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Sir Smoke aLot

How close is Iran towards making Nuclear bomb

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RoofGardener
18 minutes ago, Setton said:

In no small part because they don't have them... 

Yet !

They have the Shahab-3, which has a 1000Km range, and they are working on improving it. 

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.AKUMA.
2 hours ago, RoofGardener said:

Yet !

They have the Shahab-3, which has a 1000Km range, and they are working on improving it. 

What has that got to do with Nuclear tipped missiles? is there any evidence Irans nuclear program has progressed to a stage they can weaponize it? let alone miniaturize it for a ballistic missile.

North Korea doesnt even have this capability yet.

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Setton
4 hours ago, RoofGardener said:

Yet !

They have the Shahab-3, which has a 1000Km range, and they are working on improving it. 

And they wouldn't get them if the US would just keep to its word. 

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and then
11 hours ago, Setton said:

Or have you grown enough as a person to admit that was wrong too? 

Pan, you can say anything you like but you can't make it reality.  You need to work on that a bit.  Delusional people come to bad ends quite often ;) 

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and then
On 7/16/2019 at 11:19 AM, Sir Smoke aLot said:

Other countries which have nukes were never close to even consider using them.

Until Pakistan got the bomb, no Islamic government possessed them.  Fortunately, the real fanatics of that religion don't have access to those weapons in Pakistan.  In Iran, that would not be the case.  The ayatollah Khamenei would be the sole arbiter of when they were to be used.  He has cancer and he's in his 80s.  He also believes in the "Twelver" doctrine of expediting the return of their "Mahdi" by creating a world full of ultimate chaos and ongoing destruction.  The point is, those who subscribe to that particular belief system are not rational in the sense that secular governments have been.  Even Khomeini held them in contempt and suppressed their doctrine as too dangerous.   

Those who are unwilling to accept that Iran having nukes is a danger to the world will pathetically attempt to blame the west or America specifically for the damage Iran will do when they get the bomb but they will learn - as spoiled children often do - that blame changes nothing.  So many today are exactly like our resident version of Peter Pan in that they have come to call good evil and evil good.  In fact, they seem unwilling to accept that evil actually exists any longer.  Their wake-up call is going to be painful.

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Setton
Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, and then said:

 

Edited by Kismit
Insults removed
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Dumbledore the Awesome
11 hours ago, and then said:

  The point is, those who subscribe to that particular belief system are not rational in the sense that secular governments have been. 

Explain to us how many times recently, in particular since January 2017, the secular government of the United States has behaved rationally in any field really, but particularly foreign policy, and your arguments might be listened to by a few more people. 

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Setton
12 hours ago, and then said:

Pan, you can say anything you like but you can't make it reality.  You need to work on that a bit.  Delusional people come to bad ends quite often ;) 

Seeing as it's apparently an insult to point out your lies, I guess I'll leave it here for now. Anyone who wants to can see the truth. 

Wouldn't want to upset the snowflake. 

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and then
1 hour ago, Setton said:

Seeing as it's apparently an insult to point out your lies, I guess I'll leave it here for now. Anyone who wants to can see the truth. 

Wouldn't want to upset the snowflake. 

I made no complaint about anything you said.  In fact, I never saw it.

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and then
1 hour ago, Dumbledore the Awesome said:

Explain to us how many times recently, in particular since January 2017, the secular government of the United States has behaved rationally in any field really, but particularly foreign policy, and your arguments might be listened to by a few more people. 

Whether people listen to my arguments or not is their choice.  I'd say the fact that we haven't seen a nuke explode in anger since 1945 is evidence enough of the kind of rationality I'm speaking of.  Not toeing your line politically isn't proof of "irrationality", mate.

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.AKUMA.
2 hours ago, and then said:

Whether people listen to my arguments or not is their choice.  I'd say the fact that we haven't seen a nuke explode in anger since 1945 is evidence enough of the kind of rationality I'm speaking of.  Not toeing your line politically isn't proof of "irrationality", mate.

Well, the US has been actively using other forms to Nuclear weaponry in the Form of DU rounds............ Sooo really?

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Setton
3 hours ago, and then said:

I made no complaint about anything you said.  In fact, I never saw it.

