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Peter B

Gene Cernan on the Moon

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bknight
4 hours ago, Rlyeh said:

No, you can see light reflecting through the hole by the stowage plate.  Where are you getting it's going clear through the PLSS?

Yes reflected light, just like all the rest of the videos that show similar characteristic, just reflected light.  HB's don't really know a lot about physics.  

So RubyGray you didn't post an answer to my question but posted nonsense.  I shouldn't have expected more.:no:

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Noteverythingisaconspiracy
10 minutes ago, bknight said:

To my knowledge Cosmic Dave and all the rest of his socks, never invented anything in the way of conspiracy narrative.  All he did was parrot one of the others to the lament of many moderators.

In the end most of the arguments can be traced back to Kaysing.

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Noteverythingisaconspiracy
10 minutes ago, bknight said:

Yes reflected light, just like all the rest of the videos that show similar characteristic, just reflected light.  HB's don't really know a lot about physics.  

So RubyGray you didn't post an answer to my question but posted nonsense.  I shouldn't have expected more.:no:

Giving clear answers to questions is the one thing that conspiracy theorists fear the most.

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Rlyeh
2 hours ago, bknight said:

Yes reflected light, just like all the rest of the videos that show similar characteristic, just reflected light.  HB's don't really know a lot about physics.  

So RubyGray you didn't post an answer to my question but posted nonsense.  I shouldn't have expected more.:no:

That's what I mean, it's the same glaring bright white as the other parts of the suit.  I'm not sure how it gives the idea it's hollow or going through the PLSS.

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bknight
2 hours ago, bknight said:

Yes reflected light, just like all the rest of the videos that show similar characteristic, just reflected light.  HB's don't really know a lot about physics.  

So RubyGray you didn't post an answer to my question but posted nonsense.  I shouldn't have expected more.:no:

If she would look closely the shiny spot is much brighter than the Moon's surface, so it could not be a "hole" through the PLSS.

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Noteverythingisaconspiracy
8 hours ago, RubyGray said:

Gene Cernan's PLSS, the life support system in a backpack required for existence on the moon, was hollow.

At 4 points in this video,

Apollo 17 - Geology Station 6 - part 1 (1972)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-DE_P209jSs

Gene Cernan (dark armband) was side-on to the light, which shone from one side clear through to the other, through significant gaps in the sidewalls of his PLSS.

As he moves around, the hollow light-filled space reveals

14:04    5 frames
14:57    5 frames
18:30-31    23 frames
19:38    10 frames

The image below shows what the interior of the Apollo 17 PLSS was supposed to look like, and the screenshot of Gene Cernan shows how there was actually empty space inside it.1253711206_GeneCernanHollowPLSS.thumb.jpg.54b363d62fb813fce5492cf11962a1a0.jpg

There is a similar bright spot further up and to the left, on the edge of the PLSS. How do you explain that ? By applying your "logic" it would meant that the PLSS is empty on the outside wouldn't it ? That makes no sense.

Edited by Noteverythingisaconspiracy
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bknight
11 minutes ago, Noteverythingisaconspiracy said:

There is a similar bright spot further up and to the left, on the edge of the PLSS. How do you explain that ? By applying your "logic" it would meant that the PLSS is empty on the outside wouldn't it ? That makes no sense.

And both spots are much brighter than the surface, so the PLSS can't be hollow.

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Noteverythingisaconspiracy
1 minute ago, bknight said:

And both spots are much brighter than the surface, so the PLSS can't be hollow.

Yeah there are so many reasons why this isn't proof of a conspiracy. It is however proof of very lazy research. 

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ChrLzs

Ruby, working out sun angles is rather trivial.  Also, the position and orientation of the astronauts can be determine with quite high accuracy by studying the EVA maps, and as posted we know the shape of the PLSS and which bits stick out.

A real researcher/investigator would have used all those references, which are all freely available and also verifiable.

 

It's NOT rocket science, but clearly it's way out of your league, as well as the person who suckered you - Cosmic Dave is well known as a troll, and likely doesn't believe this stuff at all, he just likes to laugh at people he gets to follow along..  If nothing else, this shows there is always an 'audience' for this manure.

So may I politely suggest that rather than post any more threads containing easily refutable garbage like that ... pick a different hobby.

