Man says the footprints he found aren't human

[Trelane]

5 hours ago, docyabut2 said:

DEFINITELY NOT TATESSOS.

[Myles]

I would love for there to be large undiscovered apes all over the world, but the millions of trail cams out there make it very unlikely.

[Earl.Of.Trumps]

29 minutes ago, Myles said:

I would love for there to be large undiscovered apes all over the world, but the millions of trail cams out there make it very unlikely.

Trail cams are great... for a certain location.

Here's what I see happening one day. Drones. Miniature exploratory drones with batteries that can be recharged by the sun.

Release a bunch of those drones into the deep woods that are inaccessible to man for a month or so. That will go a ways to figuring it all out. 

[the13bats]

7 minutes ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

Trail cams are great... for a certain location.

Here's what I see happening one day. Drones. Miniature exploratory drones with batteries that can be recharged by the sun.

Release a bunch of those drones into the deep woods that are inaccessible to man for a month or so. That will go a ways to figuring it all out. 

Do we have robot drones that can nav deep woods and run for months? Perhaps soon,

I had a blast with a 10 buck tiny quad chopper in my house, but a cat took mine out,  a fellow i know and believe told me he took his tiny quad out just to see how high it would go before loosing control, he says it took off about 30 high about 20 feet forward of him and out of no where a hawk takes it out, and flew off with it, too funny.

During the last few years of krantz life he worked on a mail order one man helicopter, I suspect something like the auto gyro from road warrior, krantz believed if he flew around with flir type devices he could find a dead bigfoot,

He had some issues getting this thing off the ground and sadly passed before he ever did,

I thought one remark he made about it was hilarious, he said to the effect it was a secret project that he sure didnt want any press there on its maiden flight and crash where emt are pulling his broken bloody body out of the wreckage.

 

[stereologist]

One problem with a drone project is that there are wilderness areas where drones would not be allowed. For example, trail crews in wilderness areas are not allowed to use chainsaws.

[docyabut2]

On ‎10‎/‎20‎/‎2019 at 1:33 AM, Trelane said:

DEFINITELY NOT TATESSOS.

I`m not referring to a  TATESSOS a  tale of Atlantis, but how we all came out of a evolution of mankind   

[kel_kel]

Prints are too easily faked to be taken seriously. Hair samples would be better.

[the13bats]

4 hours ago, kel_kel said:

Prints are too easily faked to be taken seriously. Hair samples would be better.

This is true however the best of the mighty bigfoot hunters present their alleged bf hair samples for testing, shaking their fists it can only be hair from a bf,

It never is.

[ThereWeAreThen]

16 hours ago, kel_kel said:

Prints are too easily faked to be taken seriously. Hair samples would be better.

Do they ever check prints for DNA or any other traces which may identify what created the prints?

 

Surely if they were faked, which I'm fairly certain all bf prints are, wouldn't there be traces of say...wood (if the thing was obviously made out of wood).

Just a thought.

[the13bats]

 

7 hours ago, ThereWeAreThen said:

Surely if they were faked, which I'm fairly certain all bf prints are,

Don't you believe some might be known animals and the track gets distorted and morphed, like when bears double step or snow melts or mud oozes.

[ocpaul20]

I suspect most of us here are armchair researchers as I am but no-one has mentioned Professor Jeff Meldrum ( Associate Professor of Anatomy & Anthropology as well as Adjunct Associate Professor of the Department of Anthropology at Idaho State College ) has loads of plaster casts and a few hand casts too I believe, collected from different areas of the world. He knows how these things walk and where and how the casts show the distribution of weight. It is almost inconceivable that he has a bear track plaster cast and not know it is a bear track.

I have a feeling that the reason why we have not got trail cam pictures is that Bigfoot can see into the infrared spectrum, which would mean whenever the trailcam tries to take a picture, it will light up the surrounding area with a floodlight of IR. Bigfoot can probably smell humans just like a dog can which might be another reason why he does not get close enough to things humans have left behind to photograph him.

It seems very few of us actually get out there and search for Bigfoot - partly because a large 900lb hominid is dangerous and partly because not many people have the time to spend days out in the woods looking.

