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RoofGardener

Was Trump correct over Iran ?

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12 hours ago, DingoLingo said:

I really wish people would understand what decimated means.. 

what you have effectively stated is he killed 1 in 10 ISIS members 

While what you stated is technically correct, you make no allowance for the growth and evolution of the language.  English is forever changing so that even corrupted usage of terms become acceptable over time.

Decimated

transitive verb
To destroy or kill a large part of (a group of people or organisms).

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On 11/8/2019 at 8:54 PM, Black Red Devil said:

Nobody cares or even considers Hezbolah's role as an influence

Israel considers Iran's act of standing up Hizballah to be very important and I can assure you that Little Vlad does not ignore the IDF.

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On 11/9/2019 at 3:40 PM, Black Red Devil said:

You see, your progress is about arming yourselves to your teeth and fighting wars against people with opposing opinions, my progress is living in peace and harmony within our world and accepting their differences.  If there would be less XI's, Putin's, Trump's Netanyahu's, MBS's, Right Wing warmongers and extremists in the world there would be no bad guys.  You keep on getting it wrong, I don't dislike the 'evil' US, just those individuals on the political spectrum you like. 

Also, don't worry about us, our soldiers distinguish ourselves in every war you guys drag us into.  Good luck to those that think invading us would be a walk in the park.

I wasn't speaking of your soldiers.  I was speaking of YOU and those like YOU in the government.  Let's be clear here.

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49 minutes ago, Tatetopa said:

So how do we do both?  How do we  Stop getting into wars but keep Russia and China from dominating world politics and economy?

We don't because to do so would require changing human nature in some fundamental way.  We will step back, they will step forward and at some point a clash will come that lights the nuclear fires.  Almost certainly in the M.E.  These fools are even beginning to kid themselves that they can make "smaller" nukes that could be used without the larger ones coming into play.  Tick Tock...

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On 11/9/2019 at 4:04 PM, Tatetopa said:

And what happens to all of us US citizens when we are paralyzed by the resistance and insurrection you talk about so frequently?  Who is going to come over here and clean up the pockets of resistance and  pick up the pieces?  It damsure won't be anybody that cares about our freedom, self determination, or the Constitution.

Am I supposed to choose which boot I'd prefer on my neck?  I'll take NONE, thank you.  If getting your way is so important that compromise is out of the question, you'd better think long and hard about such potential consequences.  They are quite real.  Throwing a tantrum over politics and PC culture in the hope that better men and women in uniform will suppress those who disagree with you is a sketchy plan at best.  You might just find you have to fight for yourself. 

When all that gets started it will be a little late to decide compromise wasn't such a poor choice, after all.  All people on the Right are demanding is the right to live as we always have done.  It's the Left that has decided which bathrooms our children MUST use in public or who we MUST allow in our businesses and which religions cannot have access to the public square.  If you can't see the wrongheadedness of that then the next time you glance at a mirror you should see the problem.  Your choice.  

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joc
2 hours ago, Tatetopa said:

Yes I do, and China as well.  So, even though I applaud Trump's desire to get us out of  foreign wars and entanglements, it will leave a vacuum for somebody else to fill.  Truly, this is one thing that I think is vastly superior  in President Trump to Hillary Clinton, the desire to stop being the world's military police.  

So how do we do both?  How do we  Stop getting into wars but keep Russia and China from dominating world politics and economy?

We build up the worlds finest military....for starters.  We even out the economic playing field by making trade actually fair. We protect our borders keeping America safer from outside attacks.  We attack the beast in our own home first...the swamp...i.e.  The Deep State.  i.e.  The Powers That Be.  We weed them out thus changing the whole game making it better for everyone on the planet.  We show Russia and China that we are strong...very strong...and let them see that indeed...our Button is bigger than their Button.

