BrooklynGuy Posted November 13, 2019 #1 Share Posted November 13, 2019 Is it unreasonable to believe in miracles? What makes a miracle? A glance at media output suggests we are surrounded by the supernatural. We have miracle foods, miracle drugs and miracle babies. According to the Central Bank, Ireland is a “Phoenix miracle” for bouncing back from economic disaster, while the president of the European Commission Jean-Claude Juncker has pleaded for miraculous intervention in EU-UK negotiations. “Juncker says miracles are needed for progress on Brexit talks,” ran a perfectly serious headline in The Guardian. Read more: https://www.irishtimes.com/culture/is-it-unreasonable-to-believe-in-miracles-1.3401635 Do You Believe in Miracles? Physicians are encouraged to recognize the importance of and understand their patient’s spiritual and religious needs. Believing in miracles gives meaning to life; especially when life is threatened. Discovering that you or a loved one is seriously medically ill can be devastating; particularly if the prognosis is poor. Among the various responses to this type of news, such as experiencing disbelief, anguish, and worry, many people turn to spiritual support—including the hope for a miracle. Believing in miracles is somewhat common. Holding these beliefs is not limited to certain age groups nor is it restricted to certain religious denominations or a religious affiliation. Read more: https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/emotional-nourishment/201712/do-you-believe-in-miracles 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gwynbleidd Posted November 13, 2019 #2 Share Posted November 13, 2019 (edited) Yes, definitely. Edited November 13, 2019 by Gwynbleidd Oops sorry, I meant to say I voted YES, I believe in Miracles. 2 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RAyMO Posted November 13, 2019 #3 Share Posted November 13, 2019 (edited) They may not exist - I don't believe they do. but if believing in them helps someone get through there day week month year ..... then fair enough. Edited November 13, 2019 by RAyMO 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habitat Posted November 13, 2019 #4 Share Posted November 13, 2019 Depends what you call a miracle I suppose, I consider it a miracle if I lend someone a book, and they return it. 2 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rlyeh Posted November 13, 2019 #5 Share Posted November 13, 2019 2 hours ago, BrooklynGuy said: What makes a miracle? Ignorance. 3 2 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rlyeh Posted November 13, 2019 #6 Share Posted November 13, 2019 (edited) Your title doesn't match the poll; Is it unreasonable to believe in miracles? Which I voted yes. However the poll asks if you believe in miracles. Which would be no. Edited November 13, 2019 by Rlyeh 2 2 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onlookerofmayhem Posted November 13, 2019 #7 Share Posted November 13, 2019 Nope. I don't believe in miracles if this is the definition being used : mir·a·cle /ˈmirək(ə)l/ Learn to pronounce noun a surprising and welcome event that is not explicable by natural or scientific laws and is therefore considered to be the work of a divine agency. "the miracle of rising from the grave" 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrooklynGuy Posted November 13, 2019 Author #8 Share Posted November 13, 2019 1 hour ago, Rlyeh said: Your title doesn't match the poll; Is it unreasonable to believe in miracles? Which I voted yes. However the poll asks if you believe in miracles. Which would be no. Rlyeh, I can see you are confused however for the sake of accuracy I'm going to have to put you down as voting for: I'm not sure, I need more details. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buzz_Light_Year Posted November 13, 2019 #9 Share Posted November 13, 2019 Albert Einstein said, 'There are only two ways to live your life. One is as though nothing is a miracle. The other is as though everything is.'” 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XenoFish Posted November 13, 2019 #10 Share Posted November 13, 2019 I don't know anymore. 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papageorge1 Posted November 13, 2019 #11 Share Posted November 13, 2019 The OP seemed to be mixing different uses of the word 'miracle'. Things like 'economic miracle' or 'miracle drugs', etc. are things quite different from what I would call a paranormal miracle. I believe also in paranormal miracles and hold then often to be the benevolent work of super-physical entities effecting the physical world in ways our current science does not understand yet. 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Essan Posted November 13, 2019 #12 Share Posted November 13, 2019 I suppose that technically a miracle may well be something inexplicable based on current knowledge, and thus attributed to divine intervention, but may become quite explicable in future. More often, though, they are likely to be coincidence - which happen far more often than most people think. And I definitely believe in coincidence .... 