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Phaeton80

New Evidence Proves Israel Attacked USS Liber

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Tatetopa
11 minutes ago, and then said:

If today Israel determined that their "ally", America, was working to take them down with proxies, they would have my approval if they attacked the most proximate threats against themselves - even if that were the U.S. forces in theater. 

I can't feature the reason why this would be so. It seems near impossible.

Yet, if the US finds that it is for some unknown  reason in our best interest to take down Israel, nevertheless you would side with Israel in this circumstance.  That is certainly not wishy-washy.

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preacherman76
1 hour ago, and then said:

To what purpose?  Realistically, what would it gain them?

I don’t know. The only thing that possibly might make sense is they thought we had gathered intelligence pertaining to the war that was unfavorable. 

I really don’t know why though. Did you watch any of the video? I don’t know if any of this part is verified, but they have recordings of the Israel’s communications straight saying it was an American ship, and were talking about which one of them were gonna sink it  

The ship was clearly marked, and according to the American crew, Israel’s pilots had flown by several times that day. They were even waving to each other during the fly by’s. Seems impossible that they would just start bombing them hours later. 

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Hammerclaw

The most amusing thing about this charade is the idea the Israeli Air Force and Navy could attack and bomb a ship for hours and not sink it.

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and then
2 minutes ago, Hammerclaw said:

The most amusing thing about this charade is the idea the Israeli Air Force and Navy could attack and bomb a ship for hours and not sink it.

Indeed, a ship that couldn't even return their fire.

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preacherman76
17 minutes ago, Hammerclaw said:

The most amusing thing about this charade is the idea the Israeli Air Force and Navy could attack and bomb a ship for hours and not sink it.

What do you think happened? I mean there really was a bunch of dead sailors, and there really is a handful of survivors who told the story. Do you think they are lying? For what purpose?

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Gromdor

 

15 minutes ago, preacherman76 said:

What do you think happened? I mean there really was a bunch of dead sailors, and there really is a handful of survivors who told the story. Do you think they are lying? For what purpose?

Eh, they left a 39 ft by 24 ft hole in the hull, 34 dead Americans, and 171 wounded.  The belief was that Israel was trying to commit a false flag attack and blame Egypt but the USS Liberty didn't seem to want to sink fast enough. 

36 minutes ago, Hammerclaw said:

The most amusing thing about this charade is the idea the Israeli Air Force and Navy could attack and bomb a ship for hours and not sink it.

Here's a list of the dead with bio's and pictures if you want to click on them and laugh some more: http://www.ussliberty.org/casualty.htm

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Hammerclaw
1 hour ago, preacherman76 said:

What do you think happened? I mean there really was a bunch of dead sailors, and there really is a handful of survivors who told the story. Do you think they are lying? For what purpose?

I have no idea. Could be they thought it an Egyptian ship flying false colors. Whatever it was, false ID or paranoia tne Americans would warn the Arab States of their pre-emptive strikes, it was a bad call. If it weren't for the Holocaust pity points they had to spend and the geo-political situation, it could have cost them, dearly. Instead, it was explained away as attributable to the fog of war.

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Hammerclaw
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Gromdor said:

 

Eh, they left a 39 ft by 24 ft hole in the hull, 34 dead Americans, and 171 wounded.  The belief was that Israel was trying to commit a false flag attack and blame Egypt but the USS Liberty didn't seem to want to sink fast enough. 

Here's a list of the dead with bio's and pictures if you want to click on them and laugh some more: http://www.ussliberty.org/casualty.htm

I'm not disputing any of what is known to have happened, merely remarking on the apparent inability to sink a very sinkable  ship. It's like the military personal given the task were dragging their feet as much as they could, trying not to.

Edited by Hammerclaw

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Phaeton80
Posted (edited)
18 hours ago, pallidin said:

I see the pro-Islamic propaganda "war machine" against Israel and America is at it again (as always)

The entire thrust of the article are propoganda efforts to have Americans distrust Israel, so that as pro-Islamic militants continue attacks on Israel, America will do nothing.