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Tatetopa
1 hour ago, and then said:

If getting your way is so important that compromise is out of the question, you'd better think long and hard about such potential consequences.  They are quite real

Sorry, as far as I can tell, you are the one who does not want to compromise want to put your boot on my neck

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Black Red Devil
1 hour ago, and then said:

I wasn't speaking of your soldiers.  I was speaking of YOU and those like YOU in the government.  Let's be clear here.

Aha, OK.  Phew, thank Gawd we have people like you in the West who will save us all from damnation.  How silly of me, we need more warmongers like you in the world, people that can spread the word against those evil victims of tyranny who dare expect to live in peace in harmony without being manipulated by greedy deceitful Capitalist Governments. 

 

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1 hour ago, Tatetopa said:

Sorry, as far as I can tell, you are the one who does not want to compromise want to put your boot on my neck

How so, Tat?  Serious desire to understand why you think this.

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30 minutes ago, Black Red Devil said:

Aha, OK.  Phew, thank Gawd we have people like you in the West who will save us all from damnation.  How silly of me, we need more warmongers like you in the world, people that can spread the word against those evil victims of tyranny who dare expect to live in peace in harmony without being manipulated by greedy deceitful Capitalist Governments. 

 

As I said, enjoy your chains.  You're way more than halfway there already.  Hope the wakeup call isn't too shocking.  BTW, Mandarin is an ironclad Biotch to become fluent in.  Just sayin'

 

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ThereWeAreThen
3 hours ago, joc said:

We build up the worlds finest military....for starters.  We even out the economic playing field by making trade actually fair. We protect our borders keeping America safer from outside attacks.  We attack the beast in our own home first...the swamp...i.e.  The Deep State.  i.e.  The Powers That Be.  We weed them out thus changing the whole game making it better for everyone on the planet.  We show Russia and China that we are strong...very strong...and let them see that indeed...our Button is bigger than their Button.

So essentially Cold War 2.0? Which is basically where we're at now or at least close to.

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joc
12 minutes ago, ThereWeAreThen said:

So essentially Cold War 2.0? Which is basically where we're at now or at least close to.

At least when it was considered a Cold War the proletariat believed that Russia was an enemy.  Now everyone thinks Putin is a good ole boy.   I'm good with Cold War2.  Hell of a lot better than hot WWIII

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ThereWeAreThen
1 minute ago, joc said:

At least when it was considered a Cold War the proletariat believed that Russia was an enemy.  Now everyone thinks Putin is a good ole boy.   I'm good with Cold War2.  Hell of a lot better than hot WWIII

Define everyone? Cause alot of governments around the world wouldnt see him as a good boy. I most certainly don't. Want him out of the gene pool asap.

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Tatetopa
2 hours ago, and then said:

How so, Tat?  Serious desire to understand why you think this.

My core belief is that we strive for equal rights for all under the Constitution.  Even people whose choices in life are foreign to me.  I don't have a problem with which bathroom your kids choose to use.  People are free and many do to have a pretty strict belief in how the genders should be separated, and how each gender should behave.  Some people do not have the same philosophy of that.  Still they are citizens and have rights.  Compromise would be finding a way to let them do that. They have a right to go to some bathroom.  There are plenty of single unisex bathrooms all over the place. If a school puts one in fine.  I am an old white guy, but if I were black and following the laws of the land, I would have a right to expect the same service as everybody else.  I grew up in the Jim Crow South, I don't want to see citizens humiliated and suffer because of the color of their skin any more.  That was how we used to live.  Behavior, take note, is a separate issue.

I grew up in a Southern Baptist Church.  A little of that is still with me, but I don't want any religion telling me how they think God wants me to live my life.  I can ask him myself.  I respect your beliefs, but I want to go my own way.  I don't want any religion telling me how they think I should live.  Christianity is a fine religion with a 2000 year old tradition,  it can be in the town square, but it can't monopolize it.  In my youth, it was the few Jewish kids that always had to go along or be left out. We did not respect their beliefs or even try to find out what they were.   There were not any other minority religions to speak of in Texas.  I don't want any citizen to be discriminated against because of their religion.  I don't want the state to espouse the morals of a particular religion.  I would prefer to stick with the founding fathers' approach to a tolerant and enlightened government.   Most religions tend to want to determine sexual practices, birth control and abortion.  Every religion has a different idea of how that should go.  Growing up there were also Blue laws.  Stores had to be closed on Sunday.  When the laws were lightened, some stores were open and sections of some were roped off.  I could then buy notebook paper for school on Sunday but not airplane glue because that was for fun.  I don't want that kind of single religion governed society.