Aw, it's OK, you don't have to be scared. The mods have made the nasty real world go away so you can go back to encouraging the murder of innocent people. 

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Sir Smoke aLot
23 hours ago, and then said:

Until Pakistan got the bomb, no Islamic government possessed them. 

So what?

Pakistan is country which is full of terrorists. Especially it's border areas. Government in that country, government which is faulty on many levels, has nuclear weapons. Yes, they are Islamic country in nature and jet they haven't used nuke, even in times of very high tensions with India.

Basically what you are saying is that government which can not provide safety for it's own civilians and has ties with terrorists - that such government is more honorable than Iran. To support such wild and illogical claim only ''evidence'' you have is baseless accusation against Iranian leader. 

23 hours ago, and then said:

Fortunately, the real fanatics of that religion don't have access to those weapons in Pakistan.  In Iran, that would not be the case.  The ayatollah Khamenei would be the sole arbiter of when they were to be used.  He has cancer and he's in his 80s.  He also believes in the "Twelver" doctrine of expediting the return of their "Mahdi" by creating a world full of ultimate chaos and ongoing destruction. 

1. He has cancer.

2. He believes in ''end of the world''.

Well let me remind you that it's not Muslims who are working in order to ''hasten the coming'' (reference is clear on this to those who actually know about the subject) so leave that BS for someone less knowledgeable and for web sites where people discuss fascist and other supremacist ideas. And they discuss such things in a shallow way, simply taking what suits them and leaving parts which contradict their whole theory.

Out of such beliefs comes harm to civilians and every terror attack in the world is tied to such world view so by promoting such wild ideas you are actually helping those radical elements to succeed in their strives.

Let me give you a little shot of reality man - Iranian political system is far more complex than simple ' ''Supreme Leader'' decides everything ' type of government. Actually ''supreme leader'' is term coined by propagandists and is widely accepted in political rhetoric and media narrative all across Western area of influence.

23 hours ago, and then said:

Those who are unwilling to accept that Iran having nukes is a danger to the world will pathetically attempt to blame the west or America specifically for the damage Iran will do when they get the bomb but they will learn - as spoiled children often do - that blame changes nothing.  So many today are exactly like our resident version of Peter Pan in that they have come to call good evil and evil good.  In fact, they seem unwilling to accept that evil actually exists any longer.  Their wake-up call is going to be painful.

There will always be difference of opinion, some people agree some disagree but if we approach situation objectively there is little with which to actually form strong case against Iran. If there was i truly doubt that EU would go into dealings with Iran in a way that they do. I doubt that Russia would. Brazil. ... Most of world nations would not have any dealings with Iran, but they do ;)  

One more thing - when Iran stops oil tankers in their region medias already know that tanker was ''seized'', not because of laws and legalities, but because Iranians are pirates!

Just like this new tanker which Iran is investigating, most likely they captured group of smugglers. But when someone takes Iranian tankers there are no doubts about why. With so many flaws in accusations, proven scams and even wars waged over fabricated evidences... Iran has much more credibility than any of it's prosecutors.

When world manages to get Israel to ratify nuclear deals in Knesset than we can get to position to preach to Iran. It wasn't Iran who had alliance with apartheid regime in South Africa, suspected to have helped with their nuclear weapons program. It was regime which has roots in ideology and racial supremacy. Everything you accuse Iran, your beloved Israel was already guilty for that. Some of accusations against Iran, like that of Iran being ''factor of instability in the region'' it's actually not Iran to be blamed for. It's ''western corporate mafia'' which is guilty for that.

Like seed banks in Iraq. First thing done to Iraq after Saddam was beaten was to implement occupation constitution and amendments of old constitution of Iraq. For most part that new constitution was dealing with, obvious, corporate interests.

If it only finished on money! Relatively soon after isis was born. Frustrated civilians were easy pray for radical elements. Leading figures of those elements radical groups mainly came from western countries :D Medias even had fun in promoting individuals like ''Jihadi John'' :D

Man there is like thousand of facts which easily answer the question about '' who is responsible for wild situation in ME '' and Iran, being actually situated in that region, is also victim of situation. But to blame the victim is new tactic employed by criminals and is also cooked in western political offices.

Like that case of woman, her home was target of one robber and he, while he was entering the room through window - he cut his leg on knife which was left on the floor. What do you think who payed compensation? Woman or the robber?

