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darkmoonlady

If Jesus was a god his death wasn't a sacrifi

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DieChecker
1 hour ago, eight bits said:

Well, Odin-Wotan hung on the World Tree (Yggdrasil ... and people complain about English spelling), but that may have been influenced by the Christian story.

Myself, I think late Norse mythology was heavily influenced by Christianity, which had been trying to make inroads into northern Europe for around a thousand years by that time.

Balder is resurrected after the End Times battle to lead a blessed few into paradise. Odin, "The All Father", hung on a tree. Monsters showing up for the Ragnarok. A trickster enemy, Loki/Satan, who really is just doing his job....

(WHAT? Autocorrect doesn't know Ragnarok?)

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Desertrat56
12 minutes ago, DieChecker said:

Myself, I think late Norse mythology was heavily influenced by Christianity, which had been trying to make inroads into northern Europe for around a thousand years by that time.

Balder is resurrected after the End Times battle to lead a blessed few into paradise. Odin, "The All Father", hung on a tree. Monsters showing up for the Ragnarok. A trickster enemy, Loki/Satan, who really is just doing his job....

(WHAT? Autocorrect doesn't know Ragnarok?)

Wow!  Really?

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eight bits
36 minutes ago, lightly said:

  Saints be praised !

Be very careful about Acharaya S (D.M. Murdock) as a source for anything.

However, there is a Borgian Codex image that I'm sure will interest you:

https://digi.vatlib.it/view/MSS_Borg.mess.1

click on page 72 in the array of thumbnails, and check out the guy in the lower right quadrant.

Is that really an image of a "crucified god"? That's way above my pay grade :)

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odas
16 hours ago, XenoFish said:

Have you ever thought about how much energy that's put toward religion. The mental, physical, and emotional energy spent into believing. All the hours in prayer, in devotion? Can you imagine all of that energy and time put into just being a decent human being? Without all the hangups. Prayers might make people feel good about doing nothing, I'd rather do something. Instead of wishing for it. How much does religion divide people? Group A hates Group B. People fight over ideologies, how about putting that energy into something constructive? 

I think a lot about stuff like that. How many who've prayed for world peace, without ever being a peaceful person. Short of temper and swift to judge. Self-righteous all because some book told them they were special...

Religion divides us. Definitely. But so does everything else. Nationality, skin color, eye color, language..you name it.

Must be something in our Genes.

But, I noticed, that people who do not follow any organized religion are far more generous, welcoming and honest.

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danydandan
3 hours ago, odas said:

But, I noticed, that people who do not follow any organized religion are far more generous, welcoming and honest.

I doubt that,.

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GlitterRose

The blood atonement thing has always bothered me. 

Why not just forgive people? I mean...isn't that what the bible tells us to do?

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GlitterRose

In effect, is Jesus asking people to do something that God isn't capable of?  

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XenoFish
4 hours ago, odas said:

Religion divides us. Definitely. But so does everything else. Nationality, skin color, eye color, language..you name it.

The less stumbling blocks the better I say.

Must be something in our Genes.

Could very well be.

But, I noticed, that people who do not follow any organized religion are far more generous, welcoming and honest.

I'm not sure about that. But, perhaps their motivations are more honest?

 

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Jodie.Lynne
4 hours ago, danydandan said:

I doubt that,.

why?

I would that secular people who help others, would be doing so out of truer motivation to help their fellow humans, without expectation of reward (either earthly or 'heavenly').

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Jodie.Lynne
3 hours ago, GlitterRose said:

In effect, is Jesus asking people to do something that God isn't capable of?  

In a word?

 

Yes.

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lightly

....thanks eight bits,  I guess I had a premature excitation ...  and got a bit WOOsy   :P

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Sojo

Just to throw my 2 cents worth on this topic, Christ experienced physical, mental, and spiritual death.  I believe he suffered guilt, shame, and condemnation to a degree we cannot fathom. He was willing to experience this ultimate torment for both humankind and God. He further had sufficient love and faith to not only be willing to be the one to do so for us, but also attain the power of resurrection from death.

Christ has the power to forgive karmic debt. Those who are willing to believe this and accept his experience, and have enough faith to ask for that forgiveness, can receive it and forgo karmic retribution for their sins.  But, no one is forced to do so. If one so chooses, they may continue to learn their lessons and pay their debts from life to life.

As for those who have problems with the fact that there are numerous galaxies, planets, and worlds in the universe, be mindful he experienced it for us.  (And it also gives God that experience and perspective from his life/death as well.) There is likely additional understanding to be had about what it means to be (a) Christ, but that's a whole 'nother topic.

Sojo

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odas
20 hours ago, danydandan said:

I doubt that,.

Emphasize is on "organized".

They might not follow any mainstreem organized religion but they might be spiritually religious. 

Privately, I am not very organized, therefore..

But I still know where to find what I need.

