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Still Waters

New Zealanders hand over guns in Christchurch

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Still Waters

New Zealanders have started handing over their semi-automatic weapons as part of a buyback scheme following a ban after the Christchurch attacks.

Gun reforms were enacted after a gunman shot dead 51 people at two mosques in March.

Saturday's handover in Christchurch was the first of more than 250 collections to be held across the country.

More than NZ$433,600 (£230,000) was paid in compensation to 169 firearms owners, who handed in 224 weapons.

The weapons were then destroyed.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-48973511

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DieChecker
Posted (edited)

A little over a thousand dollars each. 

That's 224 out of about 12,000. just under 2% turned in so far.

Edited by DieChecker
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pixiii

Well this has been a long time coming and our little brother NZ will be much like Australia now.  Unfortunately, if a criminal really wants a gun, they'll get one.  Sadly, just because we have strict Gun Laws doesn't necessarily mean there isn't going to be any more crimes related to them.  It may cut down the number of gun related crimes, but you won't be able to stop the criminally minded from buying them.....ever.   

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Professor Buzzkill
On 14/07/2019 at 1:43 AM, DieChecker said:

A little over a thousand dollars each. 

That's 224 out of about 12,000. just under 2% turned in so far.

Actually, the 12000 figure is from people with e category licenses. That means they are licensed to hold military style rifles. This represents a tiny % of the banned weapons. Only e category weapons had to be registered with the police.

The law allowed category a license holders to have semi automatic weapons as well, with restrictions around magazine size, bayonet lugs, pistol grips, etc. These weapons did not have to be registered with the police.

Basically, no one knows how many weapons have actually been banned, but the largest gun shop in nz said they estimate the cost to buy all the banned weapons would be at least 750 million dollars.  The Government has put aside less than 200 million for the buy out. 

 

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aztek
Posted (edited)

few  questions to anyone living in NZ  

how much safer will your country be if YOUR gun is removed? 

how much safer or less safe do you think YOU will be with a such gun taken from you?

how many of your fellow New Zealanders do YOU think share your opinion?

 

Edited by aztek
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psyche101
On 7/14/2019 at 2:19 PM, pixiii said:

Well this has been a long time coming and our little brother NZ will be much like Australia now.  Unfortunately, if a criminal really wants a gun, they'll get one.  Sadly, just because we have strict Gun Laws doesn't necessarily mean there isn't going to be any more crimes related to them.  It may cut down the number of gun related crimes, but you won't be able to stop the criminally minded from buying them.....ever.   

You know what this will do to the price of blackmarket guns. Put them out of reach of the average criminal. 

Another sensible move by a good people focused on community. Well done NZ. 

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psyche101
On 7/13/2019 at 11:43 PM, DieChecker said:

A little over a thousand dollars each. 

It varies, from the link. 

One gun owner, who requested anonymity, was pleased with the NZ$13,000 (£6,900) he received for his semi-automatic hunting firearm.

"I didn't think this would be a fair process at all - I wasn't particularly happy about it. But the outcome was good and they handled it well," he told the New Zealand Herald newspaper.

And then there was a disgruntled resident 

Christchurch firearm owner Vincent Sanders told TV New Zealand that he would be staying away after being offered just $150 for his grandfather's 100-year-old gun.

Obviously the sentimental value exceeds the functional value. 

On 7/13/2019 at 11:43 PM, DieChecker said:

That's 224 out of about 12,000. just under 2% turned in so far.

And a great start, 249 more collections across the country yet to happen. 

It sounds like it will be a resounding success. 

"Police recognise that this is a big change for the law-abiding firearms community and we are hearing really positive feedback from people as they come through today that they are finding the process works well for them," regional police commander Mike Johnson said.

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Kismit
5 hours ago, aztek said:

few  questions to anyone living in NZ  

how much safer will your country be if YOUR gun is removed? 

how much safer or less safe do you think YOU will be with a such gun taken from you?

how many of your fellow New Zealanders do YOU think share your opinion?

 

I feel safer, the houses of worship feel safer. Not everyone agrees with it, but the Government have already paid out $1million in just one buy back in Christchurch, so it would appear that quite a few people are happy about it.

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DieChecker
Posted (edited)
8 hours ago, Professor Buzzkill said:

Actually, the 12000 figure is from people with e category licenses. That means they are licensed to hold military style rifles. This represents a tiny % of the banned weapons. Only e category weapons had to be registered with the police.

The law allowed category a license holders to have semi automatic weapons as well, with restrictions around magazine size, bayonet lugs, pistol grips, etc. These weapons did not have to be registered with the police.