Refusing service or persecuting someone because of their color or religious beliefs seems to be against the law of this land. I wish to keep it that way.

I am for compromise about things like budgets and policy, I certainly don't agree with all of the beliefs of any side.   I would like those rights to be retained by all citizens.

If we can't compromise, I am also amenable to a mutually agreeable divorce.  Not many people would favor that, but we might come out with two healthy nations instead of a shattered one.  Then, as two nations, if it were the South to separate again, they could keep or rewrite the Constitution, have religion rolled into their governments.  Blacks and Hispanics could have different rights, women could be supervised by their male relatives, it could be illegal to be gay.  There could be no public services, welfare, or medical care.  Many countries are like that and we still deal with them and even trade and sell weapons.   Personally, I would prefer not to live in one, but for many people, some combination or evolution of those things would be attractive. 

I don't think I answered your question totally.   I associate you with my parents who had opinions about everything (they were Old South) and didn't stop telling me how I should do everything until I left home after college. It would have freaked my dad out if I had ever had a Black friend.  But it was especially the religious aspects.  I was reprimanded if I questioned Southern Baptist Doctrines, so I tend to view religion as close minded and repressive. I don't mean to transfer that to you, but I guess I do.

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Black Red Devil
2 hours ago, and then said:

As I said, enjoy your chains.  You're way more than halfway there already.  Hope the wakeup call isn't too shocking.  BTW, Mandarin is an ironclad Biotch to become fluent in.  Just sayin'

 

At least we'll have a healthier diet. 

People like you who follow the orange wig subserviently no matter what he does make me laugh.  Your supreme boss is the one that doesn't want anything to do with anyone else he thinks is ruining his budget and he's managed to pi$$ on the EU, he thinks NATO is a waste of money, NAFTA is a ripoff, the JCPOA wasn't harsh enough, trade with anyone that has a positive trade gap is a bad deal.  Even in conflict he's shown his true colors by back stabbing his allies.  What a trooper!

He pulled out of the TPP (Trans Pacific Partnership) that didn't include China, so what's going to happen?  The Pacific region will introduce a new trade deal in 2020 called the RCEP that includes China and excludes the US.

S.M.A.R.T.

Another 4 years of Trump and who knows, we might be eating dumplings and drinking vodka instead of Macdonalds and Bourbon.  After all, once you get used to the new taste it's just a matter of habit.

Nastrovje :tu:

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20 minutes ago, Tatetopa said:

I don't have a problem with which bathroom your kids choose to use.

Your Party under Obama certainly did and they enforced it under pain of law.

21 minutes ago, Tatetopa said:

I grew up in a Southern Baptist Church.  A little of that is still with me, but I don't want any religion telling me how they think God wants me to live my life.

The Church in America is dying from apathy as it is yet ANY mention is now being fought regularly.  Most who do not believe are more than happy with this and will not be satisfied until NO MENTION is tolerated.  I welcome that day because it will mark a final choice from Americans as a people.

23 minutes ago, Tatetopa said:

I am for compromise about things like budgets and policy, I certainly don't agree with all of the beliefs of any side.   I would like those rights to be retained by all citizens.

Totally agree.

 

23 minutes ago, Tatetopa said:

If we can't compromise, I am also amenable to a mutually agreeable divorce.  Not many people would favor that, but we might come out with two healthy nations instead of a shattered one.  Then, as two nations, if it were the South to separate again, they could keep or rewrite the Constitution, have religion rolled into their governments. 