My point, you might be asking?

Point is that there is no moral authority in this world, no one who has superior position to behave like some do. Especially not countries (mine included) with absurd legal systems which protect criminals in the end. That's just silly lol

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Sir Smoke aLot
On 7/17/2019 at 2:02 PM, Setton said:

In no small part because they don't have them... 

It's becoming reality only because some of the loudest Iranian critics are actually helping to speed up Iranian nuclear weapons program, by breaking agreements and trying to force their own opinion.

It was Trump who, on Bibi's order, moved out from JCPOA which effectively moved Iran towards slowly moving out of the deal. Now they criticize Iran for it? :D

Truth is that Iranian politicians were not united about JCPOA and many were against it, it took time to get support for that deal because many people and parties asked for tougher approach. Oh, this silly world, no matter how hard one tries to make it look black and white - it always ends up colorful.

 

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Earl.Of.Trumps
2 hours ago, Sir Smoke aLot said:

It was Trump who, on Bibi's order, moved out from JCPOA which effectively moved Iran towards slowly moving out of the deal. Now they criticize Iran for it? :D

Thank you, SSaL.

There are many people in America and in here that don't even understand that the revolution that the Iranian people had was totally the fault of the meddling United States, whose CIA  deposed the democratically elected president and installed the Shah of Iran, who the US used as their puppet to run Iran. nice, huh?  Anyway, American meddling in Iranian affairs backfired in the worst way and we've only ourselves to blame.

Meanwhile... it's those moozlim Iranian people's fault! Hate them!

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DarkHunter
2 hours ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

Thank you, SSaL.

There are many people in America and in here that don't even understand that the revolution that the Iranian people had was totally the fault of the meddling United States, whose CIA  deposed the democratically elected president and installed the Shah of Iran, who the US used as their puppet to run Iran. nice, huh?  Anyway, American meddling in Iranian affairs backfired in the worst way and we've only ourselves to blame.

Meanwhile... it's those moozlim Iranian people's fault! Hate them!

So the UK setting up a blockade of Iran because the then democratically elected Iranian prime minister nationalized the Iranian oil fields which caused a financial crisis and a massive drop in popularity of said prime minister which caused him to move towards increasingly dictatorial measures to remain in power,  such as if I remember correctly banning rival political parties and starting secret police organizations to arrest and intimidate rivals, all while starting to court the USSR which finally caused America to get involved in a UK plot to do a coup to depose the prime minister and reinstall the Shah as head of the government is the fault of America.

The Shah wasnt perfect and mistakes were made but trying to blame America for the 1953 coup isnt accurate.

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Black Red Devil
46 minutes ago, DarkHunter said:

So the UK setting up a blockade of Iran because the then democratically elected Iranian prime minister nationalized the Iranian oil fields which caused a financial crisis and a massive drop in popularity of said prime minister which caused him to move towards increasingly dictatorial measures to remain in power,  such as if I remember correctly banning rival political parties and starting secret police organizations to arrest and intimidate rivals, all while starting to court the USSR which finally caused America to get involved in a UK plot to do a coup to depose the prime minister and reinstall the Shah as head of the government is the fault of America.

The Shah wasnt perfect and mistakes were made but trying to blame America for the 1953 coup isnt accurate.

What's inaccurate?  The FBI admitted meddling in the 1953 coup because they didn't want one of the biggest oil producing countries in the world run by Mossadeq, a Commie.  LMFAO.

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DarkHunter
31 minutes ago, Black Red Devil said:

What's inaccurate?  The FBI admitted meddling in the 1953 coup because they didn't want one of the biggest oil producing countries in the world run by Mossadeq, a Commie.  LMFAO.

First off it was the CIA and M16 involved with the coup and not the FBI but I guess knowing factual historical events is secondary to laying the blame solely on America.

Even then the role the CIA and MI6 played was not as major as certain people seem to like to suggest.  The CIA helped to organized anti-communist to fight the Tudeh party, the Iranian communist party that Mossadeq was increasingly becoming reliant on to stay in power, if they tried to seize power during the chaos of the coup and negionated with tribes in southern Iran to be allowed to use their territory as a safe base of operations if needed.  Also major general SchwarzKopf Sr. was sent to persuade the Shah to return to Iran and reclaim the throne.  The only really active part the CIA played during the coup was bribing business men, reporters, government officials, and street gangs to support the Shah or attack public images of the Shah in an attempt to change public perception.

