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ExpandMyMind

Government to ask Queen to suspend Parliament

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Essan

The UK, like most western nations, is not a parliamentary democracy.  It's a particracy.  And it is thus because the electorate specifically vote to ensure that we are run not by a democratic parliament, representing the people who elected them, but by a self-centered egotistical gang whose members represent only the gang, friends of the gang, or factions therein (we occasionally change which gang it is, although the Scots now seem to prefer a one party state, like some Africans nations).

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Setton
4 hours ago, Dumbledore the Awesome said:

So Mad Boris has gone into full tyrant mode then. With a wave of his hand, he simply removes Parliament so it can't interfere with his fanatical obsession about sticking two fingers up to Johnny Foreigner. So all you people who were smugly explaining how Britain is a Parliamentary Democracy; how does this sit with your beliefs?  

Simple. We are still a parliamentary democracy (just). But one particular traitor has temporarily seized power to force through his vision. And all the other traitors have come out to cheer him on. 

The good news is, when the traitor in chief is removed (which won't take long), we already know all those who are secretly against our democracy. And they'll never be in any position of authority with this on their record. 

The funny thing is that they think they're winning. 

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Essan

Incidently, Parliament gets suspended for a couple of weeks in Sept/Oct every year anyway, because all the gangbangers are off on their annual ****-licking conventions ;) 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Party_conference_season


 

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Cookie Monster
5 hours ago, Dumbledore the Awesome said:

but I thought the justification for having a leader imposed by the ruling party was that we choose the MPs, and they can be trusted to make wise and informed decisions? But now the Leader is making sure that Parliament can't make any wise and informed decisions in case they go against his wishes? I'm confused now :( 

In the UK we use a FPTP (first past the post) electoral system where the public choose only the MPs.

We picked FPTP because it helps to avoid hung Parliaments. The catch is it means a party can gain a majority in Parliament with as little as 35% of the vote. If we go further and say that of those 35% of voters 15% made do because the party they picked was the closet match to their views, then it means the ruling party might only have 10% genuine support amongst the population.

This crazy situation is why historically there have been calls to replace FPTP with proportional representation. It is also why in the UK the Labour Party and Conservative Party can get away with doing such a poor job of representing the people. If they had to win 51% of the vote to form a Government then we would have left the EU and ended mass immigration long ago.

But as mentioned.... FPTP also helps to avoid those hung Parliaments. It doesnt always work, it has failed recently (twice), but under normal conditions its actually very effective at preventing Parliament gridlocks. Under FPTP the public dont choose the PM. During elections we arent electing a President, we are choosing ministers who decide amongst themselves who the lead minister or `Prime Minister` is.

The Brexit problems arent the result of FPTP flaws because the public got a referendum. A referendum compliments FPTP nicely because it prevents those policies which dont have support from the majority of the population. Lets not forget that before the banks went belly up YouGov polling was consistently showing that 60% to 65% of the UK population wanted us to leave the EU. Cameron timed that Brexit referendum to use peoples employment fears to get a remain vote through but lost spectacularly (although it was a bit too close for my comfort). Even with the economic problems going on we still voted to leave!

As the UK population got their Brexit instance of direct Democracy, they have expressed their will, and it is the duty of the Government to get on and execute what they voted for. Looking at the results of the Brexit referendum then all we know is that the majority of the public want us to leave the EU. There wasn't enough support for us to stay. Ideally, that referendum should have been done pre-2008 when people weren't concerned about their finances to gauge the true level of anti-EU feeling. But, it is what it is.

In a Democracy people dont always get what they want, and its fundamentally wrong for a minority to then try and impose its will on the majority. That kind of spoiled brattish behaviour has arisen from a culture where shouting the loudest gets your views represented. That has came about because of historically weak leadership, and its currently making a mockery of both UK and US Democracy.

The same type of spoiled brat that cannot cope with Trump being President cannot cope with the UK voting to leave the EU. They cry aloud, they make desperate attempts to character assassinate, they nip pick relentlessly, they clutch at straws looking for any possible excuse to invalidate the will of the people, and with Trump as well as Boris they arent getting their way. Thats the way it should be!

If you cannot accept that you live in a Democracy, if you cannot accept the Democratic Will of the People, then may I suggest going and finding a Pro-EU authoritarian regime to live in.

