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GLCsector3295

Bob Lazar / Alien Tech

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Gwynbleidd
Posted (edited)
9 minutes ago, GLCsector3295 said:

yeah again with regards to his education, even if his records were scrubbed clean, if he had at least a hard copy diploma with the names of the institutions, an signatures and stamps that accompany them, least then he could be like , I at least got this. an then let people debate if it is fake or not i suppose.

Right!?  I can't even find where he has degree's/diploma's anywhere.  I have always kept mine framed in my Office which is the "norm", but why wouldn't he at least have a copy? Some things just make no sense. Ah well! :)

Edited by pixiii
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the13bats
1 hour ago, pixiii said:

So what you're saying is, he originally described "something" which he later claimed was Element 115 (E115), only after it was discovered?  I'm sorry, I'm not familiar with the terms used so forgive me if I've worded it wrongly.

You've answered with an opinion of "He made it up".  What did you base your opinion on? 

i know very little about elements when bob said 115 does this 115 does that then when 115 is actually discovered it isnt any of what bob claimed,  well no reach bob wasnt talking about the element 115 but rather his version of 115 and i dont believe elements work that way,

so who knows what bob was describing and it makes me wonder because knapp said bob had it and some matter accelerator and if "they" closed in to get him was gonna take vegas or all of Nevada off the map with it,

i would love to hear more on that.

 

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Rlyeh
5 hours ago, pixiii said:

So what you're saying is, he originally described "something" which he later claimed was Element 115 (E115), only after it was discovered?  I'm sorry, I'm not familiar with the terms used so forgive me if I've worded it wrongly.

No, I'm saying he made up a magical substance and called it element 115.  He didn't need to wait for them to discover it.

I can do the same thing, element 119 has antigravity properties.  While my description is complete BS, I don't need to wait for them to discover or synthesize 119.

 

5 hours ago, pixiii said:

You've answered with an opinion of "He made it up".  What did you base your opinion on? 

Anti-matter isn't created by bombarding an element with protons.  No other element shares properties with Lazar's 115.

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stereologist
10 hours ago, Ironside said:

I hear this toilet mopper business alot
 
1) Is there any proof he worked as a janitor?  No, yet you stick by that notion despite the lack of evidence don't you?

2) I was under the impression as a military installation most cleaning/cooking/housekeeping was undertaken by military underlings anyway not civilians. From my understanding civilians should not be allowed into a top secret military base in the first place. so this kind of discredits Lazar in a way anyway...

Yes they are horrible at keeping secrets, You probably would have not even heard about Area 51 had Bob not come forward. The base itself was a top secret. Look at The Gulf of Tonkin incident, The many leaks via Chelsea Manning, Edward Snowden, Julian Assange/Wikileaks. ''Collateral Murder'' It is also no secret about the shady way the US Government runs, yet some people still have blind faith in everything they say.

Yeah? So? Nobody has respect for anybody. Its a dog eat dog world. we don't live in a utopia people will walk over their dead mother so long as they get something out of it. As to why he spilled the beans, i mean he goes over that every interview he gives. If you really want to know go watch some...

Once again i'm not trying to say its true or false. only time will tell. I'm just trying to show some skeptics use the same broken logic as some blind believers do. They are two sides of the same coin.
We all have our bias. I know i do and i know you do.

Its impossible to come to a conclusion on things like this without mountains of time and information. I guarantee even if the US Navy or Air Force came out with a new top secret space/aircraft exactly as described by Lazar you probably still wouldn't believe him and would say it was just a lucky guess. Its the same with me i haven't actually seen any soild proof he DIDN'T work for EG&G but there is no proof he DID either

Look Bob Lazar is either the single best liar, able to pass multiple lie detectors and keep his story straight for decades or he is telling the truth. I believe him because i want to believe him. But my mind is probably going to change sooner or later but you are bringing nothing new to the table to make me change it now.

The pay stub shows a salary that is too low for a scientist. So what did he get paid for? No said he was that job but that would be more in line with the pay stub.

Military installations only use military people to do such tasks if it is a base training recruits. That would not be the case at that military installation.

The other incidents you mentioned had corroborating information. Lazar does not. You are comparing apples and oranges.

The argument that we have to wait to tell if Lazar is a liar or not is a joke. He has shown that he is a liar. Just like wackos of 2012 kept up the demand to wait and see till that time there iss a wait and see on someone that has shown they are a liar.

