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K9Buck

Biblical contradictions?

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Guyver
7 hours ago, Mr Walker said:

In christian theology christ died to remove original sin from  everyone It is this which then allows an individual's thoughts and behaviours (intha t same theology ) to determine their salvation or damnation

 

Right.  Well, I just have a problem with the notion of original sin in the first place.  That makes no sense whatsoever.  How in the world is it just or righteous to hold an innocent person accountable for the misdeeds of another human being?

It isn’t.  No one chose to come here as far as we can recall, but we did find ourselves here in this place of struggle. To be born into a world of death and be automatically condemned for no fault of your own is just like a complete failure on the part of the Maker.  I just can’t accept it personally.  I think that if there is a God who made us, He knew exactly what he was doing and what we would become.

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Desertrat56
14 hours ago, Crikey said:

He did..:D

Or to be more precise he told Jesus exactly what to say, so Jesus's words are God's words, how kool is that!-

Jesus said - "For I have not spoken on my own authority; but the Father who sent me gave me a command, what I should say and what I should speak" (John 12:49)

After his execution, some people said "Hey let's write it all down for posterity before we forget it.", and that's a bingo, the first gospels were written..Beats me why people today think they have to study the entire Bible when Jesus can be found in any slimline gospel like this one for a few pennies from bookshops or free from most Christian groups.

If people can't lock on to Jesus with one of these, they might as well go whistle Dixie, because all the intensive hard study of the whole Bible ain't gonna help them one iota-

rel-gosp-john.jpg

But Jesus didn't write the book either.

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Guyver
14 hours ago, Crikey said:

He did..:D

Or to be more precise he told Jesus exactly what to say, so Jesus's words are God's words, how kool is that!-

Jesus said - "For I have not spoken on my own authority; but the Father who sent me gave me a command, what I should say and what I should speak" (John 12:49)

After his execution, some people said "Hey let's write it all down for posterity before we forget it.", and that's a bingo, the first gospels were written..Beats me why people today think they have to study the entire Bible when Jesus can be found in any slimline gospel like this one for a few pennies from bookshops or free from most Christian groups.

It’s just that it doesn’t work.  It isn’t real.  You see that Gospel of John you’re holding in your hands?  In the 14th chapter of that book Jesus claims that people who believe in him will do the same works that he did and greater.  It goes on to say that Jesus will do anything you ask him to because he goes to the Father.  

If that worked, it would only take one Christian walking in to the Children’s Hospital and healing every child dying of cancer to convince the entire world that Christianity is the right religion.

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Crikey
1 hour ago, Desertrat56 said:

But Jesus didn't write the book either.

So what? Elvis never wrote a book but the bookshops are full of books written by people who knew him, right Elv?

 

 

 

Edited by Crikey
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Desertrat56
2 minutes ago, Crikey said:

So what? Elvis never wrote a book but the bookshops are full of books written by people who knew him, right Elv?

 

 

 

Anti-logic there!   :lol:   So, if Jesus didn't write anything in the bible how is it written by god?

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Crikey
2 hours ago, Guyver said:

No one chose to come here as far as we can recall, but we did find ourselves here in this place of struggle. To be born into a world of death and be automatically condemned for no fault of your own is just like a complete failure on the part of the Maker.  I just can’t accept it personally.  I think that if there is a God who made us, He knew exactly what he was doing and what we would become.

Yeah the earth is like a Military Testing Ground to see if we qualify for that great passing out parade in the sky. The trick is not to let ourselves get "spiritually polluted" by getting bogged down in worldly affairs-

"Religion that God our Father accepts as pure and faultless is this....to keep oneself from being polluted by the world" (James 1:27)

Sure, it can get rough at times-

"All creation groans in pain from the beginning til now" (Romans 8:22)

but hey let's hang in there-

"Blessed is the man who perseveres under trial, because when he has stood the test, he will receive the crown of life.." (James 1:12)

How about it sergeant?

 

Edited by Crikey

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XenoFish
11 minutes ago, Desertrat56 said:

Anti-logic there!   :lol:   So, if Jesus didn't write anything in the bible how is it written by god?

Isn't that why it's called the 'inspired' word of God.

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Crikey
24 minutes ago, Desertrat56 said:

Anti-logic there!   :lol:   So, if Jesus didn't write anything in the bible how is it written by god?

The disciples and others regularly heard Jesus saying the same stuff at his gigs for 3 long years and the words became embedded in their memories and they later wrote them down, just as we can remember the words spoken by other great prophets such as "Stay offa my blue suede shoes", "See you later alligator", "Get around, get around, I get around", and of course prophet Gene Vincent's deeply profound and mysterious utterances that rank up there alongside the book of Revelation- 

 

 

Edited by Crikey

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Desertrat56
19 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

Isn't that why it's called the 'inspired' word of God.