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazy Horse Posted November 13, 2019 #13 Share Posted November 13, 2019 Yes I believe in miracles, but then I see a miracle as being the true effect of the mind and consciousness, as exerting its authority over material substances. So actually, miracles are the normal form of higher physics, only we have collectively lost sight of how powerful the mind is! Just before coming to post here, I was watching a video about Wim Hoff, "the Ice Man", and some of the things he can do using the power of his mind are pretty amazing if not miraculous to modern, materialistic science. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XenoFish Posted November 14, 2019 #14 Share Posted November 14, 2019 6 hours ago, Crazy Horse said: Yes I believe in miracles, but then I see a miracle as being the true effect of the mind and consciousness, as exerting its authority over material substances. So actually, miracles are the normal form of higher physics, only we have collectively lost sight of how powerful the mind is! Just before coming to post here, I was watching a video about Wim Hoff, "the Ice Man", and some of the things he can do using the power of his mind are pretty amazing if not miraculous to modern, materialistic science. So miracles are just confirmation bias. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aquila King Posted November 14, 2019 #15 Share Posted November 14, 2019 Depends on the definition of the word "miracle." Are we just talking bout a super rare occurance? Then yes. If supernatural? Then no. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jodie.Lynne Posted November 14, 2019 #16 Share Posted November 14, 2019 A plane crashes. All onboard are killed, except for a child. "It's a MIRACLE!" the people shout. No, not a miracle. A horrible tragedy, where the child's parents are killed. A miracle would be: A plane falls out of the sky, full speed, and smashes into the ground... and EVERYBODY lives. A miracle would be: Everyone on a cancer ward, getting up and walking out of there under their own power, completely healed. A miracle would be: Everyone having enough to eat, and a safe place to stay. A miracle would be: Every nation on Earth, laying down arms, and living in peace. Do I believe in miracles? I honestly don't know. I have experienced things that might seem miraculous to some, or just coincidence to others. 6 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Walker Posted November 14, 2019 #17 Share Posted November 14, 2019 (edited) 11 hours ago, Jodie.Lynne said: A plane crashes. All onboard are killed, except for a child. "It's a MIRACLE!" the people shout. No, not a miracle. A horrible tragedy, where the child's parents are killed. A miracle would be: A plane falls out of the sky, full speed, and smashes into the ground... and EVERYBODY lives. A miracle would be: Everyone on a cancer ward, getting up and walking out of there under their own power, completely healed. A miracle would be: Everyone having enough to eat, and a safe place to stay. A miracle would be: Every nation on Earth, laying down arms, and living in peace. Do I believe in miracles? I honestly don't know. I have experienced things that might seem miraculous to some, or just coincidence to others. None the less it would be considered a miracle that the child survived, unless there was some scientific explanation for why it, alone, did Miracles don't have to be divine. Anything which beats incredible odds can be considered a miracle eg a friend told me the other day about a doctor in Perth. He had a massive heart attack and was admitted to hospital unconscious He had basically no brain function His wife was told he would die that night. However tha t night she was was told by a person who contacted her from India that her husband would not only survive but make a perfect recovery (In this case there IS a religious component as the couple were Christians from Pentecostal church and had many people praying for them. The indian lady said that god had told her, her husband would be ok Every doctor specialist etc told the wife there was no chance of survival, and that was a good thing because if he survived he would be in a vegetative state going on the readings from the monitors The next rnorning there was no change. This went on for 5 days. The wife appealed to god asking for a sign that her husband would be ok. "please let him open his eyes " she prayed . At that moment the husband opened his eyes spoke to his wife, and squeezed her hand . I wasn't too sure about this story, although I trust the bloke who told me, so i googled it With only a few minor discrepancies from oral accounting, there it was. Maybe even more dramatic than as told to me By the end of tha t day he was fully recovered (as much as one can be from a major heart attack ) with no residual cognitive impairment and no physical effects which might have prevented him continuing to be a doctor. His full convalescence took much longer but was assured once he awoke from the 5 days of coma https://seangeorge.com.au/my-story/what-doctors-are-saying/ "I have been intimately inured in fatal accidents and deaths of all variety. When Dr Sean suffered the heart attack I witnessed the Kalgoorlie Regional Hospital and local church communities come together like never