The Afghanistan Papers

[Farmer77]

At war with the truth

Quote

A confidential trove of government documents obtained by The Washington Post reveals that senior U.S. officials failed to tell the truth about the war in Afghanistan throughout the 18-year campaign, making rosy pronouncements they knew to be false and hiding unmistakable evidence the war had become unwinnable.

The documents were generated by a federal project examining the root failures of the longest armed conflict in U.S. history. They include more than 2,000 pages of previously unpublished notes of interviews with people who played a direct role in the war, from generals and diplomats to aid workers and Afghan officials.

 

[Farmer77]

Quote

One unidentified contractor told government interviewers he was expected to dole out $3 million daily for projects in a single Afghan district roughly the size of a U.S. county. He once asked a visiting congressman whether the lawmaker could responsibly spend that kind of money back home: “He said hell no. ‘Well, sir, that’s what you just obligated us to spend and I’m doing it for communities that live in mud huts with no windows.’ ”

The gusher of aid that Washington spent on Afghanistan also gave rise to historic levels of corruption.

In public, U.S. officials insisted they had no tolerance for graft. But in the Lessons Learned interviews, they admitted the U.S. government looked the other way while Afghan power brokers — allies of Washington — plundered with impunity.

Christopher Kolenda, an Army colonel who deployed to Afghanistan several times and advised three U.S. generals in charge of the war, said that the Afghan government led by President Hamid Karzai had “self-organized into a kleptocracy” by 2006 — and that U.S. officials failed to recognize the lethal threat it posed to their strategy.

 

[SHaYap]

Eighteen years of lies... 

Quote

 

[00.17:37]

~

Vietnam all over again 

~

[Grim Reaper 6]

16 minutes ago, third_eye said:

Eighteen years of lies... 

[00.17:37]

~

Vietnam all over again 

~

Your right about that, the US needs to stop this Nation building crap. If they invade a country and topple the Government, they need to let the people of the country reform their government without US influence politically. Other Nations certainly don't need to be like the USA and that's what has happened in Libya, Iraq, and in Afghanistan. This Nation building crap doesn't work plain and simple.

In my opinion, the US should stay and provide security until the people of the country, can form a Government and protect it. Then the US needs to go home and provide no more assistance unless asked for it. But what do I know, people like me are not suppose to voice an opinion, our only job is to fight the battle and die if necessary. Meatsheilds, can always be replaced.

[+and-then]

"Since Flynn was in the news we wanted to look into him"  BINGO and par for the course with WAPO.  Afghanistan HAS been a waste of blood and treasure but WAPO isn't interested in THAT.  They just want to keep going after all things Trump.

[Farmer77]

1 minute ago, and then said:

"Since Flynn was in the news we wanted to look into him"  BINGO and par for the course with WAPO.  Afghanistan HAS been a waste of blood and treasure but WAPO isn't interested in THAT.  They just want to keep going after all things Trump.

I noticed you used quotation marks. Is that an actual quote ?

[Grim Reaper 6]

5 minutes ago, and then said:

"Since Flynn was in the news we wanted to look into him"  BINGO and par for the course with WAPO.  Afghanistan HAS been a waste of blood and treasure but WAPO isn't interested in THAT.  They just want to keep going after all things Trump.

I suspect we will see WAPO start writing about the Christian Zionist influence in the White House soon. I brought it to their attention around 15 days ago by email, they said they were aware of it and they replied that a representative would be in contact in the next 20 days. I have been contacting many of the media organizations over the last month. Many are saying they are already updating written information or preparing to write new stories on the subject. 

So at least the subject certainly isn't going to die, I think in time it will become a large scandal. The constitution clearly states that Goverment and Religion must remain separated and that obviously isn't occurring in the Trump White House. This is also something I think the Democrates will bring up during the 2020 Election, currently they are just waiting for the right time to do it.

i think believe that 2020 will bring the religion hide in plain sight out of the shadows and into the day light where it should be.

 

[Tatetopa]

Ah, so since the Washington Post is just fake news, this can't be true anyway. Thank God, I though for a minute the government was lying to us.

[Grim Reaper 6]

38 minutes ago, Farmer77 said:

I noticed you used quotation marks. Is that an actual quote ?

Crickets

[+susieice]

1 hour ago, third_eye said:

Eighteen years of lies... 

[00.17:37]

~

Vietnam all over again 

~

So 18 yrs is the key? Just want to clarify the point.

[Farmer77]

1 minute ago, susieice said:

So 18 yrs is the key? Just want to clarify the point.

The government lied about its war efforts for a decade plus only to have its own study into its failures and their coverups uncovered and released to the public. The parallels are uncanny.

 

[Farmer77]

I guess I should say as a guy who didnt live through the vietnam era, I see the general parallells, im sure folks who were there probably have a more detailed perspective than myself.

 

[+susieice]

3 minutes ago, Farmer77 said:

I guess I should say as a guy who didnt live through the vietnam era, I see the general parallells, im sure folks who were there probably have a more detailed perspective than myself.

