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South Alabam

Who will the Democratic nominee be?

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Gwynbleidd
Posted (edited)
23 hours ago, RoofGardener said:

Well, that all appears to make perfect sense to me, @Farmer77. However, can you imagine ANY democratic nominee trying to explain THAT to a Black Lives Matter mob ? They'd be torn to pieces. 

For a start imo, I don't feel it should be Black Lives Matter, it should be ALL Lives Matter.  

As Farmer talked about a vulnerable area where Police go in and it ends up that some black civilian is shot dead....could it possibly be the black civilian was doing something wrong within this vulnerable area and the police had to do their job?  Ultimately, there's got to be law abidance and it would be the same if you went to some vulnerable mid-lower income white neighbourhood too.  This colour difference in skin shouldn't make one more of a victim than the other.  Lets face it, a Democratic nominee would never address this or they'd lose their mid-lower income black and white votes.  I'm very pro Police too as I've seen firsthand how hard their jobs are.

edit:  This only becomes a racist issue if one makes it a racist issue.  But it affects ALL skin colours. 

Edited by pixiii
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DieChecker
39 minutes ago, Farmer77 said:

Interesting. When discussing police violence I dont personally think racism is the underlying issue. At least not in the "i hate black people" sense.

What do you think the underlying issue is?

Mostly cultural. Urban minority areas are geographically, and socially isolated, regardless of the internet. And develop fears/anger based on their situation. Many feel trapped, IMHO, and turn to those who locally seem successful, which too often are criminals, known, or unknown. A unhealthy fear of the police results, which leads to individuals raised this way running, or fighting, because they believe they're in real danger and the cops are out to get them.

Ironically, the worse this belief gets in the population, the worse the police will get in their response. A feedback loop perhaps.

And an anger at those outside that seem prosperous develops. This usually resolves in the form of the nearby (relatively) mainly white neighborhoods. So this in turn results in aggression between neighborhoods, both ways, further installing a feeling of racism in the poorer minority neighborhood. A feeling of racism not based on words, but on Them and Us thinking where the Them are mainly white citizens, who just happen to live over there in a better neighborhood.

I knew many who hated me for being white, while I was in the Army in Georgia. And I had never done a thing to them. I lived in the same building, wore the same clothes, and got paid the same, but was hated because they thought I was getting treated better somehow. They were just sure it was true, because that was how they had been raised....

Once hate gets rooted, regardless of the skin color of a person, it is hard to weed back out.

I dont know if the minority urban culture can be adjusted. I believe anyway, that adjusting the main American culture isnt going to fix the problem. If anything it will just allow for victim, and user, mentality to thrive.

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skliss
13 hours ago, pixiii said:

For a start imo, I don't feel it should be Black Lives Matter, it should be ALL Lives Matter.  

I don't know if you are aware but you can't say that in America....it's considered racist...dumb, right?

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Farmer77
14 hours ago, pixiii said:

Well after I heard her speak - I thought wow, she's actually really lovely and well spoken, not snarky like some of the pollies are.  I especially liked the way she called out Kamala Harris.  I'm not really a big fan of Harris at all.  But I thought Tulsi might be a good option for people who are more centrist rather than left or right. Ah well, I was really hoping to see her in this upcoming debate but I don't think she will be.  

Yeah shes polling really low. Im with you on Harris im not a fan at all, honestly im not a real fan of any of the dem candidates, but ill be voting for one of them.

 

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Gwynbleidd
15 minutes ago, skliss said:

I don't know if you are aware but you can't say that in America....it's considered racist...dumb, right?

My apologies if anyone is offended by me saying ALL lives matter - Yes it is dumb @skliss - what makes black lives more important than asian and indian lives?  I'm fairly sure there would be a number of people who aren't black that find it offensive.  Asian Lives Matter.....Indian Lives Matter.  Could be onto something here. ;)    

At the end of the day we'd all bleed the same if stabbed.  Unless of course you wanna head down the lizardpeople path, but that's probably for a totally different section of the forums! :lol::P 

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Farmer77

Does anyone understand the 2020 race? This scholar nailed the blue wave — here’s her forecast

Has anyone else noticed the litany of articles on foxnews.com, and opinions posted on here , that say the democrats are going to "scare away" moderate voters by going to the left? This bit helps explain the introduction of that mantra into the lexicon

Quote

With a record like that, you’d think that Bitecofer’s explanation of what happened would have drawn universal attention and become common sense — but you’d be sadly mistaken. She’s barely beginning to get the recognition she deserves, and more troubling for the country, the outdated assumptions her model dispensed with continue to cloud the thinking of pundits and Democratic Party leadership alike. (Follow her on Twitter here.)

This hampers efforts to counter Donald Trump’s destructive impact on a daily basis, and spreads confusion about both Democratic prospects and strategy in the 2020 election prospects. Above all, the mistaken belief that Democrats won in 2018 by gaining Republican support (aka winning back “Trump voters”) fuels an illusory search for an ill-defined middle ground that could actually demobilize the Democratic leaners and voters who actually drove last year’s blue wave.

