come to this ? They had 20 candidates, all of whom where losers or wierdoes. 

I mean... how ?