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Sherapy

Would Jesus condone corporal punishment?

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Piney
9 minutes ago, Sherapy said:

Did you do a vision quest?

No, I'm a member of the religious caste and learned how the mind and the power of suggestion created spirits early on. My learning how to be a Warrior-Advisor was a greater hardship and more extensive. 

Well, my grandmother's brother wanted me drowned (and actually tried to) because I was sickly with no coarse motor skills so the prick made it even harder.  

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Sherapy
4 minutes ago, Piney said:

No, I'm a member of the religious caste and learned how the mind and the power of suggestion created spirits early on. My learning how to be a Warrior-Advisor was a greater hardship and more extensive. 

Well, my grandmother's brother wanted me drowned (and actually tried to) because I was sickly with no coarse motor skills so the prick made it even harder.  

Wow, did you make it through. 

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Piney
4 minutes ago, Sherapy said:

Wow, did you make it through. 

I became my father's Warrior-Advisor and a type of Wisdon Keeper didn't I? :whistle:

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Festina
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Debra F. II said:

Sounds like we might have a few things in common : ) 

and I'll throw it out there...

but no matter what age we are, in some peoples eyes we are ALL God's children. 

&... Parents are irrelevant. 

Not irrelevant but not as relevant as most think.  Parents and children teach each other and black sheeps are the most effective teachers of the families into which they have “fallen”. :)

Edited by Festina Lente
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Piney
3 hours ago, OverSword said:

  At a time when 99% of humans were living in abject poverty

That's a myth. The Roman Empire had a very strong middle class. That's why the whole "poor carpenter" spiel makes me giggle. 

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Debra F. II
1 hour ago, Sherapy said:

Good point, question why didn’t he stone the prostitute? 

The teaching of love and kindness, not to judge otherd and that we are all equally sinners therefore his point was every one of them getting ready to stone her were just as guilty as she was and they all knew it and at that point thought of their own wrong doings, but the only reason they weren't facing death is only because they weren't the one who got cought red handed.

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Festina
1 minute ago, Piney said:

That's a myth. The Roman Empire had a very strong middle class. That's why the whole "poor carpenter" spiel makes me giggle. 

Indeed.  I love the word spiel.  

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Debra F. II
1 hour ago, Sherapy said:

Meaning it doesn’t matter what we think in the biblical eyes?

lol no a few other things you mentioned about yourself that are off topic.

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Piney
4 minutes ago, Festina Lente said:

Indeed.  I love the word spiel.  

Something I picked up from a Rabbi college professor. 

.....along with "schmuck".  :yes:

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Festina
Posted (edited)
5 minutes ago, Piney said:

Something I picked up from a Rabbi college professor. 

.....along with "schmuck".  :yes:

It’s a New York Metropolitan area kinda word.  For those who don’t know...

Spiel

  • noun A lengthy or extravagant speech or argument usually intended to persuade.
  • intransitive & transitive verb To talk or say (something) at length or extravagantly.

 

Entomology Spiel; German, play, or Yiddish shpil, both from Middle High German spil, from Old High German.]

Edited by Festina Lente
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Desertrat56
3 minutes ago, Festina Lente said:

It’s a New York Metropolitan area kinda word.  For those who don’t know...

Spiel

  • noun A lengthy or extravagant speech or argument usually intended to persuade.
  • intransitive & transitive verb To talk or say (something) at length or extravagantly.

 

Entomology Spiel; German, play, or Yiddish shpil, both from Middle High German spil, from Old High German.]

I only visited New York once but I knew the word spiel since I was a kid.  I think someone in the family would use it.  Probably my dad, because his grandmother was german and so was his mother's dad; both his parents used some german words.

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Paranoid Android

@Hammerclaw has already basically said what I would have said to answer the OP, Jesus was a product of his time. 

More generally to delve into modern issues with raising children I think parental modelling is the best way to raise kids. Consider the modelling this child has had:

I'm certain that the parent has modelled this sort of response the whole kids life, and it shows how much our kids actually learn from us. In saying that, I'm not actually against smacking children altogether. I think most parents who use spankings use it far more often than they should, which is its own problem considering the difference between a smack and physical abuse is a real problem affecting many. But I think it would be counterproductive to over-legislate the matter to the point that a smack is considered abuse, because it is not (in my opinion). 

On a related matter, this following video isn't directly about corporal punishment, but it is about child rearing in the modern world and it is one of the most insightful videos I've watched in the last 12 months or so. It's 72 minutes long, but anyone who has kids or young adults, or is a kid or young adult, or works with kids or young adults, or has any interest in the topic whatsoever will find it absolutely fascinating. You may not agree with absolutely everything he says (I didn't agree with everything) but I think he's spot on the money on most of it:

Anyway, just wanted to share these videos, I think you'll like them :tu:

~ PA

 

 

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Habitat
23 minutes ago, Piney said:

That's why the whole "poor carpenter" spiel makes me giggle. 

And what would be the relevance or import of whether he was poor or not ?

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Debra F. II
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, joc said:

I'm glad all that made sense to you... :)  You lost me with justifying God's orders to kill...and God wrote the ten commandments...you know...thou shalt not kill...

