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zep73

You don't have a soul

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Desertrat56

@larryp   Thanks for the laughs.  I hadn't been reading in this thread for a while but you are still just as hilarious as ever.   

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Umipear
12 minutes ago, ChrLzs said:

As I said, bring your best...

This Carol Bowman?

https://skeptoid.com/episodes/4612

To be specific and I quote:

And so it is with all these claims - it's a load of unsupported, unscientifically cherry picked anecdotes and claims.  And that was the best...? :td::td:

How can I put this succinctly?   ....   If reincarnation was real, it would be easily proven.  It's not.  The stories are made up.

 

The website lists the source of the article, its not from Carol Bowman. How do you know the stories are made up? Were you there? 

So witnesses don't matter? What about crime scenes then?  And how about your experiences? Can I say they didn't happen because you can't show me proof? How about if I say you don't exist as a real person because you're not sitting right in front of me. 

 

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Sherapy
3 hours ago, Umipear said:

Then whats the point of being alive here then? There is proof of reincarnation, so it suggests that there is a soul. Why is it so hard to believe that people have souls? Do you feel afraid like you're going to be duped after you die? There is no harm in believing you have a soul, that it can be reborn into another life after this one ends. 

What about this belief serves you? Are you afraid of dying? 

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psyche101
58 minutes ago, Umipear said:

Existing and living is the same thing to me. 

Definitely not to me. 

58 minutes ago, Umipear said:

No body said anyone should live for another life, you have this lifetime to concentrate on. As I said to experience this life now, grow, learn, evolve. 

We do experience this life now, that's a default. You seem to be alluding to this life experience as some sort of preparation for another life. Is that what you are saying or am I misinterpreting your post?

58 minutes ago, Umipear said:

But it isn't the end. Maybe it works for you to have the belief that we only get one life. To each his own. 

It's a belief that we live on. Science and physics day we don't. That's not a belief. Only our own tales allude to the afterlife idea. There's actually no good reason to think am afterlife exists, that's a personal pursuit based on personal views. Sorry if that's disturbing, but this is it. We do only get one life. 

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ChrLzs
1 hour ago, Umipear said:

How do you know the stories are made up? Were you there? 

So witnesses don't matter? What about crime scenes then?  And how about your experiences? Can I say they didn't happen because you can't show me proof? How about if I say you don't exist as a real person because you're not sitting right in front of me.

:rolleyes: Have you ever done any Science?  Law?  Anything where the meaning of the word 'proof' was made to clear to you?  Clearly not.

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Hyperionxvii
1 hour ago, XenoFish said:

Well that's enough weird for the day. Moving on.....

Well, I mean, unless  you're Dave Mustaine. Then not only might you have a soul, you might be a God.

 

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Umipear
34 minutes ago, Sherapy said:

What about this belief serves you? Are you afraid of dying? 

It is a deeper meaning of life, I don’t see the harm in believing in the soul. I’ve had experiences that defy science. 

 

34 minutes ago, psyche101 said:

Definitely not to me. 

We do experience this life now, that's a default. You seem to be alluding to this life experience as some sort of preparation for another life. Is that what you are saying or am I misinterpreting your post?

It's a belief that we live on. Science and physics day we don't. That's not a belief. Only our own tales allude to the afterlife idea. There's actually no good reason to think am afterlife exists, that's a personal pursuit based on personal views. Sorry if that's disturbing, but this is it. We do only get one life. 

No you are misunderstanding what I’m saying, you’re not preparing for the next life when you’re alive. You live this life now, you accumulate experiences, grow, learn, evolve. It’s hard to understand the reason when you don’t believe in the existence of a soul. It’s like why do you even go to school? 
it doesn’t disturb me because that’s what you choose to follow. For me and my experiences, I couldn’t explain certain things that happened. Not with science. 

 

29 minutes ago, ChrLzs said:

:rolleyes: Have you ever done any Science?  Law?  Anything where the meaning of the word 'proof' was made to clear to you?  Clearly not.

