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Raptor Witness

Trump Declares De Facto War on Iran

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Raptor Witness
Posted (edited)

Reportedly passed over by two previous U.S. presidents, including Bush and Obama, for fear of it starting a war with Iran, President Trump has ordered the assassination of Iran's top general, Qasem Soleimani.

What does this mean for the United States is the big question before all of U.S.?

My thoughts are, given Soleimani was on Iraqi soil, at the time of his assassination; a country which the United States still occupies, he was a foreign, adversarial general in a quasi theatre of battle. The problem is, there will still likely be consequences, whether justified or not, and those consequences, like the war with Iraq, are not pleasant.

 ... the Iranians could also try to assassinate Donald Trump, in retaliation, and if successful, this would mark the beginning of a real war with Iran.

Edited by Raptor Witness
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Dumbledore the Awesome

The forces of righteousness are supposed to be assisting the Iraqi government in their fight against a terror army of ruthlessness hitherto unparalleled in the history of mankind, not occupying Iraq. Are you trying to suggest that they might be there under false pretenses, such as, for example, to give Washington an excuse to steal anybody's oil whenever they might want to? 

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Raptor Witness

I agree with CNN’s foreign correspondent that this act will likely be viewed, locally, as a continued colonial power struggle, with the United States asserting it’s perceived colonial rights, not just over Iraq, and Afghanistan, but now looking to Iran, as the next target.

At the 6:15 minute mark ....

 

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5 hours ago, Raptor Witness said:

the Iranians could also try to assassinate Donald Trump, in retaliation, and if successful, this would mark the beginning of a real war with Iran.

Or they could lick their wounds and S T F U.  One can hope, anyway.  Regardless of what they choose to do, their choice will be met with strength and these kinds of ideologies respect nothing else.  It doesn't matter which side people feel is right, that is a fact known to all who have had dealings in the M.E.  I noticed that one of their grand potentate abu salamis said they already had 35 of our "vital sites" mapped and that they could hit Tel Aviv as well.  Talk is, as they say, cheap.  

Your title is a tad confusing.  Where, exactly, is your evidence that Trump has declared war?  He slapped down a murdering thug that kissed the old greybeard's robes.  Nothing else has changed except the old greybeard's dress and his bedroom location.  

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Raptor Witness
3 minutes ago, and then said:

 ....

Your title is a tad confusing.  Where, exactly, is your evidence that Trump has declared war?  He slapped down a murdering thug that kissed the old greybeard's robes.  Nothing else has changed except the old greybeard's dress and his bedroom location.  

“A de facto state of war is a situation where two nations are actively engaging, or are engaged, in aggressive military actions against the other without a formal declaration of war.” Source

 

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2 minutes ago, Raptor Witness said:

“A de facto state of war is a situation where two nations are actively engaging, or are engaged, in aggressive military actions against the other without a formal declaration of war.” Source

 

Yes, I'm aware of the definition and common usage of the term.  The confusing part of your use is that nothing has changed in our relationship with Iran over the last 3 years except that Trump finally returned their fire.  I note that you did not get hysterical when they shot down a 240-million dollar surveillance asset or when they destroyed refining capability of an ally in the region.  In short, THEY have been in a de-facto state of war with us for roughly 40 years.  We finally have a president that isn't going to take their guff anymore.  Sorry if that ruffles your lace. (not really ) ;) 

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Black Red Devil

Trump doesn't want a war but thought he'd show some muscle for his fans. Problem is he hit the right guy in the wrong spot and at the wrong time. I have no doubt Iran will retaliate. At which, the ball will be back in Trumps court and he'll have to decide whether to get embroiled in a dirty war killing thousands of Iranians together with American body bags or tuck tail. You know, there is a reason previous Presidents didn't go around their backyard playing the bully. Because they wouldn't have been faced with this dilemma that, above all, doesn't look good for election prospects. Although not American I'm pretty sure the majority don't like Presidents dragging them into wars.

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Raptor Witness
Posted (edited)
21 minutes ago, Black Red Devil said:

Trump doesn't want a war but thought he'd show some muscle for his fans. Problem is he hit the right guy in the wrong spot and at the wrong time. I have no doubt Iran will retaliate. At which, the ball will be back in Trumps court and he'll have to decide whether to get embroiled in a dirty war killing thousands of Iranians together with American body bags or tuck tail. You know, there is a reason previous Presidents didn't go around their backyard playing the bully. Because they wouldn't have been faced with this dilemma that, above all, doesn't look good for election prospects. Although not American I'm pretty sure the majority don't like Presidents dragging them into wars.