Following that suggestion  you make the following claim: "even if ... you probably still wouldn't believe him " That falls in the same useless category as the wait idea. It is nonsense.

Are those the best defense you have for Lazar's obvious lies?

And finally you suggest that Lazar's stories are so good that if a liar he must be the best liar ever. There are plenty of great liars that keep their story straight. Madoff was one. Bundy was another. Coming up with  a title of "single best liar" tells me that you are not looking around to figure out who else is lying.

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stereologist
10 hours ago, Ironside said:

Look It's a long shot but how do we know he was just told it was element 115 when it could have been any Element 114 and up simply to discredit anyone who came out with it?

That's not how secrets are kept. A secret is kept by not naming something. It is marked as need to know. Doesn't sound anywhere in the story that there was a need to know.

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Ironside
Posted (edited)
12 minutes ago, stereologist said:

The pay stub shows a salary that is too low for a scientist. So what did he get paid for? No said he was that job but that would be more in line with the pay stub.

I am not trying to say he wasn't the janitor, But rather saying it lacks the same amount of proof as saying he worked at S4 as a physicist. None

 

12 minutes ago, stereologist said:

Following that suggestion  you make the following claim: "even if ... you probably still wouldn't believe him " That falls in the same useless category as the wait idea. It is nonsense.

That was more of a stab at hardcore skeptics who shall remain nameless than whatever you took it as. so i don't know how to reply to that

 

12 minutes ago, stereologist said:

The other incidents you mentioned had corroborating information. Lazar does not. You are comparing apples and oranges.

Again that was towards @Dejarma's point of sarcastically saying that the government/military are bad at keeping things under wraps. My point was they are. i was not comparing the incidents.

 

12 minutes ago, stereologist said:

Are those the best defense you have for Lazar's obvious lies?

I'm not trying to defend the guy at all. I simply believe his story could happen even if in this case it did not happen.

 

12 minutes ago, stereologist said:

Bundy was another. Coming up with  a title of "single best liar" tells me that you are not looking around to figure out who else is lying.

Again that's my point exactly. We should be glad he just wants to tells stories and not lobotomize or murder people. I never said he was the ''single best liar'' i said he must be a good one considering he has managed keep his story rather watertight in regards with people being unable to fully disprove it. ''that you are not looking around to figure out who else is lying.'' Could you expand on that? are you talking about politicians or what :P Do you know something we don't?!:lol:

Edited by Ironside
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stereologist

Just to make sure everyone is on the same page, anti-matter is routinely made. It is used in hospitals.

https://www.zdnet.com/article/the-practical-uses-of-antimatter/

Quote

Take hospital PET scans for example, which are probably the most common application of antimatter. The “P” in PET stands for positron, which is a subatomic, antimatter particle. The medical profession uses Positron Emission Tomography to inject positrons into a brain and watch for gamma rays that flash when the positrons encounter electrons of normal matter. The two destroy each other, giving off a light pattern that is different in an afflicted brain than in a normal one, thus revealing neurological aberrations.

I am probably telling people what they already know but I want to to sure that people understand that making antimatter is routinely done.

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stereologist
1 minute ago, Ironside said:

I am not trying to say he wasn't the janitor, But rather saying it lacks the same amount of proof as saying he worked at S4 as a physicist. None

That was more of a stab at hardcore skeptics who shall remain nameless than whatever you took it as. so i don't know how to reply to that

Again that was towards @Dejarma's point of sarcastically saying that the government/military are bad at keeping things under wraps. My point was they are. i was not comparing the incidents.

I'm not trying to defend the guy at all. I simply believe his story could happen even if in this case it did not happen.

Again that's my point exactly. We should be glad he just wants to tells stories and not lobotomize or murder people. I never said he was the ''single best liar'' i said he must be a good one considering he has managed keep his story rather watertight in regards with people being unable to fully disprove it. ''that you are not looking around to figure out who else is lying.'' Could you expand on that? are you talking about politicians or what :P Do you know something we don't?!:lol:

I don't agree at all. The pa stub is too low for a scientist. He lied about degrees. He is incompetent when it comes to gravity. He made up some dubious stories about 115. The evidence is clearly against him having served as a scientist.