Related: I know people with a specific diet have a particular smell. Generally speaking, white man has a kind of dairy-smell due to the amount of cheese and milk he eats, Indians have a kind of curry-smell and other races have their own smells according to their diets. I once went on a water fast and my wife said I smelled different after a week. The point is, I am sure if Bigfoot exists, he can smell us and our trail cameras a mile away and probably hear us too. Is it difficult to understand we have not got much evidence?

The David Paulides books Missing 411, cite some of the kids who are too young to talk very well (2-4 year olds) and who survived an abduction, reported a " friendly dog-man" who took them. OK, this may not be Bigfoot, but the kids, both dead and alive, were often found many miles away and in areas which had previously been searched by the Search and Rescue party. Also, in a couple of instances, the National Guard were called in and they did NOT interface with the Parks Dept or the S & R teams. That is all a bit strange.

[Horta]

2 hours ago, ocpaul20 said:

I suspect most of us here are armchair researchers as I am but no-one has mentioned Professor Jeff Meldrum ( Associate Professor of Anatomy & Anthropology as well as Adjunct Associate Professor of the Department of Anthropology at Idaho State College ) has loads of plaster casts and a few hand casts too I believe, collected from different areas of the world. He knows how these things walk and where and how the casts show the distribution of weight. It is almost inconceivable that he has a bear track plaster cast and not know it is a bear track.

Meldrum has been quite easily fooled regarding bigfoot claims, so he isn't taken too seriously. He claimed the "snow walker" video showed a massive beast that he calculated at  8-10' tall and that moved far to naturally for such a huge beast to be a human in a costume. Until the people that made it explained to him it was a human in a costume lol.

He also accepts tracks that have since been shown to be consistent with Wallace fakes, even down to the heel crack in one of the stompers. Rather than admit error of course, he claims Wallace must have modelled his stompers on really real bigfoot tracks lol.

He doesn't know how bigfoot walks at all (he believes it walks like "Patty" for obvious reasons). In fact he looks to have very poor basic tracking skills, his expertise is in anatomy not tracks, so when he gets a bigfoot foot he might be worth listening to. He also accepts tracks from very dubious sources.

His claims re the PG film are eerily similar to the snow walker hoax. He makes all sorts of non verifiable claims about it, which amount to no more than personal belief. The source he sites for his claim of Patty being over 7' tall is bogus, this claim was retracted years ago and he knows this.

There is also the skookum elk lay which is so ridiculous even many bigfoot believers laugh at it. There was a PhD with a specialty in Ichnology who wrote a small appraisal of the claims, and was even willing to write a paper on it and submit it to a mainstream journal if he got enough interest. Something Meldrum is yet to do, by the way. Of course Meldrum dismissed his work with a "he wasn't there" and refused to engage in any dialogue, while bigfooters generally tried to crucify him for not believing, so he gave up.

There is also his support for Todd Standing and his bigfoots....

If bigfoot exists where it is claimed to, there is no way to explain why we wouldn't have specimens going back to the 19th century, so making excuses for lack of other type of evidence now is irrelevant. There is no evidence to suggest any type of large undiscovered mammal species that could potentially be bigfoot is inhabiting the US. The whole thing is consistent with folklore.

[stereologist]

11 hours ago, ocpaul20 said:

I suspect most of us here are armchair researchers as I am but no-one has mentioned Professor Jeff Meldrum ( Associate Professor of Anatomy & Anthropology as well as Adjunct Associate Professor of the Department of Anthropology at Idaho State College ) has loads of plaster casts and a few hand casts too I believe, collected from different areas of the world. He knows how these things walk and where and how the casts show the distribution of weight. It is almost inconceivable that he has a bear track plaster cast and not know it is a bear track.

I have a feeling that the reason why we have not got trail cam pictures is that Bigfoot can see into the infrared spectrum, which would mean whenever the trailcam tries to take a picture, it will light up the surrounding area with a floodlight of IR. Bigfoot can probably smell humans just like a dog can which might be another reason why he does not get close enough to things humans have left behind to photograph him.

It seems very few of us actually get out there and search for Bigfoot - partly because a large 900lb hominid is dangerous and partly because not many people have the time to spend days out in the woods looking.

