Influence on English, in regard to semitic

[Kittens Are Jerks]

4 hours ago, VastLand said:

yes exactly, I am not defending any purity to West germanic or to Indo-european languages, English is obviously a melding pot, and I would like to post on the matter, but I am busy with another thread.

There are a number of hypotheses regarding the original homeland of the Indo-Europeans, but none of them (to my knowledge) place them in areas where Semitic languages are believed to have originated. Furthermore, if there were any Semitic influences on the origins of the English language, they would easily be identifiable given the vast archaeological research and linguistic reconstructions that have been done in this area.

[Piney]

41 minutes ago, Kittens Are Jerks said:

There are a number of hypotheses regarding the original homeland of the Indo-Europeans,

It's been narrowed down to the Pontic-Caspian Steppe. The Anatolian  hypothesis is now "dead in the water". 

[Jodie.Lynne]

7 hours ago, VastLand said:

Recently, in another thread, and although off topic, there seemed to have been some quarrel, concerning the roots and influence, of the English language. It appears, some feel informed to believe that Semitic has no influence on English, aside from more recent loan words, that being, names from "Hebrew", which were adopted into England. Others, feel informed, believing a more alternative approach to the history of the English language, believing that English has some of her roots in the Semitic language.

What is true? That is the question for anyone looking to know. I have my opinion, and I will likely express it, so let us discuss. There may even be some discoveries, or facts to help validate the claims we may have. 

OK, your writing style is a little confusing, but can you give some examples of Semitic words than have been incorporated into English, other than names.

[jmccr8]

21 hours ago, Jodie.Lynne said:

OK, your writing style is a little confusing, but can you give some examples of Semitic words than have been incorporated into English, other than names.

Hi Jodie

Just of the top of my head "putz" is one that aptly describes certain persons known.

jmccr8

[Piney]

4 minutes ago, jmccr8 said:

Hi Jodie

Just of the top of my head "putz" is one that aptly describes certain persons known.

jmccr8

"Schmuck" is more appropriate. 

[jaylemurph]

7 hours ago, Piney said:

"Schmuck" is more appropriate. 

Real schmucks are fun!

—Jaylemurph 

[Mellon Man]

On 11/5/2019 at 1:59 AM, Piney said:

It's been narrowed down to the Pontic-Caspian Steppe. The Anatolian  hypothesis is now "dead in the water". 

I know a lot of colleagues who would disagree with this. Although the Kurgan hypothesis is commonly accepted, which i favour myself. I would not suggest the Anatolian hypothesis is 'dead in the water'. Even the Armenian hypothesis is back on the table. 

[Piney]

2 hours ago, Mellon Man said:

Even the Armenian hypothesis is back on the table. 

That is a absolute joke. 

[quiXilver]

When teaching my son to read, he was constantly perplexed by the way we pronounce some spellings.

For a goof, I wrote out on a small card, an example of ough pronunciation.

 

"Though roughly, I thought I brought you through that trough thoroughly, while avoiding the bough and in spite of the coughing.  Now finish those doughnuts."

 

English for the win...

[Piney]

2 hours ago, Mellon Man said:

Even the Armenian hypothesis is back on the table. 

Quote

Recent DNA-research has led to renewed suggestions of a Caucasian homeland for a 'pre-proto-Indo-European'.^{[2][3][4][5][6]}  

according to which both proto-Anatolian and proto-Indo-European split-off from a common mother language "no later than the 4th millennium BCE."^[7]

We both agreed on this but it's not Gamkrelidze's original theory which has Armenian as a outgrowth of Hitttite.

There is not enough surviving Anatolian languages to make a determination though. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armenian_hypothesis

[Mellon Man]

1 hour ago, Piney said:

We both agreed on this but it's not Gamkrelidze's original theory which has Armenian as a outgrowth of Hitttite.

There is not enough surviving Anatolian languages to make a determination though. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armenian_hypothesis

I agree most of the hypotheses have a weak argument, however, you try tell that to Lord Renfrew. 

Hint: Won't go well. 

[Piney]

13 minutes ago, Mellon Man said:

I agree most of the hypotheses have a weak argument, however, you try tell that to Lord Renfrew. 

Hint: Won't go well. 

A debate between ol' Colin and Gimbutas would of been something. 