before. Witnessed by six doctors - three Christian, two Hindu and one Muslim, two nurses, two paramedics and two police officers, his death is also conclusively proved by the defibrillator logs. I can only imagine the shock of his doctors when the man who died woke up, sat up and eventually asked to read his own charts. First witnessed by family and friends, and now by every patient he serves and enquirer who’ll listen, the resurrection of Dr Sean is simply proved by the man himself. From the depths of despair to the elation of miraculous healing and restoration to family, hospital and church, it has been my great privilege to share a close friendship with Dr Sean and his family. In a world demanding evidence, the resurrection of Dr Sean stands head and shoulders above any other contemporary proof of God I know, and dares the sceptic to believe like nothing else." Stephen Bedells Masters in Criminal Justice ( MCJ); Bachelor of Social Science; Bachelor of Science (Forensics); Bachelor or Laws ( LLB) Close Friend of Sean Ironically he was also a heart specialist. Today he shows his students the graphs etc of him that night. He asks them for their prognosis. Every one, as per their medical training says that the patient could not survive and now would be dead "in which case you are looking at a dead man walking." the doctor tells the students "Those graphs etc were mine, after a heart attack" His point ? Not so much about miracles but the need never to give up on a patient nor to give up hope no matter what the physical condition of the patient https://seangeorge.com.au/my-story/my-story/ Edited November 14, 2019 by Mr Walker 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazy Horse Posted November 14, 2019 #18 Share Posted November 14, 2019 17 hours ago, XenoFish said: So miracles are just confirmation bias. There is no confirmation bias within the work of Wim Hof, only a shed load of Guinness World Records and a bunch of scientific fact. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tatetopa Posted November 14, 2019 #19 Share Posted November 14, 2019 On 11/13/2019 at 8:12 AM, papageorge1 said: I believe also in paranormal miracles and hold then often to be the benevolent work of super-physical entities effecting the physical world in ways our current science does not understand yet. I think papageorge nailed it on this one. To believe in miracles you need to believe in super-physical entities affecting the physical world. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XenoFish Posted November 14, 2019 #20 Share Posted November 14, 2019 19 minutes ago, Crazy Horse said: There is no confirmation bias within the work of Wim Hof, only a shed load of Guinness World Records and a bunch of scientific fact. He isn't performing a 'miracle'. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papageorge1 Posted November 14, 2019 #21 Share Posted November 14, 2019 16 minutes ago, Tatetopa said: I think papageorge nailed it on this one. To believe in miracles you need to believe in super-physical entities affecting the physical world. And in the stricter sense of the word ‘miracle’ they are natural but involving entities, forces and energies just not yet understood. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Walt' E. Kurtz Posted November 14, 2019 #22 Share Posted November 14, 2019 There is no miracles unless you like Hot chocolate :-P 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazy Horse Posted November 14, 2019 #23 Share Posted November 14, 2019 22 minutes ago, XenoFish said: He isn't performing a 'miracle'. He has been injected with e-coli, and by the power of his mind overcome all symptoms. And he has also sat in a tub of ice cold water, up to his neck for over 2 hours without even his skin getting cold. Science has no answer for these things, therefore, I would suggest that these things are quite miraculous? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XenoFish Posted November 14, 2019 #24 Share Posted November 14, 2019 3 minutes ago, Crazy Horse said: He has been injected with e-coli, and by the power of his mind overcome all symptoms. And he has also sat in a tub of ice cold water, up to his neck for over 2 hours without even his skin getting cold. Science has no answer for these things, therefore, I would suggest that these things are quite miraculous? It's not a miracle and you need to present citations to some of these claims. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazy Horse Posted November 14, 2019 #25 Share Posted November 14, 2019 (edited) 14 minutes ago, XenoFish said: It's not a miracle and you need to present citations to some of these claims. If something goes against all scientific knowledge and logic, then, in my opinion, that is a miracle, not so useful as turning water into wine, or walking on water, but a miracle none-the-less. Edit: Actually, I take that back. Having the ability to over-come inflammation and deadly viruses just by the power of 0ones own mind, it a heck of a lot more useful, not to mention having the ability to remain warm in any environment. Edited November 14, 2019 by Crazy Horse 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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