How will Impeachment play out?

[Gromdor]

1 hour ago, RavenHawk said:

You still don’t get it do you?  No you don’t.  Early on academia, science, and the politically PC types struggled to find the precise word to use for propaganda purposes (Eisenhower’s warning).  It had used one, then the other and combined with ‘global’ and ‘warming’ but eventually settled on just climate change.  Scientific preciseness usually concedes to PC.  During that process, I took exception to their little process.  I understood what their ploy was and I started using the one term sarcastically ever since.  I use it so that the Left will never forget what they are trying to do.  I guess unfortunately for me, that is what the Left does best and that is forget little things like that.  I’ve explained this three different ways.  A rational person by now would state that they understand where I’m coming from and why I use the term and reply “gotchya” and move on.  But you’re going to continue to try to correct me when there is nothing to correct.  You have to accept that there are things that you were never aware of, especially before the internet.  I will continue to use the term and if you don’t like it, well tough!

  Eh, it's fine.  English isn't the official language of the United States so there isn't any real need for it's citizens to know how to speak it or use it's words correctly. Also, it's easier to change things made of words (like the Constitution and laws) if you change the meaning of the very words it is made of.  Only someone who cares about preserving the Constitution would take the time to make sure that words aren't distorted.  If you want Anthropomorphic to mean human caused and Socialism to mean every thing you disagree with, feel free.  Just don't get sad when someone redefines words to strip away your first or second amendment rights. 

[Tatetopa]

21 hours ago, RavenHawk said:

Anthropomorphic Climate Change is neither lightening or a cigarette from a car, so no fire would ensue.  Climate is changing and we need to learn how to adapt to those changes as Man has always done.  There is nothing we can do to change climate.  Hell, we aren’t even a Type I Civilization.  ACC is a globalist plot to create the largest plantation ever seen.  Where the masses become serfs doing the bidding of a few ruling elite.

Well, I can see how that would fit seamlessly into your world view.

One world view might be that Humanity would achieve that Type 1  civilization and surpass it.  That would be a future of exploration and settlement of the solar system and perhaps beyond.  In itself that requires cooperation from most of the world's countries.  It may imply peace and willingness to cooperate, but that is as far as it goes.  It is up to individual philosophies to paint that as either the greatest freedom and power individuals have ever had or the largest plantation ever seen. 

Another world view is to slide back into the past where the ruling elites are local warlords or kings.  Again, an individual might paint this as the era of the noble savage, free and unbound by society or a return to the good old days when the strong could rape, murder, and pillage the weak.

Looking at history so far, there have more pillagers than noble savages.  

 

[Tatetopa]

12 hours ago, DarkHunter said:

So you just expect a bunch of Democrat representatives, approximately 40, to commit political suicide on sending the impeachment to the senate which will not find Trump guilty.  The best move Pelosi could do is get the required number to defect to the Republicans secretly so the whole show ends before any more damage to the Democratic party is done.

How does that follow?  If they have damaged themselves, it has already been done.  If they back down now they will appear even weaker.  No way to get off this moving train.  If the Senate  appears too glaringly dismissive and Trump's puppets, that also might anger some voters.  

Best if all had been handled honestly, but that didn't happen.  It will not happen in the near future either.  Trump is not a leader who can bring back honesty, dignity, and unity to America.  It is not how he rolls, and his supporters love that.

[RoofGardener]

11 hours ago, Farmer77 said:

Lots of them. I like looking at aggregates myself, this site does a good job of varying sources and explaining methodology : https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/impeachment-polls/

Thanks for that @Farmer77. 

So there is a majority opinion for Impeaching President Trump ... but... by a VERY narrow majority. Something like 48% to 45.9% ? 

Hmmm.... that means that ALMOST half of the population are against it ? (and ALMOST half the population are for it). 

With that in mind.... what are the consequences going to be for proceeding with Impeachment ? 

Edited December 15, 2019 by RoofGardener

[Agent0range]

2 hours ago, RoofGardener said:

Thanks for that @Farmer77. 

So there is a majority opinion for Impeaching President Trump ... but... by a VERY narrow majority. Something like 48% to 45.9% ? 

Hmmm.... that means that ALMOST half of the population are against it ? (and ALMOST half the population are for it). 

With that in mind.... what are the consequences going to be for proceeding with Impeachment ? 