[+Desertrat56]

I thought "putz" and "schmuck" were from eastern euorpean language.  Those are the jewish people who used those terms, not the middle easterns.

I found this on meriam webster website

Definition of Yiddish

 

: a High German language written in Hebrew characters that is spoken by Jews and descendants of Jews of central and eastern European origin

History and Etymology for putz

Noun

Yiddish puts, literally, "finery, show," probably from putsn "to clean, shine"; akin to German putzen "to adorn, clean"

 

History and Etymology for schmuck

Yiddish shmok, literally, penis

 

Edited November 6, 2019 by Desertrat56

[Tatetopa]

On 11/4/2019 at 12:31 PM, VastLand said:

yes exactly, I am not defending any purity to West germanic or to Indo-european languages, English is obviously a melding pot, and I would like to post on the matter, but I am busy with another thread.

No worries, we are doing perfectly well without you.  Carry on, we'll see ourselves out when we are done.

[jaylemurph]

...where do you think the Jews /came/ from, if not the Middle East?

--Jaylemurph 

[+Desertrat56]

23 minutes ago, jaylemurph said:

...where do you think the Jews /came/ from, if not the Middle East?

--Jaylemurph 

Who are you asking?  Is this in response to my post?  There was a large number of jewish people in eastern europe.  I haven't looked it up, but I was told that some king wanted his people to all follow one religion and he chose the current (at the time) non-christian judaic religion, taught the people the hebrew alphabet but used their language which is now called yiddish, not middle eastern, eastern european, a germanic language.

[jmccr8]

1 hour ago, Desertrat56 said:

I thought "putz" and "schmuck" were from eastern euorpean language.  Those are the jewish people who used those terms, not the middle easterns.

I found this on meriam webster website

Definition of Yiddish

 

: a High German language written in Hebrew characters that is spoken by Jews and descendants of Jews of central and eastern European origin

History and Etymology for putz

Noun

Yiddish puts, literally, "finery, show," probably from putsn "to clean, shine"; akin to German putzen "to adorn, clean"

 

History and Etymology for schmuck

Yiddish shmok, literally, penis

 

Hi Desertrat

 After reading your post I looked and you are right but the meanings that were known to me were from Sam and Ben Grotsky who were the grocers that we got food from 50-60+ yrs ago and were friends of our family so I was just going off of memory. Even though it is not of Jewish origin the impact that it has had is of their use of the word.

https://jel.jewish-languages.org/words/449

putz

ALTERNATIVE SPELLINGS

pots, puts, potz

DEFINITIONS

• "A fool, an ass, a jerk." (Rosten) [lit. "penis"]

EXAMPLE SENTENCES

• Al D'amato called Chuck Schumer a putz-head in a private meeting. He said afterwards, "The Yiddish word I used to describe you at a private meeting means fool...I stand by my remark 100%."

LANGUAGES OF ORIGIN

Yiddish

ETYMOLOGY

פּאָץ pots '(vulgar) penis; fool'

WHO USES THIS

Jews: Jews of diverse religious backgrounds and organizational involvements
Non-Jews: (words that have spread outside of Jewish networks)

REGIONS

North America

DICTIONARIES

The New Joys of Yiddish, by Leo Rosten and Lawrence Bush (New York, 2003[1968]).
 

https://grammarist.com/spelling/schmuck-versus-putz/

1. • Tired_&_Retired says:

     April 23, 2015 at 4:45 pm

     Only a putz futzes around all day in the garage. And urologists futz around with putzes all day.

      
2. Eagle in NYC says:

   June 15, 2015 at 12:17 am

   A famous print ad (from the 60’s I think, for a shirt manufacturer) showed a man on a golf course standing over his ball with his putter in his hands. The headline, by a creative team conversant in Yiddish was, “Sometimes the shortest putts (read “putz”) are the hardest.”

   It was quickly cancelled once the inside joke became public. Don’t know what happened to the copywriter.

   okay I cherry picked those last 2 because they were funny.

