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the13bats

Are any UFOs alien craft from other planets?

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the13bats

as you know im all about proof but lets toss proof out the window for the sake of kinship and camaraderie,

i came up with one question that will answer many about what you believe,

"Are any UFOs alien craft from other planets?"

go with simple yes or no or get all long winded but be sure to actually answer the question,  its just what you believe,

lets keep track of how many do and do not believe.

ill start as you expected with "no".

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Imaginarynumber1
25 minutes ago, the13bats said:

"Are any UFOs alien craft from other planets?"

ill start as you expected with "no".

No

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Not A Rockstar

I think all the evidence supports "No", however, I want to believe :) 

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the13bats
10 minutes ago, Not A Rockstar said:

I think all the evidence supports "No", however, I want to believe :) 

okay, so evidence aside do you personally believe any UFOs are alien craft?

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ChrLzs

Yes.  But they are all figments of those aliens' imagination...

 

 

sorry.. my serious answer is NO.

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Not A Rockstar
2 minutes ago, the13bats said:

okay, so evidence aside do you personally believe any UFOs are alien craft?

I go with what evidence there is, generally speaking, for all some here think of me as fringey. Had I ever seen a UFO land on my front yard I would consider that a fact, uncaring what anyone else said. I have not. I was in the military with clearances sufficient, worked with a guy in Blue Book. Nothing there either is all I can say. I am satisfied 90% there is no evidence, no wreckage, nothing found as yet. I have seen nothing myself. So, No. But, I keep hoping for proof, yeah.

To me, if a alien race was that advanced, we would not be finding wreckage etc anyway. They would not be losing their fallen crews to secret labs either. If they are advanced enough to hide and avoid detection, then maybe someday we will advance and find evidence. Until then, or until one drops by to visit, No, I do not think we have alien ships landing and messing around down here, to about 90% belief. If they are really woo-ey, maybe they use portals or something, but no point in arguing from an absence of proof even further down the woo stick than UFOs.

My one "wow" sighting was on the range of a major Air Force base so I count that as a weapons trial that wasn't revealed yet as to what it was. Probably a laser of some sort is my best guess. But, not alien. Had it been the base would have been scrambling to go after it. Didn't happen. Just common sense.

But, I wholly believe there are other races out there, and hope for proof someday. Existence and other means speculated about is outside your question, though. As I said before, UFOs? No. Not until I see something.

But, I keep hoping.

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ChrLzs
4 minutes ago, Not A Rockstar said:

I go with what evidence there is, generally speaking, for all some here think of me as fringey. Had I ever seen a UFO land on my front yard I would consider that a fact, uncaring what anyone else said. I have not. I was in the military with clearances sufficient, worked with a guy in Blue Book.

Wandering a bit offtopic here, sorry Bats!  I'm just curious, NAR, did your military training include 'fatigue management' - eg depriving you of sleep until you hallucinate?  Or have you had any *really* lucid dreams, where whilst dreaming you genuinely believed it was reality?  From my own viewpoint, I've had to rethink all my trust in my own memories after:

- {non military} self-managed exhaustion training :D where I deliberately got myself to the point of being beyond exhaustion and began to hallucinate wildly - no drugs or alcohol, just a very long time without sleep - iirc about 35 hours..  I was in a deserted outback location on a full-moonlit night, and it got to the stage where I was seeing bushes change into wild animals and vice versa, as well as lights flying thru the sky.  To my out-of-it brain, these things were real.  But they weren't real for anyone but me....  and...

- I've now had 2-3 lucid dreams (over my entire lifetime of 60+ years) where the reality was just amazing - full colour, perfectly logical scenarios (one very pleasant, the other nightmarish, but just as possible / logical).  After those dreams it took about an hour after waking to convince myself that my new state was the 'real' one, not the other way around.  And depending on the content and how I awoke, I could easily visualise such a lucid dream that blended back into reality to the point that it remained as a 'real' memory...

Anyways, I'm not trying to deny happenings, but I know that I tend to be very careful with putting forth my memories as any sort of gospel...

20 minutes ago, Not A Rockstar said:

I wholly believe there are other races out there, and hope for proof someday. Existence and other means speculated about is outside your question, though. As I said before, UFOs? No. Not until I see something.

Hear hear!

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Not A Rockstar

@ChrLzs  yeah I have had training of that sort and also been in the field where there was no sleeping for a very looong time if you planned to get back.

I know you do not believe in it, but that sort of thing is similar to some few Shamanic experiences, so I understand the state of mind. When I am in it and when I am NOT and fully here and now. Context is everything.

