The Atlantis Research Charter

[cormac mac airt]

6 minutes ago, Pettytalk said:

There are multiple representations for some of the descriptions that will fit logically, as the picture becomes more apparent. Don't get tripped by exactness, nor expect precise description in wanting the details to match verbatim. The reason why the rings of land and water were given as circles, is to also identify the capital of Atlantis, after it is understood that one indication is for the 5 Great lakes. We will note that the design is as a typical target. Also the symbol for the capital. Nowhere on earth will we find, to that scale, a natural formation of a combination of water and land resembling perfect circles of land nor of bands of water obviously the capital of Atlantis is Washington DC. And some of the other descriptions will be, specifically fit for DC and not the Great Lakes.

If you had followed me fully, I was pointing point out that we go from generals to more specific details as the story and descriptions progress. We started with the two Americas as being all of Atlantis to then only the territories of the first twins, and finally down to only Atlas' territory, the USA. At that near final stage the brothers of Atlas become the representation of the 13 States forming the First Newborn independent Nation of the New World, and Atlas becomes the Federal US Government.

We can discuss about the reason for Plato's use of the term, island, for Atlantis another day, as it's very late where I find myself currently, and I'm signing off since I have to up at the crack of dawn to perform a few tasks that i cannot put off. This will give anyone interested in discussing my nonsense plenty of time to mull over what has been put out so far.

Please note that I stated, INTERESTED. But for those not interested, I guess you can either ignore me, if you can, or just continue, as per protocol.

καληνυχτα

I'm not interested in following you, I'm interested in what Plato detailed in his writings as it compares to actual geography and history and as it stands you've grossly misrepresented what he wrote to the point of being irrelevant to any conversation of Atlantis. 

cormac

Edited July 12, 2019 by cormac mac airt

[Hanslune]

1 hour ago, RabidMongoose said:

Your translation is off. It says in ancient times there were a group of islands in the North Atlantic that allowed travel back and forth between Atlantis and Europe. Again, the true ocean does not exist `outside of Atlantis` you can see it on Greek and Roman maps. It is quite cleared marked and refers to the water mass surrounding Europe, Africa, and Asia.

Chuckle - okay. Please link us to this other translation please.

[Hanslune]

41 minutes ago, Pettytalk said:

There are multiple representations for some of the descriptions that will fit logically, as the picture becomes more apparent. Don't get tripped by exactness, nor expect precise description in wanting the details to match verbatim. The reason why the rings of land and water were given as circles, is to also identify the capital of Atlantis, after it is understood that one indication is for the 5 Great lakes. We will note that the design is as a typical target. Also the symbol for the capital. Nowhere on earth will we find, to that scale, a natural formation of a combination of water and land resembling perfect circles of land nor of bands of water obviously the capital of Atlantis is Washington DC. And some of the other descriptions will be, specifically fit for DC and not the Great Lakes.

If you had followed me fully, I was pointing point out that we go from generals to more specific details as the story and descriptions progress. We started with the two Americas as being all of Atlantis to then only the territories of the first twins, and finally down to only Atlas' territory, the USA. At that near final stage the brothers of Atlas become the representation of the 13 States forming the First Newborn independent Nation of the New World, and Atlas becomes the Federal US Government.

We can discuss about the reason for Plato's use of the term, island, for Atlantis another day, as it's very late where I find myself currently, and I'm signing off since I have to up at the crack of dawn to perform a few tasks that i cannot put off. This will give anyone interested in discussing my nonsense plenty of time to mull over what has been put out so far.

Please note that I stated, INTERESTED. But for those not interested, I guess you can either ignore me, if you can, or just continue, as per protocol.

καληνυχτα

 

The term you used above is from modern Greek based on Koine which is based on the Alexandrian version of Attic while ancient Attic speaking Greeks would have said Ὑγίαινε! or in the plural Ὑγιαίνετε! Think old English version modern English.

It is clear you don't know what you are talking about. You have been caught in a number of embarrassing mistakes and failed attempts to pretend you were Plato - why would anyone be interested in what someone like yourself might make up?

I would recommend taking your lame stage show to Above Top Secret, Graham Hancock's Forum or Crystal links were they actually LIKE this kind of creative ****e.

Edited to add: However if you like being lambasted then you can take this to the Hall of Ma'at Ancient History sub-forum or even Historum.