   I'm am not challenging you just thought I was fun.

   jmccr8

[+Desertrat56]

3 minutes ago, jmccr8 said:

Hi Desertrat

 After reading your post I looked and you are right but the meanings that were known to me were from Sam and Ben Grotsky who were the grocers that we got food from 50-60+ yrs ago and were friends of our family so I was just going off of memory. Even though it is not of Jewish origin the impact that it has had is of their use of the word.

https://jel.jewish-languages.org/words/449

putz

ALTERNATIVE SPELLINGS

pots, puts, potz

DEFINITIONS

• "A fool, an ass, a jerk." (Rosten) [lit. "penis"]

EXAMPLE SENTENCES

• Al D'amato called Chuck Schumer a putz-head in a private meeting. He said afterwards, "The Yiddish word I used to describe you at a private meeting means fool...I stand by my remark 100%."

LANGUAGES OF ORIGIN

Yiddish

ETYMOLOGY

פּאָץ pots '(vulgar) penis; fool'

WHO USES THIS

Jews: Jews of diverse religious backgrounds and organizational involvements
Non-Jews: (words that have spread outside of Jewish networks)

REGIONS

North America

DICTIONARIES

The New Joys of Yiddish, by Leo Rosten and Lawrence Bush (New York, 2003[1968]).
 

https://grammarist.com/spelling/schmuck-versus-putz/

1. • Tired_&_Retired says:

     April 23, 2015 at 4:45 pm

     Only a putz futzes around all day in the garage. And urologists futz around with putzes all day.

      
2. Eagle in NYC says:

   June 15, 2015 at 12:17 am

   A famous print ad (from the 60’s I think, for a shirt manufacturer) showed a man on a golf course standing over his ball with his putter in his hands. The headline, by a creative team conversant in Yiddish was, “Sometimes the shortest putts (read “putz”) are the hardest.”

   It was quickly cancelled once the inside joke became public. Don’t know what happened to the copywriter.

   okay I cherry picked those last 2 because they were funny.

   I'm am not challenging you just thought I was fun.

   jmccr8

I always heard "putz" as fussy, "quit putzing with that"; schmuck was an idiot.  I see in Merriam Webster they both seem to mean the same thing nowdays though they didn't a long time ago.  I like words and knowing their roots and how the meanings have changed.

 

[jmccr8]

7 minutes ago, Desertrat56 said:

Who are you asking?  Is this in response to my post?  There was a large number of jewish people in eastern europe.  I haven't looked it up, but I was told that some king wanted his people to all follow one religion and he chose the current (at the time) non-christian judaic religion, taught the people the hebrew alphabet but used their language which is now called yiddish, not middle eastern, eastern european, a germanic language.

Hi Desertrat

I thought I would give this link as I was sure that there have been migrations of Jewish people throughout Europe for quite some time.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Jews_in_Europe

he history of the Jews in Europe stretches back over two thousand years, at least. Some Jews, a Judaean Israelite tribe from the Levant,^[1][2][3][4] migrated to Europe just before the rise of the Roman Empire. A notable early event in the history of the Jews in the Roman Empire was Pompey's conquest of the East beginning in 63 Before Common Era (BCE), although Alexandrian Jews had migrated to Rome before this event.

The pre-World War II Jewish population of Europe is estimated to have been close to 9 million.^[5] Around 6 million Jews were murdered^[6][7][8] in the Holocaust, which was followed by the emigration of much of the surviving population.

The current Jewish population of Europe is estimated to be ca. 2.4 million (0.3% of European population).^[9]

^jmccr8

[jmccr8]

2 minutes ago, Desertrat56 said:

I always heard "putz" as fussy, "quit putzing with that"; schmuck was an idiot.  I see in Merriam Webster they both seem to mean the same thing nowdays though they didn't a long time ago.  I like words and knowing their roots and how the meanings have changed.

Hi Desertrat

When I was growing up they were both used to described an idiot/fool/sucker or mark and that is still how I would and do use them.

Yes it is interesting to see changes in the meanings of words and uses even the one's I grew up with that changed or disappear from use and dictionaries.

jmccr8

[VastLand]

54 minutes ago, Tatetopa said:

No worries, we are doing perfectly well without you.  Carry on, we'll see ourselves out when we are done.

Someone with sense, thank you.

[jaylemurph]

4 hours ago, Desertrat56 said:

Who are you asking?  Is this in response to my post?  There was a large number of jewish people in eastern europe.  I haven't looked it up, but I was told that some king wanted his people to all follow one religion and he chose the current (at the time) non-christian judaic religion, taught the people the hebrew alphabet but used their language which is now called yiddish, not middle eastern, eastern european, a germanic language.