You can also be for impeachment, but against removal.  I think the majority of people, at least the ones that I know and talk to, think impeachment equals removal.  Impeachment can be used as a tool to say, "hey, that thing you did...it ain't right."  If you don't take action, the behavior will continue.  So no, most democrats don't expect removal.  But, most people have to think there is a good chance this conduct won't take place again.  And that is what is important.

[acidhead]

 

[Duke Wellington]

Next week the impeachment of Trump will go to the Senate for the vote.

Will it succeed? Almost certainly not because of two reasons. The first is that the Republicans hold a majority in the senate. The second is that two thirds of the senators would have to vote to pass the impeachment.

So why is it even occurring? The delusional cry-baby left cannot cope with the fact that the American people voted for Trump to be their president. They would do anything to get rid of him. But the more the cry and lie, the more damage they are doing to themselves.

The US people expect professional behaviour out of their politicians and the Democrats are in the process of destroying their reputation. Sure, the far-left in the USA will believe everything they hear. But for that ordinary man or woman without any political allegiance to the left or right they will look at the Democrats and feel disgusted at their behaviour.

We have just had our own subversion of democracy occur in the UK and the public gave the two parties doing it a mauling in our General Election. I predict a significant Trump majority for his second term.

Edited December 15, 2019 by RabidMongoose

[+and-then]

32 minutes ago, RabidMongoose said:

I predict a significant Trump majority for his second term.

I agree, but what remains to be seen is whether any adults on the Left will be willing to pull back on the rhetoric.  I've already heard a couple of Congress members saying that if Trump wins he will be illegitimate.  We're nearly a year away from the vote.  This kind of toxic rhetoric is harming our nation in ways we can't even appreciate yet.  It's nothing less than a group of Americans who have decided they will no longer honor elections unless they win.  

[Gromdor]

13 minutes ago, and then said:

I agree, but what remains to be seen is whether any adults on the Left will be willing to pull back on the rhetoric.  I've already heard a couple of Congress members saying that if Trump wins he will be illegitimate.  We're nearly a year away from the vote.  This kind of toxic rhetoric is harming our nation in ways we can't even appreciate yet.  It's nothing less than a group of Americans who have decided they will no longer honor elections unless they win.  

I doubt it.  Trump is an agitator not a healer.  I imagine he will be picking at scabs instead of healing wounds.  It should be the same if not worse if he gets elected again. 

[+and-then]

11 minutes ago, Gromdor said:

I doubt it.  Trump is an agitator not a healer.  I imagine he will be picking at scabs instead of healing wounds.  It should be the same if not worse if he gets elected again. 

If by "picking at scabs" you mean punching back against people who dish hate against him 24/7 then yeah, he surely will.  How do you feel about the Congress persons who are ruling out any legitimate 2nd term?  Do you believe that violence would be a justified reaction to his re-election?

[Agent0range]

12 minutes ago, and then said:

If by "picking at scabs" you mean punching back against people who dish hate against him 24/7 then yeah, he surely will.  How do you feel about the Congress persons who are ruling out any legitimate 2nd term?  Do you believe that violence would be a justified reaction to his re-election?

Do you have a source for your congressional comments?  And attacking a 16 year old girl who never said anything about him is certainly not punching back.  It's being a POS...but be best Melania!  But, God forbid people say the name of her anchor baby.

[Gromdor]

1 minute ago, and then said:

If by "picking at scabs" you mean punching back against people who dish hate against him 24/7 then yeah, he surely will.  How do you feel about the Congress persons who are ruling out any legitimate 2nd term?  Do you believe that violence would be a justified reaction to his re-election?

He does more than punch back.  Nothing is ever his fault- it's always the Deep State or Democrats.  Take the subject of this whole impeachment-  sending his personal lawyer to dig up conspiracy theories against Biden and the Russian interference.  That's a man who starts fights and picks at old scabs hoping to find blood.

Do I think violence is a justified reaction?  Nah.  It's not like he really did anything his whole first term except follow the curve of the economy up.  No new wall, no Mexicans paying for it, illegal immigration up, no coal jobs, no manufacturing jobs, farmers going bankrupt, a trade war, homeless pooping in the streets, vets killing themselves, etc.  If the American people vote to continue this, I am fine with it.  I believe in Karma.  I'll still post how stupid he is here and point out the karma instances.  It's nothing worth dragging people out in the streets and shooting them for.  If anything if my beliefs are correct, it would be his followers that suffer the most from his err... governance. 