It may come to a separation but it won't be limited to geography this time.  It will almost certainly be an internecine struggle between urban and rural entities and so will be FAR more divisive and destructive.  It will benefit no one other than America's enemies.  The media in this nation should be held liable for this for without them it would never get to the point it has or will.

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Gromdor

Given recent history, if I were Iran I would would be making nukes.  The last country that did it went from us threatening war to exchanging love letters with the president.

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joc

Some posts just don't even deserve a reply....

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3 hours ago, Gromdor said:

Given recent history, if I were Iran I would would be making nukes.  The last country that did it went from us threatening war to exchanging love letters with the president.

They've been working assiduously on that for years.  The evidence is clearly there and ignoring it doesn't make you correct, just overtly biased to the point of being darkly farcical.  The greatest reason they haven't dashed to a finish line yet is they fear Netanyahu and the IAF.  The mullahs KNOW that the Israelis mean what THEY say.  If Israel truly believes that Iran will use them then they WILL pre-empt, no matter the risk.  As the Iranians have openly said... Israel is a "one bomb country". Hashemi Rafsanjani.  

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Gromdor
4 hours ago, and then said:

They've been working assiduously on that for years.  The evidence is clearly there and ignoring it doesn't make you correct, just overtly biased to the point of being darkly farcical.  The greatest reason they haven't dashed to a finish line yet is they fear Netanyahu and the IAF.  The mullahs KNOW that the Israelis mean what THEY say.  If Israel truly believes that Iran will use them then they WILL pre-empt, no matter the risk.  As the Iranians have openly said... Israel is a "one bomb country". Hashemi Rafsanjani.  

Maybe Israel should have led the efforts to prevent North Korea from finishing the race?  The world now knows for certain that there is a reward for passing the finish line.

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RoofGardener
On 11/12/2019 at 11:33 AM, Gromdor said:

Maybe Israel should have led the efforts to prevent North Korea from finishing the race?  The world now knows for certain that there is a reward for passing the finish line.

Perhaps. But Israel is 8000Km away from North Korea. They don't have diplomatic relations. (North Korea refuses to acknowledge the existence of Israel). What - precisely - would you have Israel DO ? :P

Edited by RoofGardener
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Gromdor
19 minutes ago, RoofGardener said:

Perhaps. But Israel is 8000Km away from North Korea. They don't have diplomatic relations. (North Korea refuses to acknowledge the existence of Israel). What - precisely - would you have Israel DO ? :P

It's too late now, but instill the fear in them to prevent them from acquiring nuclear weapons like Andthen says it is doing for Iran.

North Korea certainly didn't fear Trump, the United States, or any of our sanctions enough to stop.

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RoofGardener
2 hours ago, Gromdor said:

It's too late now, but instill the fear in them to prevent them from acquiring nuclear weapons like Andthen says it is doing for Iran.

North Korea certainly didn't fear Trump, the United States, or any of our sanctions enough to stop.

Well.. yes.. but.. when did NK get its nuclear weapon ? 2006 ? What could Israel possibly have done to pressurise North Korea into abandoning its nuclear ambitions ? It had neither economic or diplomatic ties to threaten NK over. 

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Gromdor
21 minutes ago, RoofGardener said:

Well.. yes.. but.. when did NK get its nuclear weapon ? 2006 ? What could Israel possibly have done to pressurise North Korea into abandoning its nuclear ambitions ? It had neither economic or diplomatic ties to threaten NK over. 

Eh, you would have to go back and read from Andthen's comments down to the current point to understand the context.  It's already too late to do anything about North Korea.  The US failed.  Now all we can do is dissuade them from using them.

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RoofGardener
10 minutes ago, Gromdor said:

Eh, you would have to go back and read from Andthen's comments down to the current point to understand the context.  It's already too late to do anything about North Korea.  The US failed.  Now all we can do is dissuade them from using them.

Well... perhaps. 

Israel couldn't do anything about North Korea, but Iran is another kettle of fish entirely. 

Edited by RoofGardener
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