Yes, I have. I like science, it explains physical reality well. And the brilliance of scientists and their research was born from their thoughts and experiences. It began somewhere. The soul is something that science doesn’t quite understand yet. Will it ever? Perhaps not. 

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psyche101
4 minutes ago, Umipear said:

No you are misunderstanding what I’m saying, you’re not preparing for the next life when you’re alive. You live this life now, you accumulate experiences, grow, learn, evolve. 

That's just life. I don't think anyone requires that advice to be honest, with all due respect you see stating the obvious. I just can't see why.

4 minutes ago, Umipear said:

It’s hard to understand the reason when you don’t believe in the existence of a soul. It’s like why do you even go to school? 

It seems harder for you to articulate a coherent response? Isn't that more important with regards to your claims? You're talking in circles without saying anything, you are just expressing a wild belief in a very general sense.

4 minutes ago, Umipear said:

it doesn’t disturb me because that’s what you choose to follow. For me and my experiences, I couldn’t explain certain things that happened. Not with science. 

That's a ridiculous call to make. You are saying you understand all sciences and have found reason to reject the obvious conclusions. That you say you have seen things that cannot be explained by science is a dead giveaway that you don't really understand science and are blindly dismissing it. How do you know science cannot explain your alleged experiences? What aspects of science are violated well enough to dismiss it as a whole? 

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Umipear
20 minutes ago, psyche101 said:

That's just life. I don't think anyone requires that advice to be honest, with all due respect you see stating the obvious. I just can't see why.

It seems harder for you to articulate a coherent response? Isn't that more important with regards to your claims? You're talking in circles without saying anything, you are just expressing a wild belief in a very general sense.

That's a ridiculous call to make. You are saying you understand all sciences and have found reason to reject the obvious conclusions. That you say you have seen things that cannot be explained by science is a dead giveaway that you don't really understand science and are blindly dismissing it. How do you know science cannot explain your alleged experiences? What aspects of science are violated well enough to dismiss it as a whole? 

Sorry I didn’t explain why I said why do you even go to school. I meant the concept is like the reason for going to school. So you won’t be ignorant. The concept is the soul lives these lives to learn and experience, to become enlightened. I never claimed anything, I said there is no harm in believing in the soul, and there were accounts that suggest the existence of it, and you all tried to destroy everything I said and mentioned. How arrogant and dismissive.
When did I say I understand all science? I’ve heard the conclusions though for my experiences , and nothing can truly explain it. You assume a lot of things about people when you don’t know their experiences. I get how highly you hold science, but it doesn’t explain everything and have all the answers. 

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ChrLzs
39 minutes ago, Umipear said:

When did I say I understand all science?

Me neither.

39 minutes ago, Umipear said:

I’ve heard the conclusions though for my experiences , and nothing can truly explain it.

Wait a minute... that doesn't make any sense.  You just said you don't know everything or understand all science, so how can you possibly reject all explanations?  That suggests a very closed mind, which is quite the opposite of what you are trying to portray.

 

39 minutes ago, Umipear said:

I get how highly you hold science, but it doesn’t explain everything

You are correct - science does NOT try to explain 'everything' (eg, nothing could possibly explain why people like reality TV..).

But what it *does* do, is try to explain everything that is REAL, everything that is measurable or testable..  It does a dam good job of that - but feel free to point out something truly explainable.  I don't see much of that above...  And if you cry "but some things are not measurable!!", then my response is - those things may as well NOT be real then.

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ChrLzs
2 hours ago, Umipear said:

...I like science, it explains physical reality well.

Yes, by definition, it does.  And even self-corrects and expands as it trundles along..

Quote

And the brilliance of scientists and their research was born from their thoughts and experiences. It began somewhere.

As Carl Sagan said so wisely, if you want to bake an apple pie from scratch, first you need to create the Universe.  Your 'soul' did not just snap into existence upon some undefined deity's will (where did that deity's soul come from?).  It came after millions of years of evolution, starting from LUCA, to create the dna for a successful, efficient brain and body.  Intelligence has obvious evolutionary advantage - ask any dolphin - and from there it's only a short step to self-awareness and advanced communication thru to social structures and technology (maybe no tech if you live under water, tho'...)