 

Edited July 12, 2019 by Hanslune

[jaylemurph]

2 hours ago, Pettytalk said:

Now in this island of Atlantis there was a great and wonderful empire which had rule over the whole island and several others, and over parts of the continent, (Alaska too)

 

 

 

2 hours ago, RabidMongoose said:

The USA does.

...last time I checked, Canada and Mexico, you know, /existed/. Making the US — which is not and never has been an empire — not an island and North America in toto is not US property. 

So that basic application of common sense has killed this asinine “theory.” As if someone who claims to be both Jesus and Plato needed outside debunking. 

—Jaylemurph 

[docyabut2]

Quote

If  Atlantis was a Solon  poem ,   trying to find it by his poems.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solon

 

 

[Kenemet]

11 hours ago, RabidMongoose said:

A `Place in the Heart` is central to both Christianity and Judaism. 

I have never seen/heard this phrase used in reference to Christianity or Judaism and I can't find any links that show it as a philosophical point.  Could you provide me with some links and a definition?

[Kenemet]

21 hours ago, Pettytalk said:

Well well! You sure are going far away from your field of studies. Be careful about frequenting those sites you linked, as you may become tainted with all that nonsense, and the next thing may be that you'll be claiming to be Cleopatra, or Messalina, Claudius' wife. 

But as far as knowing, only God knows....remember your Plato?

And as far as free will, my dear Kenemet, we have it only when choosing a new life before we are born again. Because once we are here, all we can do is follow the life we chose for ourselves.

However, they merit investigating even if only to say "not Plato."  I don't simply accept the word of someone who walks up and proclaims to be whoever or who has a message/prophecy from someone or something.  You can't evaluate something without knowledge of that thing, and one method to do so is to collect all things with the same label ("Form" in a Socratic sense, if I read that book correctly) and compare them with each other.  

Hence it seems to be logical to compare the claims of one Plato against another and those against the original.  At least, this is the only way I can think of to test "which one is the real one, if any."

 

[Kenemet]

3 hours ago, RabidMongoose said:

There is another possible source of information on Atlantis.

The Roman death myths about the ferryman coming to collect them. It includes a story of two rivers surrounding the world with a large land mass outside of it. I will find a link tomorrow, its late.

I think you're confusing it with something else.  There were five rivers in the afterlife (other versions have the River Styx encircling it nine times.)

[Kenemet]

22 hours ago, Pettytalk said:

And as far as free will, my dear Kenemet, we have it only when choosing a new life before we are born again. Because once we are here, all we can do is follow the life we chose for ourselves.

However, this appears to be a very contradictory stance.

You either have a completely deterministic universe or a completely "free will" universe.  You can't mix them.  Deterministic timelines mean that everything (even when you eat something or where you step and how many bookworms there are to devour an old text) must be in the right place at the right time.  Even the tiniest bit of "free will" throws the whole thing into chaos (complete free will) at some point. 

In a free will universe, your ability to predict is extremely limited to things that occur a short distance into the future and rely on a specific set of circumstances (i.e., "if you step out of a submarine in the middle of the Marianas Trench you will die.")  But you can't predict "on March 21, 2585 someone  named Graham Hancock will drive a Lamborghini over Niagara Falls at 5 pm" unless you live in a deterministic universe and you were fated to know certain events.

Since there can't be any free will in a clockwork universe, the concept of good and evil does not exist (things and people simply do what they are fated to do, so it can't be either good or evil (though people can be programmed to think of these actions as good or evil.)  There is no "self control" and there is no "self examination" because the results were pre-programmed into the universe.

The deities of this universe must also be clockwork because any free will that the deity had would destroy the foundation of the universe.  Even after death there could not be a free choice; only a fated choice.

Hence the idea of choosing in the afterlife violates the idea of a clockwork universe.. and only with a clockwork universe is accurate prophecy possible.

[Jarocal]

8 minutes ago, Kenemet said:

 

Hence the idea of choosing in the afterlife violates the idea of a clockwork universe.. and only with a clockwork universe is accurate prophecy possible.

But it would still be possible in a multiverse.

Edited July 13, 2019 by Jarocal

[Piney]

7 minutes ago, Jarocal said:

But it would still be possible in a multiverse.

       *HEADSLAP*

 

 

[stereologist]

10 hours ago, Pettytalk said:

I may be a bumbler with my story telling and explaining, since I'm uneducated, but never a mangler.