Related: I know people with a specific diet have a particular smell. Generally speaking, white man has a kind of dairy-smell due to the amount of cheese and milk he eats, Indians have a kind of curry-smell and other races have their own smells according to their diets. I once went on a water fast and my wife said I smelled different after a week. The point is, I am sure if Bigfoot exists, he can smell us and our trail cameras a mile away and probably hear us too. Is it difficult to understand we have not got much evidence?

The David Paulides books Missing 411, cite some of the kids who are too young to talk very well (2-4 year olds) and who survived an abduction, reported a " friendly dog-man" who took them. OK, this may not be Bigfoot, but the kids, both dead and alive, were often found many miles away and in areas which had previously been searched by the Search and Rescue party. Also, in a couple of instances, the National Guard were called in and they did NOT interface with the Parks Dept or the S & R teams. That is all a bit strange.

I just wanted to point out that BF photos are almost exclusively daylight photos. A trail cam would not flood an area with IR during daylight hours.

Before Meldrum there was Krantz. There will be others I suspect. The problem is that no one has really turned up anything and Krantz and Meldrum knew or know that.

People do not have to actively search for BF. Not a requirement. There are plenty of explorers out there. When I was in Alaska I was told by park rangers about small groups traveling huge distances across the wilds of Alaska. But no one ever reports a BF. They report caribou, bear, foxes, and wolverines, but never a BF.

[ocpaul20]

On 11/5/2019 at 4:58 AM, stereologist said:

I just wanted to point out that BF photos are almost exclusively daylight photos. A trail cam would not flood an area with IR during daylight hours.

yes, and I was pointing out that, in the dark, the IR light which is often used to take photos by these trail cams, would be like a floodlight IF the creature has evolved to see into the IR spectrum.

I agree, there are not (m)any good photos of Bigfoot, but he certainly is reported to be active at night which is when we are hoping to use the IR lights on the trailcams to illuminate the area and record a photograph. Of course, there are also IR detectors on the trailcams too which work in the daytime as well, but given that humans stink of human smell, it is not really surprising we do not get many good photos.

[stereologist]

7 hours ago, ocpaul20 said:

yes, and I was pointing out that, in the dark, the IR light which is often used to take photos by these trail cams, would be like a floodlight IF the creature has evolved to see into the IR spectrum.

I agree, there are not (m)any good photos of Bigfoot, but he certainly is reported to be active at night which is when we are hoping to use the IR lights on the trailcams to illuminate the area and record a photograph. Of course, there are also IR detectors on the trailcams too which work in the daytime as well, but given that humans stink of human smell, it is not really surprising we do not get many good photos.

The lack of photos is likely due to the same reason there is zero evidence of BF - BF doesn't exist. 

I believe that what I used to call all of the excuses for the lack of evidence is more properly termed special pleading.

Here you suggest that BF can see IR.  Can primates see IR?

https://io9.gizmodo.com/under-the-right-conditions-humans-can-see-infrared-1665448040

Quote

But if huge amounts of infrared photons flooded the eye over a short period of time, two infrared photons could hit the chromophore at once. Their combined energy is enough to cause it to change its structure and allow people to see what they otherwise wouldn't. Two 1000 nanometer photons add up, energetically speaking, to one photon of around 500 nanometers - which is in the green range of the visual spectrum. So infrared light, if concentrated enough, would leave us seeing green.

Another link: http://www.sci-news.com/biology/science-humans-can-see-infrared-light-02313.html

And another link: http://discovermagazine.com/2015/oct/3-seeing-the-invisible

Quote

Palczewska and her colleagues at Polgenix Inc. set up an experiment to investigate the phenomena and found that everyone might have this strange ability. When observing a rapidly pulsing infrared laser, each of 30 participants reported seeing the light, too.

They would have to be staring into the trail cam to detect it - well, maybe detect it.

In general, no primates see into the infrared portion of the spectrum.

In fact, land mammals in general cannot see red well. The primates do the best at this. Cats chase a red spot of laser light because they see it due its brightness. They do not see the red as we do.

 

The chance that BF can see an IR flash is basically zero.