That's all it is!!!!!!!

Edit: Just checked your "sources" and they are all pro-Islamic.

 


Typical fanboy response. Propaganda, as a rule, is not factual. These are unequivocal facts concerning a warcrime perpetrated on US servicemen, with the goal to kill with extreme prejudice full well knowing they were attacking a US vessel.

Heres a thought, instead of trying to prove the sources are 'pro Islamic', why not try and prove the veracity of the content. But thats not what fanboys do, they will defend the entity they fanatically support no matter the subject, no matter the crime. The opposite is true when it concerns their imagined enemy, they will readily accept any crimes, and rage against any nuancing and or conflicting input.

This is your profile.

If you would have actually read the supplied links, citations (which you structurally do not use in your own extremely subjective, one sided posts), you would realize the 'pro Islamic sources' position doesnt hold water (that is, for any rational human being):

Quote

Navy Admiral Thomas Moorer, who has served this country as Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff and Chief of Naval Operations, once lead an independent commission to investigate what really happened to the USS Liberty. The commission’s findings were made public in 2003. Here are a few of the shocking conclusions.

  • The attack, by a U.S. ally, was a deliberate attempt to destroy an American ship and kill its entire crew.
  • The attack included the machine-gunning of stretcher-bearers and life rafts .
  • The White House deliberately prevented the U.S. Navy from coming to the defense of the USS Liberty. This was the first time in naval history a rescue mission had been cancelled while an American ship was under attack.
  • Surviving crew members were later threatened with court-martial, imprisonment, or worse if they talked to anyone about what had happened to them; and were “abandoned by their own government.”


The OP is relevant because its only one instance of many where Israel employs false flag tactics to achieve geo political goals, and their most loyal ally is not left out of the crosshairs if it serves her.  And its relevant because its describes a template which shoud concern anyone today given the stark, extremely disconcerting implications of the goings on that day (not only regarding Israel criminal attack, but also regarding the reaction of the US government).

Edited by Phaeton80

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Phaeton80

Heres another instance of an Israeli false flag against US and British targets... No doubt some more 'pro Islamic' sourced 'propaganda', in the minds of some here..

Quote

The Lavon affair was a failed Israeli covert operation, codenamed Operation Susannah, conducted in Egypt in the summer of 1954. As part of the false flag operation,[1] a group of Egyptian Jews were recruited by Israeli military intelligence to plant bombs inside Egyptian-, American-, and British-owned civilian targets: cinemas, libraries and American educational centers. The bombs were timed to detonate several hours after closing time. The attacks were to be blamed on the Muslim Brotherhood, Egyptian Communists, "unspecified malcontents" or "local nationalists" with the aim of creating a climate of sufficient violence and instability to induce the British government to retain its occupying troops in Egypt's Suez Canal zone.[2] The operation caused no casualties among the population, but cost the lives of four operatives: two cell members who committed suicide after being captured; and two operatives who were tried, convicted, and executed by the Egyptian authorities.

The operation ultimately became known as the Lavon affair after the Israeli defense minister Pinhas Lavon was forced to resign as a consequence of the incident. Before Lavon's resignation, the incident had been euphemistically referred to in Israel as the "Unfortunate Affair" or "The Bad Business" (Hebrew: העסק הביש‎, HaEsek HaBish). Israel publicly denied any involvement in the incident for 51 years; however, the surviving agents were officially honored in 2005, being awarded certificates of appreciation by Israeli President Moshe Katsav.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lavon_Affair

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Phaeton80
Quote


June 09, 2019 "Information Clearing House" -  Two days ago the US celebrated the 75th anniversary of D-Day with accolades to the armed forces and thanks to surviving veterans.  The country stood strongly with the military.  But today two days later is the 52nd anniversary of a day of shame when Washington turned its back on the US Navy.  It was June 8, 1967 when the USS Liberty, a surveillance ship stationed off the coast of Egypt was attacked by Israeli fighter aircraft and torpedo boats.  The Israelis were unable to sink the Liberty, but managed to kill 34 American sailors and wound 174. Seventy percent of the crew were casualties of the Israeli attack.