Edited by RabidMongoose
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Setton
16 hours ago, itsnotoutthere said:

Here's a fact for you, back in 2016 after 5 months of being told that this was going to be the most important decision in a generation and despite the remain camp splurging £12 million of tax payers money on their campaign, we were asked a simple question. 'Do you want the UK to stay in the EU or do you want the UK to leave the EU' (no mention of good deal, bad deal or no deal).

The majority voted to leave the EU. 

That is the only fact you need to concentrate on.

Exactly. And now it is down to parliament, as our elected representatives, to decide how we leave. That is the power we entrust to them. If they are unable to decide, the power must revert to the people. 

Not to one unelected man. 

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Setton
1 minute ago, Essan said:

Incidently, Parliament gets suspended for a couple of weeks in Sept/Oct every year anyway, because all the gangbangers are off on their annual ****-licking conventions ;) 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Party_conference_season


 

Yes, and if he'd done it for the usual length, he might have a thin veneer of legitimacy left. 

Instead, we have a prime minister who said he'd bend the rules by proroguing Parliament to force through his vision, then did so, for longer than is standard. 

Anyone saying they believe this is normal, legitimate or justified is either lying to you or never really supported democracy unless it was going their way. 

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Habitat
19 minutes ago, Setton said:

Not to one unelected man. 

Of course he was elected, in his seat, and by his party to PM

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RoofGardener
1 hour ago, Setton said:

Yes, and if he'd done it for the usual length, he might have a thin veneer of legitimacy left. 

Instead, we have a prime minister who said he'd bend the rules by proroguing Parliament to force through his vision, then did so, for longer than is standard. 

Anyone saying they believe this is normal, legitimate or justified is either lying to you or never really supported democracy unless it was going their way. 

You're just sore because we are leaving the EU :P 

Edited by RoofGardener
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OverSword

Man, the English libs are nearly as whacky as ours. Shutting out parliament at the pleasure of the queen is not uncommon. As well, since the remoaners blocked every effort of the last pm to make a brexit deal they ensured brexit without a deal. Now they’re moaning that their right to participate in a democracy is being stolen from them. Wasn’t there a vote with an outcome? Maybe you all should consider getting rid of the electoral college. Oh wait, you sound so familiar I got the countries mixed up.

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OverSword
21 hours ago, Setton said:

You know as well as I do that under our democracy, parliament is sovereign. I advocate letting them handle this. 

You advocate letting whoever will let you get your way handle it. 

I have accepted our democracy.

Can you? 

I agree with you.  representative government abdicating their duty to govern by handing it over to the populous to decide by majority vote is a poor way to represent.  But your representatives did indeed hand their sovereignty over to the people in this case.  They handled it, you just don't like how. 

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OverSword
20 hours ago, Dejarma said:

stay in & have the Euro parliament idiots still  in charge

get out, no deal & have the brainless British politicians in charge. Wow what a choice! It's the same **** but in a different bucket.. Oh joy:rolleyes:

No, it really isn't.  One bucket is full of people from England the other with people not from England.  Wouldn't you rather England be ran and ruled by the English?

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OverSword
9 hours ago, Dumbledore the Awesome said:

but I thought the justification for having a leader imposed by the ruling party was that we choose the MPs, and they can be trusted to make wise and informed decisions? But now the Leader is making sure that Parliament can't make any wise and informed decisions in case they go against his wishes? I'm confused now :( 

There were three years to make wise decisions, right?  And instead what did you have?  Obstructionism?  He must have convinced the queen that there was no reason to expect anything different at this point than what has been served up prior to this so the Queen made the executive decision to prevent the way out from being further mucked with.  

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OverSword
5 hours ago, Setton said:

Simple. We are still a parliamentary democracy (just). But one particular traitor has temporarily seized power to force through his vision. And all the other traitors have come out to cheer him on. 

The good news is, when the traitor in chief is removed (which won't take long), we already know all those who are secretly against our democracy. And they'll never be in any position of authority with this on their record. 

The funny thing is that they think they're winning. 

Are you talking about the Queen? Because that's whos actions you're describing don't you think?  

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OverSword
5 hours ago, Setton said:

Yes, and if he'd done it for the usual length, he might have a thin veneer of legitimacy left. 

You mean she.  She suspended parliament, not the PM.  

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'Walt' E. Kurtz

" The sun never sets on the British Empire " wake up Britons you no longer have an empire leaving the EU will cost you more than it taste. And you wont get rid of those bloody immigrants....especially the Swedes ;-) i rather see a united Europe. 