[ocpaul20]

On 11/7/2019 at 12:24 AM, stereologist said:

In general, no primates see into the infrared portion of the spectrum

So, are you telling us there are NO primates which can see into the IR spectrum or just most of them cannot? It still does not exclude the possibility that Bigfoot can. It might be just another adaption to living in forests etc.

I agree, we humans cannot see much IR but I do know we can see some of the IR LED lights used in some of the IR cameras, the LEDS glow red although this is not seeing the actual light coming from them as we would a stage floodlight. Maybe we are seeing the small amount of lower red spectrum light also coming from the IR LEDs? These cheaper ones are 850nm which tend to glow red but the higher 940nm LEDS cannot be seen by humans at all as far as I know.

I have suggested this before, but putting hanging CDs or DVDs out on trees would possibly capture DNA from Bigfoot fingerprints.

[stereologist]

14 hours ago, ocpaul20 said:

So, are you telling us there are NO primates which can see into the IR spectrum or just most of them cannot? It still does not exclude the possibility that Bigfoot can. It might be just another adaption to living in forests etc.

I agree, we humans cannot see much IR but I do know we can see some of the IR LED lights used in some of the IR cameras, the LEDS glow red although this is not seeing the actual light coming from them as we would a stage floodlight. Maybe we are seeing the small amount of lower red spectrum light also coming from the IR LEDs? These cheaper ones are 850nm which tend to glow red but the higher 940nm LEDS cannot be seen by humans at all as far as I know.

I have suggested this before, but putting hanging CDs or DVDs out on trees would possibly capture DNA from Bigfoot fingerprints.

I pointed out MAMMALS in general do not see IR and most have trouble seeing the red close to IR.

The idea that any MAMMAL can see IR is unsupported. That would not be an adaptation but a development of a new way of seeing for mammals.

We see between 390 and 780nm. The 390 end is the shorter, higher energy violet end of the spectrum. The longer wave lengths are the lower energy photos or red end of the spectrum.

We can't see 850nm which is beyond human detection.

https://www.physicsclassroom.com/class/light/Lesson-2/Visible-Light-and-the-Eye-s-Response

What you are mistaking as human detection of IR with 850nm LEDs is probably the two photon effect..

https://ellipsesecurity.com/2018/05/850nm-vs-940nm-ir-illuminator/

Quote

Although the IR light is invisible to the human eye, the IR LED’s will produce a faint red glow when looking directly at the camera or source.

The detection is due to two photons providing enough energy to allow detection of the light source.

The use of two photon excitation has been used for microscopy for a number of years.

https://www.microscopyu.com/techniques/multi-photon/multiphoton-microscopy

 

[stereologist]

Putting out shiny things hoping for BF DNA does not need to be done.

In many places  in the US there are bear sampling strategies that have never found primate hair on them.

http://www.wildlife.state.nm.us/download/hunting/species/bear/publications/Estimating-density-of-black-bears-in-New-Mexico.pdf

Quote

A hair trap consisted of a single strand of barbed wire placed around 3-6 trees with a non-consumable lure placed at the center. During each sampling occasion, hair traps were moved and 1 of 4 lures (blood/fish emulsion, skunk/lanolin, anise oil, and fatty acid scent tablet) was randomly selected to increase novelty of hair traps and consequently increase recapture rates. When a bear passed over or under the wirea barb snagged a tuft of hair from the individual. We deposited each hair sample in a separate paper coin envelope, and sterilized barbed wire using a propane torch to ensure any remaining hair was removed to prevent false recaptures the next sampling occasion.

http://fwp.mt.gov/mtoutdoors/HTML/articles/2005/BarbedWireBears.htm

Quote

The wire, exactly 50 centimeters from the ground, snags hair whether bears go over or under it. Being careful to retain the follicles, which hold the tissue containing DNA, the technicians use tweezers to place each hair into an envelope. They then use lighters to sterilize each barb on the wire.

https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/environment/studying-black-bears-in-washington-use-deer-blood-and-fish-oil/

https://www.scientificamerican.com/slideshow/bear-hair-research-insights-grizzlies-salmon-dependence/

I could go on but you can see what all of these places are doing - sampling bear populations. It is happening all over North America and has been happening for years.