This is very different from normal life and walking outside and finding a UFO parking in my yard. I never have, so no, I do not believe. BUT, had I ever and talked to them and was convinced it was not fake or a hoax, I would believe what I saw, no matter what anyone else said. It would not be unidentified then anyway :). I trust myself more than anyone else in anything subjective. I am very aggressive about doing my own debunking and have a whole host of things I leave on the back burner without labelling it since I do not have to today and maybe I will learn more later and be able to. This satisfies me. That is all my life experience really MUST do, IMO. 

Mind you, one man's proof is another man's BS so you do not find me bothering to debate as that is not my deal. I do not care what others believe as long as they are not in danger or harming someone else and they do not get a vote as to what I believe :). Seems fair.

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Manwon Lender
3 hours ago, the13bats said:

as you know im all about proof but lets toss proof out the window for the sake of kinship and camaraderie,

i came up with one question that will answer many about what you believe,

"Are any UFOs alien craft from other planets?"

go with simple yes or no or get all long winded but be sure to actually answer the question,  its just what you believe,

lets keep track of how many do and do not believe.

ill start as you expected with "no".

I have never seen a UFO or an Alien, but I don't think we are the only life in the Universe. Now the closer you get to the center of the Universe the older life would be. Do I think that other life forms have the ability to travel to earth. There is no proof I have seen that shows that has happened, but I can't say it will never happen. However, I hope it doesn't happen until we have the technology to defend ourselves from an advanced race. Steven Hawking said the last thing we need is to make Alien contact, because it will most likely be the end of us. I tend to agree with him, based upon our own history. In every case where an advanced culture met a primitive one on our planet, the primitive people were not treated well, and most died. I fear the same thing may happen if we meet an Alien race that has the ability to travel light years and finds us here.

JIMO

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Minimalists

Based on evidence there is no proof they are...Based on my personal belief no I do not think they are alien craft. 

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psyche101

UFOs have been tracked in RADAR. 

Not one has ever been tracked leaving or entering the atmosphere and subsequently the solar system. 

There's no actual connection between UFOs and space. 

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Golden Duck

Thomas Gold promoted the idea the of panspermia - that life on Earth came from outer space or ET rubbish.

You would think that life would come from somewhere relatively local and SETI should be picking up signals from a nearby civilisation.

I got this video that suggests that it may be less likely, as time passes, for SETI to find anything. 

 

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the13bats
Quote

Wandering a bit offtopic here, sorry Bats!

its all good :tu:

i encourage that type discussion in this thread, i hope people do elaborate about why the believe as they do or if it gets the mind engaged with other questions or comments that great run with it.

 

 

Quote

 Steven Hawking said the last thing we need is to make Alien contact, because it will most likely be the end of us. I tend to agree with him, based upon our own history. In every case where an advanced culture met a primitive one on our planet, the primitive people were not treated well, and most died. I fear the same thing may happen if we meet an Alien race that has the ability to travel light years and finds us here.

 

i guess the optimistic side in me hopes it would play out more like star trek 1st contact where the anal alien race is perplexed by how crass and uncouth we are but they accept us or perhaps the aliens would be like the ones in the abyss and let us know we tolerate you perhaps like you , but play nice with each other or we will take you out.

side note, ever notice in sci fi with the hostile aliens their physiology seldom supports their technology, look at predator, the ones where he goes to set off his bomb on his arm, his big clawed fingers can hardly work the controls, very ham fisted, i wonder how many "oops" moments those guys had and many nasty aliens have elaborate ships and devices their tentacles, craws or whatever couldnt have built, it makes me wonder what an alien race would look like,

symmetry seems to work well on earth but past that we evolved from apes what if the alien species evolved from a mollusk type creature or an ostrich type creature holds the chairs at their colleges,  ir what if the writer ran out of ideas that day and alien life is something we cant even see,

okay bats, i think your blood sugar is getting low.

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Earl.Of.Trumps

I think so.

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Robotic Jew

Nope.

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Earl.Of.Trumps

@the13bats

I should have clarified this earlier... but clearly not all UFO's are any kind of intelligently constructed air ship (meteor, orbs etc)

But if it is an intelligently constructed and flown airship before the early days of manned flight, then, yes, it is not ours for high certainty

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Hazzard

While I certainly expect that the Galaxy is home to many advanced societies, the quality of the evidence has so far failed to convince me that any of them have emissaries on our planet.  In the end, the matter of alien visitation will be decided by the evidence, not by the intensity of opinion.

