EVP in the perceptual research lab

[XenoFish]

11 minutes ago, Impedancer said:

the reason why we are bad at being  sourse critical is that we are fed with too much information these days. I think we're becoming more gullible hence it's good to be curious and do some research on facts especially today with fake news and all. I know i dont always do this.... Yes those muffeled  EVP's is horrible it's more like guess and tell. 

The problem is that saying you heard "get out" in an evp, and telling others is basically suggestion or priming. 

[Alchopwn]

42 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

The problem is that saying you heard "get out" in an evp, and telling others is basically suggestion or priming. 

Unless the neighbors are having another argument, and you can "just" hear them over the static because you are focussed on your hearing.

[XenoFish]

1 minute ago, Alchopwn said:

Unless the neighbors are having another argument, and you can "just" hear them over the static because you are focussed on your hearing.

Good point. I think this also applies to that abominable ghost box, which is just a radio shuffler. 

['Walt' E. Kurtz]

32 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

Good point. I think this also applies to that abominable ghost box, which is just a radio shuffler. 

Yep and then you might as well start doing the shuffel :-D.( jokingly) if EVP's existed and you were a ghost you would probably have to try hard for over hundred years to leave a message to your relatives and all that would come through is a muffeled "BURrrp"  :-D

Edited September 24, 2019 by Impedancer

['Walt' E. Kurtz]

I said that i believe it's plausable that  EVP's exist in one way or another...

they do exist but only in our own minds.

Plus 98% what we believe is paranormal can be explained. 

Edited September 24, 2019 by Impedancer

[moonman]

I love it when science proves what was common sense to begin with. I don't need a study to know that people hear what they want to hear in white noise, that has been obvious for years.

Edited September 24, 2019 by moonman

[papageorge1]

6 hours ago, Impedancer said:

the reason why we are bad at being  sourse critical is that we are fed with too much information these days. I think we're becoming more gullible hence it's good to be curious and do some research on facts especially today with fake news and all. I know i dont always do this.... Yes those muffeled  EVP's is horrible it's more like guess and tell. 

I actually also say there is a wide range of quality in EVPs but there are Class A's where no reasonable person can doubt they heard the same thing as everyone else and even accents (like Irish, Scottish, etc.) are distinctive. If EVPs can be real (as I believe some are), it actually makes sense that there will be a wide range of quality.

What I don't want to see people do is confuse the baby (clear EVPs) with the bathwater (very unclear EVPs) and then throw the baby out with the bathwater as if they are all one thing.

Edited September 24, 2019 by papageorge1

[papageorge1]

9 hours ago, Gwynbleidd said:

Yes, I know what you mean....I try to remain firmly in the middle but sometimes I find myself swaying towards each side.  In relation to EVP's, I don't think I've ever been able to hear what other people claim they're hearing.  I always seem to hear something completely different. 

I've been talking about Class A EVPs in this thread. Here is a discussion from the Pacific Paranormal Investigation website. Here is the first paragraph:

Class A EVP

 

The American originator of EVP Classification system, Sarah Estep, describes the Class A event of interest as a "clear and distinct voice or sound that is universally accepted and undisputed, because it must be understood by anyone with normal hearing and without being told or prompted to what is being said or heard. It can be heard without the use of headphones.” Estep here is talking about the consensus that forms around what’s clear and trustworthy....

 

Here's some examples from Sarah. I 've heard even more interesting ones in my time but these will suffice for my quick-found examples. Some of these examples can still be argued but some are undoubtedly impressive (I'd say the “We’re down beside ya.” one was outstanding. I think our buddy @macqdor posted one of Irish immigrants to America that was knock your socks off.