That’s history garbled almost to the point of non-sense, and linguistics the same. There was a king of the Khazars who did, briefly convert his people to Judaism in the early 700s CE. But it didn’t take with most of his people, and they were soon converted to Islam. And this was to the south and east of the Black Sea, so not near Germany at all. 
 

Yiddish arose when Southern European Jews from places like Toulouse and Marseille travelled inland, started speaking German rather than Romance languages but still used the Hebrew alphabet to write. 
 

Wikipedia is free to use and not written by brain-addled conspiridiots with racist axes to grind. You should check it out. 

—Jaylemurph 
 

[VastLand]

And so the time has come to post my opinion, and you know sometimes I put a huge effort into my posts including sources, foot notes and all, probably the more convincing approach for some people, but sometimes I am not in the mood to take it that far. I think maybe today, I will take it easy and give my piece. (edit: it went further)

English, as they say comes from West Germanic, in her expansion west. West Germanic of course evolved out of East Germanic, and the people of pre-germany, were of course the Goths. 

Quote

The Ostrogoths (Latin: Ostrogothi, Austrogothi) were the eastern branch of the older Goths (the other major branch being the Visigoths). The Ostrogoths traced their origins to the Greutungi – a branch of the Goths who had migrated southward from the Baltic Sea and established a kingdom north of the Black Sea, during the 3rd and 4th centuries. They built an empire stretching from the Black Sea to the Baltic. The Ostrogoths were probably literate in the 3rd century, and their trade with the Romans was highly developed. Their Danubian kingdom reached its zenith under King Ermanaric, who is said to have committed suicide at an old age when the Huns attacked his people and subjugated them in about 370.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ostrogoths

Previous to the Goths however, were the Danim, the nation of Dan, who migrated into Europe, some speculate they were migrating within the Scythian Stock, who migrated into the West from the Near East (Northern Near East), into the very same region that these Goths moved into, but about One-Thousand Years before the goths ever moved south. Others speculate they moved into Europe via Ships, through the Grecian regions.

Quote

Scythian, also called Scyth, Saka, and Sacae, member of a nomadic people, originally of Iranian stock, known from as early as the 9th century BCE who migrated westward from Central Asia to southern Russia and Ukraine in the 8th and 7th centuries BCE.

https://www.britannica.com/topic/Scythian

Scythians may have existed and ruled much earlier than recorded, having ruled over the slavs. Scythians, being Indo-Iraneans, were not the first "Indo-europeans", an earlier western group to Indo-Iraneans had already migrated into Central Europe.

Quote

From an early date, quite probably before their existence is recorded (and the 1200s BC has been mentioned as a likely period), a large proportion of the early Slavs in the Middle Dnieper basin fall under the rule of the Scythians. The Finno-Ugric tribes and the eastern Balts living in the forested areas to the north remain outside the orbit of strong Scythian influence.

While the western branch of the Indo-European-speaking groups - the centum-speakers - largely headed towards Central Europe and Scandinavia, the eastern branches were much less adventurous at first, generally filling the void on the steppe. These groups, classed as Indo-Iranians, would eventually supply migratory peoples such as the Persians and Medians, and the Indo-Aryans of northern India. They also supplied the Sakas who dominated Central Asia by the middle of the first millennium BC. 

https://www.historyfiles.co.uk/KingListsEurope/BarbarianScythians.htm

Scythians were primarily Iranian stock, as the people who migrated in the land before the 11th century BCE. However, with migrations of Semites, the community became a more mixed race in particular regions, later on (modern day, pretty well melded). The Scythian borders shifted in time, but during the seventh century, the time which is said to be Scythian migration toward Europe, the Empire's borders were stretched as far as China. No doubt they were expanding, and their people migrating. Their borders exceed what maps show, even to the West.