There's your soul.  Oh look, I just explained the Theory of Everything....

Quote

The soul is something that science doesn’t quite understand yet. Will it ever? Perhaps not. 

Given that the soul is a hugely complex myriad of instantaneous electrical impulses, going right down to the cellular and atomic level, the aspiration of perfect understanding is neither sensible, or necessary.  Already we know enough to explain the basics about the process by which we came to be, and why we act as we do.. 

It's not rocket science...  it's biology, physiology, chemistry, and then some psychology and sociology.  Done.  :) 

Edited by ChrLzs
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psyche101
55 minutes ago, Umipear said:

Sorry I didn’t explain why I said why do you even go to school. I meant the concept is like the reason for going to school. So you won’t be ignorant. The concept is the soul lives these lives to learn and experience, to become enlightened.

That's not true at all though. This life is for this life. Experience helps make decisions in the here and now, it's how we get through life. There's nothing to say or indicate that this is some sort of training.

55 minutes ago, Umipear said:

I never claimed anything, I said there is no harm in believing in the soul, and there were accounts that suggest the existence of it, and you all tried to destroy everything I said and mentioned. How arrogant and dismissive.

When did I say I understand all science? I’ve heard the conclusions though for my experiences , and nothing can truly explain it.

Let's look at what you said.

Science cannot explain your experiences.

You stated 'cannot'

How can you say that unless you know all of the sciences we have gathered?

55 minutes ago, Umipear said:

You assume a lot of things about people when you don’t know their experiences. I get how highly you hold science, but it doesn’t explain everything and have all the answers. 

I don't think I'm assuming anything. Claims such as yours are dime a dozen, and never come from academic fields. 

It's just superstition.

Superstitions are broad enough to fit a lot of anomalies. It's very common for people to attribute those superstitions to anomalies and proclaim oneself knowledgeable on areas beyond observation. 

How is that not arrogant? 

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Sherapy
10 hours ago, Umipear said:

It is a deeper meaning of life, I don’t see the harm in believing in the soul. I’ve had experiences that defy science. 

 

No you are misunderstanding what I’m saying, you’re not preparing for the next life when you’re alive. You live this life now, you accumulate experiences, grow, learn, evolve. It’s hard to understand the reason when you don’t believe in the existence of a soul. It’s like why do you even go to school? 
it doesn’t disturb me because that’s what you choose to follow. For me and my experiences, I couldn’t explain certain things that happened. Not with science. 

 

Yes, I have. I like science, it explains physical reality well. And the brilliance of scientists and their research was born from their thoughts and experiences. It began somewhere. The soul is something that science doesn’t quite understand yet. Will it ever? Perhaps not. 

What experiences have you had that defy science and what evidence do you have to support this?

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ChrLzs
7 hours ago, Sherapy said:

What experiences have you had that defy science and what evidence do you have to support this?

Indeed.

To Umipear and others, let's cut to the chase..  There seems to be a pattern here.. the claim is made about a soul, and then there will be claims of seemingly impossible (or very unlikely) coincidences, or feats of intuition that defy belief..  And then there's the old standard - "how do you explain LOVE???"  Let me address all of those briefly...

In my very own family, there was one such incident involving my father and his sister (my aunt).  I won't repeat the full details but the claim was that my aunt had a vivid dream of something happening to my father (wartime incident) that she diarised, and then some weeks later she found out that the incident, as dreamt, had happened at exactly the moment she woke up screaming....

But then someone dared to ask to see the diary entry...  That resulted in an uncomfortable silence and the question was never asked again.

It's a wonderful story and gave my aunt and the family in general a lot of comfort and an awesome story to pass on, but in truth...?  Yes, there was probably a traumatic dream at around the correct date, but I'll bet it didn't match exactly what had happened, and over time, the story just grew.  Memories change - that's what brains do.  It was likely just a mild coincidence, and coincidences like that have to happen - it's the law of averages...