Basically, no one knows how many weapons have actually been banned, but the largest gun shop in nz said they estimate the cost to buy all the banned weapons would be at least 750 million dollars.  The Government has put aside less than 200 million for the buy out. 

 

Actually it is from the experts who testified to the NZ government on the vote to ban the weapons. 

If you have a better link, with numbers, I'll be very happy to read it.

 

Quote

Because the government does not have a gun registry, it is not sure how many weapons that are in private hands fall into the banned categories, although it estimates that there are about 13,500 of these firearms in the country and that it would cost the equivalent of between U.S.$70 million and $140 million to buy them from their owners.

From mid-April, only those who have a special “E” category of gun license — a group of only 7,500 people nationwide — will be allowed to own military-style weapons. Ardern said that no member of the public should bother trying to obtain an E license now. “My advice to them is that they’re wasting their time,” she said.

 

Edited by DieChecker
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DieChecker
Posted (edited)
7 hours ago, psyche101 said:

It varies, from the link. 

One gun owner, who requested anonymity, was pleased with the NZ$13,000 (£6,900) he received for his semi-automatic hunting firearm.

"I didn't think this would be a fair process at all - I wasn't particularly happy about it. But the outcome was good and they handled it well," he told the New Zealand Herald newspaper.

And then there was a disgruntled resident 

Christchurch firearm owner Vincent Sanders told TV New Zealand that he would be staying away after being offered just $150 for his grandfather's 100-year-old gun.

13000 dollars for a single gun? That is over 2% of the entire buyback. No wonder he's happy with it.

Quote

It sounds like it will be a resounding success. 

I certainly hope this is the preventative they hope it is.

Edited by DieChecker
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Kismit

I think the Government might reboot the buy back just before Christmas and offer slightly more. I think quite a few more would come out of the woodwork then.

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Kismit

It turns out that the gun shops are doing good business with the buy back. With people using their buy back money to buy new guns. So it appears to be good for everyone.

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Professor Buzzkill
21 hours ago, DieChecker said:

Actually it is from the experts who testified to the NZ government on the vote to ban the weapons. 

If you have a better link, with numbers, I'll be very happy to read it.

 

 

Once again, as a licensed firearms holder in New Zealand, I have to say that you are wrong. 

 

Gun city owner Mr Tipple advised that along with the 15k MSSA rifles (his figures) the government had banned over 170k other semi automatic rifles. Not to mention shotguns and other weapons. 

 

I think this guy knows what hes saying, considering he makes a living selling these items in retail stores throughout the country. He provided a full spreadsheet which is in the attached article

https://i.stuff.co.nz/national/christchurch-shooting/111795104/gun-city-owner-david-tipple-tells-select-committee-on-gun-law-its-letting-the-shooter-win

 

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Professor Buzzkill
On 17/07/2019 at 9:30 AM, aztek said:

few  questions to anyone living in NZ  

how much safer will your country be if YOUR gun is removed? 

how much safer or less safe do you think YOU will be with a such gun taken from you?

how many of your fellow New Zealanders do YOU think share your opinion?

 

No comment

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psyche101
21 hours ago, DieChecker said:

13000 dollars for a single gun? That is over 2% of the entire buyback. No wonder he's happy with it.

It sounds petty fair on the owners. 

21 hours ago, DieChecker said:

I certainly hope this is the preventative they hope it is.

They have the same conditions we do, so it seems highly likely they too will see the success we did. 

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DieChecker
2 hours ago, Professor Buzzkill said:

Once again, as a licensed firearms holder in New Zealand, I have to say that you are wrong. 

 

Gun city owner Mr Tipple advised that along with the 15k MSSA rifles (his figures) the government had banned over 170k other semi automatic rifles. Not to mention shotguns and other weapons. 

 

I think this guy knows what hes saying, considering he makes a living selling these items in retail stores throughout the country. He provided a full spreadsheet which is in the attached article

https://i.stuff.co.nz/national/christchurch-shooting/111795104/gun-city-owner-david-tipple-tells-select-committee-on-gun-law-its-letting-the-shooter-win

 

Reading up, I see there is a point that happened between then and now that I apparently missed....

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_laws_in_New_Zealand

Quote

The first step in this process was taken on 21 March by reclassifying most semi-automatic firearms as "military style semi-automatic firearms" for the purpose of the Arms Act 1983, pursuant to section 74A(c) of the statute.[50]

So, yeah they labeled nearly all semi automatic weapons as military style. That includes a tremendous lot more firearms then just the assault rifles. Technically this affects most all guns except revolvers, bolt action, and muzzle loaders.