Quote

The Scythians – the Greeks' name for this initially nomadic people – inhabited Scythia from at least the 11th century BC to the 2nd century AD.^[6] In the seventh century BC, the Scythians controlled large swaths of territory throughout Eurasia, from the Black Sea across Siberia to the borders of China.^[7][8] Its location and extent varied over time, but it usually extended farther to the west and significantly farther to the east than is indicated on the map.^[9] Some sources document that the Scythians were energetic but peaceful people.^[10] Not much is known about them.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scythia

During the existence of the Scythians, that being the Indo-Iraneans, the "Assyrian Empire" began, where by a "captivity" occurred, in which the Northern Samaritan tribes were relocated, in an exile from their homeland, into Assyrian ruled cities. Scythia began in 11th century BCE, and ended 2nd century AD. Assyria began in the 10th century BCE and ended 7th century BCE.

Quote

The Neo-Assyrian Empire was an Iron Age Mesopotamian empire, in existence between 911 and 609 BC

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neo-Assyrian_Empire

Quote

The Scythians – the Greeks' name for this initially nomadic people – inhabited Scythia from at least the 11th century BC to the 2nd century AD.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scythia

Showing that New Assyria started, perhaps, a century after Scythia, and ended nearly 123 years after the captivity of the Samaritans.

Quote

The Assyrian captivity (or the Assyrian exile) is the period in the history of Ancient Israel and Judah during which several thousand Israelites of ancient Samaria were resettled as captives by Assyria. This is one of the many instances of forcible relocations implemented by the Neo-Assyrian Empire.

............................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................

The captivities began in approximately 740 BCE (or 733/2 BCE according to other sources).^[1]

And the God of Israel stirred up the spirit of Pul king of Assyria, and the spirit of Tilgathpilneser king of Assyria, and he carried them away, even the Reubenites, and the Gadites, and the half tribe of Manasseh, and brought them unto Halah, and Habor, and Hara, and to the river Gozan, unto this day. (1 Chronicles 5:26)

In the days of Pekah king of Israel came Tiglathpileser king of Assyria, and he took Ijon, and Abelbethmaachah, and Janoah, and Kedesh, and Hazor, and Gilead, and Galilee, all the land of Naphtali, and carried them captive to Assyria. (2 Kings 15:29)

In 722 BCE, nearly ten to twenty years after the initial deportations, the ruling city of the Northern Kingdom of Israel, Samaria, was finally taken by Sargon II after a three-year siege started by Shalmaneser V.

Against him came up Shalmaneser king of Assyria; and Hoshea became his servant, and gave him presents.

And the king of Assyria found conspiracy in Hoshea: for he had sent messengers to So king of Egypt, and brought no present to the king of Assyria, as he had done year by year: therefore the king of Assyria shut him up, and bound him in prison. Then the king of Assyria came up throughout all the land, and went up to Samaria, and besieged it three years.

In the ninth year of Hoshea the king of Assyria took Samaria, and carried Israel away into Assyria, and placed them in Halah and in Habor by the river of Gozan, and in the cities of the Medes. (2 Kings 17:3–6)

And the king of Assyria did carry away Israel unto Assyria and put them in Halah and in Habor by the river of Gozan, and in the cities of the Medes: because they obeyed not the voice of the LORD their God, but transgressed his covenant, and all that Moses the servant of the LORD commanded and would not hear them, nor do them. (2 Kings 18:11–12)

The term "cities of the Medes" mentioned above may be a corruption from an original text "Mountains of Media".^[2][3]

The Book of Kings states several times that the entire people of the Kingdom of Israel had been taken into exile by the Assyrians. Some believe that the Books of Chronicles information about the fate of the Northern Kingdom adds up differently. What is often cited is 2nd Chronicles, Chapter 15, which mentions that there had been people from the hill-country cities of Ephraim and Manasseh who were captured by the Judean king, Asa of Judah. And Asa, sojourning among the Judean kingdom population, returned practicing the Hebrew belief. However, this is a mis-characterization of the events. Since those scriptures clearly declare that it was at a time when the Northern Kingdom was still intact, this happened in an era before the Assyrian Captivity.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assyrian_captivity

The Captivity started in about 732 BCE and finally came to an end around 722 BCE. This takes place within the 8th century BCE. In the seventh century, Scythians crossed the Caucus mountains, but probably, Scythians entered the region above the Black Sea much earlier, making this a secondary migration of the "Saka", and yet another migration for the Indus people.