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XenoFish
4 hours ago, Sojo said:

Just to throw my 2 cents worth on this topic, Christ experienced physical, mental, and spiritual death.  I believe he suffered guilt, shame, and condemnation to a degree we cannot fathom. He was willing to experience this ultimate torment for both humankind and God. He further had sufficient love and faith to not only be willing to be the one to do so for us, but also attain the power of resurrection from death.

Christ has the power to forgive karmic debt. Those who are willing to believe this and accept his experience, and have enough faith to ask for that forgiveness, can receive it and forgo karmic retribution for their sins.  But, no one is forced to do so. If one so chooses, they may continue to learn their lessons and pay their debts from life to life.

It's all a story book tale of a demi-god known as Jesus. That's it. Karmic debt doesn't exist. It's a good way to get people to join a cult though. Forgiveness for your sins for the low price of complete devotion to just another cult of ego. Join now or go to hell. 

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Liquid Gardens
4 hours ago, Sojo said:

I believe he suffered guilt, shame, and condemnation to a degree we cannot fathom.

Why would he suffer guilt or shame, he's usually held up as the one sinless individual?  Without sin, what is there to be guilty or ashamed of?  To that extent, we suffer a degree of shame and guilt that he can't really ever fathom.

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danydandan
17 hours ago, Jodie.Lynne said:

why?

I would that secular people who help others, would be doing so out of truer motivation to help their fellow humans, without expectation of reward (either earthly or 'heavenly').

Because there are bad and good people everywhere and in every walk of life. To say that there might be a slight bit more of a percentage of 'nice' people who fall into the irreligious group I think is erroneous. 

I reckon you would find the same ratio of 'nice' : 'not-nice' in most cases. Obviously there are extremes. But you get my point I think?

1 hour ago, odas said:

Emphasize is on "organized".

They might not follow any mainstreem organized religion but they might be spiritually religious. 

Privately, I am not very organized, therefore..

But I still know where to find what I need.

I'm sorry, I'm not following you here. 

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danydandan
3 minutes ago, Liquid Gardens said:

he's usually held up by a cross.

I know I'm bold, but that made me laugh.

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lightly
17 hours ago, Jodie.Lynne said:

why?

I would that secular people who help others, would be doing so out of truer motivation to help their fellow humans, without expectation of reward (either earthly or 'heavenly').

I guess I must be dim.. What would you say it is that motivates people to help someone else? ..without expectation of reward?

     Compassion?  Love? 

...even if someone does it just to make themselves feel better about themselves ..that's still a "reward"?

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XenoFish
2 minutes ago, lightly said:

I guess I must be dim.. What would you say it is that motivates people to help someone else? ..without expectation of reward?

     Compassion?  Love? 

...even if someone does it just to make themselves feel better about themselves ..that's still a "reward"?

Sometimes helping others generates positive feelings. That is a reward to some. Being nice because it feels nice. 

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danydandan
3 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

Sometimes helping others generates positive feelings. That is a reward to some. Being nice because it feels nice. 

There is an old Irish saying.

"It's nice to be nice"

I agree with it.

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third_eye

I guess JC ain't coming back now, for sure... Too bad he ain't reading this here thread, if he did, he's be back so quick, he be knocking on everybody's door at the very same time. 

~

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lightly
1 minute ago, XenoFish said:

Sometimes helping others generates positive feelings. That is a reward to some. Being nice because it feels nice. 

Well, ya....if it genuinely makes you happy for the person you've helped.        But, if you kid yourself and it's really just a nice feeling ego boost..that's a selfish motivation.    ?  There's a a lot of that going around.

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danydandan
6 minutes ago, third_eye said:

I guess JC ain't coming back now, for sure... Too bad he ain't reading this here thread, if he did, he's be back so quick, he be knocking on everybody's door at the very same time. 

~

That's impossible.

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XenoFish
10 minutes ago, lightly said:

Well, ya....if it genuinely makes you happy for the person you've helped.        But, if you kid yourself and it's really just a nice feeling ego boost..that's a selfish motivation.    ?  There's a a lot of that going around.

Everything we do is out of self-interest/selfishness. When was the last time you did something where you got zero reward. Even the feeling of doing something good is a reward. When I'm kind to other it is because doing so makes me feel good. 

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Desertrat56
1 minute ago, XenoFish said:

Everything we do is out of self-interest/selfishness. When was the last time you did something where you got zero reward. Even the feeling of doing something good is a reward. When I'm kind to other it is because doing so makes me feel good. 

Usually if you get zero reward for doing something it is something you did not want to do.  Like the ministers wife letting *******s into the house at 3 in the morning to bother the minister about a silly fight they had with their spouse.  That is not only no reward but negative reward.  People do things like that and wish they hadn't so mabye the conversation should be where do you set your boundaries and how does that fit in with donating to charity or helping a stranger.

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