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Peter B
On 10/15/2019 at 7:12 PM, RubyGray said:

Gene Cernan's PLSS, the life support system in a backpack required for existence on the moon, was hollow.

At 4 points in this video,

Apollo 17 - Geology Station 6 - part 1 (1972)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-DE_P209jSs

Gene Cernan (dark armband) was side-on to the light, which shone from one side clear through to the other, through significant gaps in the sidewalls of his PLSS.

As he moves around, the hollow light-filled space reveals

14:04    5 frames
14:57    5 frames
18:30-31    23 frames
19:38    10 frames

The image below shows what the interior of the Apollo 17 PLSS was supposed to look like, and the screenshot of Gene Cernan shows how there was actually empty space inside it.1253711206_GeneCernanHollowPLSS.thumb.jpg.54b363d62fb813fce5492cf11962a1a0.jpg

Out of interest, why is "the PLSS was hollow" the only possible explanation for what shows on the video? What did you do to eliminate other possible explanations?

After all, in each case the artefact occurs while Cernan is turning and also part of his PLSS or spacesuit is brightly lit by the Sun. That should provide a clue about an alternative explanation.

ETA: What can you say to explain other features of the video which suggest it was filmed in a low gravity vacuum? Kicked soil falls back to the ground rather than billowing as dust would in an atmosphere, suggesting a vacuum; the arm movements of the astronauts clearly show the video isn't slowed down; and yet the astronauts are moving much more easily than people could carrying the gear they're wearing, indicating low gravity.

Edited by Peter B
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ChrLzs
5 hours ago, Peter B said:

Out of interest, why is "the PLSS was hollow" the only possible explanation for what shows on the video? What did you do to eliminate other possible explanations?

After all, in each case the artefact occurs while Cernan is turning and also part of his PLSS or spacesuit is brightly lit by the Sun. That should provide a clue about an alternative explanation.

And quite apart from anything else, it is blindingly obvious that the Sun is located to the right of frame (roughly at '2:45pm' azimuth/bearing) and is well above the horizon, so the fact that it would brightly illuminate any little bits sticking out of the side, is hardly surprising... Note that if it was a hole, then unless the PLSS was made of glass or had a completely open other side to let the sunlight in, it would in fact be much darker, not brighter.  It's a pity that little or no thought was applied here...

As stated earlier, it would be also possible to get the sun's exact location in the sky, and also pretty accurately nail down the astronaut's angle.  (This has been done several times for other similar images.)

But that's what the CLAIMANT should have done...  would have done if they understood the basics...  Didn't do.  And there's no way I'm putting in a couple of hours work to do it...

Unless, of course, Ruby has convinced anyone else..  So is there anyone else here who has thought about it and despite the comments above, agrees with Ruby's interpretation?

 

Edited by ChrLzs
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rambaldi
On 10/15/2019 at 5:15 PM, bknight said:

so it could not be a "hole" through the PLSS.

I'm still waiting for a (at least halfway sane) explanation why a fake PLSS would have a hole. 

 

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bknight
44 minutes ago, rambaldi said:

I'm still waiting for a (at least halfway sane) explanation why a fake PLSS would have a hole. 

 

To my knowledge there is no sane explanation.  These image artifacts have many reflections and some willfully ignorant person thought up well "If there are bright spots that means there is a "hole" in a spacesuit or other important objects thus "confirming" that Project Apollo was a hoax.  Another sad attempt to show that all the missions were faked on Earth.  I wouldn't be bothered anymore with this "issue" the claim is without merit as Peter B, ChrLzs and noteverythingisaconspiracy have pointed out. 

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bknight
On 10/13/2019 at 5:10 PM, bknight said:

Well I'll ask what are your beliefs concerning the Apollo landings. Please include evidence of said beliefs. 

I'll bump this question for you as you have not answered.

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Noteverythingisaconspiracy

Come on @RubyGray give us your best evidence. What convinced you that the Moon landings were fakes ? 

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ChrLzs
3 hours ago, Noteverythingisaconspiracy said:

Come on @RubyGray give us your best evidence. What convinced you that the Moon landings were fakes ? 

You'd think (and so would anyone of sound mind..) that if you had an important position to take, you would offer up the very best evidence as your first posting....

It is a common (and very obvious) tinfoilhat tactic to offer up something but NEVER refer to it to as your 'best'.  Because if you do .. and it is proven completely wrong - as here - your position is untenable and your lack of knowledge exposed.