No, that word inspired does not change the fact that people claim it is written by their deity which, in fact it is written by people who may or may not claim to be inspired by what they think is their deity.  Most of the texts were written as history, then changed to intimate that they were the word of god.  Any part of the bible supposedly written by Paul is a perfect example of that.  Letters from Prison, is what they are, god did not tell Paul to get himself thrown in prison everywhere he went nor did he write the letters.

As for the gospel of John, it was written after the fact, John didn't even write it, much less Jesus or god.

Edited by Desertrat56
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XenoFish
2 minutes ago, Desertrat56 said:

No, that word inspired does not change the fact that people claim it is written by their deity. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biblical_inspiration

Biblical inspiration is the doctrine in Christian theology that the human authors and editors of the Bible were led or influenced by God with the result that their writings may be designated in some sense the word of God.[1]

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Crikey
2 hours ago, Guyver said:

You see that Gospel of John you’re holding in your hands?  In the 14th chapter of that book Jesus claims that people who believe in him will do the same works that he did and greater.  It goes on to say that Jesus will do anything you ask him to because he goes to the Father.  

If that worked, it would only take one Christian walking in to the Children’s Hospital and healing every child dying of cancer to convince the entire world that Christianity is the right religion.

Think "spiritual pollution" or "negative vibes" mate, there's so much of it sloshing around the world churned out by nonchristians that it scuppers  the attempts by the rest of us to do miracle cures..So the best we can hope for is that "prayer pressure" does have at least some effect.

For example remember when Jesus went  to bring that dead little girl back to life, he had to kick the scoffers and their neg vibes out of the room, and only let some disciples and her parents stay before he could bring her back-

 

 

Edited by Crikey
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Desertrat56
3 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biblical_inspiration

Biblical inspiration is the doctrine in Christian theology that the human authors and editors of the Bible were led or influenced by God with the result that their writings may be designated in some sense the word of God.[1]

Just because it is their doctrine does not make it fact.  The modern day christian has no idea who actually wrote any of it or why.  And I love to argue, can you tell?  It just seems like the worst "proof" of all to claim "god said...." and it is in the bible on page  chapter  verse... and then what ever they claim god said isn't even a complete sentence, a fragment of a sentence has no meaning.

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Crikey

WAIT, I feel a soppy story coming on, break out the tissues..:)

JESSICA 

Jessica had a good life in ancient Israel, she grew into a fine young woman, got married and had children, and was kind and friendly to all.

Like everyone else, she knew the story of the young carpenter from Nazareth who the snooty priests had killed years before when she was just a little girl,and she often used to sit and think about him and wished she'd seen him.

The years passed, and grey hairs began to appear. Her dear father died of old age, and then her mother became gravely ill. As she sat at her bedside holding her hand and talking to her, their conversation turned to years gone by.

"Mum" she said, "you were a young woman when Jesus was alive,and i just wonder if you ever saw him?"

Her mother looked up into her eyes and said with a gentle smile:- "Well yes, as a matter of fact he came to our town one day when you were just a little girl,but you wouldn't remember because you were...very ill.."

"Wow mum!" replied Jessica "and did you manage to catch a glimpse of him among all the crowds?"

"Yes i did,in fact he came down our very street!" replied her mother.

"Really?" asked Jessica in wide-eyed astonishment.

"Yes darling" answered her mother, "and as a matter of fact your dad ran out to him and asked him to come into our house"

Hearing this, Jessica's jaw dropped in amazement.

"Oh mum, thats fantastic!..I wish i hadn't been ill or i'd have remembered it, and i could have held his hand and talked to him!"

"Darling" replied her mother tenderly, "I've never told you this before,but when he came in he held your hand and he spoke to you!"

"Wow thats absolutely incredible mum!" said Jessica in delight, "And what did he say to me?"

Her mother looked into her beloved daughters eyes and replied:- "He said to you softly and gently 'Get up little girl'.."

"Ooh and what happened then mum?"

"You came back to life darling" answered her mum, "he brought you back to us.."

 

Jesus-girl.jpg

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XenoFish
Just now, Desertrat56 said:

Just because it is their doctrine does not make it fact.  The modern day christian has no idea who actually wrote any of it or why.  And I love to argue, can you tell?  It just seems like the worst "proof" of all to claim "god said...." and it is in the bible on page  chapter  verse... and then what ever they claim god said isn't even a complete sentence, a fragment of a sentence has no meaning.

The bible like all holy books are not the word of god or any god for that matter. We don't need to argue that point. I'm just as puzzled as you as to why people are so convinced that their "Holy Word" is literally gods desires. Then again how many cherry pick the bible anyway? Too many if you ask me.