You posted an unwarranted claim instead of dealing with the facts of the case. You were mud slinging.

Lazar isn't believable at all. I don't think that the government would look the other way on an issue so important. He could be quickly scooped up and prosecuted. People would speculate if the story was true or what parts of the story are true.

And yes, I quoted you that he was "single best liar". Don't pretend you didn't post that. Let me help you. Bolding mine.

Quote

Look Bob Lazar is either the single best liar, able to pass multiple lie detectors and keep his story straight for decades or he is telling the truth.

You didn't say a good liar you wrote "single best liar".

And I have to disagree. People have disproved it for decades. Lazar was an obvious charlatan and liar and he has been shown to be a liar for decades.

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Ironside
Posted (edited)
4 minutes ago, stereologist said:

You didn't say a good liar you wrote "single best liar".

And I have to disagree. People have disproved it for decades. Lazar was an obvious charlatan and liar and he has been shown to be a liar for decades.

Oops okay, i didn't even go back and check sorry Sir. But it was a figure of speech i did not mean it literally. 

 

4 minutes ago, stereologist said:

I don't agree at all. The pa stub is too low for a scientist. He lied about degrees. He is incompetent when it comes to gravity. He made up some dubious stories about 115. The evidence is clearly against him having served as a scientist.

You posted an unwarranted claim instead of dealing with the facts of the case. You were mud slinging.

Well we will have to agree to disagree then. :) Yes i might have been mud slinging but i am not the only guilty party in that area. I hope you can see that.

Cheers,

Edited by Ironside
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Ironside
10 minutes ago, stereologist said:

I don't agree at all. The pa stub is too low for a scientist. He lied about degrees. He is incompetent when it comes to gravity. He made up some dubious stories about 115. The evidence is clearly against him having served as a scientist.

 

On that note: Image result for bob lazar pay stub

Was this a monthly/fortnightly/weekly pay stub and how can we find that out? i mean that's about $2k back then it would have to be monthly if he was the janitor right?

 

12 minutes ago, stereologist said:

I don't agree at all. The pa stub is too low for a scientist.

But why are we so set on this ''Janitor'' thing? how do we know he didn't work in the canteen or something? This is what i mean when i say there's no evidence he was the toilet mopper. He could of had any role. Are we just trying to give him the lowest demeaning job we possibly could?

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stereologist
2 minutes ago, Ironside said:

On that note: Image result for bob lazar pay stub

Was this a monthly/fortnightly/weekly pay stub and how can we find that out? i mean that's about $2k back then it would have to be monthly if he was the janitor right?

 

But why are we so set on this ''Janitor'' thing? how do we know he didn't work in the canteen or something? This is what i mean when i say there's no evidence he was the toilet mopper. He could of had any role. Are we just trying to give him the lowest demeaning job we possibly could?

the13bats wrote " sure, we have things like he knew where to pay for a coke at the area 51 snack bar, so what any toilet mopper would, " He didn't say Lazar was one, but that even the facilities staff would know where to accomplish a mundane task.

This is not a pay stub. This reports total earnings in 1989 from that source. Even if he worked one pay period he was earning a salary of $24K that year. That's too low to have been a scientist in 1989.

Let's check that out.

https://www.federalpay.org/employees/occupations/general-physical-science

According to that link the mean salary of a physical scientist today is $121K. Lazar's pay is roughly 1/5 that amount. Salaries have not gone up by a factor of 5 since 1989.

A rough idea can be found by looking at military pay in 1989 and comparing it to today.

https://www.navycs.com/charts/1989-military-pay-chart.html

An E-5 goes from 926 to 2333 which is an increase of 2.5 times. That tells us that the pay Lazar received was 1/2 of what scientists were being paid.

I would comment that it looks to me like he was let go which is why the pay for 1989 is low.

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the13bats

ironside,

i have suggested BL was a toilet mopper i have no problem admitting i have suggested that and you hit that nail on the head because it was the lowest most demeaning job i could come up with, why would i do that? its not because i believe BL is full of BS ( which i do believe )  but rather hes just too pompous for my taste, when asked to prove he stole element 115 he gives a snide reply and no, hes not gonna prove it and dont say another word about it or interview over, and there are countless other examples.