Quote

In the 7th century BC, the Scythians crossed the Caucasus

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scythians

Quote

From an early date, quite probably before their existence is recorded (and the 1200s BC has been mentioned as a likely period), a large proportion of the early Slavs in the Middle Dnieper basin fall under the rule of the Scythians. The Finno-Ugric tribes and the eastern Balts living in the forested areas to the north remain outside the orbit of strong Scythian influence.

While the western branch of the Indo-European-speaking groups - the centum-speakers - largely headed towards Central Europe and Scandinavia, the eastern branches were much less adventurous at first, generally filling the void on the steppe. These groups, classed as Indo-Iranians, would eventually supply migratory peoples such as the Persians and Medians, and the Indo-Aryans of northern India. They also supplied the Sakas who dominated Central Asia by the middle of the first millennium BC. 

https://www.historyfiles.co.uk/KingListsEurope/BarbarianScythians.htm

Now onto how Semites became inducted into new names. The tribes were relocated, some to the Medes, an Indo-Iranean group; they, semites were brought to Mannae, a Cimmerian stronghold in Assyria; perhaps the only way they would have entered scythia, would have been when the "Slave tribes" fled Assyria, when Babylon finally toppled the kingdom. They would have headed away, namely Northeast or Northwest.

Quote

Perhaps more significantly, it was Assyrian policy to use relocated peoples in the creation of “buffer states” between themselves and their enemies. In his Ancient History of the Near East, H. R. Hall writes that the Assyrians worked to establish “dependant” mini-states “largely composed of conquered and deported tribes from other parts of western Asia.” He specifically mentions “imported Semites” in association with the area of Mannae.⁶ As noted in the previous chapter, Mannae was a Cimmerian stronghold used as an Assyrian buffer state.

 

Quote

The Tribe of Dan had been carried off by the Assyrians (modern day Germans and Austrians). But when the Babylonians destroyed Assyria, the slave tribes scattered. Dan headed northwest.

https://www.geni.com/projects/Where-are-The-Ten-Lost-Tribes-of-Israel/3474

Quote

Overwhelmingly, scholars and researchers insist that the deported tribes of Israel vanished soon after exile, having been absorbed into the lands of their captors. For example, the highly reputable Cambridge Ancient History notes, “All the northern tribes … had been carried off … [and] enquiry into their fate has been one of the curiosities of learned and other research; [yet they] were probably soon swallowed up in their new [exilic] homes.”³

https://www.cbcg.org/booklets/america-britain/chapter-eight-israel-migrates-to-the-north-and-west.html

And so Cimmerians, and "Slave tribes" would head Northwest migrating around the Black Sea. Even the Scythians migrated Northwest, over the caspian sea, and up through the caucuses as result of war with Babylon.

Quote

Their Scythian brothers to the east would soon find themselves on the move as well—following the same path across the Caucasus, as well as going north around the east side of the Caspian Sea—spurred on by a Babylon bent on conquest. Edmund Filmer writes: “Following the fall of Nineveh in 612 BC and the subsequent collapse of Assyrian power in 609, the Scythians were deprived of their most powerful ally and consequently came under increasing pressure from the Medes [allied with Babylon]…. As a result, all Scythians west [and south] of the Caspian Sea would have been forced to retreat northwards into south Russia through the Dariel Pass in the Caucasus. Clearly, this migration must have begun about 600 BC, and this agrees with the fact that the earliest Scythian tombs [found] in [southern] Russia have been dated to about 580 BC.”¹²

https://www.cbcg.org/booklets/america-britain/chapter-eight-israel-migrates-to-the-north-and-west.html

In addition to the opinion that Semites migrated Northwest, there is also evidence and opinions on the matter of a danim portion fleeing West from the start of the Assyrian siege of Samaritans.

Quote

As previously noted, tens of thousands of Jews from the southern kingdom were also taken captive along with the northern tribes; still, a sizable number of scattered Israelites no doubt found refuge in Judah. And, as Chapter 9 brings out, a significant number of Israelites with maritime skills escaped captivity altogether by fleeing to the west on ships.

https://www.cbcg.org/booklets/america-britain/chapter-eight-israel-migrates-to-the-north-and-west.html

Dan then assumed new names, nations and roles:

Quote

During modern (2010's) excavations at Tell el-Qadi (the city of Dan), compelling Aegean influences were discovered. The head of the excavation, archaeologist Dr David Ilan of the Hebrew Union College, proposed that the people of Dan could be the Greek "Danaoi", who were hired as mercenaries by the Egyptian overlords of Canaan, to help them keep order in the land.^[3]

..........................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................