 

Right, thats why I said "I conveniently separate God and Jesus" from one another, (sometimes) by doing so it helps me to, somewhat understand why God would order a whole village to be murdered including their animals. And if God and Jesus are one in the same but Jesus was not that way....on one hand... in my eyes, you have God saying that killing and Capital punishment is correct and just., throw the 10 commandments in there ( correct the shall not kill but also in other words saying there is a time and place for it)  and then along comes Jesus preaching peace, love and forgiveness.

 

Edited by Debra F. II

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Desertrat56
2 minutes ago, Habitat said:

And what would be the relevance or import of whether he was poor or not ?

The relevance is that the authorities used it as a way to guilt people into giving their money to them, and be grateful that they are poor "like jesus".

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Piney
1 minute ago, Habitat said:

And what would be the relevance or import of whether he was poor or not ?

It makes him look more humble to the peasant who was told to emulate him. 

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Debra F. II
29 minutes ago, Festina Lente said:

Not irrelevant but not as relevant as most think.  Parents and children teach each other and black sheeps are the most effective teachers of the families into which they have “fallen”. :)

: ) but if parents abandon their children, God wants us to know that he is the father, even more so...

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Paranoid Android
2 hours ago, Debra F. II said:

So if he were to condone it, he wouldn't have stepped in and saved her live, he most likely would have picked up a stone and threw it at her but he did not and had the power in his words to stop the others.

Maybe some of you know the story that I am referring to.

Correct, but there are two points to note. The first was already mentioned - the story itself is a known late insertion, it probably is not something Jesus ever did. The second is the nature of the punishment. Stoning someone was a death sentence, a capital punishment. You can recover from corporal punishment! 

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Festina
13 minutes ago, Paranoid Android said:

@Hammerclaw has already basically said what I would have said to answer the OP, Jesus was a product of his time. 

More generally to delve into modern issues with raising children I think parental modelling is the best way to raise kids. Consider the modelling this child has had:

I'm certain that the parent has modelled this sort of response the whole kids life, and it shows how much our kids actually learn from us. In saying that, I'm not actually against smacking children altogether. I think most parents who use spankings use it far more often than they should, which is its own problem considering the difference between a smack and physical abuse is a real problem affecting many. But I think it would be counterproductive to over-legislate the matter to the point that a smack is considered abuse, because it is not (in my opinion). 

On a related matter, this following video isn't directly about corporal punishment, but it is about child rearing in the modern world and it is one of the most insightful videos I've watched in the last 12 months or so. It's 72 minutes long, but anyone who has kids or young adults, or is a kid or young adult, or works with kids or young adults, or has any interest in the topic whatsoever will find it absolutely fascinating. You may not agree with absolutely everything he says (I didn't agree with everything) but I think he's spot on the money on most of it:

Anyway, just wanted to share these videos, I think you'll like them :tu:

~ PA

 

 

Priceless...but did she lie to him?  If so, not good. 

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Debra F. II
9 minutes ago, Debra F. II said:

Right, thats why I said "I conveniently separate God and Jesus" from one another, (sometimes) by doing so it helps me to, somewhat understand why God would order a whole village to be murdered including their animals. And if God and Jesus are one in the same but Jesus was not that way....on one hand... in my eyes, you have God saying that killing and Capital punishment is correct and just., throw the 10 commandments in there ( correct the shall not kill but also in other words saying there is a time and place for it)  and then along comes Jesus preaching peace, love and forgiveness.

 

By me separating the two it seems to come into balance lol

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Habitat
7 minutes ago, Desertrat56 said:

The relevance is that the authorities used it as a way to guilt people into giving their money to them, and be grateful that they are poor "like jesus".

Authorities ? You mean the church ? 

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Habitat
10 minutes ago, Piney said:

It makes him look more humble to the peasant who was told to emulate him. 

If he could have been more wealthy, but eschewed that, it only makes him more convincing, though. It is a lot easier for the poor to advocate poverty, they are already in it, and are at no risk of being accused of hypocrisy but the wealthy man is.

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OverSword
40 minutes ago, Piney said:

That's a myth. The Roman Empire had a very strong middle class. That's why the whole "poor carpenter" spiel makes me giggle. 

You mean Rome had a strong middle class not the Roman Empire.  And the middle class in rome probably accounted for 1/50th of 1% of the worlds population.

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Desertrat56
3 minutes ago, Habitat said:

Authorities ? You mean the church ? 

A church, not the church, there is not just one The Church, but I mean anyone who sets themselves up as an authority using Jesus as an example, it could be a cult leader that is not affiliated with any church, or it could be the pope, or billy graham.

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Debra F. II
4 minutes ago, Paranoid Android said:

Correct, but there are two points to note. The first was already mentioned - the story itself is a known late insertion, it probably is not something Jesus ever did. The second is the nature of the punishment. Stoning someone was a death sentence, a capital punishment. You can recover from corporal punishment! 

Punishment is just that, a punishment... the infliction or imposing of a penalty.

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