[Dradan]

Well, with so many footprints being found, you really start to wonder if its a series of hoaxers or some wild animal.

[Night Walker]

20 hours ago, ocpaul20 said:

I have suggested this before, but putting hanging CDs or DVDs out on trees would possibly capture DNA from Bigfoot fingerprints.

You suggested doing that on another forum nearly 5 years ago - have you not tried it out for yourself?

It is not a new idea, though. People have been hanging cds in trees for Bigfoot for at least 20 years with zero results...

[ocpaul20]

5 hours ago, Night Walker said:

You suggested doing that on another forum nearly 5 years ago - have you not tried it out for yourself?

It is not a new idea, though. People have been hanging cds in trees for Bigfoot for at least 20 years with zero results...

Yes, it is not my idea, I heard it on Midnight-in-the-Desert. I just think it is a good idea and since not that many people know about it, I thought it was worth repeating. Does that make it any the less useful ? I dont know about the results - how do you know there are zero results? I suppose because you have not heard any results which are positive. Maybe the DNA test for these things is expensive.

I think this hanging CD method may be more likely to catch evidence of Bigfoot than the trailcam suggestions, but it is only a hunch.

Steralizing a barbed wire bear hair trap is pretty useless if you still leave your human smell there. Dont ask me why the bears dont mind human stink, but I still do not believe all the evidence we have for Bigfoot points to hoaxers or misidentifications.  I cannot explain why we do not have more positive proof.

I know there are many on here who believe Bigfoot does not exist. However, there are probably also many who believe the evidence is enough and money should be available to investigate the phenomena properly. You would have thought the money would have been available for funding if it such a big deal to find a new hominid.

[+joc]

16 minutes ago, ocpaul20 said:

I cannot explain why we do not have more positive proof.

 What 'positive' proof is there?  If there was positive proof at all would we even be discussing this?

[Night Walker]

37 minutes ago, ocpaul20 said:

I think this hanging CD method may be more likely to catch evidence of Bigfoot than the trailcam suggestions, but it is only a hunch.

So why have you not tried it out for yourself? 

[ocpaul20]

I wanted to add to my last comment but it was too late:

Added: The other thing which occurs to me is that bears go around on all-4s mostly while Bigfoot goes around standing upright. A 50cm high barbed wire 'fence' is just not high enough to warrant much effort, and can be easily stepped over if the animal is 8-10 feet high. It is horses for courses and a bear hair trap is fine at 50cm for a four-legged bear but may not work at all for a 2-legged Bigfoot. You cannot assume one thing (a bear hair trap) will work for both animals.

[stereologist]

35 minutes ago, ocpaul20 said:

I wanted to add to my last comment but it was too late:

Added: The other thing which occurs to me is that bears go around on all-4s mostly while Bigfoot goes around standing upright. A 50cm high barbed wire 'fence' is just not high enough to warrant much effort, and can be easily stepped over if the animal is 8-10 feet high. It is horses for courses and a bear hair trap is fine at 50cm for a four-legged bear but may not work at all for a 2-legged Bigfoot. You cannot assume one thing (a bear hair trap) will work for both animals.

You left off the rest of bad excuse which is that bears could slip under or could step over. BF seems to avoid these traps day and night.

If anyone wants to believe the PF film hoax then they have Patty at a little over 6, not 8 to 10.

The fact is that there is nothing out there. No evidence exists for BF but tracks and they get found out as hoaxes, even ones determined by Meldrum to be real.

This CD ideas is a failure. It has turned up nothing most likely because BF does not exist.

Here is another bad excuse

Quote

Steralizing a barbed wire bear hair trap is pretty useless if you still leave your human smell there.

The same applies to hanging CDs. People walking through the woods should cause BF to stay away, but that means almost every report is a hoax. In fact, I can't think of a BF sighting that wasn't where people travel through  regularly.

 

BF excuses are excuses and most are just plain sad. The proper term for these sad excuses is special pleading.

 

There are many reasons to not believe in BF:

• The fossil record has no apes in NA
• There are no bones or teeth of apes in NA
• There is no hair, or tissue or DNA evidence
• There is nothing but stories and stories mean little