Ultimately a large part of the coup was done internally by Iranian monarchist against a prime minister that was becoming increasingly unpopular due to the economic crisis the UK forced on Iran and from a legal perspective was breaking Iran's constitution.

Without the CIA and MI6 the coup as it was done probably wouldnt of happened but Iran was already on course for a major political upheaval no matter what.

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Black Red Devil
Posted (edited)
33 minutes ago, DarkHunter said:

First off it was the CIA and M16 involved with the coup and not the FBI but I guess knowing factual historical events is secondary to laying the blame solely on America.

Even then the role the CIA and MI6 played was not as major as certain people seem to like to suggest.  The CIA helped to organized anti-communist to fight the Tudeh party, the Iranian communist party that Mossadeq was increasingly becoming reliant on to stay in power, if they tried to seize power during the chaos of the coup and negionated with tribes in southern Iran to be allowed to use their territory as a safe base of operations if needed.  Also major general SchwarzKopf Sr. was sent to persuade the Shah to return to Iran and reclaim the throne.  The only really active part the CIA played during the coup was bribing business men, reporters, government officials, and street gangs to support the Shah or attack public images of the Shah in an attempt to change public perception.

Ultimately a large part of the coup was done internally by Iranian monarchist against a prime minister that was becoming increasingly unpopular due to the economic crisis the UK forced on Iran and from a legal perspective was breaking Iran's constitution.

Without the CIA and MI6 the coup as it was done probably wouldnt of happened but Iran was already on course for a major political upheaval no matter what.

Correct about the CIA.  Withe the rest of your post you just argued the point and then finally came to my same conclusion.  What's the point in that?  As I said, they meddled and they interfered in another country's political decisions which is a lot different than claiming 'but trying to blame America for the 1953 coup isnt accurate'.  I'm sure most Americans who feel pi$$ed off that Russia interfered in the 2016 elections will understand it's not a nice thing to do.  :P

Edited by Black Red Devil

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Sir Smoke aLot
On 7/19/2019 at 12:18 AM, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

Thank you, SSaL.

There are many people in America and in here that don't even understand that the revolution that the Iranian people had was totally the fault of the meddling United States, whose CIA  deposed the democratically elected president and installed the Shah of Iran, who the US used as their puppet to run Iran. nice, huh?  Anyway, American meddling in Iranian affairs backfired in the worst way and we've only ourselves to blame.

Meanwhile... it's those moozlim Iranian people's fault! Hate them!

It was always easier to simplify problem and promote good and bad guy stories than to approach issues in civilized manner.

Recent events often remind me of that statement by Bush when he 'made a mistake' and said 'crusades' instead of 'war on terror'. War which messed up already complicated situation in ME region. Radical, fascist reasoning has made way up to the top of government in many nations, unfortunately and that wave of madness doesn't seem to be ending soon in this silly world.

On 7/19/2019 at 2:37 AM, DarkHunter said:

So the UK setting up a blockade of Iran because the then democratically elected Iranian prime minister nationalized the Iranian oil fields which caused a financial crisis and a massive drop in popularity of said prime minister which caused him to move towards increasingly dictatorial measures to remain in power,  such as if I remember correctly banning rival political parties and starting secret police organizations to arrest and intimidate rivals, all while starting to court the USSR which finally caused America to get involved in a UK plot to do a coup to depose the prime minister and reinstall the Shah as head of the government is the fault of America.

The Shah wasnt perfect and mistakes were made but trying to blame America for the 1953 coup isnt accurate.

Luckily a lot of documents, official statements and disclosed 'secrets' prove what was happening in Iran back then, without any doubt.

First there were Iranian disagreements with French authorities. That resulted in French giving power to British in that particular region because tensions and situation on the field were changing and not in French favor. All because politics and industry interests, at the time mainly in Britain. It didn't took long to finally get CIA to forcefully implement government which is acceptable to interests in London and Washington. 

Was it all planned for years? Or it was spontaneous. Whatever behind, fact is that coup happened.

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