 

 

Its a good read

 

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Gwynbleidd
11 minutes ago, Farmer77 said:

Yeah shes polling really low. Im with you on Harris im not a fan at all, honestly im not a real fan of any of the dem candidates, but ill be voting for one of them.

 

I shall never speak to you again if you vote for that creepy hands-on Joe Biden @Farmer77 :whistle: :lol:

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Farmer77
Just now, pixiii said:

My apologies if anyone is offended by me saying ALL lives matter - Yes it is dumb @skliss - what makes black lives more important than asian and indian lives?  I'm fairly sure there would be a number of people who aren't black that find it offensive.  Asian Lives Matter.....Indian Lives Matter.  Could be onto something here. ;)    

At the end of the day we'd all bleed the same if stabbed.  Unless of course you wanna head down the lizardpeople path, but that's probably for a totally different section of the forums! :lol::P 

Its only offensive when said as a response to the Black Lives Matter movement which was a specific movement dealing with the deaths of black people. Well that and the American idiots who hide their racism behind a pretense of not understanding that are pretty offensive too. 

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Farmer77
1 minute ago, pixiii said:

I shall never speak to you again if you vote for that creepy hands-on Joe Biden @Farmer77 :whistle: :lol:

God I hope he isnt the candidate 

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Gwynbleidd
Posted (edited)
15 minutes ago, Farmer77 said:

God I hope he isnt the candidate 

If he does end up being the candidate it's going be like two old grandpa's fighting like a pair of wild dogs.  Trump will be tweeting insults as fast as he can with his small hands and Joe will have his hands on some female somewhere most likely.  Gosh I sound so terribly cynical, sorry.  I feel bad for you guys. It's as bad for choice there as what it's been for us here in Australia too.  Just horrible now. 

Edited by pixiii
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South Alabam
1 hour ago, Farmer77 said:

God I hope he isnt the candidate 

It will probably come down to the last three of Harris, Biden, and Pocah  Warren..Like

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Tatetopa
1 hour ago, pixiii said:

My apologies if anyone is offended by me saying ALL lives matter - Yes it is dumb @skliss - what makes black lives more important than asian and indian lives?  I'm fairly sure there would be a number of people who aren't black that find it offensive.  Asian Lives Matter.....Indian Lives Matter.  Could be onto something here. ;)    

All lives do matter, but of course there is more than one story here.

There were still lynchings going on in the South when my parents were children.  There was segregation until I was 20.  I never saw a black student until college.  There was a lot of daily violence against blacks.  My uncles indulged in it, some of my schoolmates did and I went along with some of that just to be popular and accepted.  I am ashamed of myself for that meanness and weakness.   Black people were not treated equally in the South or given opportunities to climb out of poverty easily.   Land grant state colleges did not allow black students.  The private university I went to specifically barred black students until 1964.  White people did not buy from black owned businesses.  Black people couldn't get loans from most banks.  

That is not made up stuff, that is what all of us in the South lived with  prior to the 1970's. 

In Texas, it was the same with Mexicans.  Texas Rangers were infamous for their handling of any complaints by Mexican farm workers.  They disappeared or sometimes wound up with a bullet in the head for resisting arrest.

Asians were less common, but the ideal minority.  They kept to themselves, did not cause trouble, did not speak out, cooked our dinner and ironed our shirts.  Now they are becoming a lot more vocal and participate more in the public arena.

Indians were and still are largely pushed off to the outskirts.  Their kids were taken from them in many cases and sent to Indian Boarding Schools to be Americanized. Their religions were forbidden, literally forbidden.  Indians that did sweat lodges or Sun Dances or other ceremonies got arrested.  It wasn't until 1978 that the Native American Religious Freedom Act got passed.  Can you conceive of having your forefather's religion banned in your native land, in  a country that praises its own religious tolerance? Cognitive dissonance?  You remember the American Indian Movement and their stand off against the FBI?  They are still around.

 

That was how I and many other people grew up in the 50's 60's and 70's.  I know Skliss and Michele and others had a different experience.  I would not invalidate that because they have their own truth, and they see violence and danger around them.. 

The children and grandchildren of victims do not get a make-up  entitlement to become perpetrators.  

When more and more white people say "All lives matter" and mean it, this will be more than a great country, it will be magnificent.  We don't have to write up any new documents, just live up to the ones our forefathers wrote.

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Gwynbleidd
10 minutes ago, Tatetopa said:

When more and more white people say "All lives matter" and mean it, this will be more than a great country, it will be magnificent.  We don't have to write up any new documents, just live up to the ones our forefathers wrote.

I agree with all of the points you made Tatetopa, something very similar happened here to the Aboriginals.  It was something that happened 3 generations ago.  I do not believe people today should be responsible for what happened in the past.  We need to concentrate on the present and we have to get better in order to move forward.

It shouldn't just be white people saying "All Lives Matter", it needs to be EVERYONE.   Skin colour shouldn't enter the equation.  It doesn't need to be mentioned.  By mentioning it continuously, all we're doing, is making it worse.  To me, everyone is green - decisions shouldn't be made based upon skin colour. 