Is not the great plain of Atlantis in Atlas' territory of a rectangular form of 3,000 x 2,000 stadia? Is not the USA a sort of a rectangular shape with nearly those dimensions, if we substitute the mile in place of a stadia? Roughly 3,000 miles east-west, and nearly 2,000 miles north-south. And is not the figure 50 mentioned quite a lot?  But the kicker is why there were 100 Nereids instead of the official mythological number of 50? Plato is giving another corroborating clue, but that is another matter for the future "mangling"of the Atlantean political system, and not its current geographical "mangling."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AGTh-WUWwak

 

You are mangling. You want to replace one unit with another. You want to call a shape that  is not a rectangle that shape.

All of this mangling leads to nothing more than a pathetic joke.

[stereologist]

9 hours ago, Piney said:

If "Atlantis" is representative of the United States being punished for not following Jesus, and the story starts during the glacial retreat.@stereologist  I'm curious how the Native American genocide fits in all this? 

Just listening to analysis from a group in the UK. The western hemisphere genocide leads to global cooling.

[Piney]

6 minutes ago, stereologist said:

Just listening to analysis from a group in the UK. The western hemisphere genocide leads to global cooling.

I have the original paper on one of these laptops.

It's not surprising. When Verrazano cruised down the East Coast of NA prior to the die off. He could see and smell the smoke 5 miles out. 

Edited July 13, 2019 by Piney
**** Atlantis!!

[+Pettytalk]

Nearly everyone is jumping the gun. Rome was not built in a day. Neither can the truth of the story of Atlantis be the conveyed all at once, and to all. it does take a little preparation on the part of the listeners. Like with some of the difficult courses and subjects at those higher learning institutions, there are some mandatory prerequisites that must be met, before being allowed to enroll and attend them. 

There are many prerequisites before anyone can just throw out some senseless critique at the material being presented. And since my proposal and theme for the truth on Atlantis is one on the nature of future prophecy from divine Providence, it behooves those who are intent on active participation, to assure they have the necessary clear understanding of the proposition.

There is no need, as I have repeated, to keep citing history to contradict Plato's ability to know matters and events which were impossible for him to know, since they are dealing with future events that would only take place and develop around 2,000 years later. We all get it, and also the logical objections. But it's prophecy, primarily, the subject of Plato's Atlantis story.

Therefore, besides needing to be very familiar with Plato's work, the listeners need to really grasp the concept and nature of divine prophecy. And without being any sort of preaching, since it's only for an example, I'm just going to point out a couple of points on the nature of prophecy, which I have copied from a source on the net for easy reference, since I'm delaying my work schedule for the day, just to post this clarification.  I believe these points cover a little of the objections raised. 

The Language of Prophecy

If one is to accurately interpret Bible prophecy, he must surely recognize that language of predictive literature can be either literal or figurative. But how does one determine the nature of prophetic terminology? In some instances common sense will dictate the character of the prophecy. If a literal view implies an impossibility or an absurdity, it is obviously figurative. The context will frequently shed light on the situation. In many instances, the issue will be settled by how the New Testament writers (who quote or cite the prophecies) viewed the matter. When Old Testament writers declared that Christ would be the offspring of Abraham (Genesis 22:18), or that he would be raised from the dead (Psalm 16:10), they made straightforward predictions that were fulfilled literally.

However, when Isaiah announced that John the Baptizer would “make level in the desert a highway for our God” (40:3), he was not suggesting that John would engineer a freeway project in the Palestinian wilderness; rather, the language was a symbolic description of John’s preparatory work preliminary to the ministry of Jesus (cf. Matthew 3:1ff). When the prophet foretold that “the lion shall eat straw like an ox” (Isaiah 11:7), he was not suggesting that Jehovah intended to redesign the dental/digestive processes of the animal kingdom in the alleged “millennial” age. He was figuratively suggesting the peaceful atmosphere that would be characteristic of the church of Christ as the various nations flowed into it (cf. Isaiah 11:10; Romans 15:12). Thus, it is vital that the nature of the language in biblical prophecy be correctly identified.