Quote

I am not trying to say he wasn't the janitor, But rather saying it lacks the same amount of proof as saying he worked at S4 as a physicist. None

so we get past bl cant prove himself to other actual scientists or physicists, he cant even grasp gravity, but we are putzing with the theory he knows something about the inside of area 51 then his whole story must be true, that is just weak as hell to me,

let me use a low end example its mid 80s i just booked um lords of the new church at my club, i go outside and grab a few gutter punks to help the roadies in exchange for free concert, drinks and a meal,

i make one my runner, he might hear me making band deals, paying the bands, working out issues, shows always have issues, he might meet the band, get an autographed, maybe even party with the band,

of course its different the club isnt a high security military complex but some stuff is still a bit private, that running could go tell stories how he did all kinds of stuff he didnt do, he could make it sound great to the naive, and any of the private stuff he couldn't prove,  nor could he come back and do my job.

this is how i see BL he hasnt proven anything, nothing zero zip zlitch, hes empty like a cold reader phychic, i dont know if he got his info on area 51 mopping a toilet, flipping a bantha burger or ? it doesnt matter its not proof of his claims,

sure i am greatly sceptical of BL but if a person believes his every word i dont care at all, and i wish people didnt care i find BL full of bull.

 

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Minimalists
8 hours ago, Ironside said:

On that note: Image result for bob lazar pay stub

Was this a monthly/fortnightly/weekly pay stub and how can we find that out? i mean that's about $2k back then it would have to be monthly if he was the janitor right?

 

But why are we so set on this ''Janitor'' thing? how do we know he didn't work in the canteen or something? This is what i mean when i say there's no evidence he was the toilet mopper. He could of had any role. Are we just trying to give him the lowest demeaning job we possibly could?

That W2 is for 1989..His claim was that he worked for S4 in 1988 so that W2 is not from 1988..Secondly he did not work for the US Department of Naval Intelligence, that department has not existed since WW2... 

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papageorge1
On 7/11/2019 at 11:07 AM, GLCsector3295 said:

I

I was curious after everything Bob Lazar did to uncover what he did, why didn't the U.S Government instead of going out of their way to discredit him and possibly kill him, just not arrest him ? 

It would be too late to arrest him after he has already let the cat out of the bag. That would in a sense be admitting he was real and not a liar.

On 7/11/2019 at 11:07 AM, GLCsector3295 said:

 

My question is this, if the US Government or any private agency has the capability to create this tech / a space ship, what ever.

 

My hunch is not yet. There may be some elements involved like stabilized element 115 or whatever we just can't procure along with other mysteries.

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the13bats

what cat is out of the bag?

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GLCsector3295

I am starting to see there are already a few threads created on bob lazar,   dunno who can do this, but, it might be helpful to consolidate  lazar related threads and then pin as a sub category in this section of the forum.

 

I have found some really good links to debunk lazar just from browsing that didn't go on tirades about how corrupt he is. but went on with a common sense approach to why he isn't credible.   For me now,things are stacked against lazar, and it is up to him to give more credible proof or at least better answers as to why he should be believed.   He is way out of the limelight now, but I look at it, as if it was me.... If it was me, and I was telling the truth, I would want to clean up my history before I died, so I didn't look like a complete whackamole.  I would start by answering for any shady criminal history be it something minor or significant. I would at least have a hard copy of degrees I earned on hand to show that I at least have that much, and that it isn't a forgery .   I would have an open interview for all to see on some pod cast or something, an go toe to toe with people calling bs and are coming up with articles stating why they think it is all bs.  But i wouldn't do it for everyone, i'd probably pick at least a handful that are extremely critical and have some valid claims that need to be answered.

Thing is, I got the feeling that even if it was me, and i was telling the truth, and i did all this, it still wouldn't be enough. In the end one cant get people in government positions to admit to destroying evidence or harassment and etc. An people are just going to believe what they want to believe no matter how much proof is out there on the topic of Aliens and UFOS.

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stereologist

The idea that arresting someone simply validates their claims is not sensible.

Counter example? There are plenty Assange and Snowden. The cat is out of the bag and the US government wants to arrest them as it does everyone revealing classified information.

Not arresting someone simply tells others that if they steal and reveal they get away with it.

The US government and other governments want people to realize that they will be dealt with.

Lazar is walking around free because he is a pathological liar that has fooled the easy to fool gullible people. He didn't reveal any secrets. He told stories to the foolish.

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