 

 

• My point is that people that want to consider the phenomena of EVP fairly will want to focus on all cases and classes of EVP. People with just an anti-paranormal bent will try to get the question moved to center on just the weakest link of very vague EVPs on a ghost hunter's TV covered adventures. As for me as I stated above:

  Papameter   96% Chance real EVPs Occur      4% Chance All hoax and natural phenomena

Edited September 24, 2019 by papageorge1

[Matt221]

The power of suggestion is a wonderful phenomenon just get yuorself a hacked radio and you can her whatever you want job done

[Inn Spectre]

21 hours ago, XenoFish said:

Because they don't do anything in regards to the paranormal.

Do the manufacturers claim otherwise? If not, no refund is due.

[freetoroam]

9 hours ago, moonman said:

I love it when science proves what was common sense to begin with. I don't need a study to know that people hear what they want to hear in white noise, that has been obvious for years.

As this thread clearly shows, even when science proves it does not exists, (by using the the ghost hunters own tapes too) there are some who still will not have it.

They are the sorts if you take them to an old house at night and slap them in the face with a kipper, they will insist they were slapped by some poor soul who jumped off the roof 400 years ago. 

Edited September 25, 2019 by freetoroam

[freetoroam]

8 hours ago, papageorge1 said:

I've been talking about Class A EVPs in this thread. Here is a discussion from the Pacific Paranormal Investigation website. Here is the first paragraph:

Class A EVP

 

The American originator of EVP Classification system, Sarah Estep, describes the Class A event of interest as a "clear and distinct voice or sound that is universally accepted and undisputed, because it must be understood by anyone with normal hearing and without being told or prompted to what is being said or heard. It can be heard without the use headphones.

You sure do pick em!!

Quote

Estep claims that in the 1970s she started picking up voices on her husband's Teac reel-to-reel recorder. She is sure that the voices are spirits, proving there is life after death. Estep also claims to hear voices of aliens on some of her tapes. 

http://www.skepdic.com/evp.html

Reel to reel would pick up all sounds around and the tapes could be spliced.

But I doubt she did splice them as there was no need, she picked up voices alright, but they were not from the dead. 

And then we get to the alien bit, 

Quote

Aliens don't speak English, however, so she is not sure what they are saying.

http://www.skepdic.com/evp.html

^^^ 

This is what the research had proven to be 

Quote

We concluded that EVP are an auditory example of pareidolia 

https://theconversation.com/hearing-ghost-voices-relies-on-pseudoscience-and-fallibility-of-human-perception-48160

She can not recognise the noise, so she assumes they were aliens. because she so wanted it to be something to fuel.her belief.

Edited September 25, 2019 by freetoroam

[papageorge1]

13 minutes ago, freetoroam said:

You sure do pick em!!

Reel to reel would pick up all sounds around and the tapes could be spliced.

But I doubt she did splice them as there was no need, she picked up voices alright, but they were not from the dead. 

And then we get to the alien bit, 

^^^ 

This is what the research had proven to be 

She can not recognise the noise, so she assumes they were aliens. because she so wanted it to be something to fuel.her belief.

So did you listen to the Class A EVPs I presented?

If she has anything of value to the paranormal world I would expect the best thrash article Skepdic can put out would be written on her. I see that happened so I know she gained positive notoriety from somewhere.

[Timothy]

19 hours ago, papageorge1 said:

*snip*

Some of these examples can still be argued but some are undoubtedly impressive (I'd say the “We’re down beside ya.” one was outstanding. I think our buddy @macqdor posted one of Irish immigrants to America that was knock your socks off.

*snip*

‘We’re down beside ya’ didn’t sound like that at all. It is incoherent and the phraseology of anyone who can speak coherent English is not apparent in that one. 

@macqdor could never even produce the fire department report he claimed he had, and told me he had given it to people here on UM, but he wouldn’t give me. Did he give you that report?

He has never produced anything of substance on UM or otherwise, as far as I’m aware. 

A ‘knock your socks off EVP’ is definitely not something I would expect from him, unless fraudulent. 

Do you have any other ‘outstanding examples’? Because they all are examples which actually support the OP article. Lol. I am sorry, but it is true.