My link was just the assault rifles. 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arms_(Prohibited_Firearms,_Magazines,_and_Parts)_Amendment_Act

So.... @Professor Buzzkill you turning in your guns?

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Professor Buzzkill
Posted (edited)
12 hours ago, DieChecker said:

 

So.... @Professor Buzzkill you turning in your guns?

I think the Government will be worried by the lack of action by gun owners so far. A tiny fraction of gun owners have filled in the forms to declare your now illegal firearms. 

There are also constant warnings whenever the topic is raised with the government, that anyone caught with one of these weapons will spend 5 years in jail. 

But if I'm honest, I'd rather give my gun a burial at sea then have the government "buy it back". That way they'll never know if it's out there or not.

 

Edited by Professor Buzzkill
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Professor Buzzkill
Posted (edited)
2 minutes ago, Professor Buzzkill said:

 

 

 

Edited by Professor Buzzkill
Double up

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DieChecker
1 hour ago, Professor Buzzkill said:

I think the Government will be worried by the lack of action by gun owners so far. A tiny fraction of gun owners have filled in the forms to declare your now illegal firearms. 

There are also constant warnings whenever the topic is raised with the government, that anyone caught with one of these weapons will spend 5 years in jail. 

But if I'm honest, I'd rather give my gun a burial at sea then have the government "buy it back". That way they'll never know if it's out there or not.

So there are like millions of now illegal rifles and pistols out there? And at any time someone is caught with one, they could do 5 years?

Wow. Have they been enforcing it much yet?

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Golden Duck
2 hours ago, DieChecker said:

So there are like millions of now illegal rifles and pistols out there? And at any time someone is caught with one, they could do 5 years?

Wow. Have they been enforcing it much yet?

There's an amnesty through to 20 December 2019.

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skliss

Proposed New Zealand law says owning guns is not a right

WELLINGTON, New Zealand (AP) — New Zealand's government is planning further restrictions to gun ownership in a law proposed Monday that emphasizes owning guns is a privilege and not a right.

The new law would ban the sale of guns to overseas visitors, create a register to track all guns in the country, and require gun owners to renew their gun licenses every five years instead of every 10. It would also allow police to weigh other factors such as a person's mental health and even what they had been posting on social media to determine whether they were fit to own a gun.

The government hopes lawmakers will approve the legislation by the end of the year.

https://news.yahoo.com/proposed-zealand-law-says-owning-074155413.html

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DingoLingo
On 7/14/2019 at 12:19 PM, pixiii said:

Well this has been a long time coming and our little brother NZ will be much like Australia now.  Unfortunately, if a criminal really wants a gun, they'll get one.  Sadly, just because we have strict Gun Laws doesn't necessarily mean there isn't going to be any more crimes related to them.  It may cut down the number of gun related crimes, but you won't be able to stop the criminally minded from buying them.....ever.   

true.. but they are very expensive to buy on the black market :D

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pixiii
2 hours ago, DingoLingo said:

true.. but they are very expensive to buy on the black market :D

Yes absolutely!  The point I was making was that you can ban guns all you like, but at the end of the day, if a person wants to get a gun so badly, they'll get a gun.  Don't get me wrong, I'm glad NZ has taken the step to do a buy-back scheme like we did in Oz all those years ago now.  Lord knows, NZ has been through a lot over the past decade and I hope this helps people feel somewhat safer especially after that last tragedy.  :)  

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aztek
On 7/24/2019 at 1:27 AM, DingoLingo said:

true.. but they are very expensive to buy on the black market :D

so criminals will have to rob more people to buy a more expensive gun,  you do not really think those people care about black market prices? but you should, cuz next person they rob may be you.

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Professor Buzzkill
On 19/07/2019 at 8:03 AM, DieChecker said:

So there are like millions of now illegal rifles and pistols out there? And at any time someone is caught with one, they could do 5 years?

Wow. Have they been enforcing it much yet?

No, the line is "posession of these firearms is punishable by five years in prison, but dont worry, you have until December (previously September) to declare them and arrange to hand them over to police" 

In the meantime you cannot use these firearms at all. 

 

So far the "buy back" (I hate that term, the government never owned my guns, so how do they buy them back?) is on track to bring in about 60,000 guns. This is less than 1/3 of the estimated quantity of banned firearms. 

 

I guess that's why you offer to pay full price, or even more, in a gun compensation deal if you actually wanted the guns off the street.

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