As for love being unexplainable, don't be ridiculous.
- Hormones.
- The desire to reproduce.
- The social need to set up family relationships
- The evolutionary advantage of the entirety of all the above, and more.

I could continue but there's a start.  Love is at the peak of science and involves many disciplines...

And let's not head into empathy and intuition - we'll be here for far too long.  :lol:

 

So, when you actually look at the properties of the soul, it is complex and amazingly wonderful.  There's no need to add in the paranormal.

Unless you have actual evidence of something beyond that which I've amateurishly and only partially explained above.

 

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Mr Walker
20 hours ago, ChrLzs said:

:rolleyes: Have you ever done any Science?  Law?  Anything where the meaning of the word 'proof' was made to clear to you?  Clearly not.

Are you talking about transferrable proofs and evidences or personal  ones which can be identical but not transferrable.

When a person tells a narrative of their own life it COULD be entirely imaginative /delusional  OR it could be totally true, and known to the individual by the same proofs and evidences by which we know anything 

BUT, encounter a 2 metre goanna in your back yard ,and, unless you can get a photo of it, you have no transferrable proofs or evidences (and even with a photo how do you prove it is genuine /relevant to your story )   Get chased by a great white while water skiing, and once the witnesses die, you  have NO transferable evidences, even though it was totally true

 

"99%" of events in your life will be known to you by personal  evidences and proofs, but non provable to others, because you cant transfer your evidences and proofs  

Edited by Mr Walker

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Sherapy
28 minutes ago, Mr Walker said:

Are you talking about transferrable proofs and evidences or personal  ones which can be identical but not transferrable.

When a person tells a narrative of their own life it COULD be entirely imaginative /delusional  OR it could be totally true, and known to the individual by the same proofs and evidences by which we know anything 

BUT, encounter a 2 metre goanna in your back yard ,and, unless you can get a photo of it, you have no transferrable proofs or evidences (and even with a photo how do you prove it is genuine /relevant to your story )   Get chased by a great white while water skiing, and once the witnesses die, you  have NO transferable evidences, even though it was totally true

 

"99%" of events in your life will be known to you by personal  evidences and proofs, but non provable to others, because you cant transfer your evidences and proofs  

Who cares about one’s subjective take on life? The point Charles is making with his story is the subjective component is meaningless in the big scheme of things. 
 

 

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Sherapy
2 hours ago, ChrLzs said:

Indeed.

To Umipear and others, let's cut to the chase..  There seems to be a pattern here.. the claim is made about a soul, and then there will be claims of seemingly impossible (or very unlikely) coincidences, or feats of intuition that defy belief..  And then there's the old standard - "how do you explain LOVE???"  Let me address all of those briefly...

In my very own family, there was one such incident involving my father and his sister (my aunt).  I won't repeat the full details but the claim was that my aunt had a vivid dream of something happening to my father (wartime incident) that she diarised, and then some weeks later she found out that the incident, as dreamt, had happened at exactly the moment she woke up screaming....

But then someone dared to ask to see the diary entry...  That resulted in an uncomfortable silence and the question was never asked again.

It's a wonderful story and gave my aunt and the family in general a lot of comfort and an awesome story to pass on, but in truth...?  Yes, there was probably a traumatic dream at around the correct date, but I'll bet it didn't match exactly what had happened, and over time, the story just grew.  Memories change - that's what brains do.  It was likely just a mild coincidence, and coincidences like that have to happen - it's the law of averages...

As for love being unexplainable, don't be ridiculous.
- Hormones.
- The desire to reproduce.
- The social need to set up family relationships
- The evolutionary advantage of the entirety of all the above, and more.

I could continue but there's a start.  Love is at the peak of science and involves many disciplines...

And let's not head into empathy and intuition - we'll be here for far too long.  :lol:

 

So, when you actually look at the properties of the soul, it is complex and amazingly wonderful.  There's no need to add in the paranormal.

Unless you have actual evidence of something beyond that which I've amateurishly and only partially explained above.

 

Great story to illustrate how anecdotal stories can be fun, entertaining to family. 
 