Nearly every one of your posts causes me to question your health psychologically and physically. Others feel the same. And don’t claim it’s an attack. You just seem to not comprehend basic things which are obvious to people of sound mind with sound eyesight and sound hearing etc.

So, post a better ‘outstanding example’, because all you’ve done since you joined UM is prove the article in this thread correct.

You are biased and cannot comprehend it. I’m sorry if you’re older, but you may or may not ever come to terms with this reality. 

Edited September 25, 2019 by Timothy
Typo. Rephrase.

[ThereWeAreThen]

19 hours ago, papageorge1 said:

I've been talking about Class A EVPs in this thread. Here is a discussion from the Pacific Paranormal Investigation website. Here is the first paragraph:

Class A EVP

 

The American originator of EVP Classification system, Sarah Estep, describes the Class A event of interest as a "clear and distinct voice or sound that is universally accepted and undisputed, because it must be understood by anyone with normal hearing and without being told or prompted to what is being said or heard. It can be heard without the use of headphones.” Estep here is talking about the consensus that forms around what’s clear and trustworthy....

 

Here's some examples from Sarah. I 've heard even more interesting ones in my time but these will suffice for my quick-found examples. Some of these examples can still be argued but some are undoubtedly impressive (I'd say the “We’re down beside ya.” one was outstanding. I think our buddy @macqdor posted one of Irish immigrants to America that was knock your socks off.

 

 

• My point is that people that want to consider the phenomena of EVP fairly will want to focus on all cases and classes of EVP. People with just an anti-paranormal bent will try to get the question moved to center on just the weakest link of very vague EVPs on a ghost hunter's TV covered adventures. As for me as I stated above:

  Papameter   96% Chance real EVPs Occur      4% Chance All hoax and natural phenomena

You got 96%?? Did you actually listen to the recordings. Absolute nonsense. Even if they did say what was allegedly said, most don't, it can be easily hoaxed. So how did you get 4% for hoaxes. You are so biased at times its unreal.

[moonman]

Those "class A" evps are absolute garbage, just a garbled mess that don't sound anything like what they are claiming.

I'm guessing each starts with a known person asking questions, and I can't even understand those parts. None of it sounds like words at all.

Edited September 25, 2019 by moonman

[papageorge1]

6 hours ago, Timothy said:

‘We’re down beside ya’ didn’t sound like that at all. It is incoherent and the phraseology of anyone who can speak coherent English is not apparent in that one. 

So, post a better ‘outstanding example’, because all you’ve done since you joined UM is prove the article in this thread correct.

 

I am going to strongly disagree and call that a Class A EVP. That was just a satisfactory example from a quick-search done for another member to see. I am sure you will give your best effort to attack any example I could ever produce and I have come to believe your opposition is more pathological than logical. You have an agenda when analyzing evidence. 

6 hours ago, Timothy said:

 

@macqdor could never even produce the fire department report he claimed he had, and told me he had given it to people here on UM, but he wouldn’t give me. Did he give you that report?

He has never produced anything of substance on UM or otherwise, as far as I’m aware. 

A ‘knock your socks off EVP’ is definitely not something I would expect from him, unless fraudulent. 

 

It is not my job to defend other members. My well-considered opinion on Macqdor is that he is a genuine major paranormal experiencer and is a man of honesty and integrity but he can get a little sloppy with you guys in the emotion of debate,

6 hours ago, Timothy said:

Do you have any other ‘outstanding examples’? Because they all are examples which actually support the OP article. Lol. I am sorry, but it is true.

Nearly every one of your posts causes me to question your health psychologically and physically. Others feel the same. And don’t claim it’s an attack. You just seem to not comprehend basic things which are obvious to people of sound mind with sound eyesight and sound hearing etc.

So, post a better ‘outstanding example’, because all you’ve done since you joined UM is prove the article in this thread correct.

You are biased and cannot comprehend it. I’m sorry if you’re older, but you may or may not ever come to terms with this reality. 