It’s arguably possible that Trump may be trying to force his impeachment trial in the Senate, and if that’s the case, it’s just another example of how his bad behavior is dangerous; not just for U.S. interests, but for all of western civilization. The problem I’m having with this argument, is that I’m afraid a war with Iran was inevitable, regardless.

Is it Donald Trump’s fault that this foolish general was in Iraq, making trouble in the first place? I’m inclined to give Trump a pass on that, but it doesn’t mean I want to vote for him, or that I’m less worried about where this likely leads. 

Edited by Raptor Witness
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Not A Rockstar

I find it curious that the General was in Iraq at the same time as an attack on our embassy, which everyone would know would not be met with cake and punch. I mean, if he had nothing to do with it and was not involved in anything with proxies and stuff. 

Just saying.

I'm glad he's dead. There are always consequences if you take an action, unless it is against the US usually. Until recently, anyway.

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Agent0range

When you get a chance to kill an enemy, you take it.  My feelings for Trump are certainly well known, but you kill the enemy.  That was my brigade motto.  You would salute and say "strike force" and the officer would respond with "kill the enemy."

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Posted (edited)
33 minutes ago, Black Red Devil said:

Trump doesn't want a war but thought he'd show some muscle for his fans. Problem is he hit the right guy in the wrong spot and at the wrong time. I have no doubt Iran will retaliate. At which, the ball will be back in Trumps court and he'll have to decide whether to get embroiled in a dirty war killing thousands of Iranians together with American body bags or tuck tail. You know, there is a reason previous Presidents didn't go around their backyard playing the bully. Because they wouldn't have been faced with this dilemma that, above all, doesn't look good for election prospects. Although not American I'm pretty sure the majority don't like Presidents dragging them into wars.

Your heartfelt concern over our people in bodybags notwithstanding, you don't have a clue what the U.S. is capable of.  Iran is currently in its economic sick bed and it's having trouble keeping up its commitments abroad.  We didn't fire a shot to accomplish that bit of legerdemaine.  Let Iran bluster and enjoy your short-lived hopes that they actually can harm us in any significant way.  It's just a fantasy but go with it.  To use one of Obama's aphorisms - If they bring a knife, we bring a gun.  Iran has devolved into a nation whose leaders are just international crime bosses - kind of like Mo's early days.  They have no capability to project any significant power outside their territory.  

They can kill Americans in America, I'd guess.  But they have no way to stop us from returning the favor X 10 or 20.  Those old men are hated by the majority of their citizens slaves and they know it.  If it weren't for their Praetorian and the Basij thugs on motorcycles, they'd be hung by their own people.  This move has had a very chilling effect on those who have assumed they were totally safe from the Bad Orange Man.  If they're smart, they'll think awhile before lashing out.  

Edited by and then
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This from today:

 @realDonaldTrump
FollowFollow @realDonaldTrump
More

....targeted 52 Iranian sites (representing the 52 American hostages taken by Iran many years ago), some at a very high level & important to Iran & the Iranian culture, and those targets, and Iran itself, WILL BE HIT VERY FAST AND VERY HARD. The USA wants no more threats!

 

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Raptor Witness
9 minutes ago, Agent0range said:

When you get a chance to kill an enemy, you take it.  My feelings for Trump are certainly well known, but you kill the enemy.  That was my brigade motto.  You would salute and say "strike force" and the officer would respond with "kill the enemy."

... and might makes right, always looks safer than it really is.

 

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5 minutes ago, Raptor Witness said:

and might makes right, always looks safer than it really is.

 

That was a very long time ago and during the typical Democrat administration.  Carter had gutted our military and drawn down our training to the point where our "best" were under trained.  But you stick with the hope that your dreams will come true, you ghoul.  You should be ashamed for showing glee over the deaths of men whose boots you aren't fit to tie.  But since you dared to remind us of this time in our history with these thugs, you should remember Trump's statement from today:

 @realDonaldTrump
FollowFollow @realDonaldTrump
More

....targeted 52 Iranian sites (representing the 52 American hostages taken by Iran many years ago), some at a very high level & important to Iran & the Iranian culture, and those targets, and Iran itself, WILL BE HIT VERY FAST AND VERY HARD. The USA wants no more threats!

Today, we have a military that is MORE than up to the job of beating these animals down into their own patch of desert.  Their choice.  If they try it, they'll find that Salami was just a downpayment on their butcher's bill  :tu:

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Agent0range
5 minutes ago, and then said:

 You should be ashamed for showing glee over the deaths of men whose boots you aren't fit to tie

 

Oh stop it.  You insult Veteran posters on here on a daily basis if they disagree with you.  

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2 minutes ago, Agent0range said:

Oh stop it.  You insult Veteran posters on here on a daily basis if they disagree with you.  