The White House, fearing the Israel Lobby, prevented the US Navy from going to the defense of the Liberty, thus sacrificing American lives, and further dishonored the US Navy by ordering Admiral McCain, father of the former US Senator John McCain, to orchestrate a cover-up.  The surviving crew were threatened with court-martial and imprisonment if they spoke about the event.  It was 20 years before one of the surviving officers wrote a book about the greatest act of shame the US government ever inflicted on the US military.  

In 2003, 36 years after the Israeli attack on the Liberty, Admiral Tom Moorer, former Chief of Naval Operations and Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, convened the Independent Commission of Inquiry into the Israeli Attack on USS Liberty, the Recall of Military Rescue Support Aircraft while the Liberty was Under Attack, and the Subsequent Cover-up by the United States Government. The Commission consisted of Adm. Moorer, Gen. Raymond Davis, former Assistant Commandant of the US Marine Corps, Rear Adm. Merlin Staring, former Judge Advocate General of the US Navy, and Amb. James Akins, former US Ambassador to Saudi Arabia.

You can read the report online, here for example: https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/The_Moorer_Report 

The report is devastating.  Among the report’s conclusions, these stand out:

That due to the influence of Israel’s powerful supporters in the United States, the White House deliberately covered up the facts of this attack from the American people;

“That due to continuing pressure by the pro-Israel lobby in the United States, this attack remains the only serious naval incident that has never been thoroughly investigated by Congress; to this day, no surviving crewmember has been permitted to officially and publicly testify about the attack;

“That there has been an official cover-up without precedent in American naval history; the existence of such a cover-up is now supported by statements of Rear Admiral Merlin Staring, USN (Ret.), former Judge Advocate General of the Navy; and Captain Ward Boston, USN, (Ret.), the chief counsel to the Navy’s 1967 Court of Inquiry of Liberty attack;

“That the truth about Israel’s attack and subsequent White House cover-up continues to be officially concealed from the American people to the present day and is a national disgrace;

“That a danger to our national security exists whenever our elected officials are willing to subordinate American interests to those of any foreign nation, and specifically are unwilling to challenge Israel’s interests when they conflict with American interests; this policy, evidenced by the failure to defend USS Liberty and the subsequent official cover-up of the Israeli attack, endangers the safety of Americans and the security of the United States.”

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/51739.htm


You guessed it, more propaganda.. ^_^

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RoofGardener

I don't understand this. Granted that Israeli Air Force and Navy DID attack the liberty.. why did they do it ? 

We are supposed to believe that the Israeli high command ordered that the ship be sunk, with no survivors. And yet the Israeli forces failed to do this ? Why ? Surely if Israel really wanted the ship sunk, then they could have done it ? 

Secondly, what motive would the Israeli's have for deliberately sinking a US ship ? The 6-day war was almost over, so I find it hard to believe that Israel wanted the USA to get involved in a war with Egypt. And the theory that they wanted to prevent the ship listening in to radio chatter from the Sinai doesn't seem realistic ? 

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aztek

meh, lame

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Earl.Of.Trumps

I knew it was deliberate years ago. There may be more evidence now but what existed already was enough to deem Israel guilty.

President Lyndon Johnson expressed his dismay as did the CIA chief, and yet no retaliation?  This really is clear and cut evidence of the existence of a Deep State. Some powerful people put the kabosh on it.

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aztek

we know Israel is guilty, just as much as we know SA, and pak support terrorists, yet they are our ally, that is called politics.  it is full of backdoor deals, that we have no clue about, thus it does not add up.     

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Earl.Of.Trumps
1 hour ago, aztek said:

we know Israel is guilty, just as much as we know SA, and pak support terrorists, yet they are our ally, that is called politics.  it is full of backdoor deals, that we have no clue about, thus it does not add up.     

yup. It's because we have "professional" politicians at the helm.  They could give a rat's behind about America, it's all about their special interests and $$$$

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Phaeton80
On 10-6-2019 at 5:17 PM, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

I knew it was deliberate years ago. There may be more evidence now but what existed already was enough to deem Israel guilty.