Sorry, getting off topic a bit. :) 

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Tatetopa
2 minutes ago, pixiii said:

I agree with all of the points you made Tatetopa, something very similar happened here to the Aboriginals.  It was something that happened 3 generations ago.  I do not believe people today should be responsible for what happened in the past.  We need to concentrate on the present and we have to get better in order to move forward.

It shouldn't just be white people saying "All Lives Matter", it needs to be EVERYONE.   Skin colour shouldn't enter the equation.  It doesn't need to be mentioned.  By mentioning it continuously, all we're doing, is making it worse.  To me, everyone is green - decisions shouldn't be made based upon skin colour. 

Sorry, getting off topic a bit. :) 

Excellent comment.  Yes it shouldn't matter, and maybe within your lifetime it will not.  

No we do not need to assume guilt for what our ancestors did, just be the best people we know how to be and our principles say we should be now.  

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skliss
9 hours ago, pixiii said:

t shouldn't just be white people saying "All Lives Matter", it needs to be EVERYONE.   Skin colour shouldn't enter the equation.  It doesn't need to be mentioned.  By mentioning it continuously, all we're doing, is making it worse.  To me, everyone is green - decisions shouldn't be made based upon skin colour. 

Exactly

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Gromdor
Posted (edited)

Well, except asylum seekers and immigrants.  Or perhaps that Khashoggi fellow.  Those people in Yemen.  The people in Puerto Rico.  The homeless.  I could go on, I suppose but it would be pretty pointless.

Oh yeah, might as well add all those vets that are committing  suicide in what seems to be an epidemic.

Edited by Gromdor
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Earl.Of.Trumps
On 8/24/2019 at 2:05 AM, Farmer77 said:

Agreed. In fact I was thinking his performance at the G-7 is likely to dictate if he gets any challengers at all.

I dont think anyone would have a shot at beating Trump in a primary but if there are undecided voters out there like foxnews keeps telling us there are it would be really nice if a conservative spent a few months during the primary explaining to them all the things wrong with Trump and Trumpism.

 

I think you will see Bill Weld give Trump a run just because "somebody has to do it".  He's likeable enough to Dems to get elected governor in dem stronghold, Massachusetts. And if he *did* upset Trump....? I wouldn't bet the farm on the Dem candidate winning, this guy is good.

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Earl.Of.Trumps
On 8/24/2019 at 6:40 AM, Farmer77 said:

IDK reading the article certainly made some dots connect for me as it relates to the sudden upswell of right wing support she received right around the first set of debates.

One on here in particular stood out to me who I know takes his guidance from those types.

If Trump was smart he'd offer Tulsi a place in his cabinet. 

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Earl.Of.Trumps
15 hours ago, South Alabam said:

It will probably come down to the last three of Harris, Biden, and Pocah  Warren..Like

No hope for Bernie...?  How can Dems turn him aside? After all, he promised to spend $16 trillion of *someone else's* money B)

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South Alabam
17 minutes ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

No hope for Bernie...?  How can Dems turn him aside? After all, he promised to spend $16 trillion of *someone else's* money B)

No. I figure In all seriousness, even Dems aren't that stupid.

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DieChecker
18 hours ago, pixiii said:

My apologies if anyone is offended by me saying ALL lives matter - Yes it is dumb @skliss - what makes black lives more important than asian and indian lives?  I'm fairly sure there would be a number of people who aren't black that find it offensive.  Asian Lives Matter.....Indian Lives Matter.  Could be onto something here. ;)    

At the end of the day we'd all bleed the same if stabbed.  Unless of course you wanna head down the lizardpeople path, but that's probably for a totally different section of the forums! :lol::P 

I think over time the movement will include everyone. Just as colleges started out with black student unions, but have multitudes of student unions now. Eventually "black lives matters" will morph into "everyone's lives matter". History shows this trend in almost everything.

It just that our, "NOW!", "TODAY!", culture doesn't want to wait for progress. It demands progress now... which hopefully we'll grow out of. 

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Farmer77
Posted (edited)
13 hours ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

I think you will see Bill Weld give Trump a run just because "somebody has to do it".  He's likeable enough to Dems to get elected governor in dem stronghold, Massachusetts. And if he *did* upset Trump....? I wouldn't bet the farm on the Dem candidate winning, this guy is good.

That would be exciting. Im not hung up on the party, hell id love to vote third party (as usual) if I thought they had a chance to win. If a repub came out honestly swinging at Trumpism and Moscow Mitch i would definitely consider voting for them.

 

Edited by Farmer77

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Farmer77

Stable Genius part deux?

 

Joe Biden: 'I want to be clear, I'm not going nuts'

Seems to me once one feels the need to discuss their own mental fitness theyre probably not mentally fit.

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Dumbledore the Awesome
On 8/24/2019 at 12:08 PM, pixiii said:

For a start imo, I don't feel it should be Black Lives Matter, it should be ALL Lives Matter.  

That's what Bernie said, and he was attacked as racist for it. :rolleyes: 

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