Edited by Impedancer

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aztek

their cost for being in EU is high already , they now got measles  problem from all those immigrants, and that gift will keep on giving,   

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hetrodoxly
21 minutes ago, Impedancer said:

Britons you no longer have an empire

It's the compete opposite, we don't want to be part of one. 

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stevewinn
6 hours ago, Essan said:

Incidently, Parliament gets suspended for a couple of weeks in Sept/Oct every year anyway, because all the gangbangers are off on their annual ****-licking conventions ;) 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Party_conference_season


 

exactly.

These MP's say they want to 'debate' Brexit which is code for stopping Brexit. lets point out to the people at home watching in colour. These MP's have debated Brexit for over 3 years. but they were so keen to debate Brexit that they decided to take their six week holidays. they could of cut short or cancelled their holidays and debated Brexit for those six weeks. but it seems they weren't so keen after all.

Parliament suspended for the party conferences. dates below now bear in mind Boris suspended parliament for the Queens Speech. dates government to suspend Parliament no earlier than Monday 9 September and no later than Thursday 12 September, until Monday 14 October.

image.png.578c15b028dbe99a50a90fc0a504c841.png

So Shock horror, we are going to have the same 3 week break for party conferences we have always had. Bigger shock horror, we are going to end the longest Parliamentary session since the civil war, and have a new Queen’s speech as we used to do every year. Worse shock horror, the Remain forces who have dominated the Parliamentary agenda for three years complaining about the result of the referendum will not have many more days to repeat this. Most of the country will breathe a sigh of relief if the endless rows about Brexit are over and we can get on with a decent agenda for the UK.

The irony of Remain is they now dare to say it undemocratic to implement the referendum decision, undemocratic to have a new session of Parliament with a new agenda for a new government, and undemocratic if the majority get their way. It is they who launch the attack on democracy, by denying the result of the referendum and seeking to stop the transfer of powers of self government back to Parliament, which was the whole point of the Brexit vote.

Edited by stevewinn

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RoofGardener
1 hour ago, Impedancer said:

" The sun never sets on the British Empire " wake up Britons you no longer have an empire leaving the EU will cost you more than it taste. And you wont get rid of those bloody immigrants....especially the Swedes ;-) i rather see a united Europe. 

As a citizen of EuroZone North, you WILL see a united Europe. :P

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stevewinn
1 hour ago, Impedancer said:

" The sun never sets on the British Empire " wake up Britons you no longer have an empire leaving the EU will cost you more than it taste. And you wont get rid of those bloody immigrants....especially the Swedes ;-) i rather see a united Europe. 

CALpMIuWQAMlrSd.jpg

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godnodog

I'm with Boris on this one, I too want the UK to fraqoff  of the EU.

 

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stevewinn
2 minutes ago, godnodog said:

I'm with Boris on this one, I too want the UK to fraqoff  of the EU.

 

so are the 17.4million majority. a poll of 13,700 in Wales was conducted. do you agree with Boris suspending Parliament.83% said YES. 

Your own Govt realising the long standing friendship the UK as with Portugal they have assured UK citizens rights living and working in Portugal and also created dedicated check in and arrival queues at your airports.

Thank You. Portugal isn't the UKs oldest ally for nothing.

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godnodog
1 hour ago, aztek said:

their cost for being in EU is high already , they now got measles  problem from all those immigrants, and that gift will keep on giving,   

Care to provide where you got to that info, or should I say nonsense like that worldwide cancer is due to the british defective genes?

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godnodog
1 minute ago, stevewinn said:

so are the 17.4million majority. a poll of 13,700 in Wales was conducted. do you agree with Boris suspending Parliament.83% said YES. 

Your own Govt realising the long standing friendship the UK as with Portugal they have assured UK citizens rights living and working in Portugal and also created dedicated check in and arrival queues at your airports.

Thank You. Portugal isn't the UKs oldest ally for nothing.

I am against this too, as its not reciprocal.
Diont get me wrong, I am in favor when reciprocal.

Edited by godnodog

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stevewinn
4 minutes ago, godnodog said:

I am against this too, as its not reciprocal.
Diont get me wrong, I am in favor when reciprocal.

You'll find the UK acted first and so is reciprocal. your govt followed the UKs lead. The EU dragged its feet and so individual EU members have taken it upon themselves. Thank you.

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