That's because THEY'RE ALIVE to return my fire.  Their opinions about politics mean no more than mine.  Just because they served doesn't make them untouchable in a political discussion but dying in service warrants a bit more respect, even from you.

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OverSword
6 hours ago, Piney said:

Well, the Christian Zionists will be pleased. They think a war with Iran will mean the return of Santa Claus.  ^_^

Yeah, and is also prophetically agreeable to Islam’s crazy we are right and the rest of you will die in a war to prove it myth. 

 

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Habitat

Trump threatening to attack Iranian cultural sites ? That tells you all you need to know about Trump.

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Piney
4 minutes ago, OverSword said:

Yeah, and is also prophetically agreeable to Islam’s crazy we are right and the rest of you will die in a war to prove it myth. 

 

The Twelver Prophecy has Jesus and the Mahdi fighting together. 

So their all crazy.....

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3 minutes ago, OverSword said:

Yeah, and is also prophetically agreeable to Islam’s crazy we are right and the rest of you will die in a war to prove it myth. 

 

Strictly speaking and as a person who believes in Israel's descendents having an immutable right to that land, Christian prophecy says just the opposite than the Twelver fantasies that the mullahs in Tehran subscribe to.  They believe it is their DUTY to create conditions so chaotic that their "Rightly Guided One" (al Mahdi) can return and cleanse their world so that Islam is the only religion.  

Christians, especially CZs or Evangelicals, know from scripture that there is NOTHING we can do to expedite Christ's return.  We are told that "no man knows the day or the hour" but we are commanded to be aware of the "season" that signifies His return.  These are two totally different outlooks.  Just because there may be some Christians who are militant and believe that nonsense is not justification for saying all believe it.  But people will conflate the two so that they can ignore them.  My guess is they'll be successful in the short term but as these events come faster and with greater frequency, it will be a growing struggle to continue ignoring them with a straight face.  To each, his own choice.

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OverSword
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Black Red Devil said:

You know, there is a reason previous Presidents didn't go around their backyard playing the bully. 

Presidents never do anything like this. Presidents ride white horses. They never take military actions in other countries without asking permission at the risk of those who are struck, striking back. 

Edited by OverSword
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Black Red Devil
Posted (edited)
59 minutes ago, and then said:

Your heartfelt concern over our people in bodybags notwithstanding, you don't have a clue what the U.S. is capable of.  Iran is currently in its economic sick bed and it's having trouble keeping up its commitments abroad.  We didn't fire a shot to accomplish that bit of legerdemaine.  Let Iran bluster and enjoy your short-lived hopes that they actually can harm us in any significant way.  It's just a fantasy but go with it.  To use one of Obama's aphorisms - If they bring a knife, we bring a gun.  Iran has devolved into a nation whose leaders are just international crime bosses - kind of like Mo's early days.  They have no capability to project any significant power outside their territory.  

They can kill Americans in America, I'd guess.  But they have no way to stop us from returning the favor X 10 or 20.  Those old men are hated by the majority of their citizens slaves and they know it.  If it weren't for their Praetorian and the Basij thugs on motorcycles, they'd be hung by their own people.  This move has had a very chilling effect on those who have assumed they were totally safe from the Bad Orange Man.  If they're smart, they'll think awhile before lashing out.  

Talking about slaves, unlike your 'concerns' for American lives which pass by the interests in Tel Aviv first, my concern is for all lives., including Iranian civilians and our soldiers who seem to be always dragged into your wars. 

They can kill Americans in America, I'd guess.  But they have no way to stop us from returning the favor X 10 or 20. :lol:

As long as it's not you huh??

Edited by Black Red Devil

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Black Red Devil
2 minutes ago, OverSword said:

Presidents never do anything this. Presidents ride white horses. They never take military actions in other countries without asking permission at the risk of those who are struck, striking back. 

No, only Emperors ride white horses.  BTW, was your Congress consulted before the general was disintegrated?

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2 minutes ago, Piney said:

The Twelver Prophecy has Jesus and the Mahdi fighting together. 

So their all crazy.....

This is true.  They call him "Issa" and say he will "pray behind the Mahdi".  Christian Eschatology describes the person they call "Issa" with exactly the same attributes as the "False Prophet"  Joel Richardson wrote a book on the comparisons of these two versions of eschatology and the descriptions are nearly identical.  Issa=False Prophet, Christ=Mahdi, references to end times wars and developments each have an analog in Christian and Islamic prophecy.  Considering they were written a minimum of centuries apart, I find them fascinating.  If a person wanted to create a mirror image of Judeo Christian eschatology Islam couldn't be equaled.  The one absolute bond between the two is that they both focus on control of Jerusalem.  

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