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Desertrat56
4 minutes ago, Crikey said:

Think "spiritual pollution" or "negative vibes" mate, there's so much of it sloshing around the world churned out by nonchristians that it scuppers  the attempts by the rest of us to do miracle cures..So the best we can hope for is that "prayer pressure" does have at least some effect.

For example remember when Jesus went  to bring that dead little girl back to life, he had to kick the scoffers and their neg vibes out of the room, and only let some disciples and her parents stay before he could bring her back-

 

 

If christians left non-christians alone you could read or believe anything you want, but you want a war and you want to be the only people allowed into heaven and you also for some reason need brownie points to convince people to believe in your heaven.  There are no nonchristians scuppering anything involving your beliefs.  You do that yourself.  If it were the nonchristians then you would be able to prove them wrong by doing your miracles, no one is stopping you but yourself.

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Crikey
7 minutes ago, Desertrat56 said:

Just because it is their doctrine does not make it fact.  The modern day christian has no idea who actually wrote any of it or why.  And I love to argue, can you tell?  It just seems like the worst "proof" of all to claim "god said...." and it is in the bible on page  chapter  verse... and then what ever they claim god said isn't even a complete sentence, a fragment of a sentence has no meaning.

 

Logic it out mate, who do you think the crowds were seeing up there delivering sermons at his gigs, Mary Poppins?..:D

Oh wait.. 

poppins-mount.jpg

Edited by Crikey
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Desertrat56
1 minute ago, Crikey said:

 

Logic it out mate, who do you think the crowds were seeing up there delivering sermons at his gigs, Mary Poppins?..:D

Oh wait.. 

poppins-mount.jpg

Yeah, that is just as believable.  You don't know who it was or even if there were any crowds because you weren't there.  Logic it out mate.

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Crikey
6 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

The bible like all holy books are not the word of god or any god for that matter..

Prove it..:D

God is a spiritual lifeform in some other dimension somewhere, so he had to beam a solid flesh and blood Jesus down to us to do his talking for him-

Jesus said- "I know where I came from and where I am going, but you have no idea where I come from or where I am going,.....I am not of this world" (John 8:14, John 8:23)

Maybe we should send out a probe to find him? Hey Daniel where is it now?-

"On the far side of the known universe"

rel-stargate-known-universeB.jpg

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Crikey
7 minutes ago, Desertrat56 said:

You don't know who it was or even if there were any crowds because you weren't there.  Logic it out mate.

But mate, when the first gospels were written, why didn't a single person from the priests, the Romans or the people ever come forward to say "Baloney, it never happened"?

Obviously Jesus was TOO BIG to have been a myth, heck he pulled crowds of over 5000 and 4000 at two gigs alone (Matt 14:13, Matt 15:32) and was almost as big as Elvis, and the similarities are striking..:)

"Everybody tried to touch Jesus because power was coming from him" (Luke 6:12-19)

elvis-stage_zpsdbf8f1c6.jpg~original

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Crikey
26 minutes ago, Desertrat56 said:

If christians left non-christians alone you could read or believe anything you want, but you want a war and you want to be the only people allowed into heaven and you also for some reason need brownie points to convince people to believe in your heaven..

Nonchristians are regularly putting the boot into Christians, so I'm simply booting them back, it's great fun, bring it on..:D

 

 

Edited by Crikey
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Desertrat56
21 minutes ago, Crikey said:

But mate, when the first gospels were written, why didn't a single person from the priests, the Romans or the people ever come forward to say "Baloney, it never happened"?

Obviously Jesus was TOO BIG to have been a myth, heck he pulled crowds of over 5000 and 4000 at two gigs alone (Matt 14:13, Matt 15:32) and was almost as big as Elvis, and the similarities are striking..:)

"Everybody tried to touch Jesus because power was coming from him" (Luke 6:12-19)

elvis-stage_zpsdbf8f1c6.jpg~original

Because they were all dead!  Those gospels were written after everyone involved was dead, except, MAYBE the letters Paul wrote, but when they were added to the gospels we don't know if he really wrote them because he was dead by then.  The romans did not compile what you call the bible until Constantine was emperor and he saw his empire crubling around him.   Look up when he was emperor and when he had the conclave to create the Holy Roman Empire. 

Also, look up when King James had it translated into english.  That might give you a clue too, because he had control over what the translations said.

Edited by Desertrat56
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Sherapy
1 hour ago, Desertrat56 said:

Anti-logic there!   :lol:   So, if Jesus didn't write anything in the bible how is it written by god?

You got your hands cut out with this poster.. He doesn’t critically think at.

 

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Desertrat56
11 minutes ago, Sherapy said:

You got your hands cut out with this poster.. He doesn’t critically think at.

 

Maybe he can learn.  I don't know how young he is.

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Hammerclaw

It is better to die, than to learn how not to dream.

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Sherapy
1 hour ago, Hammerclaw said:

It is better to die, than to learn how not to dream.

Dream?

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