As part of the Kingdom of Israel, the territory of Dan was conquered by the Assyrians, and exiled; the manner of their exile led to their further history being lost.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tribe_of_Dan

Quote

They are mentioned in the Amarna letters from the 14th century BC as possibly being related to the "Land of the Danuna" near Ugarit.^[1]

The Egyptians described them as Sea Peoples.^[2]

..........................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................

The Denyen have been identified with the people of Adana, in Cilicia who existed in late Hittite Empire times. They are also believed to have settled in Cyprus. A Hittite report^[3] speaks of a Muksus, who also appears in an eighth-century bilingual inscription from Karatepe stele in Cilicia. The kings of Adana are traced from the "house of Mopsos," given in hieroglyphic Luwian as Moxos and in Phoenician as Mopsos, in the form mps. They were called the Dananiyim.^[4] The area also reports a Mopsukrene ("Mopsus' fountain" in Greek) and a Mopsuhestia ("Mopsus' hearth" in Greek), also in Cilicia.

...........................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................

There are suggestions that the Denyen joined with Hebrews to form one of the original 12 tribes of Israel. No strong evidence supports this view, however.

A minority view first suggested by Yigael Yadin attempted to connect the Denyen with the Tribe of Dan, described as remaining on their ships in the early Song of Deborah, contrary to the mainstream view of Israelite history. It was speculated that the Denyen had been taken to Egypt, and subsequently settled between the Caphtorite Philistines and the Tjekker, along the Mediterranean coast with the Tribe of Dan subsequently deriving from them.^[5]

The most famous Danite was Samson, whom some suggest is derived from Denyen tribal legends.^[6]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Denyen

Therefore Dan may have entered Europe from the south, a Semitic people, and would have influence all European languages to the north.

Here are some human to human encounters, video recorded, on the matter of specific locals admitting their ancestries. Of course peoples in the regions of Afghanistan, Pakistan, Iran, and Bhagdad(or who were from Baghdad) claim "Benai Israel" descendants. Yes these are the regions of Scythia, Assyria, and later Parthia.

Lost Tribes in Uzbekistan: https://youtu.be/S0QCPXnAPNA?t=1226

 

Nephtalites: https://youtu.be/S0QCPXnAPNA?t=1762

Samarkan Northern tribes: https://youtu.be/S0QCPXnAPNA?t=1991

Yhuda in Kaifheng, China: https://youtu.be/S0QCPXnAPNA?t=2037

Investigating Manesah migration through Burma, India : https://youtu.be/S0QCPXnAPNA?t=2199

Zebulon in Bombay, India (Northern Indian rulers of ancient time): https://youtu.be/S0QCPXnAPNA?t=2941

Lost tribes in the Parthan, and Pashtun people between Afghanistan and Pakistan: https://youtu.be/S0QCPXnAPNA?t=3656

People living among Parthans who claim descent from the Assyrians and who still posses an oral tradition of the conquest of Israel ("We took the people to areas we ruled"):https://youtu.be/S0QCPXnAPNA?t=4318

In Europe we have peoples such as those on the Island of "Sar-dan-ia", and there were the "Dan-oi" of troy, there are a great deal of rivers named "Dan", such as the Danube. There be a seafaring people who were called Denyen, and also people called Danuna.

Where did the Danish come from?

Quote

The first mentions of "Danes" are recorded in the mid-6th century by historians Procopius (Greek: δάνοι) and Jordanes (danī), who both refer to a tribe related to the Suetidi inhabiting the peninsula of Jutland, the province of Scania and the isles in between.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Danes

Quote

The origin of the Danes remains undetermined

.............................................................................

The Danes first appear in written history in the 6th century with references in Jordanes' Getica (551 AD), by Procopius, and by Gregory of Tours. They spoke Old Norse (dǫnsk tunga), which the Danes shared with the people in Norway and Sweden and later in Iceland.^[1] In his description of Scandza, Jordanes says that the Dani were of the same stock as the Suetidi ("Swedes") and expelled the Heruli and took their lands.