President Lyndon Johnson expressed his dismay as did the CIA chief, and yet no retaliation?  This really is clear and cut evidence of the existence of a Deep State. Some powerful people put the kabosh on it.


Xactly. A clear indication of the real situation in the US government, where their loyalty lies, what their intentions are.. without all the blinders, without all the fluff.

Isnt it interesting though, that some of the usual suspects are passionately grasping / clinging to another explanation, even when the facts stare them straight in the kisser. Even going sofar as to attempt to disqualify this information based on 'pro Islamic sources'.

So very predictable.

 

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aztek
21 hours ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

yup. It's because we have "professional" politicians at the helm.  They could give a rat's behind about America, it's all about their special interests and $$$$

yea pretty much, but our politicians are not the only ones, pretty much every politician in the world is about enriching themselves and living on people's dime. ours are not that bad compared to others in the rest of the world

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Phaeton80
Posted (edited)
23 hours ago, aztek said:

yea pretty much, but our politicians are not the only ones, pretty much every politician in the world is about enriching themselves and living on people's dime. ours are not that bad compared to others in the rest of the world

 

Ah, thats allright then.

By all means, Play On (ie. keep sending our sons and daughters to die in your wars, keep robbing me and mine on unimaginable scale, and keep taking our rights away step by step)!

:mellow:

Edited by Phaeton80

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aztek
Posted (edited)
4 minutes ago, Phaeton80 said:

 

Ah, thats allright then.

By all means, Play On (ie. keep sending our sons and daughters to die in your wars, keep robbing me and mine on unimaginable scale, and keep taking our rights away step by step)!

:mellow:

yea, all of that and much more,  and i could not care less how a hater half the world away feels about it,.

Edited by aztek

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Phaeton80
5 minutes ago, aztek said:

yea, all of that and much more,  and i could not care less how a hater half the world away feels about it,.


Well said aztek, well said.

You know if it wasnt for your unrelenting coherent, critical, thoughtful responses 'round here, it would all be a rather dull exercise..

Thanks!

 

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aztek
1 hour ago, Phaeton80 said:


Well said aztek, well said.

You know if it wasnt for your unrelenting coherent, critical, thoughtful responses 'round here, it would all be a rather dull exercise..

Thanks!

 

you get exactly what you deserve

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Phaeton80
Posted (edited)

Found a referral to an interesting book describing the supposed reason of (A) the attack on the Liberty and (B) the lack of US support after being attacked.

Quote

Since it reviewed A. Jay Cristol's book, THE LIBERTY INCIDENT, in August 2003, MILITARY HISTORY was bombarded with letters, including some from outraged survivors, insisting that the Israeli attack on their ship on June 8, 1967, was not in error, but deliberate (see letters, P. 8), and demanding that the guilty party confess to the crime.  Absent from all such accusations, however, was a substantial explanation of motive:  What would make it worth Israel's while to attack a ship -- even a spy ship -- being operated by one of its few supporters in the world?

"President Lyndon B. Johnson and some key officials, seeing the increasingly Soviet-leaning Egyptian President Gamel Abdel Nasser as a threat, made secret arrangements to help Israel in its coming June offensive with the intention of toppling Nasser.

"As part of Operation Cyanide, USS LIBERTY was sent to operate off the Sinai coast, where it was to be sunk with all hands by unmarked Israeli aircraft and torpedo boats, after which the United States would blame the attack on Egypt and launch carrier airstrikes against Cairo...
 