 

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Mr Walker
6 hours ago, Sherapy said:

Who cares about one’s subjective take on life? The point Charles is making with his story is the subjective component is meaningless in the big scheme of things. 
 

 

Then he and you are wrong 

I was talking about objective occurrences in a life.

  These cant be proven to anyone who wasn't with you at the time 

Ok here is a task.

Try to find convincing evidences for what you ate for lunch yesterday.

These must be good enough to prove to me that YOU ate these things  for lunch on tha t day 

You KNOW what you ate and you have/had  evidences for that  knowledge, but its impossible for you to convince me, unless I accept your evidences as truthful  ie its impossible for you to produce transferable evidences to support what is an entirely truthful, and evidenced, moment in your life. 

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Mr Walker
9 hours ago, ChrLzs said:

Indeed.

To Umipear and others, let's cut to the chase..  There seems to be a pattern here.. the claim is made about a soul, and then there will be claims of seemingly impossible (or very unlikely) coincidences, or feats of intuition that defy belief..  And then there's the old standard - "how do you explain LOVE???"  Let me address all of those briefly...

In my very own family, there was one such incident involving my father and his sister (my aunt).  I won't repeat the full details but the claim was that my aunt had a vivid dream of something happening to my father (wartime incident) that she diarised, and then some weeks later she found out that the incident, as dreamt, had happened at exactly the moment she woke up screaming....

But then someone dared to ask to see the diary entry...  That resulted in an uncomfortable silence and the question was never asked again.

It's a wonderful story and gave my aunt and the family in general a lot of comfort and an awesome story to pass on, but in truth...?  Yes, there was probably a traumatic dream at around the correct date, but I'll bet it didn't match exactly what had happened, and over time, the story just grew.  Memories change - that's what brains do.  It was likely just a mild coincidence, and coincidences like that have to happen - it's the law of averages...

As for love being unexplainable, don't be ridiculous.
- Hormones.
- The desire to reproduce.
- The social need to set up family relationships
- The evolutionary advantage of the entirety of all the above, and more.

I could continue but there's a start.  Love is at the peak of science and involves many disciplines...

And let's not head into empathy and intuition - we'll be here for far too long.  :lol:

 

So, when you actually look at the properties of the soul, it is complex and amazingly wonderful.  There's no need to add in the paranormal.

Unless you have actual evidence of something beyond that which I've amateurishly and only partially explained above.

 

or maybe she simply no longer had the diary :)  How do YOU know she didn't experience exactly what she said, and, indeed, write it down at the time

 However I agree strongly with the bit I bolded The soul is slef evident in human beings and manifests in   objective realities

It is observable and explicable by a variety of sciences There is nothing paranormal about it but, in a metaphorical sense, it is truly magical, and it is very powerful in defining a human being  

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Umipear
On 2/17/2021 at 8:34 PM, ChrLzs said:

Me neither.

Wait a minute... that doesn't make any sense.  You just said you don't know everything or understand all science, so how can you possibly reject all explanations?  That suggests a very closed mind, which is quite the opposite of what you are trying to portray.

 

You are correct - science does NOT try to explain 'everything' (eg, nothing could possibly explain why people like reality TV..).

But what it *does* do, is try to explain everything that is REAL, everything that is measurable or testable..  It does a dam good job of that - but feel free to point out something truly explainable.  I don't see much of that above...  And if you cry "but some things are not measurable!!", then my response is - those things may as well NOT be real then.

I'm not rejecting all possible explanations, I've searched for answers, and gotten explanations, but they weren't sufficient enough. Physics is a science I know less about, but I understand the main concepts. There is a lot science has yet to discover and understand. A lot of Information and knowledge changes over time, what you perceive as "real" is simply just something you choose to follow and rely on. 

On 2/17/2021 at 9:04 PM, psyche101 said:

That's not true at all though. This life is for this life. Experience helps make decisions in the here and now, it's how we get through life. There's nothing to say or indicate that this is some sort of training.

Let's look at what you said.

Science cannot explain your experiences.