So this approach is just a version of the Gish Gallop, combined with Moving the Goalposts, and she will likely just move onto another equally daft claim.

Or perhaps wisely she may simply no longer post and if asked, pretend she forgot all about it...

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Peter B
7 hours ago, Noteverythingisaconspiracy said:

Come on @RubyGray give us your best evidence. What convinced you that the Moon landings were fakes ? 

Judging by RubyGray's posts in this thread: http://letsrollforums.com//apollo-moon-hoax-wagging-t28489p6.html she is convinced by Dave McGowan's "Wagging the Moondoggie" series, which is available for reading here: https://centerforaninformedamerica.com/moondoggie-1/ (note that it runs to XIV - I mean 14 - parts)

Now WtM is thoroughly entertaining reading, but the late author makes a couple of the usual mistakes (Soviets were way ahead of the Americans in the Space Race until Apollo 11; Nixon had Apollo faked to distract from his problems; Apollo all came together suspiciously quickly; the Apollo photos are too good to have been taken by someone with a camera stuck to their chest; NASA lost the video footage; why didn't the astronauts jump really high in the low gravity; why has the technology vanished; the Moon rocks were collected in Antarctica; why aren't there any more recent photos of the landing sites; the more recent photos of the landing sites are probably faked; there's no way the LM could have worked; there's no way the spacesuits could have worked; there's no way the lunar rover could have worked; why haven't we been back; why didn't the Soviets go; the e-e-ebil radiation!; the astronauts would be snap-frozen in the cold of any shadows/cooked in the direct sunlight; where are the stars in the photos; shadows go in the wrong directions; no crater under the LM descent stage; and he doesn't understand orbital mechanics). Just the usual really, apart from the better than usual quality of writing...

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Earl.Of.Trumps

wow. how people can argue this ad infinitum is beyond me.

I suppose cons will have a readymade fix for the pic's of the American flags still planted on the moon, taken by the Reconnaissance Orbiter and  by a Japanese orbiter as well.

Anyway, enjoy the futility, y'all :hmm:

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bknight

Well I'll ask again, what are your beliefs concerning the Apollo landings. Please include evidence of said beliefs. 

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ChrLzs

As Ruby has had ample opportunity to respond and has chosen not to do so, I think the only sound we will now hear (apart from those crickets) is back-pedalling...

On behalf of Ruby, I now declare the flounce completed, and her very, very silly claim is now effectively withdrawn, having garnered no support whatsoever, and being completely and utterly baseless.

The small brightly lit areas are 100% consistent with small bits of the PLSS being illuminated by the Sun which is right of, and outside the frame.

 

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Hazzard
On 10/19/2019 at 11:46 PM, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

wow. how people can argue this ad infinitum is beyond me.

I suppose cons will have a readymade fix for the pic's of the American flags still planted on the moon, taken by the Reconnaissance Orbiter and  by a Japanese orbiter as well.

Anyway, enjoy the futility, y'all :hmm:

I cant answer for all the payed by NASA spooks here at UM, but for me...

Im never posting for the manic ET is here crowd, or the silly No Moonies. Im posting for the silent reader and those still in the fence.

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bknight
3 hours ago, Hazzard said:

I cant answer for all the payed by NASA spooks here at UM, but for me...

Im never posting for the manic ET is here crowd, or the silly No Moonies. Im posting for the silent reader and those still in the fence.

You should be off the fence as there is a literal mountain of data that proves the Apollo program happened as witness by many of us.  If you are indeed on the fence what questions do you have?

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ChrLzs
13 hours ago, Hazzard said:

I cant answer for all the payed by NASA spooks here at UM, but for me...

Im never posting for the manic ET is here crowd, or the silly No Moonies. Im posting for the silent reader and those still in the fence.

?

Is there a smilie or two missing from that, Hazz?  Or are you genuinely unconvinced by the official record of Apollo?  If so, may I ask why?

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Noteverythingisaconspiracy
15 hours ago, Hazzard said:

I cant answer for all the payed by NASA spooks here at UM, but for me...

Im never posting for the manic ET is here crowd, or the silly No Moonies. Im posting for the silent reader and those still in the fence.

If you have some nagging doubts then feel free to ask about it. Honest questions are allways wellcome, its the people who obviously don't care about the answers that is the problem.

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