 

I did live through Vietnam but I was pretty young for most of it. It ended the year I graduated from high school. I had a brother and two cousins that served and I hated the pictures I saw on TV every day. I know a lot of vets and some are still among my favorite people. 

[Grim Reaper 6]

55 minutes ago, and then said:

"Since Flynn was in the news we wanted to look into him"  BINGO and par for the course with WAPO.  Afghanistan HAS been a waste of blood and treasure but WAPO isn't interested in THAT.  They just want to keep going after all things Trump.

So when you say Blood and Treasure, you must be referring to US Militery deaths and wounded, US Contractor deaths and wounded, and Innocent Civilian deaths and wounded is that correct?  

Out of respect don't you think our dead deserve to be called by their proper names instead of Blood?

Now as far Treasure, I have no idea what you are talking about?

[Grim Reaper 6]

7 minutes ago, susieice said:

I did live through Vietnam but I was pretty young for most of it. It ended the year I graduated from high school. I had a brother and two cousins that served and I hated the pictures I saw on TV every day. I know a lot of vets and some are still among my favorite people. 

So you graduated from High School in 1975, I pretty much shared your experience I graduated in 1976. That's certainly a war I am glad I was to young for,  but with that said I did join the Army in 1979. So I completely understand where your coming from.

[+susieice]

21 minutes ago, Manwon Lender said:

So you graduated from High School in 1975, I pretty much shared your experience I graduated in 1976. That's certainly a war I am glad I was to young for,  but with that said I did join the Army in 1979. So I completely understand where your coming from.

I graduated in 1974. The Paris Peace Accords were signed in 1973. It probably did take awhile for the war to phase down. I had to look to see when the fall of Saigon was. I remember it, but the date didn't come into mind. It was 1975. From what I can remember of all the news coverage, and back then reporters and cameramen were right up in the front lines, it was horrible. I can remember the Mai Lai massacre and my brother was still in boot camp at Fort Gordon, GA when the Tet Offense occurred, so he was still in the states. That was 1966-67. He graduated in 1966. This was televised every day for years before I even reached my teens. A lot of vets have referred to the movie, Apocalypse Now. That movie makes me shake to this day.

Edited December 12, 2019 by susieice

[Grim Reaper 6]

35 minutes ago, susieice said:

I graduated in 1974. The Paris Peace Accords were signed in 1973. It probably did take awhile for the war to phase down. I had to look to see when the fall of Saigon was. I remember it, but the date didn't come into mind. It was 1975. From what I can remember of all the news coverage, and back then reporters and cameramen were right up in the front lines, it was horrible. I can remember the Mai Lai massacre and my brother was still in boot camp at Fort Gordon, GA when the Tet Offense occurred, so he was still in the states. That was 1966-67. He graduated in 1966. This was televised every day for years before I even reached my teens. A lot of vets have referred to the movie, Apocalypse Now. That movie makes me shake to this day.

All those pictures of the evacuation of the US Embassy, and Helicopters being pushed off ships and the Civilians fleeing Saigon happened in 1975. You see we still had Aircraft and Military personnel and equipment in Vietnam until 1975, the peace accords brought an end to hostilities between us and North Vietnam. But the South Vietnamese military and the Norths military were still fighting until Saigon fell. 

Thats why I say the end of the war was in 1975, because that's when the country was reunited.

Hope I am making sense.

[+susieice]

5 minutes ago, Manwon Lender said:

All those pictures of the evacuation of the US Embassy, and Helicopters being pushed off ships and the Civilians fleeing Saigon happened in 1975. You see we still had Aircraft and Military personnel and equipment in Vietnam until 1975, the peace accords brought an end to hostilities between us and North Vietnam. But the South Vietnamese military and the Norths military were still fighting until Saigon fell. 

Thats why I say the end of the war was in 1975, because that's when the country was reunited.

Hope I am making sense.

You are. I remember watching all this stuff but the dates are a little scrambled in my mind. I graduated right in the middle of it all. I remember the Tet offensive because my brother graduated in 1966 and he just missed it. His best friend graduated in 1967 and he served in the Air Force in Nam. I was like, 11-12 yrs old.

[Buzz_Light_Year]

Vietnam was kinda strange as far as dates are concerned. I enlisted in the Marines in May of 75 the same month Saigon fell and for VA purposes I'm classified as a Vietnam Era Veteran yet I was never in country and the National Defense Service Medal issued for all service members during the conflict was terminated on August 14th 1974.

[Grim Reaper 6]

32 minutes ago, Buzz_Light_Year said:

Vietnam was kinda strange as far as dates are concerned. I enlisted in the Marines in May of 75 the same month Saigon fell and for VA purposes I'm classified as a Vietnam Era Veteran yet I was never in country and the National Defense Service Medal issued for all service members during the conflict was terminated on August 14th 1974.