The Prophet and His Generation

Liberal critics of the Bible deny the reality of predictive prophecy (as well as other miraculous elements in the Scriptures). Frequently they ask: “What relevance would the prophecy have had to an antique generation which would never see it fulfilled?” It is for this reason that they desperately seek some application which would be contemporary with the prophet himself (as, for example, postulating a young maiden of Isaiah’s day who would conform to his virgin-birth prophecy—7:14). The fact is, some prophecies had no immediate relevance to their contemporary generation. Those ancients would not fully understand the predictions—except dimly through the eye of faith. Abraham, through prophecy, was promised that his seed would receive Canaan for an inheritance, though he himself never saw the fulfillment (cf. Genesis 15:12ff; Hebrews 11:8-16).

 

[Swede]

1 hour ago, Pettytalk said:

 which I have copied from a source on the net for easy reference...

 

1) You are yet again guilty of the sin of plagiarism. Do consult professional and forum guidelines and strictures in regards to such practices. Your intellectual theft comes from the following source:

https://www.christiancourier.com/articles/35-principles-of-bible-prophecy

This source also includes the following:

Exact fulfillment, not merely a high degree of probability, must characterize the prediction. A prophet who is eighty percent accurate is no prophet at all!

https://www.christiancourier.com/articles/35-principles-of-bible-prophecy

Thus you have repeatedly, on these pages, contradicted the very source that you cite.

.

[Piney]

6 hours ago, Pettytalk said:

Nearly everyone is jumping the gun. Rome was not built in a day. Neither can the truth of the story of Atlantis be the conveyed all at once, and to all. it does take a little preparation on the part of the listeners.

 

Gee, I never had to "prepare" students for a class or lecture. 

Somebody really thinks he's something special and wants to start a cult following. 

[Hanslune]

56 minutes ago, Piney said:

 

Gee, I never had to "prepare" students for a class or lecture. 

Somebody really thinks he's something special and wants to start a cult following. 

I was military and civilian instructor for three plus decades. If you cannot get your point across you shouldn't be trying to teach. Yeah as you say he wants to be popular or somethin'.

[Hanslune]

8 hours ago, Pettytalk said:

Delete a lot of stuff that has nothing to do with PT

 

Dude you ain't no prophet.

[Hanslune]

7 hours ago, Swede said:

1) You are yet again guilty of the sin of plagiarism. Do consult professional and forum guidelines and strictures in regards to such practices. Your intellectual theft comes from the following source:

https://www.christiancourier.com/articles/35-principles-of-bible-prophecy

This source also includes the following:

Exact fulfillment, not merely a high degree of probability, must characterize the prediction. A prophet who is eighty percent accurate is no prophet at all!

https://www.christiancourier.com/articles/35-principles-of-bible-prophecy

Thus you have repeatedly, on these pages, contradicted the very source that you cite.

.

Well done - Tusen tack

 

 

[Piney]

14 minutes ago, Hanslune said:

I was military and civilian instructor for three plus decades. If you cannot get your point across you shouldn't be trying to teach. Yeah as you say he wants to be popular or somethin'.

The worst part is he's treating academics like stupid children. He's completely mental. 

[Harte]

19 hours ago, jaylemurph said:

It's pathetic to watch petty stumble around, but he surely deserves what he's asking for.

-Jaylemurph 

I'm no longer watching it.

But I still agree.

Harte

[Piney]

9 hours ago, Pettytalk said:

Like with some of the difficult courses and subjects at those higher learning institutions, there are some mandatory prerequisites that must be met, before being allowed to enroll and attend them. 

This is a joke.....

[Harte]

17 hours ago, RabidMongoose said:

Sorry, but where is the contradiction?

On the Earliest Roman and Greek maps they call the water mass surrounding your map the river that surrounds the world. The world ocean. Taken in that context we can read that Plato says Atlantis was a continent outside the world ocean, was a vast continent bigger than Libya and Asia (or the size they thought it was at the time) and that is the Americas.

You also have submerged islands in the North Atlantic which would have been above sea level at the end of the last Ice Age. No other land mass is large enough to fit the description because Serres (China) was known about and shown on their maps.

There are no submerged islands in the North Atlantic that are known to have been above sea level at the end of the last ice age.

There are some basically flat seamounts that might have been AT or NEAR sea level at that time. And they would have been quite small.

Harte

[Duke Wellington]

2 minutes ago, Harte said:

There are no submerged islands in the North Atlantic that are known to have been above sea level at the end of the last ice age.

There are some basically flat seamounts that might have been AT or NEAR sea level at that time. And they would have been quite small.

Harte

There are two sets of islands that are only a few hundred feet below the surface.