"The stubborn refusal of LIBERTY'S crew to die or let their ship sink after 75 minutes of air and sea attack - in spite of two American carrier sorties to aid her being inexplicably called back - led to the cancellation of Operation Cyanide, Israel's apology and offer of restitution for a 'tragic mistake,' the Johnson Administration's swift acceptance of that explanation and an equally quick, reassuring 'hot line' telephone call to Soviet premierAlexei Kosygin."

https://www.amazon.com/Operation-Cyanide-Bombing-Liberty-Nearly/dp/1904132197


 

Quote

BOOK REVIEW OF "OPERATION CYANIDE"
                             By John Simpson
                         BBC World Affairs Editor
                   
     This is an extraordinary story, one of the most extraordinary, perhaps, of
     the entire twentieth century.  Suppose, in an attempt to shore up his
     critically damaged presidency, Lyndon Johnson deliberately engineered an
     event in which American lives were sacrificed and the United States was
     brought disturbingly close to an all-out nuclear war with Russia?  Suppose
     this involved a secret agreement between Israel and American intelligence,
     which resulted in an Israeli attack on an American naval vessel, in the
     latter stages of the Six-Day War?
     
     It sounds, I know, like one of those depressing conspiracy theories which
     cluster round every big controversial event from the death of Princess
     Diana to the attack on the World Trade Centre.  People often have problems
     in handling the banality of truth, and prefer to imagine deeper, darker
     plots beneath the surface.  Yet this book is based on careful, rigorous
     investigation by a well-known and respected journalist who has metic-
     ulously tracked down the people and the documents who have survived from
     the event itself: the attack on the USS Liberty, in the eastern Mediter-
     ranean in June 1967.

     Yet this is the official version, which stands to this day.  Any other
     version -- that of the Liberty's surviving crew members, for instance --
     has been extremely hard to establish because of the intensity of the
     security blanket which the Israelis and Americans wrapped around the
     entire incident.
     
     The blanket remains in place to this day, yet this book provides
     sufficient evidence for any open-minded person to see that something
     else lies underneath:  something very disturbing.
     
     I have found Peter Hounam's research compelling, and the story which
     unfolds in these pages rivetting.  It is time a little daylight was
     shed on Operation Cyanide.  This book does precisely that, and we
     should be grateful for it.

https://aldeilis.net/english/operation-cyanide-book-reviews/

 

Edited by Phaeton80

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Phaeton80

And another interesting piece about one of the USS Liberty's hero's..

The attack by unflagged gunboats (stolen from France) and planes (gifted by the US) were meant to get the US to believe it was an attack by Egypt with hopes that the US would attack Cairo. A heroic effort by Seaman Terry Halbardier changed the situation to such an extent it thwarted the whole (intended) scenario. The deck was still being strafed, but Halbardier who "grabbed a reel of cable, ran out onto the deck, and attached new cable to the antenna so a radioman could get an SOS out to the Sixth Fleet in the Mediterranean." which stopped the Israeli attack.

Quote

A USS Liberty’s Hero’s Passing

Terry Halbardier, who as a 23-year old seaman in 1967 thwarted Israeli attempts to sink the USS Liberty, died on Aug. 11 in Visalia, California. It took the U.S. government 42 years after the attack to recognize Halbardier’s heroism by awarding him the Silver Star, a delay explained by Washington’s determination to downplay Israeli responsibility for the 34 Americans killed and the 174 wounded.

On June 8, 1967, during the Six-Day War, the Israeli military attacked the USS Liberty, an American spy ship which had been monitoring Israeli transmissions about the conflict. Intercepted Israeli communications indicated that the goal was to sink the Liberty and leave no survivors.

Warplanes and torpedo boats had already killed 34 and wounded 174, when Halbardier slid over the Liberty’s napalm-glazed deck to jury-rig an antenna and get an SOS off to the Sixth Fleet.  The Israelis intercepted the SOS and broke off the attack immediately. In effect, Halbardier prevented the massacre of all 294 onboard. Still, the infamy of the attack on the Liberty was two-fold.

First, the Liberty, a virtually defenseless intelligence collection platform prominently flying an American flag in international waters, came under deliberate attack by Israeli aircraft and three 60-ton Israeli torpedo boats off the coast of the Sinai on a cloudless June afternoon during the six-day Israeli-Arab war. Second, President Lyndon Johnson called back carrier aircraft dispatched to defend the Liberty lest Israel be embarrassed, the start of an unconscionable cover-up, including top Navy brass, that persists to this day.