You stated 'cannot'

How can you say that unless you know all of the sciences we have gathered?

I don't think I'm assuming anything. Claims such as yours are dime a dozen, and never come from academic fields. 

It's just superstition.

Superstitions are broad enough to fit a lot of anomalies. It's very common for people to attribute those superstitions to anomalies and proclaim oneself knowledgeable on areas beyond observation. 

How is that not arrogant? 

That's what I was saying, this life is this life, you will never come back as the same person with the same life. 

So far there is no science that can be applied to explain my experiences as I have found, that I find sufficient enough. Like I said, I have searched for answers, and have had people try to explain them. The things that happened aren't all subjective, it happened outside of myself in the "real" world as you would put it. 

And you come from academic fields? I know people who are in the academic fields who have a broader perception of the world, the soul, and metaphysics than you and others. They aren't afraid of the possibilities. 

All you guys can't prove that the soul isn't real either, you're only projecting your philosophies and opinions about this. Can you prove to me that the soul is not there? Science is still young, it has made great strides, but as Chrlzs said science doesn't claim to know everything. The wise wouldn't be so arrogant as to say they know everything and can explain everything. 

20 hours ago, Sherapy said:

Who cares about one’s subjective take on life? The point Charles is making with his story is the subjective component is meaningless in the big scheme of things. 
 

 

Oh it matters, no one would have achieved anything if there was no subjective take on life. If there was no imagination, science would not have gotten to where it is today. Lets face it, human nature is not normally void of emotions, beliefs, trust, and subjectivity. But why is that? Why do you choose to trust anything? Why are you who you are? You choose it because you have personal feelings about it. People who are void of those things, usually have psychological problems.      

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ChrLzs

Never have I heard such handwaving.....

 

G I V E    E X A M P L E S .

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jmccr8
8 hours ago, Umipear said:

All you guys can't prove that the soul isn't real either,

Hi Umipear

Hey now don't go lumping all of us with a tag,. Personally I don't have to prove it's real I don't care and not caring about whether it's real or not has not negatively impacted my cheery outlook on an apparently (according to some) dismal life. :lol:

jmccr8

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psyche101
9 hours ago, Umipear said:

I'm not rejecting all possible explanations, I've searched for answers, and gotten explanations, but they weren't sufficient enough. Physics is a science I know less about, but I understand the main concepts. There is a lot science has yet to discover and understand. A lot of Information and knowledge changes over time, what you perceive as "real" is simply just something you choose to follow and rely on. 

I don't think you do understand the main concepts. People who don't often make the same mistake you have above. 

Yes there is a lot of science to discover. Yes that means change to what we know 

It does not mean what we do know is wrong. 

1+1=2. Always has, always will.

Atoms are made up of three basic particles. Protons, neutrons and electrons. Always have been, always will be. 

Physics that say there is no way for life to continue after death are not wrong. 

9 hours ago, Umipear said:

That's what I was saying, this life is this life, you will never come back as the same person with the same life. 

That's pretty much a given belief or not. You don't come back. 

9 hours ago, Umipear said:

So far there is no science that can be applied to explain my experiences as I have found, that I find sufficient enough. Like I said, I have searched for answers, and have had people try to explain them. The things that happened aren't all subjective, it happened outside of myself in the "real" world as you would put it. 

I find it very hard to believe that you have exhausted every possible answer considering that you state above that your understanding of physics is minimal. That's contradictory. 

It strikes me that if you really have experienced something extraordinary, then an extraordinary explanation would be required. Not something "beyond science". Physics says life does not continue after death, so in the circumstance of any extraordinary event, another solution must exist. 

9 hours ago, Umipear said:

And you come from academic fields? I know people who are in the academic fields who have a broader perception of the world, the soul, and metaphysics than you and others. They aren't afraid of the possibilities. 

That applies here how? 

I suspect they are not dedicated to their discipline if they entertain superstition.