Well, I question your clear thinking particularly after silly comments like above. My first suspicion is that you are probably a normal thinker on most mundane things but on these controversial things you are driven by a pathology and ego-defense and the screws come loose.

Your attempt to paint me as 'off' is what really seems 'off' and telling to me.

Edited September 25, 2019 by papageorge1

[papageorge1]

5 hours ago, ThereWeAreThen said:

You got 96%?? Did you actually listen to the recordings. Absolute nonsense. Even if they did say what was allegedly said, most don't, it can be easily hoaxed. So how did you get 4% for hoaxes. You are so biased at times its unreal.

I have found many, many examples very strong. The number of people showing quality examples makes the chance of the 'all the good ones are hoaxed' hypothesis ramp down to near zero in my logical way of looking at it.

[moonman]

Those are some of the worst EVPs I've ever heard. Anyone who would defend garbled auditory crap like those as "good evidence" does not deserve to be taken seriously and does not even come close to having any common sense or being impartial in any way.

Edited September 25, 2019 by moonman

[Timothy]

19 hours ago, papageorge1 said:

I am going to strongly disagree and call that a Class A EVP. That was just a satisfactory example from a quick-search done for another member to see. I am sure you will give your best effort to attack any example I could ever produce and I have come to believe your opposition is more pathological than logical. You have an agenda when analyzing evidence. 

It is not my job to defend other members. My well-considered opinion on Macqdor is that he is a genuine major paranormal experiencer and is a man of honesty and integrity but he can get a little sloppy with you guys in the emotion of debate,

Well, I question your clear thinking particularly after silly comments like above. My first suspicion is that you are probably a normal thinker on most mundane things but on these controversial things you are driven by a pathology and ego-defense and the screws come loose.

Your attempt to paint me as 'off' is what really seems 'off' and telling to me.

They were horrible examples and the majority will always agree. As others have already. 

@macqdor is in a similar category with a huge lack of comprehension, well before emotion should be involved. 

Do you have eyesight or hearing problems?

I see you avoided that bit. 

If you don’t want to disclose that information on a public forum, just say it and I won’t ask again. 

[papageorge1]

4 hours ago, Timothy said:

They were horrible examples and the majority will always agree. As others have already. 

@macqdor is in a similar category with a huge lack of comprehension, well before emotion should be involved. 

Do you have eyesight or hearing problems?

I see you avoided that bit. 

If you don’t want to disclose that information on a public forum, just say it and I won’t ask again. 

I wear run-of-the-mill corrective eyeglasses and have normal hearing although you asking such questions looks silly (or rather 'off'). 

I think your issues are in the psychological area and can not be easily asked about nor self-answered. Years on internet forums though has formed my view of the more vehement anti-paranormal types and how/why they tick to the point of quickly becoming rude and abusive towards those with a more 'optimistic' view of reality. 

So, for the benefit of the forum, let's stick to discussing the topic and not each other! I seem to be an obsession on here for your local clique.

Edited September 26, 2019 by papageorge1

['Walt' E. Kurtz]

I wont criticise anyone for believing in things which is and can be scientificly debunked , we have freedome of religion. :-)  you cant explain something to someone who dont want to understand.

Edited September 26, 2019 by Impedancer

[papageorge1]

1 hour ago, Impedancer said:

I wont criticise anyone for believing in things which is and can be scientificly debunked , we have freedome of religion. 

I think it is foolish to believe in things that science can debunk. It is important to me to know I am based in objective reality.

Edited September 26, 2019 by papageorge1

[ChrLzs]

On 9/27/2019 at 3:04 AM, Impedancer said:

I wont criticise anyone for believing in things which is and can be scientificly debunked

That's fine.  I will.

Because by helping promote this crap, those believers help grow the audience of gullibles that then get preyed on by those at the top of that food chain, ie the scammers selling EVP meters, or even those posting ad-supported YT videos/audios...