[Farmer77]

16 hours ago, and then said:

I've already heard a couple of Congress members saying that if Trump wins he will be illegitimate

This is why impeachment is important. We know he tried to get the Ukraine to intervene in the election, he then invited China to get involved in our election on camera . Honest people know we have no reason to think he hasn't had the same conversations with dozens of world leaders. 

Like most things Trump the negative consequences coming are the results of his own dangerous unwillingness to accept the bounds of societal norms and the rule of law. 

 

[Farmer77]

Quote

“Although President Trump’s actions need not rise to the level of a criminal violation to justify impeachment, his conduct here was criminal,

Impeachment Report Accuses Trump of ‘Multiple Federal Crimes’

[Gromdor]

21 minutes ago, Farmer77 said:

Impeachment Report Accuses Trump of ‘Multiple Federal Crimes’

Isn't that the story of his whole life?  Everything he does is criminal but not to the level where lawyers and technicalities can't get him out of punishment.  Stealing from children's cancer charities, defrauding students with Trump University, using the Trump Foundation as a piggy bank to pay off lawsuits, siphoning veteran's charity money into his campaign, etc.

[Buzz_Light_Year]

36 minutes ago, Farmer77 said:

Impeachment Report Accuses Trump of ‘Multiple Federal Crimes’

Judiciary Committee impeachment report alleges Trump committed 'multiple federal crimes'

[+and-then]

18 hours ago, Agent0range said:

Do you have a source for your congressional comments?  And attacking a 16 year old girl who never said anything about him is certainly not punching back.  It's being a POS...but be best Melania!  But, God forbid people say the name of her anchor baby.

No, I didn't record them for your record keeping.  I, like many here will comment on things I have seen or heard in passing.  Take them or leave them as you like.  Your propensity to accuse me of lying is duly noted and rejected.  FTR, the member was from California and clearly stated that should he win, he would do so due to election interference.  If I happen to come across her video again, I'll wrap it up with a nice bow and post it just for you.

BTW...that "16-year-old girl" has become the symbol of the Left's strategy to impose their will over climate change and as such she is a political creature.  Her parents and others in that movement pushed her into that role and when ANYONE becomes a public persona  they are going to catch hell these days.  He didn't randomly seek out some kid off the street to diss.  He also didn't really say anything offensive to her.  I will note that she popped off at the mouth in a way that has caused a lot of people to become angry and she retreated and has decided to take some time away from the movement.  She said something to the effect of putting leaders who didn't cooperate on the agenda "to the wall".  

[Farmer77]

2 hours ago, and then said:

He didn't randomly seek out some kid off the street to diss

He's the President of the United States the fact that he and his followers don't understand the concept of "punching down" is truly becoming mystifying. 

Just as a reminder of how far we've come Obama used a selfie stick and set off a firestorm for "disrespecting the office" and yet the same people are telling you how it's OK POTUS insults children on Twitter.  

[Tatetopa]

2 hours ago, and then said:

She said something to the effect of putting leaders who didn't cooperate on the agenda "to the wall".  

Sounds like the kind of tough honest, non-political, non wishy-washy talk the Right usually cheers about.

[Farmer77]

Foxnews poll 54% want Trump impeached

[Buzz_Light_Year]

18 minutes ago, Farmer77 said:

Foxnews poll 54% want Trump impeached

https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/impeachment-polls/

[Farmer77]

30 minutes ago, Buzz_Light_Year said:

https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/impeachment-polls/

Thats my favorite site for following the aggregates , thanks for the share 

[+and-then]

1 hour ago, Tatetopa said:

Sounds like the kind of tough honest, non-political, non wishy-washy talk the Right usually cheers about.

So you agree that she's a political figure?  Noted.

[F3SS]

On 12/15/2019 at 4:32 AM, Farmer77 said:

The attacks on the free press. As a former hard core militia type right winger I am just continually astonished that the right wing of all people dont understand the danger in a POTUS saying this:

The reason people don't understand things the way you do is because wether you're a rabid right winger or a rabid left winger you're always thinking in extremes. The fact that you remember the selfie stick thing as a FIRESTORM is an example of that. I didn't remember it at all until right now and I can only remember it as a short lived news blurb.

 

[acidhead]