9 hours ago, Umipear said:

All you guys can't prove that the soul isn't real either, you're only projecting your philosophies and opinions about this. Can you prove to me that the soul is not there? Science is still young, it has made great strides, but as Chrlzs said science doesn't claim to know everything. The wise wouldn't be so arrogant as to say they know everything and can explain everything. 

We know life can't continue after death according to physics. That is what you are actually referring to isn't it? Living beyond death through the soul?

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Mr Walker
1 hour ago, psyche101 said:

I don't think you do understand the main concepts. People who don't often make the same mistake you have above. 

Yes there is a lot of science to discover. Yes that means change to what we know 

It does not mean what we do know is wrong. 

1+1=2. Always has, always will.

Atoms are made up of three basic particles. Protons, neutrons and electrons. Always have been, always will be. 

Physics that say there is no way for life to continue after death are not wrong. 

That's pretty much a given belief or not. You don't come back. 

I find it very hard to believe that you have exhausted every possible answer considering that you state above that your understanding of physics is minimal. That's contradictory. 

It strikes me that if you really have experienced something extraordinary, then an extraordinary explanation would be required. Not something "beyond science". Physics says life does not continue after death, so in the circumstance of any extraordinary event, another solution must exist. 

That applies here how? 

I suspect they are not dedicated to their discipline if they entertain superstition.

We know life can't continue after death according to physics. That is what you are actually referring to isn't it? Living beyond death through the soul?

Several times in this post you state tha t physics proves there is no life after death 

that is an untruth, even if you  believe it.

  I wont say you are lying because I think you believe it to be true 

You should stop making untruthful statements   

Physics has shown that one form of life after death is improbable   using the measurement of energy 

However there are many possible forms of life after death which this fact would not preclude 

Modern physics does not have the scientific tools to prove either that life is possible after death or that it is not 

If anything, modern physics is beginning to show us ways by which human science could ensure that we lived on ,after this body /mind dies.

ie using technology to copy the mind and body , store both, and make them available when the original ceases to exist. 

 To take your example of the atom. Leaving aside the ancient greeks the atom was discovered about 200 years ago .  Electrons were only discovered about 130 years ago The nucleus was discovered by Rutherford about 1900.  (in 1918 he split a nucleus ) A student of his called Chadwick discovered neutrons in/ around 1932  Fermi (and others) went on to use previous findings to split an atom and create the first atomic bomb .

None of this would have been imaginable in1800  The physics and technologies required simply did not exist 

We are like that with the nature of life and death today.

We WILL (if our civilization continues for another 100 years) learn to make ourselves virtually immortal and make "reincarnation' the norm, just as blood transfusions and vaccines are the norm today. 

Edited by Mr Walker

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psyche101
On 2/20/2021 at 4:50 PM, Mr Walker said:

Several times in this post you state tha t physics proves there is no life after death 

that is an untruth, even if you  believe it.

  I wont say you are lying because I think you believe it to be true 

You should stop making untruthful statements   

Physics has shown that one form of life after death is improbable   using the measurement of energy 

However there are many possible forms of life after death which this fact would not preclude 

Modern physics does not have the scientific tools to prove either that life is possible after death or that it is not 

If anything, modern physics is beginning to show us ways by which human science could ensure that we lived on ,after this body /mind dies.

ie using technology to copy the mind and body , store both, and make them available when the original ceases to exist. 

 To take your example of the atom. Leaving aside the ancient greeks the atom was discovered about 200 years ago .  Electrons were only discovered about 130 years ago The nucleus was discovered by Rutherford about 1900.  (in 1918 he split a nucleus ) A student of his called Chadwick discovered neutrons in/ around 1932  Fermi (and others) went on to use previous findings to split an atom and create the first atomic bomb .

None of this would have been imaginable in1800  The physics and technologies required simply did not exist 

We are like that with the nature of life and death today.

We WILL (if our civilization continues for another 100 years) learn to make ourselves virtually immortal and make "reincarnation' the norm, just as blood transfusions and vaccines are the norm today. 

Why do you ever think I'm interested in your ridiculous views? I have zero interest in your thoughts or ideas. Pretty sure I've mentioned that before. 

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