Danes are a germanic group, and it would make sense that they headed north. We see in the names of North Germanic peoples, the reference to Goth. Examples below: Geats, and Gutes.

Quote

The North Germanic peoples are thought to have emerged as a distinct people in Sweden in the early centuries AD.^[4] Several North Germanic tribes are mentioned by classical writers in antiquity, in particular the Swedes, Danes, Geats, Gutes and the Rugii. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Germanic_peoples

The Danish language is one who's sphere influences much of europe. English, comes out of the Dane's, Jutland. From the Angle people who migrated out from Germany.

Quote

The word is a result of the heavy Danish influence on the English language. Most people do not realize that the English language's roots are really Danish, in Jutland. Equipped with this knowledge this word is easy to decipher.

The Danish word for "thanks" is tak. In Scotland and upper England it was common to drop the at the end because of the way words were pronounced during the time of Old English and Middle English. Hence the slang word "ta" which should actually be pronounced "TA-k" but over time became "ta".

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=ta

Before Germans conquered the Area north the Black Sea, and South of the Baltic, there was a prominant Scythian, Cimmerian presence, with also, those who fled from Assyria.

Quote

Like the Cimmerians, Scythian migration out of the Middle East was prompted by ongoing war between Assyria and Babylon. By the latter half of the 7th century BC, the Assyrian Empire was rapidly disintegrating. The Medes and Babylonians were openly attacking Assyria on numerous fronts, and the Scythian Israelites were emboldened to side with the aggressors.

https://www.cbcg.org/booklets/america-britain/chapter-eight-israel-migrates-to-the-north-and-west.html

The German conquer meant, all who were once individual, became assimilated into new names and culture, those who did not flee. Thus the many Germanic groups, North, West and East, were dominantly Germanic surface, over top a much more complex racial, ethnic diversity. Over time, they would become as if one race, if conditions be right.

The Dani, and Gadi or Semitic migration, would have then, been silent, in part.

This is the first part of two posts that I will do. I need to go soon, from the library, and so, the second half will feature the Lanuages.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited November 7, 2019 by VastLand

[Piney]

22 minutes ago, VastLand said:

Previous to the Goths however, were the Danim, the nation of Dan, who migrated into Europe, some speculate they were migrating within the Scythian Stock, who migrated into the West from the Near East (Northern Near East), into the very same region that these Goths moved into, but about One-Thousand Years before the goths ever moved south. Others speculate they moved into Europe via Ships, through the Grecian regions.

 

Who are the "some"? The Skythians spoke Eastern Iranian, Not Germanic

Who speculated the moved to Europe via ships? Link? Source? Name of linguist? 

22 minutes ago, VastLand said:

English, as they say comes from West Germanic, in her expansion west. West Germanic of course evolved out of East Germanic, and the people of pre-germany, were of course the Goths. 

 

You better read this before making such a asinine statement. All German languages have a common origin in Scandinavia. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Germanic_languages

 

22 minutes ago, VastLand said:

In Europe we have peoples such as those on the Island of "Sar-dan-ia", and there were the "Dan-oi" of troy, there are a great deal of rivers named "Dan", such as the Danube. There be a seafaring people who were called Denyen, and also people called Danuna.

 Prehistoric Sardinians spoke a Vasconic language. Trojans spoke Luwian-Hittite and Danu was a PIE river goddesss who evolved on the Pontic Caspian Steppe.   

22 minutes ago, VastLand said:

Quote

https://www.cbcg.org/booklets/america-britain/chapter-eight-israel-migrates-to-the-north-and-west.html

 

This is not a academic website. Just some Evangelical Christian dreck.

22 minutes ago, VastLand said:

Quote

https://www.cbcg.org/booklets/america-britain/chapter-eight-israel-migrates-to-the-north-and-west.html

 

\

Edited November 7, 2019 by Piney
**** Atlantis

[Piney]

18 minutes ago, VastLand said:

Scythians may have existed and ruled much earlier than recorded, having ruled over the slavs. Scythians, being Indo-Iraneans, were not the first "Indo-europeans", an earlier western group to Indo-Iraneans had already migrated into Central Europe.

 

Indo-Iranians

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andronovo_culture

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sintashta_culture

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indo-Iranians

The Scythians didn't rule over the Balto-Slavic people. They were absorbed by them.