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the13bats
43 minutes ago, Hazzard said:

While I certainly expect that the Galaxy is home to many advanced societies, the quality of the evidence has so far failed to convince me that any of them have emissaries on our planet.  In the end, the matter of alien visitation will be decided by the evidence, not by the intensity of opinion.

right, but i was going light hearted in this one and asked what people believe, not what they can prove, yeah i know atypical for me

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stereologist

No.  I would have expected some verification by now if there had been any alien craft about.

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Desertrat56
16 hours ago, the13bats said:

as you know im all about proof but lets toss proof out the window for the sake of kinship and camaraderie,

i came up with one question that will answer many about what you believe,

"Are any UFOs alien craft from other planets?"

go with simple yes or no or get all long winded but be sure to actually answer the question,  its just what you believe,

lets keep track of how many do and do not believe.

ill start as you expected with "no".

No.  I used to think so but I have spent a lot of time looking in to this and I think it is No, not other planets.  Some are secret military, some are space junk reflections, some are from somewhere else that is not a planet or from this planet in a different phase or something else we can't understand.

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the13bats
9 minutes ago, Desertrat56 said:

No.  I used to think so but I have spent a lot of time looking in to this and I think it is No, not other planets.  Some are secret military, some are space junk reflections, some are from somewhere else that is not a planet or from this planet in a different phase or something else we can't understand.

john keel firmly believed that the ufo=aliens phenomenon was some kind of different dimension type idea, and the enities were simply beyond our understanding.

too bad he also made up stuff to help fill his books

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Desertrat56
Posted (edited)
14 hours ago, Not A Rockstar said:

@ChrLzs  yeah I have had training of that sort and also been in the field where there was no sleeping for a very looong time if you planned to get back.

I know you do not believe in it, but that sort of thing is similar to some few Shamanic experiences, so I understand the state of mind. When I am in it and when I am NOT and fully here and now. Context is everything.

This is very different from normal life and walking outside and finding a UFO parking in my yard. I never have, so no, I do not believe. BUT, had I ever and talked to them and was convinced it was not fake or a hoax, I would believe what I saw, no matter what anyone else said. It would not be unidentified then anyway :). I trust myself more than anyone else in anything subjective. I am very aggressive about doing my own debunking and have a whole host of things I leave on the back burner without labelling it since I do not have to today and maybe I will learn more later and be able to. This satisfies me. That is all my life experience really MUST do, IMO. 

Mind you, one man's proof is another man's BS so you do not find me bothering to debate as that is not my deal. I do not care what others believe as long as they are not in danger or harming someone else and they do not get a vote as to what I believe :). Seems fair.

I have never been trained for or with sleep deprivation but in the army when we went to the field those in my group were so shorthanded that we did not sleep for 3 days, if we were lucky we could catch a 20 minute cat nap.  Then when my youngest daughter was an infant I experience long term sleep deprivation.  I did hallucinate or something, I could read people's minds and I freaked them out sometimes responding to their thoughts before they said anything.  I suspose it would be similar to some shamanic training, but I had no help for the child that caused the sleep deprivation or the understanding the effects of sleep deprivation.  There is a different state of mind when you get a 10 or 20 minute nap every 24 hours and an hour or two of real sleep every 46+ hours. 

I actually watched an energy war between one of the professors and a guy who sat next to me.  I had to sit in the back on the far left to get away from that weirdo. 

Edited by Desertrat56
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Desertrat56
7 hours ago, psyche101 said:

UFOs have been tracked in RADAR. 

Not one has ever been tracked leaving or entering the atmosphere and subsequently the solar system. 

There's no actual connection between UFOs and space. 

Well, I just saw a documentary on PBS about the early space program and the Apollo astronauts that says differently.  Key word being Unidentified, but many of the astronauts claimed they thought it was craft of some sort.

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Desertrat56
6 hours ago, Golden Duck said:

Thomas Gold promoted the idea the of panspermia - that life on Earth came from outer space or ET rubbish.

You would think that life would come from somewhere relatively local and SETI should be picking up signals from a nearby civilisation.

I got this video that suggests that it may be less likely, as time passes, for SETI to find anything. 

 

I read somewhere a theory that "when Mars lost it's atmosphere"  the inhabitants moved to Earth.

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Desertrat56
34 minutes ago, the13bats said:

john keel firmly believed that the ufo=aliens phenomenon was some kind of different dimension type idea, and the enities were simply beyond our understanding.

too bad he also made up stuff to help fill his books

Yeah, well, I am not sure dimensions is the right word.  But I do know that there are things we can't understand, especially if we cling to physical being the only part of existence that is real.

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