The cut off date for Vietnam era service is 7 May 1975 according to Congress.

https://www.kitsapdailynews.com/military/when-did-the-vietnam-era-officially-start-end-for-the-u-s/

Saigon fell on 30 April 1975

https://www.historylearningsite.co.uk/vietnam-war/the-fall-of-saigon/

Dont know why there is a difference in the above dates.

Hey and about the post you made to me Yesterday, l hope you can let by gones be by gones because I am willing to, if you don't respond here or by private message I have your answer.

Edited December 12, 2019 by Manwon Lender
This

[The Eternal Flame]

[Phaeton80]

Quote

The Warfare State Lied About Afghanistan, Iraq, and Syria. They Will Lie Again

Recently, multiple inspectors with the Organisation for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons have come forward claiming that relevant evidence related to their analysis of the reported 2017 chemical gas attack in Syria. As Counterpunch.org has reported:

Assessing the damage to the cylinder casings and to the roofs, the inspectors considered the hypothesis that the cylinders had been dropped from Syrian government helicopters, as the rebels claimed. All but one member of the team concurred with Henderson in concluding that there was a higher probability that the cylinders had been placed manually. Henderson did not go so far as to suggest that opposition activists on the ground had staged the incident, but this inference could be drawn. Nevertheless Henderson’s findings were not mentioned in the published OPCW report.

The staging scenario has long been promoted by the Syrian government and its Russian protectors, though without producing evidence. By contrast Henderson and the new whistleblower appear to be completely non-political scientists who worked for the OPCW for many years and would not have been sent to Douma if they had strong political views. They feel dismayed that professional conclusions have been set aside so as to favour the agenda of certain states.

At the time, those who dared question the official narrative about the attack - including Rep. Tulsi Gabbard, Rep. Thomas Massie, and Fox News’s Tucker Carlson - were derided for being conspiracy theorists by many of the same Serious People who not only bought the Pentagon’s lies about Afghanistan but also the justifications for the Iraq War.  

Once again we are reminded of the wise words of George Orwell, “truth is treason in an empire of lies."

https://mises.org/power-market/warfare-state-lied-about-afghanistan-iraq-and-syria-they-will-lie-again

 

[RoofGardener]

 

7 hours ago, Manwon Lender said:

.......

So at least the subject certainly isn't going to die, I think in time it will become a large scandal. The constitution clearly states that Goverment and Religion must remain separated and that obviously isn't occurring in the Trump White House. .....

 

Ummm... not really @Manwon Lender. I believe the pertinent section is in the First Amendment, wherein it says ".... Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; ".... 

It doesn't say that Presidents, Congressmen, or Senators can't be religious. Merely that they can't pass laws establishing a "state religion". That is very different from saying that "Government and Religion must remain separated". 

Consider: the House or Representatives has its own Chaplain, and each day's session begins with a Prayer. The office is very active in House debates, and has frequently excommunicated errant Representatives, at which point they are taken away by the Deacons and bricked up in the Capital Undercroft ! 

The architecture and frescoes of the Congress building are RIDDLED with Mystical, Christian and Biblical symbolism. Consider the fresco in the roof of the Capital Building Rotunda... "The apotheosis of George Washington". E.g. George Washington ascending to heaven and becoming a god. 

 

Edited December 12, 2019 by RoofGardener

[Grim Reaper 6]

51 minutes ago, RoofGardener said:

 

Ummm... not really @Manwon Lender. I believe the pertinent section is in the First Amendment, wherein it says ".... Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; ".... 

It doesn't say that Presidents, Congressmen, or Senators can't be religious. Merely that they can't pass laws establishing a "state religion". That is very different from saying that "Government and Religion must remain separated". 

Consider: the House or Representatives has its own Chaplain, and each day's session begins with a Prayer. The office is very active in House debates, and has frequently excommunicated errant Representatives, at which point they are taken away by the Deacons and bricked up in the Capital Undercroft ! 

The architecture and frescoes of the Congress building are RIDDLED with Mystical, Christian and Biblical symbolism. Consider the fresco in the roof of the Capital Building Rotunda... "The apotheosis of George Washington". E.g. George Washington ascending to heaven and becoming a god. 

 

The separation of church and state is directed at policies not individuals. It simply means that our government should not allow a religious group or organization to control its policies toward its citizens or its foreign policies for or against other nations.

Much of the religious and mystic symbolism is also Masonic

sorry I wasn't clear

Edited December 12, 2019 by Manwon Lender

[RoofGardener]

1 hour ago, Manwon Lender said:

The separation of church and state is directed at policies not individuals. It simply means that our government should not allow a religious group or organization to control its policies toward its citizens or its foreign policies for or against other nations.

Much of the religious and mystic symbolism is also Masonic

sorry I wasn't clear

Hmm.. that's very interesting. I was under the impression that the constitution does NOT forbid ".. a religious group or organisation to control its policies.... ". It merely prevents them from setting up an official "state" religion ? 

As for masonic influences... I'm sure you're right. 

Edited December 12, 2019 by RoofGardener