[..]

Just a Guy From Texas

Were it not for Halbardier’s bravery, ingenuity, and technical expertise, the USS Liberty would surely have sunk, taking down much if not all of the crew.

You see, the first thing the Israeli aircraft bombed and strafed were the Liberty’s communications antennae and other equipment. They succeeded in destroying all the antennae that were functional. One antenna on the port side, though, had been out of commission and had escaped damage.

In receiving the Silver Star, Halbardier made light of his heroism, claiming that he was just a guy from Texas who could do a whole lot with simple stuff like baling wire. (In the infantry we called this kind of thing a “field expedient.”)

In any case, with his can-do attitude and his technical training, he figured he might be able to get that particular antenna working again. But first he would have to repair a cable that had been destroyed on deck and then connect the antenna to a transmitter.

The deck was still being strafed, but Halbardier grabbed a reel of cable, ran out onto the deck, and attached new cable to the antenna so a radioman could get an SOS out to the Sixth Fleet in the Mediterranean.

https://www.lewrockwell.com/2019/06/no_author/a-uss-libertys-heros-passing/

 

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Phaeton80
Posted (edited)

Hmmm.. some more fascinating content about the subject at hand..

"According to Karl Liebknecht (1871-1919) the real purpose of war is to "Subordinate the mass of ones own domestic population to exploitation at the hands of the dominant class." If we accept this as true, then can we reason forward from the known facts as to what may have been the real reason for the attempt to sink the USS Liberty? Fighter planes were dispatched from an aircraft carrier in the gulf, armed with nuclear bombs headed for Cairo to drop them. Because the Liberty did not sink, they were recalled.

In the light of Peter Hounams excellent book, can we not surmise that the sinking of the USS Liberty was a planned triggering event that would lead to a much wider war? Frontlet 615 was the cover name for the project that involved the sinking of the USS Liberty and events to follow.."
 

Quote

Top-Tier Treason and the USS Liberty

Phillip F. Nelson’s new book, Remember the Liberty! Almost Sunk by Treason on the High Seas,* seeks to out the American politicians responsible for the planning, execution, and cover-up of the Israeli attack on the USS Liberty in 1967. In tracing the planning of the June 8 attack back to 1965, Nelson has written a work that holds President Lyndon B. Johnson and Secretary of Defense Robert McNamara responsible.
 

In 1979 Liberty survivor James M. Ennes Jr. wrote the first full treatment concerning the Israeli assault on the unarmed U.S. naval ship. After the release of his book, Ennes pursued further research at the LBJ Library in Austin, Texas. Within that research, Ennes found a misfiled document that detailed the minutes of a meeting held by a “303 Committee” in April 1967. The 303 Committee was responsible for all covert CIA operations within the Johnson administration.

The 303 Committee consisted of CIA director Richard Helms, former ambassador to the Soviet Union Foy Kohler, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff General Earle Wheeler, Deputy Secretary of Defense Cyrus Vance, and National Security Adviser Walt Rostow. Rostow also headed a separate White House group that consisted of Johnson’s most adamantly Zionist advisors.

McNamara was often used by LBJ as the key liaison and chief executioner of the covert operations birthed by the 303 Committee and the other groups.

The minutes of the 303 Committee meeting—held two months before the attack on the Liberty—referenced an operation called “Frontlet 615.” Operation Cyanide was found within the subparts of Frontlet 615. The 303 Committee used Frontlet 615 as a code name for the pending Six-Day War between Israel and Egypt. As planned, the war was scheduled to begin on June 15. The Americans had agreed to provide equipment, officer training, and the limited use of aircraft to the Israelis.

http://americanfreepress.net/top-tier-treason-and-the-uss-liberty/


https://www.liveleak.com/view?i=bf9_1487354774

Disinformation or truth? Im inclined to presume the latter.. given the larger context, ie. Gulf of Tonkin facts being in line with this scenario. It certainly fits the pattern.

http://www.ussliberty.org/cyanide.htm

http://www.ussliberty.org/submarine.txt

Edited by Phaeton80

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